Zone1 Is Hell FOREVER or does God destroy it absolutely in the End?

1miseryindex said:
so you wouldn't have a problem with that woman who was in the news a few years back who threw her child down the stairs because

"God told me to"

???
Click to expand...
Nice that Yahweh only kept that smashing of babies heads on stone down to one that time.

Blessed be Yahweh for not letting Jesus and his Armageddon loose. Right?

I feel a new O.P. forming.

Go you think the more right wing Christians would agree with that --- "Right"?
 
1miseryindex said:
Well, I don't know.. Whom do we consult on this important matter?

Protestants?
Catholics?
Both?

Both faith communities are messed up, as we all know. Where can we find the answer?

Hey, I know.. How about Jesus Christ and His Word? In Mt 25:31 and other psgs, Jesus speaks of ETERNAL damnation aka punishment. So, you'd think that would settle matters. If not, here is a (an admittedly lengthy!) commentary from an ERUDITE theologian

I found this at novusordo.watch.net, not sure who the author is, but again, the Sedevacantist Catholics (that site is Sede) have the Truth on their side vis a vis the Vatican and its corruption/heresies. That's not necessarily a reason to stop going to NO Churches (??)

I copied it to read in full later --though, so far, it seems I could have written a lot of it myself.

(Yours truly bolded certain parts)


Theologian at Novusordowatch
(who uses Christ's Words to refute Francis's)
​


Francis once again displayed his masterful skills of distorting Sacred Scripture when what it teaches doesn’t jibe with his false gospel of forgiveness without repentance, which, far from demonstrating God’s great mercy for sinners, makes a mockery of the Redemption and only assists souls in going to hell, not to Heaven.

Our Lord, we must recall, pardoned only one of the two thieves crucified with Him, because only one was contrite. In this manner He taught us never to despair of His mercy, but at the same time never to presume on it either. Both despair and presumption are mortal sins — the Catholic medium between the two is the theological virtue of hope.

The Gospel reading for the Novus Ordo Missae (not the traditional missal) last Sunday, June 25, 2023, was Matthew 10:26-33.. We will quote the passage in full, first from the traditional Catholic Douay-Rheims translation, then from the translation used in the official Novus Ordo lectionary of the United States: Matthew 10:26-33 (Douay-Rheims)

Therefore fear them not. For nothing is covered that shall not be revealed: nor hid, that shall not be known. That which I tell you in the dark, speak ye in the light: and that which you hear in the ear, preach ye upon the housetops. And fear ye not them that kill the body, and are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him that can destroy both soul and body in hell. Are not two sparrows sold for a farthing? and not one of them shall fall on the ground without your Father. But the very hairs of your head are all numbered. Fear not therefore: better are you than many sparrows. Every one therefore that shall confess me before men, I will also confess him before my Father who is in heaven. But he that shall deny me before men, I will also deny him before my Father who is in heaven.

Matthew 10:26-33 (USCCB Lectionary)

Jesus said to the Twelve: “Fear no one. Nothing is concealed that will not be revealed, nor secret that will not be known. What I say to you in the darkness, speak in the light; what you hear whispered, proclaim on the housetops. And do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; rather, be afraid of the one who can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna. Are not two sparrows sold for a small coin? Yet not one of them falls to the ground without your Father’s knowledge. Even all the hairs of your head are counted. So do not be afraid; you are worth more than many sparrows. Everyone who acknowledges me before others I will acknowledge before my heavenly Father. But whoever denies me before others, I will deny before my heavenly Father.”

These words of [Jesus] are consoling in that they encourage and edify the soul by pointing out that although eternal damnation is a real and acute danger, nevertheless God will provide all the graces needed for us to win the battle against sin and temptation.. We are not left to our weakness; God will help us..

Our Lord.. warns that he who, not cooperating with the graces given him, will “deny me before men, I will also deny him before my Father who is in Heaven.” That’s a rather exclusionary message, one that clearly doesn’t work for Bergoglio’s new “big tent” synodal church. .

Knowing that we must tread the way of the Cross with Him if we are to persevere in grace (see Lk 9:23), our Lord warns that we must be willing to sacrifice any material good — even physical life itself — if necessary to preserve the state of sanctifying grace, which is the spiritual life of the soul: “And do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; rather, be afraid of the one who can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna.” Fr. Cornelius à Lapidé (1567-1637):

Verse 28. “And fear ye not them that kill the body, and are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him that can destroy both soul and body in hell..” The sense is: Do not, from fear of death with which the persecutors will threaten you, deny My Faith, or cease from the preaching which I have commanded you, or commit any act unworthy of it, for if ye do this, ye will incur both the death of the body and the far worse and longer-lasting death of the soul, even its eternal death in hell, where the damned die an undying death, because they are constantly live [sic] in mortal torments and endure as though in living death and moribund life, according to Isaias 66:24, Their worm shall not die, and their fire shall not be quenched. Truly does S. Chrysostom say (hom. 5 ad pop.), “He who is always afraid of hell will never fall into its flames, for he is continually purified by this fear.”

Verse 33. But he that shall deny me before men, I will also deny him before my Father who is in heaven. Christ adds this, so that whoever is not moved by His magnificent promise, might be daunted by the terrible threat, that just as Christ will acknowledge those who acknowledge Him, so too, He will deny those who deny Him, saying, I never knew you. Depart from me, you that work iniquity! (Matth. 7:23), that is, go to hell, to Lucifer, whom you serve (Matth. 25:12 ff.).

à Lapide: Gospel.. Mt

There is no question that Christ’s doctrine is challenging — Christianity is not for wimps — but it is not difficult to understand. Notice that our Blessed Lord in His great goodness is pleased to present this particular doctrine in the context of His generous assistance of providing the graces necessary to persevere. That is why He can say in another place: “For my yoke is sweet and my burden light” (Mt 11:3). Our Redeemer does not leave us out in the cold, so to speak, with the dreadful prospect of having to give our lives for Him based on our own strength. No, He makes clear that He will sustain us through all trials if only we are faithful to Him. If, however, we fail to cooperate with His graces and deny Him, and if we persist in this frightful state until death, He will then also deny us. We can see, then, how very serious the matter is.

Francis twists Christ’s Words to make them compatible with Naturalism

The Gospel reading of last Sunday is, then, not terribly difficult to make sense of. Francis had a terrific opportunity … to remind people that all is lost if we lose our souls.. that this temporal life is as nothing when compared to eternity. Hell, eternal damnation, is a very real possibility, and we must arm ourselves with prayers, good works, and self-denial..

In today’s Gospel, Jesus repeats to his disciples three different times: “have no fear” (Mt 10:26, 28, 31). Shortly prior to this, he had spoken to them about the persecutions they would have to undergo for the Gospel, a fact that is still a reality. Since its beginning, in fact, the Church has experienced, together with joys – of which she has had many – many persecutions. It seems paradoxical: the proclamation of the Kingdom of God is a message of peace and justice, founded on fraternal charity and on forgiveness; and yet it meets with opposition, violence, persecution. Jesus, however, says not to fear, not because everything will be all right in the world, no, but because we are precious to his Father and nothing that is good will be lost. He therefore tells us not to let fear block us, but rather to fear one other thing, only one. What is the thing Jesus tells us we should fear?

We discover what it is through an image Jesus uses today: the image of “Gehenna” (cf. v. 28). The valley of “Gehenna” was a place the inhabitants of Jerusalem knew well. It was the city’s large garbage dump. Jesus speaks about it in order to say that the true fear we should have, is that of throwing away one’s own life. Jesus says, “Yes, be afraid of that”. It was like saying: you do not need so much to be afraid of suffering misunderstanding and criticism, of losing prestige and economic advantages to remain faithful to the Gospel, no, but of wasting your existence in the pursuit of trivial things that do not fill life with meaning.

This is important for us today. Even today, in fact, some are ridiculed or discriminated against for not following certain fads, which, however, place second-rate realities at the centre – for example, to follow after things instead of people, achievement instead of relationships. Let us give an example: I am thinking of some parents who need to work to maintain their family, but who cannot live for work alone – they need enough time to be with their children. I am also thinking of a priest or a sister who need to dedicate themselves to their service, without, however, forgetting to dedicate time to be with Jesus, otherwise, they will fall into spiritual worldliness and lose the sense of who they are. And again, I am thinking of a young man or woman who have thousands of commitments and passions – school, sports, various interests, cell phones and social networks – but who need to meet people and achieve great dreams, without losing time on passing things that do not leave their mark.

All of this, brothers and sisters, requires some renunciation regarding the idols of efficiency and consumerism. But this is necessary so as not to get lost in things that end up getting thrown out, as they threw things out in Gehenna back then. And people often end up in today’s Gehenna’s, instead. Let’s think, of the least who are often treated like waste products and unwanted objects. There is a cost to remain faithful to what counts. The cost is going against the tide, the cost is freeing oneself from being conditioned by popular opinion, the cost is being separated from those who “follow the current”. But it does not matter, Jesus says. What matters is not to throw away the greatest good: life. This is the only thing that should frighten us. (Antipope Francis.. June 25, 2023)

…Perhaps we should be grateful that Bergoglio didn’t turn Christ’s warning about Gehenna into a sermon about the importance of recycling!

Francis… tries to get his hearers’ thoughts away from the supernatural and ..focused on [earthly] life

In today’s Gospel, Jesus repeats to his disciples three different times: “have no fear” (Mt 10:26, 28, 31). Shortly prior to this, he had spoken to them about the persecutions they would have to undergo for the Gospel, a fact that is still a reality. Since its beginning, in fact, the Church has experienced, together with joys – of which she has had many – many persecutions. It seems paradoxical: the proclamation of the Kingdom of God is a message of peace and justice, founded on fraternal charity and on forgiveness; and yet it meets with opposition, violence, persecution. Jesus, however, says not to fear, not because everything will be all right in the world, no, but because we are precious to his Father and nothing that is good will be lost. He therefore tells us not to let fear block us, but rather to fear one other thing, only one. What is the thing Jesus tells us we should fear?

… Certainly, peace, justice, charity, and forgiveness are part of the Gospel, but it cannot be reduced to that. The Good News of Jesus Christ is not the Kiwanis club with prayer.

If Francis actually taught the… full Gospel… he would see.. quickly why it meets with opposition from the world.

Christ was hated because, unlike Bergoglio, He did not preach a ‘hippie’ gospel. Rather, His preaching convicted the world of sin (cf. Jn 3:19; 16:8) and demanded the strictest standards of morality. For example, not only did Jesus condemn the external act of murder, but even uncharitable speech and hateful thoughts (see Mt 5:21-22); not only did He condemn the external act of adultery, as did the Jews as well, He made clear that even the least deliberately-willed impure thought was already an infraction of the divine law, and that it would be better to suffer any temporal sacrifice rather than commit mortal sin (see Mt 5:27-30). He sanctified matrimony by raising it to a grace-giving sacrament and restoring to it its original indissolubility (see Mt 5:31-32).

Christ preached the way of the Cross. He demanded not a merely external sanctity but one that consists in a true and inward renewal (rebirth) of the whole person (see Mt 5:20; Jn 3:5-6). He condemned vengeance… (see Mt 5:38-39). He demanded that we conform our lives to His (see Mt 11:29), exhorted all who can take it to perfect chastity (see Mt 19:11-12), and demanded that we love our neighbor as we love our very own selves (see Mk 12:31), even our enemies (see Mt 5:43-47). .

..He demanded that God be loved first and above all things (see Mk 12:29-30), including one’s family, relations, friends, and even life itself:

Do not think that I came to send peace upon earth: I came not to send peace, but the sword. For I came to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. And a man’s enemies shall be they of his own household. He that loveth father or mother more than me, is not worthy of me; and he that loveth son or daughter more than me, is not worthy of me. And he that taketh not up his cross, and followeth me, is not worthy of me. He that findeth his life, shall lose it: and he that shall lose his life for me, shall find it. (Matthew 10:34-39)

That is not the gospel preached by Bergoglio. No wonder the fake pope can’t figure out why anyone would oppose the Gospel! The true Gospel is not popular, not attractive to fallen man because it convicts him of sin and demands that he amend his ways under pain of eternal damnation. It requires self-denial, obedience to ecclesiastical authority, and sometimes even heroic sacrifices to save one’s soul: “…the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent bear it away” (Mt 11:12).

“Gehenna” is used by our Lord as a metaphor for hell. The Catholic Encyclopedia explains:

…in the New Testament the term Gehenna is used more frequently in preference to hades, as a name for the place of punishment of the damned. Gehenna is the Hebrew gê-hinnom (Nehemiah 11:30), or the longer form gê-ben-hinnom (Joshua 15:8), and gê-benê-hinnom (2 Kings 23:10) “valley of the sons of Hinnom”. Hinnom seems to be the name of a person not otherwise known. The Valley of Hinnom is south of Jerusalem and is now called Wadi er-rababi. It was notorious as the scene, in earlier days, of the horrible worship of Moloch. For this reason it was defiled by Josias (2 Kings 23:10), cursed by Jeremias (Jeremiah 7:31-33), and held in abomination by the Jews, who, accordingly, used the name of this valley to designate the abode of the damned (Targ. Jon., Gen., iii, 24; Henoch, c. xxvi). And Christ adopted this usage of the term. (The Catholic Encyclopedia, s.v. “Hell”)

Interestingly enough, even Bergoglio’s own so-called Catechism of the Catholic Church notes:

Jesus often speaks of “Gehenna,” of “the unquenchable fire” reserved for those who to the end of their lives refuse to believe and be converted, where both soul and body can be lost. Jesus solemnly proclaims that he “will send his angels, and they will gather . . . all evil doers, and throw them into the furnace of fire,” and that he will pronounce the condemnation: “Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire!” (Catechism of the Catholic Church, n. 1034)

So, when Francis says that Christ speaks about Gehenna “in order to say that the true fear we should have, is that of throwing away one’s own life”, that is inaccurate — He specifically warns against throwing one’s soul away, and He distinguishes it clearly from the life of the body. Notice how the false pope omits this crucial distinction and instead conflates both into “life”, hoping no one will notice.

Why Francis does this becomes apparent when we look at what he says immediately after, namely: “It was like saying: you do not need so much to be afraid of suffering misunderstanding and criticism, of losing prestige and economic advantages to remain faithful to the Gospel, no, but of wasting your existence in the pursuit of trivial things that do not fill life with meaning.”

Now it is clear: Bergoglio had to erase Christ’s contrast between the life of the body and the life of the soul in order to be able to make the divine warning about throwing your soul away (namely, into hell) into something about not “wasting your existence in the pursuit of trivial things that do not fill life with meaning”. Obviously, that is not what Christ said… Nor does life have to be “filled” with meaning, as if the meaning of our existence were something to be produced by us and not found in God and the Beatific Vision to which He has called us. But then those are supernatural things, and Francis wants to steer souls away from the supernatural and keep them focused on the things of the earth, lest they be saved: “He that is of the earth, of the earth he is, and of the earth he speaketh” (Jn 3:31).

The whole point of Christ’s warning in the Gospel passage is that one can spend one’s entire life doing non-trivial things — things that are good, legitimate, and important in themselves — and still go to hell! For example, a surgeon who saves lives every day for thirty years, or a social worker who frequently feeds the hungry, or an architect who designs the most magnificent cathedrals, all these people are doing good things but if they do not die in the state of sanctifying grace, they will merit only eternal damnation — not for the good things they did, of course, but for their mortal sins, which can only be blotted out with sanctifying grace, which cannot be “purchased” with naturally good works. Denial of this would constitute the heresy of Pelagianism — salvation by works without grace.

Francis:

... Even today, in fact, some are ridiculed or discriminated against for not following certain fads, which, however, place second-rate realities at the centre – for example, to follow after things instead of people, achievement instead of relationships. Let us give an example: I am thinking of some parents who need to work to maintain their family, but who cannot live for work alone – they need enough time to be with their children. I am also thinking of a priest or a sister who need to dedicate themselves to their service, without, however, forgetting to dedicate time to be with Jesus, otherwise, they will fall into spiritual worldliness and lose the sense of who they are. And again, I am thinking of a young man or woman who have thousands of commitments and passions – school, sports, various interests, cell phones and social networks – but who need to meet people and achieve great dreams, without losing time on passing things that do not leave their mark.

So here Francis simply doubles down on his distortion of the holy words of our Lord. One can follow after “people” and “relationships” instead of things and achievements all one’s life long — but if one dies in the state of mortal sin, everything will be lost… Francis is diverting people’s attention from the actual words of Christ to a fanciful reading that is compatible with his own [narrative].

The false pope is bluntly taking Christ’s exhortation not to lose one’s eternal life for the sake of one’s temporal life and twisting it into a Naturalist message of not to spend one’s temporal life on the trivial but rather on the meaningful. That is not what Christ said, nor is it what He meant! And Bergoglio knows it, obviously. All temporal life will end at death, “and after this the judgment” (Heb 9:27). If the soul is in the state of mortal sin, hell will be its eternal destiny. But that is a pesky little detail Bergoglio is bending over backwards to conceal from those who are unhappily seeking instruction from his blasphemous mouth.

Francis denounces figurative “idols”… (not so much literal idols):

All of this, brothers and sisters, requires some renunciation regarding the idols of efficiency and consumerism. But this is necessary so as not to get lost in things that end up getting thrown out, as they threw things out in Gehenna back then. And people often end up in today’s Gehenna’s, instead. Let’s think, of the least who are often treated like waste products and unwanted objects. There is a cost to remain faithful to what counts. The cost is going against the tide, the cost is freeing oneself from being conditioned by popular opinion, the cost is being separated from those who “follow the current”. But it does not matter, Jesus says. What matters is not to throw away the greatest good: life. This is the only thing that should frighten us.

So here the pseudo-papal shyster desperately tries to introduce one of his favorite talking points, which hinges on Gehenna having been a garbage dump. He then blatantly lies again by claiming that Christ’s teaching is: “What matters is not to throw away the greatest good: life.” No, this earthly life is not the greatest good, eternal life in Heaven is:

And calling the multitude together with his disciples, he said to them: If any man will follow me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. For whosoever will save his life, shall lose it: and whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel, shall save it. For what shall it profit a man, if he gain the whole world, and suffer the loss of his soul. Or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul? For he that shall be ashamed of me, and of my words, in this adulterous and sinful generation: the Son of man also will be ashamed of him, when he shall come in the glory of his Father with the holy angels. (Mark 8:34-38)

Francis adds insult to injury when in his very last paragraph he warns against “not putting [the] Gospel in first place”:

So let us ask ourselves: I, what do I fear? Not having what I like? Not reaching the goals society imposes? The judgement of others? Or rather of not pleasing the Lord, and not putting his Gospel in first place? Mary, ever Virgin, Mother most Wise, help us to be wise and courageous in the choices we make.

This false pope is a master deceiver, and he is audacious in his deception, for he denies the Gospel straight to your face and then exhorts you never to deny the Gospel. Bergoglio preaches “a charity without faith, very accommodating to unbelievers, which unfortunately opens the way to eternal ruin for all”, as Pope St. Pius X warned in his allocution of Apr. 17, 1907.

‘Pope’ Francis, Apostle of Hell

As we have seen, the true Gospel is supernatural; it is concerned first and foremost with eternal salvation, without which all is lost forever. The Gospel is not a sentimental collection of platitudes about human dignity, tolerance, unconditional acceptance and forgiveness, caresses and tenderness, or helping the needy. It is also not about dreaming, welcoming, including, accompanying, or affirming everyone and everything. That is Bergoglio’s false Naturalist gospel of man, not the true supernatural Gospel of Jesus Christ.

Christ became incarnate so we would be freed from the bondage of sin and be able to go to Heaven. He preached the truth about the fallen human condition and the divinely-given remedy, offering Himself as the Divine-Human Sacrifice to atone for our sins and purchase us back from the dominion of the evil one. Christ did not become man in order to preach a generic, interreligious “message of peace and justice, founded on fraternal charity and on forgiveness”.

This past Sunday, it is clear that Francis went out of his way to avoid speaking about eternal damnation; he instead bent over backwards to come up with some other “interpretation” of Christ’s plain words. But why? Who would have an interest in keeping the truth about hell away from souls?

Would it be our dear Lord Jesus, who suffered and died for souls precisely so they would not end up there and who Himself warned of the reality of the danger of hell throughout His earthly ministry? Or would it be Satan, the devil, who wants to see as many souls eternally damned as possible?
Click to expand...
It seems to me you probably cribbed Newman but you didn't understand him rightly. Because later on in that Sermon he says the opposite

"—it is fearful, but it is right to say it;—that if we wished to imagine a punishment for an unholy, reprobate soul, we perhaps could not fancy a greater than to summon it to heaven. Heaven would be hell to an irreligious man. We know how unhappy we are apt to feel at present, when alone in the midst of strangers, or of men of different tastes and habits from ourselves. How miserable, for example, would it be to have to live in a foreign land, among a people whose faces we never saw before, and whose language we could not learn. And this is but a faint illustration of the loneliness of a man of earthly dispositions and tastes, thrust into the society of saints and angels. How forlorn would he wander through the courts of heaven! He would find no one like himself; he would see in every direction the marks {8} of God's holiness, and these would make him shudder. He would feel himself always in His presence. He could no longer turn his thoughts another way, as he does now, when conscience reproaches him. He would know that the Eternal Eye was ever upon him; and that Eye of holiness, which is joy and life to holy creatures, would seem to him an Eye of wrath and punishment. God cannot change His nature. Holy He must ever be. But while He is holy, no unholy soul can be happy in heaven."
 
1miseryindex said:
Well, I don't know.. Whom do we consult on this important matter?

Protestants?
Catholics?
Both?

Both faith communities are messed up, as we all know. Where can we find the answer?

Hey, I know.. How about Jesus Christ and His Word? In Mt 25:31 and other psgs, Jesus speaks of ETERNAL damnation aka punishment. So, you'd think that would settle matters. If not, here is a (an admittedly lengthy!) commentary from an ERUDITE theologian

I found this at novusordo.watch.net, not sure who the author is, but again, the Sedevacantist Catholics (that site is Sede) have the Truth on their side vis a vis the Vatican and its corruption/heresies. That's not necessarily a reason to stop going to NO Churches (??)

I copied it to read in full later --though, so far, it seems I could have written a lot of it myself.

(Yours truly bolded certain parts)


Theologian at Novusordowatch
(who uses Christ's Words to refute Francis's)
​


Francis once again displayed his masterful skills of distorting Sacred Scripture when what it teaches doesn’t jibe with his false gospel of forgiveness without repentance, which, far from demonstrating God’s great mercy for sinners, makes a mockery of the Redemption and only assists souls in going to hell, not to Heaven.

Our Lord, we must recall, pardoned only one of the two thieves crucified with Him, because only one was contrite. In this manner He taught us never to despair of His mercy, but at the same time never to presume on it either. Both despair and presumption are mortal sins — the Catholic medium between the two is the theological virtue of hope.

The Gospel reading for the Novus Ordo Missae (not the traditional missal) last Sunday, June 25, 2023, was Matthew 10:26-33.. We will quote the passage in full, first from the traditional Catholic Douay-Rheims translation, then from the translation used in the official Novus Ordo lectionary of the United States: Matthew 10:26-33 (Douay-Rheims)

Therefore fear them not. For nothing is covered that shall not be revealed: nor hid, that shall not be known. That which I tell you in the dark, speak ye in the light: and that which you hear in the ear, preach ye upon the housetops. And fear ye not them that kill the body, and are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him that can destroy both soul and body in hell. Are not two sparrows sold for a farthing? and not one of them shall fall on the ground without your Father. But the very hairs of your head are all numbered. Fear not therefore: better are you than many sparrows. Every one therefore that shall confess me before men, I will also confess him before my Father who is in heaven. But he that shall deny me before men, I will also deny him before my Father who is in heaven.

Matthew 10:26-33 (USCCB Lectionary)

Jesus said to the Twelve: “Fear no one. Nothing is concealed that will not be revealed, nor secret that will not be known. What I say to you in the darkness, speak in the light; what you hear whispered, proclaim on the housetops. And do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; rather, be afraid of the one who can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna. Are not two sparrows sold for a small coin? Yet not one of them falls to the ground without your Father’s knowledge. Even all the hairs of your head are counted. So do not be afraid; you are worth more than many sparrows. Everyone who acknowledges me before others I will acknowledge before my heavenly Father. But whoever denies me before others, I will deny before my heavenly Father.”

These words of [Jesus] are consoling in that they encourage and edify the soul by pointing out that although eternal damnation is a real and acute danger, nevertheless God will provide all the graces needed for us to win the battle against sin and temptation.. We are not left to our weakness; God will help us..

Our Lord.. warns that he who, not cooperating with the graces given him, will “deny me before men, I will also deny him before my Father who is in Heaven.” That’s a rather exclusionary message, one that clearly doesn’t work for Bergoglio’s new “big tent” synodal church. .

Knowing that we must tread the way of the Cross with Him if we are to persevere in grace (see Lk 9:23), our Lord warns that we must be willing to sacrifice any material good — even physical life itself — if necessary to preserve the state of sanctifying grace, which is the spiritual life of the soul: “And do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; rather, be afraid of the one who can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna.” Fr. Cornelius à Lapidé (1567-1637):

Verse 28. “And fear ye not them that kill the body, and are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him that can destroy both soul and body in hell..” The sense is: Do not, from fear of death with which the persecutors will threaten you, deny My Faith, or cease from the preaching which I have commanded you, or commit any act unworthy of it, for if ye do this, ye will incur both the death of the body and the far worse and longer-lasting death of the soul, even its eternal death in hell, where the damned die an undying death, because they are constantly live [sic] in mortal torments and endure as though in living death and moribund life, according to Isaias 66:24, Their worm shall not die, and their fire shall not be quenched. Truly does S. Chrysostom say (hom. 5 ad pop.), “He who is always afraid of hell will never fall into its flames, for he is continually purified by this fear.”

Verse 33. But he that shall deny me before men, I will also deny him before my Father who is in heaven. Christ adds this, so that whoever is not moved by His magnificent promise, might be daunted by the terrible threat, that just as Christ will acknowledge those who acknowledge Him, so too, He will deny those who deny Him, saying, I never knew you. Depart from me, you that work iniquity! (Matth. 7:23), that is, go to hell, to Lucifer, whom you serve (Matth. 25:12 ff.).

à Lapide: Gospel.. Mt

There is no question that Christ’s doctrine is challenging — Christianity is not for wimps — but it is not difficult to understand. Notice that our Blessed Lord in His great goodness is pleased to present this particular doctrine in the context of His generous assistance of providing the graces necessary to persevere. That is why He can say in another place: “For my yoke is sweet and my burden light” (Mt 11:3). Our Redeemer does not leave us out in the cold, so to speak, with the dreadful prospect of having to give our lives for Him based on our own strength. No, He makes clear that He will sustain us through all trials if only we are faithful to Him. If, however, we fail to cooperate with His graces and deny Him, and if we persist in this frightful state until death, He will then also deny us. We can see, then, how very serious the matter is.

Francis twists Christ’s Words to make them compatible with Naturalism

The Gospel reading of last Sunday is, then, not terribly difficult to make sense of. Francis had a terrific opportunity … to remind people that all is lost if we lose our souls.. that this temporal life is as nothing when compared to eternity. Hell, eternal damnation, is a very real possibility, and we must arm ourselves with prayers, good works, and self-denial..

In today’s Gospel, Jesus repeats to his disciples three different times: “have no fear” (Mt 10:26, 28, 31). Shortly prior to this, he had spoken to them about the persecutions they would have to undergo for the Gospel, a fact that is still a reality. Since its beginning, in fact, the Church has experienced, together with joys – of which she has had many – many persecutions. It seems paradoxical: the proclamation of the Kingdom of God is a message of peace and justice, founded on fraternal charity and on forgiveness; and yet it meets with opposition, violence, persecution. Jesus, however, says not to fear, not because everything will be all right in the world, no, but because we are precious to his Father and nothing that is good will be lost. He therefore tells us not to let fear block us, but rather to fear one other thing, only one. What is the thing Jesus tells us we should fear?

We discover what it is through an image Jesus uses today: the image of “Gehenna” (cf. v. 28). The valley of “Gehenna” was a place the inhabitants of Jerusalem knew well. It was the city’s large garbage dump. Jesus speaks about it in order to say that the true fear we should have, is that of throwing away one’s own life. Jesus says, “Yes, be afraid of that”. It was like saying: you do not need so much to be afraid of suffering misunderstanding and criticism, of losing prestige and economic advantages to remain faithful to the Gospel, no, but of wasting your existence in the pursuit of trivial things that do not fill life with meaning.

This is important for us today. Even today, in fact, some are ridiculed or discriminated against for not following certain fads, which, however, place second-rate realities at the centre – for example, to follow after things instead of people, achievement instead of relationships. Let us give an example: I am thinking of some parents who need to work to maintain their family, but who cannot live for work alone – they need enough time to be with their children. I am also thinking of a priest or a sister who need to dedicate themselves to their service, without, however, forgetting to dedicate time to be with Jesus, otherwise, they will fall into spiritual worldliness and lose the sense of who they are. And again, I am thinking of a young man or woman who have thousands of commitments and passions – school, sports, various interests, cell phones and social networks – but who need to meet people and achieve great dreams, without losing time on passing things that do not leave their mark.

All of this, brothers and sisters, requires some renunciation regarding the idols of efficiency and consumerism. But this is necessary so as not to get lost in things that end up getting thrown out, as they threw things out in Gehenna back then. And people often end up in today’s Gehenna’s, instead. Let’s think, of the least who are often treated like waste products and unwanted objects. There is a cost to remain faithful to what counts. The cost is going against the tide, the cost is freeing oneself from being conditioned by popular opinion, the cost is being separated from those who “follow the current”. But it does not matter, Jesus says. What matters is not to throw away the greatest good: life. This is the only thing that should frighten us. (Antipope Francis.. June 25, 2023)

…Perhaps we should be grateful that Bergoglio didn’t turn Christ’s warning about Gehenna into a sermon about the importance of recycling!

Francis… tries to get his hearers’ thoughts away from the supernatural and ..focused on [earthly] life

In today’s Gospel, Jesus repeats to his disciples three different times: “have no fear” (Mt 10:26, 28, 31). Shortly prior to this, he had spoken to them about the persecutions they would have to undergo for the Gospel, a fact that is still a reality. Since its beginning, in fact, the Church has experienced, together with joys – of which she has had many – many persecutions. It seems paradoxical: the proclamation of the Kingdom of God is a message of peace and justice, founded on fraternal charity and on forgiveness; and yet it meets with opposition, violence, persecution. Jesus, however, says not to fear, not because everything will be all right in the world, no, but because we are precious to his Father and nothing that is good will be lost. He therefore tells us not to let fear block us, but rather to fear one other thing, only one. What is the thing Jesus tells us we should fear?

… Certainly, peace, justice, charity, and forgiveness are part of the Gospel, but it cannot be reduced to that. The Good News of Jesus Christ is not the Kiwanis club with prayer.

If Francis actually taught the… full Gospel… he would see.. quickly why it meets with opposition from the world.

Christ was hated because, unlike Bergoglio, He did not preach a ‘hippie’ gospel. Rather, His preaching convicted the world of sin (cf. Jn 3:19; 16:8) and demanded the strictest standards of morality. For example, not only did Jesus condemn the external act of murder, but even uncharitable speech and hateful thoughts (see Mt 5:21-22); not only did He condemn the external act of adultery, as did the Jews as well, He made clear that even the least deliberately-willed impure thought was already an infraction of the divine law, and that it would be better to suffer any temporal sacrifice rather than commit mortal sin (see Mt 5:27-30). He sanctified matrimony by raising it to a grace-giving sacrament and restoring to it its original indissolubility (see Mt 5:31-32).

Christ preached the way of the Cross. He demanded not a merely external sanctity but one that consists in a true and inward renewal (rebirth) of the whole person (see Mt 5:20; Jn 3:5-6). He condemned vengeance… (see Mt 5:38-39). He demanded that we conform our lives to His (see Mt 11:29), exhorted all who can take it to perfect chastity (see Mt 19:11-12), and demanded that we love our neighbor as we love our very own selves (see Mk 12:31), even our enemies (see Mt 5:43-47). .

..He demanded that God be loved first and above all things (see Mk 12:29-30), including one’s family, relations, friends, and even life itself:

Do not think that I came to send peace upon earth: I came not to send peace, but the sword. For I came to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. And a man’s enemies shall be they of his own household. He that loveth father or mother more than me, is not worthy of me; and he that loveth son or daughter more than me, is not worthy of me. And he that taketh not up his cross, and followeth me, is not worthy of me. He that findeth his life, shall lose it: and he that shall lose his life for me, shall find it. (Matthew 10:34-39)

That is not the gospel preached by Bergoglio. No wonder the fake pope can’t figure out why anyone would oppose the Gospel! The true Gospel is not popular, not attractive to fallen man because it convicts him of sin and demands that he amend his ways under pain of eternal damnation. It requires self-denial, obedience to ecclesiastical authority, and sometimes even heroic sacrifices to save one’s soul: “…the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent bear it away” (Mt 11:12).

“Gehenna” is used by our Lord as a metaphor for hell. The Catholic Encyclopedia explains:

…in the New Testament the term Gehenna is used more frequently in preference to hades, as a name for the place of punishment of the damned. Gehenna is the Hebrew gê-hinnom (Nehemiah 11:30), or the longer form gê-ben-hinnom (Joshua 15:8), and gê-benê-hinnom (2 Kings 23:10) “valley of the sons of Hinnom”. Hinnom seems to be the name of a person not otherwise known. The Valley of Hinnom is south of Jerusalem and is now called Wadi er-rababi. It was notorious as the scene, in earlier days, of the horrible worship of Moloch. For this reason it was defiled by Josias (2 Kings 23:10), cursed by Jeremias (Jeremiah 7:31-33), and held in abomination by the Jews, who, accordingly, used the name of this valley to designate the abode of the damned (Targ. Jon., Gen., iii, 24; Henoch, c. xxvi). And Christ adopted this usage of the term. (The Catholic Encyclopedia, s.v. “Hell”)

Interestingly enough, even Bergoglio’s own so-called Catechism of the Catholic Church notes:

Jesus often speaks of “Gehenna,” of “the unquenchable fire” reserved for those who to the end of their lives refuse to believe and be converted, where both soul and body can be lost. Jesus solemnly proclaims that he “will send his angels, and they will gather . . . all evil doers, and throw them into the furnace of fire,” and that he will pronounce the condemnation: “Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire!” (Catechism of the Catholic Church, n. 1034)

So, when Francis says that Christ speaks about Gehenna “in order to say that the true fear we should have, is that of throwing away one’s own life”, that is inaccurate — He specifically warns against throwing one’s soul away, and He distinguishes it clearly from the life of the body. Notice how the false pope omits this crucial distinction and instead conflates both into “life”, hoping no one will notice.

Why Francis does this becomes apparent when we look at what he says immediately after, namely: “It was like saying: you do not need so much to be afraid of suffering misunderstanding and criticism, of losing prestige and economic advantages to remain faithful to the Gospel, no, but of wasting your existence in the pursuit of trivial things that do not fill life with meaning.”

Now it is clear: Bergoglio had to erase Christ’s contrast between the life of the body and the life of the soul in order to be able to make the divine warning about throwing your soul away (namely, into hell) into something about not “wasting your existence in the pursuit of trivial things that do not fill life with meaning”. Obviously, that is not what Christ said… Nor does life have to be “filled” with meaning, as if the meaning of our existence were something to be produced by us and not found in God and the Beatific Vision to which He has called us. But then those are supernatural things, and Francis wants to steer souls away from the supernatural and keep them focused on the things of the earth, lest they be saved: “He that is of the earth, of the earth he is, and of the earth he speaketh” (Jn 3:31).

The whole point of Christ’s warning in the Gospel passage is that one can spend one’s entire life doing non-trivial things — things that are good, legitimate, and important in themselves — and still go to hell! For example, a surgeon who saves lives every day for thirty years, or a social worker who frequently feeds the hungry, or an architect who designs the most magnificent cathedrals, all these people are doing good things but if they do not die in the state of sanctifying grace, they will merit only eternal damnation — not for the good things they did, of course, but for their mortal sins, which can only be blotted out with sanctifying grace, which cannot be “purchased” with naturally good works. Denial of this would constitute the heresy of Pelagianism — salvation by works without grace.

Francis:

... Even today, in fact, some are ridiculed or discriminated against for not following certain fads, which, however, place second-rate realities at the centre – for example, to follow after things instead of people, achievement instead of relationships. Let us give an example: I am thinking of some parents who need to work to maintain their family, but who cannot live for work alone – they need enough time to be with their children. I am also thinking of a priest or a sister who need to dedicate themselves to their service, without, however, forgetting to dedicate time to be with Jesus, otherwise, they will fall into spiritual worldliness and lose the sense of who they are. And again, I am thinking of a young man or woman who have thousands of commitments and passions – school, sports, various interests, cell phones and social networks – but who need to meet people and achieve great dreams, without losing time on passing things that do not leave their mark.

So here Francis simply doubles down on his distortion of the holy words of our Lord. One can follow after “people” and “relationships” instead of things and achievements all one’s life long — but if one dies in the state of mortal sin, everything will be lost… Francis is diverting people’s attention from the actual words of Christ to a fanciful reading that is compatible with his own [narrative].

The false pope is bluntly taking Christ’s exhortation not to lose one’s eternal life for the sake of one’s temporal life and twisting it into a Naturalist message of not to spend one’s temporal life on the trivial but rather on the meaningful. That is not what Christ said, nor is it what He meant! And Bergoglio knows it, obviously. All temporal life will end at death, “and after this the judgment” (Heb 9:27). If the soul is in the state of mortal sin, hell will be its eternal destiny. But that is a pesky little detail Bergoglio is bending over backwards to conceal from those who are unhappily seeking instruction from his blasphemous mouth.

Francis denounces figurative “idols”… (not so much literal idols):

All of this, brothers and sisters, requires some renunciation regarding the idols of efficiency and consumerism. But this is necessary so as not to get lost in things that end up getting thrown out, as they threw things out in Gehenna back then. And people often end up in today’s Gehenna’s, instead. Let’s think, of the least who are often treated like waste products and unwanted objects. There is a cost to remain faithful to what counts. The cost is going against the tide, the cost is freeing oneself from being conditioned by popular opinion, the cost is being separated from those who “follow the current”. But it does not matter, Jesus says. What matters is not to throw away the greatest good: life. This is the only thing that should frighten us.

So here the pseudo-papal shyster desperately tries to introduce one of his favorite talking points, which hinges on Gehenna having been a garbage dump. He then blatantly lies again by claiming that Christ’s teaching is: “What matters is not to throw away the greatest good: life.” No, this earthly life is not the greatest good, eternal life in Heaven is:

And calling the multitude together with his disciples, he said to them: If any man will follow me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. For whosoever will save his life, shall lose it: and whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel, shall save it. For what shall it profit a man, if he gain the whole world, and suffer the loss of his soul. Or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul? For he that shall be ashamed of me, and of my words, in this adulterous and sinful generation: the Son of man also will be ashamed of him, when he shall come in the glory of his Father with the holy angels. (Mark 8:34-38)

Francis adds insult to injury when in his very last paragraph he warns against “not putting [the] Gospel in first place”:

So let us ask ourselves: I, what do I fear? Not having what I like? Not reaching the goals society imposes? The judgement of others? Or rather of not pleasing the Lord, and not putting his Gospel in first place? Mary, ever Virgin, Mother most Wise, help us to be wise and courageous in the choices we make.

This false pope is a master deceiver, and he is audacious in his deception, for he denies the Gospel straight to your face and then exhorts you never to deny the Gospel. Bergoglio preaches “a charity without faith, very accommodating to unbelievers, which unfortunately opens the way to eternal ruin for all”, as Pope St. Pius X warned in his allocution of Apr. 17, 1907.

‘Pope’ Francis, Apostle of Hell

As we have seen, the true Gospel is supernatural; it is concerned first and foremost with eternal salvation, without which all is lost forever. The Gospel is not a sentimental collection of platitudes about human dignity, tolerance, unconditional acceptance and forgiveness, caresses and tenderness, or helping the needy. It is also not about dreaming, welcoming, including, accompanying, or affirming everyone and everything. That is Bergoglio’s false Naturalist gospel of man, not the true supernatural Gospel of Jesus Christ.

Christ became incarnate so we would be freed from the bondage of sin and be able to go to Heaven. He preached the truth about the fallen human condition and the divinely-given remedy, offering Himself as the Divine-Human Sacrifice to atone for our sins and purchase us back from the dominion of the evil one. Christ did not become man in order to preach a generic, interreligious “message of peace and justice, founded on fraternal charity and on forgiveness”.

This past Sunday, it is clear that Francis went out of his way to avoid speaking about eternal damnation; he instead bent over backwards to come up with some other “interpretation” of Christ’s plain words. But why? Who would have an interest in keeping the truth about hell away from souls?

Would it be our dear Lord Jesus, who suffered and died for souls precisely so they would not end up there and who Himself warned of the reality of the danger of hell throughout His earthly ministry? Or would it be Satan, the devil, who wants to see as many souls eternally damned as possible?
Click to expand...
The Hebrew word=SHEOL = The Greek word-HADES--Both translate-the grave, Hades=Hell. False religions teach a literal place of eternal suffering. Those do not know God-run from them.
 
1miseryindex said:
Well, I don't know.. Whom do we consult on this important matter?

Protestants?
Catholics?
Both?

Both faith communities are messed up, as we all know. Where can we find the answer?

Hey, I know.. How about Jesus Christ and His Word? In Mt 25:31 and other psgs, Jesus speaks of ETERNAL damnation aka punishment. So, you'd think that would settle matters. If not, here is a (an admittedly lengthy!) commentary from an ERUDITE theologian

I found this at novusordo.watch.net, not sure who the author is, but again, the Sedevacantist Catholics (that site is Sede) have the Truth on their side vis a vis the Vatican and its corruption/heresies. That's not necessarily a reason to stop going to NO Churches (??)

I copied it to read in full later --though, so far, it seems I could have written a lot of it myself.

(Yours truly bolded certain parts)


Theologian at Novusordowatch
(who uses Christ's Words to refute Francis's)
​


Francis once again displayed his masterful skills of distorting Sacred Scripture when what it teaches doesn’t jibe with his false gospel of forgiveness without repentance, which, far from demonstrating God’s great mercy for sinners, makes a mockery of the Redemption and only assists souls in going to hell, not to Heaven.

Our Lord, we must recall, pardoned only one of the two thieves crucified with Him, because only one was contrite. In this manner He taught us never to despair of His mercy, but at the same time never to presume on it either. Both despair and presumption are mortal sins — the Catholic medium between the two is the theological virtue of hope.

The Gospel reading for the Novus Ordo Missae (not the traditional missal) last Sunday, June 25, 2023, was Matthew 10:26-33.. We will quote the passage in full, first from the traditional Catholic Douay-Rheims translation, then from the translation used in the official Novus Ordo lectionary of the United States: Matthew 10:26-33 (Douay-Rheims)

Therefore fear them not. For nothing is covered that shall not be revealed: nor hid, that shall not be known. That which I tell you in the dark, speak ye in the light: and that which you hear in the ear, preach ye upon the housetops. And fear ye not them that kill the body, and are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him that can destroy both soul and body in hell. Are not two sparrows sold for a farthing? and not one of them shall fall on the ground without your Father. But the very hairs of your head are all numbered. Fear not therefore: better are you than many sparrows. Every one therefore that shall confess me before men, I will also confess him before my Father who is in heaven. But he that shall deny me before men, I will also deny him before my Father who is in heaven.

Matthew 10:26-33 (USCCB Lectionary)

Jesus said to the Twelve: “Fear no one. Nothing is concealed that will not be revealed, nor secret that will not be known. What I say to you in the darkness, speak in the light; what you hear whispered, proclaim on the housetops. And do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; rather, be afraid of the one who can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna. Are not two sparrows sold for a small coin? Yet not one of them falls to the ground without your Father’s knowledge. Even all the hairs of your head are counted. So do not be afraid; you are worth more than many sparrows. Everyone who acknowledges me before others I will acknowledge before my heavenly Father. But whoever denies me before others, I will deny before my heavenly Father.”

These words of [Jesus] are consoling in that they encourage and edify the soul by pointing out that although eternal damnation is a real and acute danger, nevertheless God will provide all the graces needed for us to win the battle against sin and temptation.. We are not left to our weakness; God will help us..

Our Lord.. warns that he who, not cooperating with the graces given him, will “deny me before men, I will also deny him before my Father who is in Heaven.” That’s a rather exclusionary message, one that clearly doesn’t work for Bergoglio’s new “big tent” synodal church. .

Knowing that we must tread the way of the Cross with Him if we are to persevere in grace (see Lk 9:23), our Lord warns that we must be willing to sacrifice any material good — even physical life itself — if necessary to preserve the state of sanctifying grace, which is the spiritual life of the soul: “And do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; rather, be afraid of the one who can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna.” Fr. Cornelius à Lapidé (1567-1637):

Verse 28. “And fear ye not them that kill the body, and are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him that can destroy both soul and body in hell..” The sense is: Do not, from fear of death with which the persecutors will threaten you, deny My Faith, or cease from the preaching which I have commanded you, or commit any act unworthy of it, for if ye do this, ye will incur both the death of the body and the far worse and longer-lasting death of the soul, even its eternal death in hell, where the damned die an undying death, because they are constantly live [sic] in mortal torments and endure as though in living death and moribund life, according to Isaias 66:24, Their worm shall not die, and their fire shall not be quenched. Truly does S. Chrysostom say (hom. 5 ad pop.), “He who is always afraid of hell will never fall into its flames, for he is continually purified by this fear.”

Verse 33. But he that shall deny me before men, I will also deny him before my Father who is in heaven. Christ adds this, so that whoever is not moved by His magnificent promise, might be daunted by the terrible threat, that just as Christ will acknowledge those who acknowledge Him, so too, He will deny those who deny Him, saying, I never knew you. Depart from me, you that work iniquity! (Matth. 7:23), that is, go to hell, to Lucifer, whom you serve (Matth. 25:12 ff.).

à Lapide: Gospel.. Mt

There is no question that Christ’s doctrine is challenging — Christianity is not for wimps — but it is not difficult to understand. Notice that our Blessed Lord in His great goodness is pleased to present this particular doctrine in the context of His generous assistance of providing the graces necessary to persevere. That is why He can say in another place: “For my yoke is sweet and my burden light” (Mt 11:3). Our Redeemer does not leave us out in the cold, so to speak, with the dreadful prospect of having to give our lives for Him based on our own strength. No, He makes clear that He will sustain us through all trials if only we are faithful to Him. If, however, we fail to cooperate with His graces and deny Him, and if we persist in this frightful state until death, He will then also deny us. We can see, then, how very serious the matter is.

Francis twists Christ’s Words to make them compatible with Naturalism

The Gospel reading of last Sunday is, then, not terribly difficult to make sense of. Francis had a terrific opportunity … to remind people that all is lost if we lose our souls.. that this temporal life is as nothing when compared to eternity. Hell, eternal damnation, is a very real possibility, and we must arm ourselves with prayers, good works, and self-denial..

In today’s Gospel, Jesus repeats to his disciples three different times: “have no fear” (Mt 10:26, 28, 31). Shortly prior to this, he had spoken to them about the persecutions they would have to undergo for the Gospel, a fact that is still a reality. Since its beginning, in fact, the Church has experienced, together with joys – of which she has had many – many persecutions. It seems paradoxical: the proclamation of the Kingdom of God is a message of peace and justice, founded on fraternal charity and on forgiveness; and yet it meets with opposition, violence, persecution. Jesus, however, says not to fear, not because everything will be all right in the world, no, but because we are precious to his Father and nothing that is good will be lost. He therefore tells us not to let fear block us, but rather to fear one other thing, only one. What is the thing Jesus tells us we should fear?

We discover what it is through an image Jesus uses today: the image of “Gehenna” (cf. v. 28). The valley of “Gehenna” was a place the inhabitants of Jerusalem knew well. It was the city’s large garbage dump. Jesus speaks about it in order to say that the true fear we should have, is that of throwing away one’s own life. Jesus says, “Yes, be afraid of that”. It was like saying: you do not need so much to be afraid of suffering misunderstanding and criticism, of losing prestige and economic advantages to remain faithful to the Gospel, no, but of wasting your existence in the pursuit of trivial things that do not fill life with meaning.

This is important for us today. Even today, in fact, some are ridiculed or discriminated against for not following certain fads, which, however, place second-rate realities at the centre – for example, to follow after things instead of people, achievement instead of relationships. Let us give an example: I am thinking of some parents who need to work to maintain their family, but who cannot live for work alone – they need enough time to be with their children. I am also thinking of a priest or a sister who need to dedicate themselves to their service, without, however, forgetting to dedicate time to be with Jesus, otherwise, they will fall into spiritual worldliness and lose the sense of who they are. And again, I am thinking of a young man or woman who have thousands of commitments and passions – school, sports, various interests, cell phones and social networks – but who need to meet people and achieve great dreams, without losing time on passing things that do not leave their mark.

All of this, brothers and sisters, requires some renunciation regarding the idols of efficiency and consumerism. But this is necessary so as not to get lost in things that end up getting thrown out, as they threw things out in Gehenna back then. And people often end up in today’s Gehenna’s, instead. Let’s think, of the least who are often treated like waste products and unwanted objects. There is a cost to remain faithful to what counts. The cost is going against the tide, the cost is freeing oneself from being conditioned by popular opinion, the cost is being separated from those who “follow the current”. But it does not matter, Jesus says. What matters is not to throw away the greatest good: life. This is the only thing that should frighten us. (Antipope Francis.. June 25, 2023)

…Perhaps we should be grateful that Bergoglio didn’t turn Christ’s warning about Gehenna into a sermon about the importance of recycling!

Francis… tries to get his hearers’ thoughts away from the supernatural and ..focused on [earthly] life

In today’s Gospel, Jesus repeats to his disciples three different times: “have no fear” (Mt 10:26, 28, 31). Shortly prior to this, he had spoken to them about the persecutions they would have to undergo for the Gospel, a fact that is still a reality. Since its beginning, in fact, the Church has experienced, together with joys – of which she has had many – many persecutions. It seems paradoxical: the proclamation of the Kingdom of God is a message of peace and justice, founded on fraternal charity and on forgiveness; and yet it meets with opposition, violence, persecution. Jesus, however, says not to fear, not because everything will be all right in the world, no, but because we are precious to his Father and nothing that is good will be lost. He therefore tells us not to let fear block us, but rather to fear one other thing, only one. What is the thing Jesus tells us we should fear?

… Certainly, peace, justice, charity, and forgiveness are part of the Gospel, but it cannot be reduced to that. The Good News of Jesus Christ is not the Kiwanis club with prayer.

If Francis actually taught the… full Gospel… he would see.. quickly why it meets with opposition from the world.

Christ was hated because, unlike Bergoglio, He did not preach a ‘hippie’ gospel. Rather, His preaching convicted the world of sin (cf. Jn 3:19; 16:8) and demanded the strictest standards of morality. For example, not only did Jesus condemn the external act of murder, but even uncharitable speech and hateful thoughts (see Mt 5:21-22); not only did He condemn the external act of adultery, as did the Jews as well, He made clear that even the least deliberately-willed impure thought was already an infraction of the divine law, and that it would be better to suffer any temporal sacrifice rather than commit mortal sin (see Mt 5:27-30). He sanctified matrimony by raising it to a grace-giving sacrament and restoring to it its original indissolubility (see Mt 5:31-32).

Christ preached the way of the Cross. He demanded not a merely external sanctity but one that consists in a true and inward renewal (rebirth) of the whole person (see Mt 5:20; Jn 3:5-6). He condemned vengeance… (see Mt 5:38-39). He demanded that we conform our lives to His (see Mt 11:29), exhorted all who can take it to perfect chastity (see Mt 19:11-12), and demanded that we love our neighbor as we love our very own selves (see Mk 12:31), even our enemies (see Mt 5:43-47). .

..He demanded that God be loved first and above all things (see Mk 12:29-30), including one’s family, relations, friends, and even life itself:

Do not think that I came to send peace upon earth: I came not to send peace, but the sword. For I came to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. And a man’s enemies shall be they of his own household. He that loveth father or mother more than me, is not worthy of me; and he that loveth son or daughter more than me, is not worthy of me. And he that taketh not up his cross, and followeth me, is not worthy of me. He that findeth his life, shall lose it: and he that shall lose his life for me, shall find it. (Matthew 10:34-39)

That is not the gospel preached by Bergoglio. No wonder the fake pope can’t figure out why anyone would oppose the Gospel! The true Gospel is not popular, not attractive to fallen man because it convicts him of sin and demands that he amend his ways under pain of eternal damnation. It requires self-denial, obedience to ecclesiastical authority, and sometimes even heroic sacrifices to save one’s soul: “…the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent bear it away” (Mt 11:12).

“Gehenna” is used by our Lord as a metaphor for hell. The Catholic Encyclopedia explains:

…in the New Testament the term Gehenna is used more frequently in preference to hades, as a name for the place of punishment of the damned. Gehenna is the Hebrew gê-hinnom (Nehemiah 11:30), or the longer form gê-ben-hinnom (Joshua 15:8), and gê-benê-hinnom (2 Kings 23:10) “valley of the sons of Hinnom”. Hinnom seems to be the name of a person not otherwise known. The Valley of Hinnom is south of Jerusalem and is now called Wadi er-rababi. It was notorious as the scene, in earlier days, of the horrible worship of Moloch. For this reason it was defiled by Josias (2 Kings 23:10), cursed by Jeremias (Jeremiah 7:31-33), and held in abomination by the Jews, who, accordingly, used the name of this valley to designate the abode of the damned (Targ. Jon., Gen., iii, 24; Henoch, c. xxvi). And Christ adopted this usage of the term. (The Catholic Encyclopedia, s.v. “Hell”)

Interestingly enough, even Bergoglio’s own so-called Catechism of the Catholic Church notes:

Jesus often speaks of “Gehenna,” of “the unquenchable fire” reserved for those who to the end of their lives refuse to believe and be converted, where both soul and body can be lost. Jesus solemnly proclaims that he “will send his angels, and they will gather . . . all evil doers, and throw them into the furnace of fire,” and that he will pronounce the condemnation: “Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire!” (Catechism of the Catholic Church, n. 1034)

So, when Francis says that Christ speaks about Gehenna “in order to say that the true fear we should have, is that of throwing away one’s own life”, that is inaccurate — He specifically warns against throwing one’s soul away, and He distinguishes it clearly from the life of the body. Notice how the false pope omits this crucial distinction and instead conflates both into “life”, hoping no one will notice.

Why Francis does this becomes apparent when we look at what he says immediately after, namely: “It was like saying: you do not need so much to be afraid of suffering misunderstanding and criticism, of losing prestige and economic advantages to remain faithful to the Gospel, no, but of wasting your existence in the pursuit of trivial things that do not fill life with meaning.”

Now it is clear: Bergoglio had to erase Christ’s contrast between the life of the body and the life of the soul in order to be able to make the divine warning about throwing your soul away (namely, into hell) into something about not “wasting your existence in the pursuit of trivial things that do not fill life with meaning”. Obviously, that is not what Christ said… Nor does life have to be “filled” with meaning, as if the meaning of our existence were something to be produced by us and not found in God and the Beatific Vision to which He has called us. But then those are supernatural things, and Francis wants to steer souls away from the supernatural and keep them focused on the things of the earth, lest they be saved: “He that is of the earth, of the earth he is, and of the earth he speaketh” (Jn 3:31).

The whole point of Christ’s warning in the Gospel passage is that one can spend one’s entire life doing non-trivial things — things that are good, legitimate, and important in themselves — and still go to hell! For example, a surgeon who saves lives every day for thirty years, or a social worker who frequently feeds the hungry, or an architect who designs the most magnificent cathedrals, all these people are doing good things but if they do not die in the state of sanctifying grace, they will merit only eternal damnation — not for the good things they did, of course, but for their mortal sins, which can only be blotted out with sanctifying grace, which cannot be “purchased” with naturally good works. Denial of this would constitute the heresy of Pelagianism — salvation by works without grace.

Francis:

... Even today, in fact, some are ridiculed or discriminated against for not following certain fads, which, however, place second-rate realities at the centre – for example, to follow after things instead of people, achievement instead of relationships. Let us give an example: I am thinking of some parents who need to work to maintain their family, but who cannot live for work alone – they need enough time to be with their children. I am also thinking of a priest or a sister who need to dedicate themselves to their service, without, however, forgetting to dedicate time to be with Jesus, otherwise, they will fall into spiritual worldliness and lose the sense of who they are. And again, I am thinking of a young man or woman who have thousands of commitments and passions – school, sports, various interests, cell phones and social networks – but who need to meet people and achieve great dreams, without losing time on passing things that do not leave their mark.

So here Francis simply doubles down on his distortion of the holy words of our Lord. One can follow after “people” and “relationships” instead of things and achievements all one’s life long — but if one dies in the state of mortal sin, everything will be lost… Francis is diverting people’s attention from the actual words of Christ to a fanciful reading that is compatible with his own [narrative].

The false pope is bluntly taking Christ’s exhortation not to lose one’s eternal life for the sake of one’s temporal life and twisting it into a Naturalist message of not to spend one’s temporal life on the trivial but rather on the meaningful. That is not what Christ said, nor is it what He meant! And Bergoglio knows it, obviously. All temporal life will end at death, “and after this the judgment” (Heb 9:27). If the soul is in the state of mortal sin, hell will be its eternal destiny. But that is a pesky little detail Bergoglio is bending over backwards to conceal from those who are unhappily seeking instruction from his blasphemous mouth.

Francis denounces figurative “idols”… (not so much literal idols):

All of this, brothers and sisters, requires some renunciation regarding the idols of efficiency and consumerism. But this is necessary so as not to get lost in things that end up getting thrown out, as they threw things out in Gehenna back then. And people often end up in today’s Gehenna’s, instead. Let’s think, of the least who are often treated like waste products and unwanted objects. There is a cost to remain faithful to what counts. The cost is going against the tide, the cost is freeing oneself from being conditioned by popular opinion, the cost is being separated from those who “follow the current”. But it does not matter, Jesus says. What matters is not to throw away the greatest good: life. This is the only thing that should frighten us.

So here the pseudo-papal shyster desperately tries to introduce one of his favorite talking points, which hinges on Gehenna having been a garbage dump. He then blatantly lies again by claiming that Christ’s teaching is: “What matters is not to throw away the greatest good: life.” No, this earthly life is not the greatest good, eternal life in Heaven is:

And calling the multitude together with his disciples, he said to them: If any man will follow me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. For whosoever will save his life, shall lose it: and whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel, shall save it. For what shall it profit a man, if he gain the whole world, and suffer the loss of his soul. Or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul? For he that shall be ashamed of me, and of my words, in this adulterous and sinful generation: the Son of man also will be ashamed of him, when he shall come in the glory of his Father with the holy angels. (Mark 8:34-38)

Francis adds insult to injury when in his very last paragraph he warns against “not putting [the] Gospel in first place”:

So let us ask ourselves: I, what do I fear? Not having what I like? Not reaching the goals society imposes? The judgement of others? Or rather of not pleasing the Lord, and not putting his Gospel in first place? Mary, ever Virgin, Mother most Wise, help us to be wise and courageous in the choices we make.

This false pope is a master deceiver, and he is audacious in his deception, for he denies the Gospel straight to your face and then exhorts you never to deny the Gospel. Bergoglio preaches “a charity without faith, very accommodating to unbelievers, which unfortunately opens the way to eternal ruin for all”, as Pope St. Pius X warned in his allocution of Apr. 17, 1907.

‘Pope’ Francis, Apostle of Hell

As we have seen, the true Gospel is supernatural; it is concerned first and foremost with eternal salvation, without which all is lost forever. The Gospel is not a sentimental collection of platitudes about human dignity, tolerance, unconditional acceptance and forgiveness, caresses and tenderness, or helping the needy. It is also not about dreaming, welcoming, including, accompanying, or affirming everyone and everything. That is Bergoglio’s false Naturalist gospel of man, not the true supernatural Gospel of Jesus Christ.

Christ became incarnate so we would be freed from the bondage of sin and be able to go to Heaven. He preached the truth about the fallen human condition and the divinely-given remedy, offering Himself as the Divine-Human Sacrifice to atone for our sins and purchase us back from the dominion of the evil one. Christ did not become man in order to preach a generic, interreligious “message of peace and justice, founded on fraternal charity and on forgiveness”.

This past Sunday, it is clear that Francis went out of his way to avoid speaking about eternal damnation; he instead bent over backwards to come up with some other “interpretation” of Christ’s plain words. But why? Who would have an interest in keeping the truth about hell away from souls?

Would it be our dear Lord Jesus, who suffered and died for souls precisely so they would not end up there and who Himself warned of the reality of the danger of hell throughout His earthly ministry? Or would it be Satan, the devil, who wants to see as many souls eternally damned as possible?
Click to expand...


Massive wall of text, Batman!

Do you have the cliffs notes version of this?
 
Last edited:
1miseryindex said:
Well, I don't know.. Whom do we consult on this important matter?

Protestants?
Catholics?
Both?

Both faith communities are messed up, as we all know. Where can we find the answer?

Hey, I know.. How about Jesus Christ and His Word? In Mt 25:31 and other psgs, Jesus speaks of ETERNAL damnation aka punishment. So, you'd think that would settle matters. If not, here is a (an admittedly lengthy!) commentary from an ERUDITE theologian

I found this at novusordo.watch.net, not sure who the author is, but again, the Sedevacantist Catholics (that site is Sede) have the Truth on their side vis a vis the Vatican and its corruption/heresies. That's not necessarily a reason to stop going to NO Churches (??)

I copied it to read in full later --though, so far, it seems I could have written a lot of it myself.

(Yours truly bolded certain parts)


Theologian at Novusordowatch
(who uses Christ's Words to refute Francis's)
​


Francis once again displayed his masterful skills of distorting Sacred Scripture when what it teaches doesn’t jibe with his false gospel of forgiveness without repentance, which, far from demonstrating God’s great mercy for sinners, makes a mockery of the Redemption and only assists souls in going to hell, not to Heaven.

Our Lord, we must recall, pardoned only one of the two thieves crucified with Him, because only one was contrite. In this manner He taught us never to despair of His mercy, but at the same time never to presume on it either. Both despair and presumption are mortal sins — the Catholic medium between the two is the theological virtue of hope.

The Gospel reading for the Novus Ordo Missae (not the traditional missal) last Sunday, June 25, 2023, was Matthew 10:26-33.. We will quote the passage in full, first from the traditional Catholic Douay-Rheims translation, then from the translation used in the official Novus Ordo lectionary of the United States: Matthew 10:26-33 (Douay-Rheims)

Therefore fear them not. For nothing is covered that shall not be revealed: nor hid, that shall not be known. That which I tell you in the dark, speak ye in the light: and that which you hear in the ear, preach ye upon the housetops. And fear ye not them that kill the body, and are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him that can destroy both soul and body in hell. Are not two sparrows sold for a farthing? and not one of them shall fall on the ground without your Father. But the very hairs of your head are all numbered. Fear not therefore: better are you than many sparrows. Every one therefore that shall confess me before men, I will also confess him before my Father who is in heaven. But he that shall deny me before men, I will also deny him before my Father who is in heaven.

Matthew 10:26-33 (USCCB Lectionary)

Jesus said to the Twelve: “Fear no one. Nothing is concealed that will not be revealed, nor secret that will not be known. What I say to you in the darkness, speak in the light; what you hear whispered, proclaim on the housetops. And do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; rather, be afraid of the one who can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna. Are not two sparrows sold for a small coin? Yet not one of them falls to the ground without your Father’s knowledge. Even all the hairs of your head are counted. So do not be afraid; you are worth more than many sparrows. Everyone who acknowledges me before others I will acknowledge before my heavenly Father. But whoever denies me before others, I will deny before my heavenly Father.”

These words of [Jesus] are consoling in that they encourage and edify the soul by pointing out that although eternal damnation is a real and acute danger, nevertheless God will provide all the graces needed for us to win the battle against sin and temptation.. We are not left to our weakness; God will help us..

Our Lord.. warns that he who, not cooperating with the graces given him, will “deny me before men, I will also deny him before my Father who is in Heaven.” That’s a rather exclusionary message, one that clearly doesn’t work for Bergoglio’s new “big tent” synodal church. .

Knowing that we must tread the way of the Cross with Him if we are to persevere in grace (see Lk 9:23), our Lord warns that we must be willing to sacrifice any material good — even physical life itself — if necessary to preserve the state of sanctifying grace, which is the spiritual life of the soul: “And do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; rather, be afraid of the one who can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna.” Fr. Cornelius à Lapidé (1567-1637):

Verse 28. “And fear ye not them that kill the body, and are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him that can destroy both soul and body in hell..” The sense is: Do not, from fear of death with which the persecutors will threaten you, deny My Faith, or cease from the preaching which I have commanded you, or commit any act unworthy of it, for if ye do this, ye will incur both the death of the body and the far worse and longer-lasting death of the soul, even its eternal death in hell, where the damned die an undying death, because they are constantly live [sic] in mortal torments and endure as though in living death and moribund life, according to Isaias 66:24, Their worm shall not die, and their fire shall not be quenched. Truly does S. Chrysostom say (hom. 5 ad pop.), “He who is always afraid of hell will never fall into its flames, for he is continually purified by this fear.”

Verse 33. But he that shall deny me before men, I will also deny him before my Father who is in heaven. Christ adds this, so that whoever is not moved by His magnificent promise, might be daunted by the terrible threat, that just as Christ will acknowledge those who acknowledge Him, so too, He will deny those who deny Him, saying, I never knew you. Depart from me, you that work iniquity! (Matth. 7:23), that is, go to hell, to Lucifer, whom you serve (Matth. 25:12 ff.).

à Lapide: Gospel.. Mt

There is no question that Christ’s doctrine is challenging — Christianity is not for wimps — but it is not difficult to understand. Notice that our Blessed Lord in His great goodness is pleased to present this particular doctrine in the context of His generous assistance of providing the graces necessary to persevere. That is why He can say in another place: “For my yoke is sweet and my burden light” (Mt 11:3). Our Redeemer does not leave us out in the cold, so to speak, with the dreadful prospect of having to give our lives for Him based on our own strength. No, He makes clear that He will sustain us through all trials if only we are faithful to Him. If, however, we fail to cooperate with His graces and deny Him, and if we persist in this frightful state until death, He will then also deny us. We can see, then, how very serious the matter is.

Francis twists Christ’s Words to make them compatible with Naturalism

The Gospel reading of last Sunday is, then, not terribly difficult to make sense of. Francis had a terrific opportunity … to remind people that all is lost if we lose our souls.. that this temporal life is as nothing when compared to eternity. Hell, eternal damnation, is a very real possibility, and we must arm ourselves with prayers, good works, and self-denial..

In today’s Gospel, Jesus repeats to his disciples three different times: “have no fear” (Mt 10:26, 28, 31). Shortly prior to this, he had spoken to them about the persecutions they would have to undergo for the Gospel, a fact that is still a reality. Since its beginning, in fact, the Church has experienced, together with joys – of which she has had many – many persecutions. It seems paradoxical: the proclamation of the Kingdom of God is a message of peace and justice, founded on fraternal charity and on forgiveness; and yet it meets with opposition, violence, persecution. Jesus, however, says not to fear, not because everything will be all right in the world, no, but because we are precious to his Father and nothing that is good will be lost. He therefore tells us not to let fear block us, but rather to fear one other thing, only one. What is the thing Jesus tells us we should fear?

We discover what it is through an image Jesus uses today: the image of “Gehenna” (cf. v. 28). The valley of “Gehenna” was a place the inhabitants of Jerusalem knew well. It was the city’s large garbage dump. Jesus speaks about it in order to say that the true fear we should have, is that of throwing away one’s own life. Jesus says, “Yes, be afraid of that”. It was like saying: you do not need so much to be afraid of suffering misunderstanding and criticism, of losing prestige and economic advantages to remain faithful to the Gospel, no, but of wasting your existence in the pursuit of trivial things that do not fill life with meaning.

This is important for us today. Even today, in fact, some are ridiculed or discriminated against for not following certain fads, which, however, place second-rate realities at the centre – for example, to follow after things instead of people, achievement instead of relationships. Let us give an example: I am thinking of some parents who need to work to maintain their family, but who cannot live for work alone – they need enough time to be with their children. I am also thinking of a priest or a sister who need to dedicate themselves to their service, without, however, forgetting to dedicate time to be with Jesus, otherwise, they will fall into spiritual worldliness and lose the sense of who they are. And again, I am thinking of a young man or woman who have thousands of commitments and passions – school, sports, various interests, cell phones and social networks – but who need to meet people and achieve great dreams, without losing time on passing things that do not leave their mark.

All of this, brothers and sisters, requires some renunciation regarding the idols of efficiency and consumerism. But this is necessary so as not to get lost in things that end up getting thrown out, as they threw things out in Gehenna back then. And people often end up in today’s Gehenna’s, instead. Let’s think, of the least who are often treated like waste products and unwanted objects. There is a cost to remain faithful to what counts. The cost is going against the tide, the cost is freeing oneself from being conditioned by popular opinion, the cost is being separated from those who “follow the current”. But it does not matter, Jesus says. What matters is not to throw away the greatest good: life. This is the only thing that should frighten us. (Antipope Francis.. June 25, 2023)

…Perhaps we should be grateful that Bergoglio didn’t turn Christ’s warning about Gehenna into a sermon about the importance of recycling!

Francis… tries to get his hearers’ thoughts away from the supernatural and ..focused on [earthly] life

In today’s Gospel, Jesus repeats to his disciples three different times: “have no fear” (Mt 10:26, 28, 31). Shortly prior to this, he had spoken to them about the persecutions they would have to undergo for the Gospel, a fact that is still a reality. Since its beginning, in fact, the Church has experienced, together with joys – of which she has had many – many persecutions. It seems paradoxical: the proclamation of the Kingdom of God is a message of peace and justice, founded on fraternal charity and on forgiveness; and yet it meets with opposition, violence, persecution. Jesus, however, says not to fear, not because everything will be all right in the world, no, but because we are precious to his Father and nothing that is good will be lost. He therefore tells us not to let fear block us, but rather to fear one other thing, only one. What is the thing Jesus tells us we should fear?

… Certainly, peace, justice, charity, and forgiveness are part of the Gospel, but it cannot be reduced to that. The Good News of Jesus Christ is not the Kiwanis club with prayer.

If Francis actually taught the… full Gospel… he would see.. quickly why it meets with opposition from the world.

Christ was hated because, unlike Bergoglio, He did not preach a ‘hippie’ gospel. Rather, His preaching convicted the world of sin (cf. Jn 3:19; 16:8) and demanded the strictest standards of morality. For example, not only did Jesus condemn the external act of murder, but even uncharitable speech and hateful thoughts (see Mt 5:21-22); not only did He condemn the external act of adultery, as did the Jews as well, He made clear that even the least deliberately-willed impure thought was already an infraction of the divine law, and that it would be better to suffer any temporal sacrifice rather than commit mortal sin (see Mt 5:27-30). He sanctified matrimony by raising it to a grace-giving sacrament and restoring to it its original indissolubility (see Mt 5:31-32).

Christ preached the way of the Cross. He demanded not a merely external sanctity but one that consists in a true and inward renewal (rebirth) of the whole person (see Mt 5:20; Jn 3:5-6). He condemned vengeance… (see Mt 5:38-39). He demanded that we conform our lives to His (see Mt 11:29), exhorted all who can take it to perfect chastity (see Mt 19:11-12), and demanded that we love our neighbor as we love our very own selves (see Mk 12:31), even our enemies (see Mt 5:43-47). .

..He demanded that God be loved first and above all things (see Mk 12:29-30), including one’s family, relations, friends, and even life itself:

Do not think that I came to send peace upon earth: I came not to send peace, but the sword. For I came to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. And a man’s enemies shall be they of his own household. He that loveth father or mother more than me, is not worthy of me; and he that loveth son or daughter more than me, is not worthy of me. And he that taketh not up his cross, and followeth me, is not worthy of me. He that findeth his life, shall lose it: and he that shall lose his life for me, shall find it. (Matthew 10:34-39)

That is not the gospel preached by Bergoglio. No wonder the fake pope can’t figure out why anyone would oppose the Gospel! The true Gospel is not popular, not attractive to fallen man because it convicts him of sin and demands that he amend his ways under pain of eternal damnation. It requires self-denial, obedience to ecclesiastical authority, and sometimes even heroic sacrifices to save one’s soul: “…the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent bear it away” (Mt 11:12).

“Gehenna” is used by our Lord as a metaphor for hell. The Catholic Encyclopedia explains:

…in the New Testament the term Gehenna is used more frequently in preference to hades, as a name for the place of punishment of the damned. Gehenna is the Hebrew gê-hinnom (Nehemiah 11:30), or the longer form gê-ben-hinnom (Joshua 15:8), and gê-benê-hinnom (2 Kings 23:10) “valley of the sons of Hinnom”. Hinnom seems to be the name of a person not otherwise known. The Valley of Hinnom is south of Jerusalem and is now called Wadi er-rababi. It was notorious as the scene, in earlier days, of the horrible worship of Moloch. For this reason it was defiled by Josias (2 Kings 23:10), cursed by Jeremias (Jeremiah 7:31-33), and held in abomination by the Jews, who, accordingly, used the name of this valley to designate the abode of the damned (Targ. Jon., Gen., iii, 24; Henoch, c. xxvi). And Christ adopted this usage of the term. (The Catholic Encyclopedia, s.v. “Hell”)

Interestingly enough, even Bergoglio’s own so-called Catechism of the Catholic Church notes:

Jesus often speaks of “Gehenna,” of “the unquenchable fire” reserved for those who to the end of their lives refuse to believe and be converted, where both soul and body can be lost. Jesus solemnly proclaims that he “will send his angels, and they will gather . . . all evil doers, and throw them into the furnace of fire,” and that he will pronounce the condemnation: “Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire!” (Catechism of the Catholic Church, n. 1034)

So, when Francis says that Christ speaks about Gehenna “in order to say that the true fear we should have, is that of throwing away one’s own life”, that is inaccurate — He specifically warns against throwing one’s soul away, and He distinguishes it clearly from the life of the body. Notice how the false pope omits this crucial distinction and instead conflates both into “life”, hoping no one will notice.

Why Francis does this becomes apparent when we look at what he says immediately after, namely: “It was like saying: you do not need so much to be afraid of suffering misunderstanding and criticism, of losing prestige and economic advantages to remain faithful to the Gospel, no, but of wasting your existence in the pursuit of trivial things that do not fill life with meaning.”

Now it is clear: Bergoglio had to erase Christ’s contrast between the life of the body and the life of the soul in order to be able to make the divine warning about throwing your soul away (namely, into hell) into something about not “wasting your existence in the pursuit of trivial things that do not fill life with meaning”. Obviously, that is not what Christ said… Nor does life have to be “filled” with meaning, as if the meaning of our existence were something to be produced by us and not found in God and the Beatific Vision to which He has called us. But then those are supernatural things, and Francis wants to steer souls away from the supernatural and keep them focused on the things of the earth, lest they be saved: “He that is of the earth, of the earth he is, and of the earth he speaketh” (Jn 3:31).

The whole point of Christ’s warning in the Gospel passage is that one can spend one’s entire life doing non-trivial things — things that are good, legitimate, and important in themselves — and still go to hell! For example, a surgeon who saves lives every day for thirty years, or a social worker who frequently feeds the hungry, or an architect who designs the most magnificent cathedrals, all these people are doing good things but if they do not die in the state of sanctifying grace, they will merit only eternal damnation — not for the good things they did, of course, but for their mortal sins, which can only be blotted out with sanctifying grace, which cannot be “purchased” with naturally good works. Denial of this would constitute the heresy of Pelagianism — salvation by works without grace.

Francis:

... Even today, in fact, some are ridiculed or discriminated against for not following certain fads, which, however, place second-rate realities at the centre – for example, to follow after things instead of people, achievement instead of relationships. Let us give an example: I am thinking of some parents who need to work to maintain their family, but who cannot live for work alone – they need enough time to be with their children. I am also thinking of a priest or a sister who need to dedicate themselves to their service, without, however, forgetting to dedicate time to be with Jesus, otherwise, they will fall into spiritual worldliness and lose the sense of who they are. And again, I am thinking of a young man or woman who have thousands of commitments and passions – school, sports, various interests, cell phones and social networks – but who need to meet people and achieve great dreams, without losing time on passing things that do not leave their mark.

So here Francis simply doubles down on his distortion of the holy words of our Lord. One can follow after “people” and “relationships” instead of things and achievements all one’s life long — but if one dies in the state of mortal sin, everything will be lost… Francis is diverting people’s attention from the actual words of Christ to a fanciful reading that is compatible with his own [narrative].

The false pope is bluntly taking Christ’s exhortation not to lose one’s eternal life for the sake of one’s temporal life and twisting it into a Naturalist message of not to spend one’s temporal life on the trivial but rather on the meaningful. That is not what Christ said, nor is it what He meant! And Bergoglio knows it, obviously. All temporal life will end at death, “and after this the judgment” (Heb 9:27). If the soul is in the state of mortal sin, hell will be its eternal destiny. But that is a pesky little detail Bergoglio is bending over backwards to conceal from those who are unhappily seeking instruction from his blasphemous mouth.

Francis denounces figurative “idols”… (not so much literal idols):

All of this, brothers and sisters, requires some renunciation regarding the idols of efficiency and consumerism. But this is necessary so as not to get lost in things that end up getting thrown out, as they threw things out in Gehenna back then. And people often end up in today’s Gehenna’s, instead. Let’s think, of the least who are often treated like waste products and unwanted objects. There is a cost to remain faithful to what counts. The cost is going against the tide, the cost is freeing oneself from being conditioned by popular opinion, the cost is being separated from those who “follow the current”. But it does not matter, Jesus says. What matters is not to throw away the greatest good: life. This is the only thing that should frighten us.

So here the pseudo-papal shyster desperately tries to introduce one of his favorite talking points, which hinges on Gehenna having been a garbage dump. He then blatantly lies again by claiming that Christ’s teaching is: “What matters is not to throw away the greatest good: life.” No, this earthly life is not the greatest good, eternal life in Heaven is:

And calling the multitude together with his disciples, he said to them: If any man will follow me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. For whosoever will save his life, shall lose it: and whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel, shall save it. For what shall it profit a man, if he gain the whole world, and suffer the loss of his soul. Or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul? For he that shall be ashamed of me, and of my words, in this adulterous and sinful generation: the Son of man also will be ashamed of him, when he shall come in the glory of his Father with the holy angels. (Mark 8:34-38)

Francis adds insult to injury when in his very last paragraph he warns against “not putting [the] Gospel in first place”:

So let us ask ourselves: I, what do I fear? Not having what I like? Not reaching the goals society imposes? The judgement of others? Or rather of not pleasing the Lord, and not putting his Gospel in first place? Mary, ever Virgin, Mother most Wise, help us to be wise and courageous in the choices we make.

This false pope is a master deceiver, and he is audacious in his deception, for he denies the Gospel straight to your face and then exhorts you never to deny the Gospel. Bergoglio preaches “a charity without faith, very accommodating to unbelievers, which unfortunately opens the way to eternal ruin for all”, as Pope St. Pius X warned in his allocution of Apr. 17, 1907.

‘Pope’ Francis, Apostle of Hell

As we have seen, the true Gospel is supernatural; it is concerned first and foremost with eternal salvation, without which all is lost forever. The Gospel is not a sentimental collection of platitudes about human dignity, tolerance, unconditional acceptance and forgiveness, caresses and tenderness, or helping the needy. It is also not about dreaming, welcoming, including, accompanying, or affirming everyone and everything. That is Bergoglio’s false Naturalist gospel of man, not the true supernatural Gospel of Jesus Christ.

Christ became incarnate so we would be freed from the bondage of sin and be able to go to Heaven. He preached the truth about the fallen human condition and the divinely-given remedy, offering Himself as the Divine-Human Sacrifice to atone for our sins and purchase us back from the dominion of the evil one. Christ did not become man in order to preach a generic, interreligious “message of peace and justice, founded on fraternal charity and on forgiveness”.

This past Sunday, it is clear that Francis went out of his way to avoid speaking about eternal damnation; he instead bent over backwards to come up with some other “interpretation” of Christ’s plain words. But why? Who would have an interest in keeping the truth about hell away from souls?

Would it be our dear Lord Jesus, who suffered and died for souls precisely so they would not end up there and who Himself warned of the reality of the danger of hell throughout His earthly ministry? Or would it be Satan, the devil, who wants to see as many souls eternally damned as possible?
Click to expand...
What common sense tells you is that the aim to show Hell is not eternal punishment is motivated to escape doing what you would do if that were true. ISthat your aim"
 
kjw47 said:
The Hebrew word=SHEOL = The Greek word-HADES--Both translate-the grave, Hades=Hell. False religions teach a literal place of eternal suffering. Those do not know God-run from them.
Click to expand...
Logic shows you can't be right.
First two perliminaries.
Hell is knowledge that you have eternally missed Heaven. You make it a place but on no grounds
Hell can't be what you take Sheol to be since the whole BIble is progressive revelation. Do we say based on the Pentateuch that David could not have meant that. Your view logically is that the first part of the revelation must have been the whole revelation OR the rest that came over hundreds of years was superfluos and contributes nothing new. And more: This would mean that the Word of God is useless past the first revelation.

Anyway your view of Hell is illogical even on your own terms, as here is shown

—it is fearful, but it is right to say it;—that if we wished to imagine a punishment for an unholy, reprobate soul, we perhaps could not fancy a greater than to summon it to heaven. Heaven would be hell to an irreligious man. We know how unhappy we are apt to feel at present, when alone in the midst of strangers, or of men of different tastes and habits from ourselves. How miserable, for example, would it be to have to live in a foreign land, among a people whose faces we never saw before, and whose language we could not learn. And this is but a faint illustration of the loneliness of a man of earthly dispositions and tastes, thrust into the society of saints and angels. How forlorn would he wander through the courts of heaven! He would find no one like himself; he would see in every direction the marks {8} of God's holiness, and these would make him shudder. He would feel himself always in His presence. He could no longer turn his thoughts another way, as he does now, when conscience reproaches him. He would know that the Eternal Eye was ever upon him; and that Eye of holiness, which is joy and life to holy creatures, would seem to him an Eye of wrath and punishment. God cannot change His nature. Holy He must ever be. But while He is holy, no unholy soul can be happy in heaven.
 
If our imaginary Goddy fellow destroys Time it becomes impossible to see Space
At best it becomes a frozen and unchanging single shot .

No consciousness is then possible because that needs Time for it to register in

Goddy needs to think it through before blundering further .
 
1miseryindex said:
Well, I don't know.. Whom do we consult on this important matter?

Protestants?
Catholics?
Both?

Both faith communities are messed up, as we all know. Where can we find the answer?

Hey, I know.. How about Jesus Christ and His Word? In Mt 25:31 and other psgs, Jesus speaks of ETERNAL damnation aka punishment. So, you'd think that would settle matters. If not, here is a (an admittedly lengthy!) commentary from an ERUDITE theologian

I found this at novusordo.watch.net, not sure who the author is, but again, the Sedevacantist Catholics (that site is Sede) have the Truth on their side vis a vis the Vatican and its corruption/heresies. That's not necessarily a reason to stop going to NO Churches (??)

I copied it to read in full later --though, so far, it seems I could have written a lot of it myself.

(Yours truly bolded certain parts)


Theologian at Novusordowatch
(who uses Christ's Words to refute Francis's)
​


Francis once again displayed his masterful skills of distorting Sacred Scripture when what it teaches doesn’t jibe with his false gospel of forgiveness without repentance, which, far from demonstrating God’s great mercy for sinners, makes a mockery of the Redemption and only assists souls in going to hell, not to Heaven.

Our Lord, we must recall, pardoned only one of the two thieves crucified with Him, because only one was contrite. In this manner He taught us never to despair of His mercy, but at the same time never to presume on it either. Both despair and presumption are mortal sins — the Catholic medium between the two is the theological virtue of hope.

The Gospel reading for the Novus Ordo Missae (not the traditional missal) last Sunday, June 25, 2023, was Matthew 10:26-33.. We will quote the passage in full, first from the traditional Catholic Douay-Rheims translation, then from the translation used in the official Novus Ordo lectionary of the United States: Matthew 10:26-33 (Douay-Rheims)

Therefore fear them not. For nothing is covered that shall not be revealed: nor hid, that shall not be known. That which I tell you in the dark, speak ye in the light: and that which you hear in the ear, preach ye upon the housetops. And fear ye not them that kill the body, and are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him that can destroy both soul and body in hell. Are not two sparrows sold for a farthing? and not one of them shall fall on the ground without your Father. But the very hairs of your head are all numbered. Fear not therefore: better are you than many sparrows. Every one therefore that shall confess me before men, I will also confess him before my Father who is in heaven. But he that shall deny me before men, I will also deny him before my Father who is in heaven.

Matthew 10:26-33 (USCCB Lectionary)

Jesus said to the Twelve: “Fear no one. Nothing is concealed that will not be revealed, nor secret that will not be known. What I say to you in the darkness, speak in the light; what you hear whispered, proclaim on the housetops. And do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; rather, be afraid of the one who can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna. Are not two sparrows sold for a small coin? Yet not one of them falls to the ground without your Father’s knowledge. Even all the hairs of your head are counted. So do not be afraid; you are worth more than many sparrows. Everyone who acknowledges me before others I will acknowledge before my heavenly Father. But whoever denies me before others, I will deny before my heavenly Father.”

These words of [Jesus] are consoling in that they encourage and edify the soul by pointing out that although eternal damnation is a real and acute danger, nevertheless God will provide all the graces needed for us to win the battle against sin and temptation.. We are not left to our weakness; God will help us..

Our Lord.. warns that he who, not cooperating with the graces given him, will “deny me before men, I will also deny him before my Father who is in Heaven.” That’s a rather exclusionary message, one that clearly doesn’t work for Bergoglio’s new “big tent” synodal church. .

Knowing that we must tread the way of the Cross with Him if we are to persevere in grace (see Lk 9:23), our Lord warns that we must be willing to sacrifice any material good — even physical life itself — if necessary to preserve the state of sanctifying grace, which is the spiritual life of the soul: “And do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; rather, be afraid of the one who can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna.” Fr. Cornelius à Lapidé (1567-1637):

Verse 28. “And fear ye not them that kill the body, and are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him that can destroy both soul and body in hell..” The sense is: Do not, from fear of death with which the persecutors will threaten you, deny My Faith, or cease from the preaching which I have commanded you, or commit any act unworthy of it, for if ye do this, ye will incur both the death of the body and the far worse and longer-lasting death of the soul, even its eternal death in hell, where the damned die an undying death, because they are constantly live [sic] in mortal torments and endure as though in living death and moribund life, according to Isaias 66:24, Their worm shall not die, and their fire shall not be quenched. Truly does S. Chrysostom say (hom. 5 ad pop.), “He who is always afraid of hell will never fall into its flames, for he is continually purified by this fear.”

Verse 33. But he that shall deny me before men, I will also deny him before my Father who is in heaven. Christ adds this, so that whoever is not moved by His magnificent promise, might be daunted by the terrible threat, that just as Christ will acknowledge those who acknowledge Him, so too, He will deny those who deny Him, saying, I never knew you. Depart from me, you that work iniquity! (Matth. 7:23), that is, go to hell, to Lucifer, whom you serve (Matth. 25:12 ff.).

à Lapide: Gospel.. Mt

There is no question that Christ’s doctrine is challenging — Christianity is not for wimps — but it is not difficult to understand. Notice that our Blessed Lord in His great goodness is pleased to present this particular doctrine in the context of His generous assistance of providing the graces necessary to persevere. That is why He can say in another place: “For my yoke is sweet and my burden light” (Mt 11:3). Our Redeemer does not leave us out in the cold, so to speak, with the dreadful prospect of having to give our lives for Him based on our own strength. No, He makes clear that He will sustain us through all trials if only we are faithful to Him. If, however, we fail to cooperate with His graces and deny Him, and if we persist in this frightful state until death, He will then also deny us. We can see, then, how very serious the matter is.

Francis twists Christ’s Words to make them compatible with Naturalism

The Gospel reading of last Sunday is, then, not terribly difficult to make sense of. Francis had a terrific opportunity … to remind people that all is lost if we lose our souls.. that this temporal life is as nothing when compared to eternity. Hell, eternal damnation, is a very real possibility, and we must arm ourselves with prayers, good works, and self-denial..

In today’s Gospel, Jesus repeats to his disciples three different times: “have no fear” (Mt 10:26, 28, 31). Shortly prior to this, he had spoken to them about the persecutions they would have to undergo for the Gospel, a fact that is still a reality. Since its beginning, in fact, the Church has experienced, together with joys – of which she has had many – many persecutions. It seems paradoxical: the proclamation of the Kingdom of God is a message of peace and justice, founded on fraternal charity and on forgiveness; and yet it meets with opposition, violence, persecution. Jesus, however, says not to fear, not because everything will be all right in the world, no, but because we are precious to his Father and nothing that is good will be lost. He therefore tells us not to let fear block us, but rather to fear one other thing, only one. What is the thing Jesus tells us we should fear?

We discover what it is through an image Jesus uses today: the image of “Gehenna” (cf. v. 28). The valley of “Gehenna” was a place the inhabitants of Jerusalem knew well. It was the city’s large garbage dump. Jesus speaks about it in order to say that the true fear we should have, is that of throwing away one’s own life. Jesus says, “Yes, be afraid of that”. It was like saying: you do not need so much to be afraid of suffering misunderstanding and criticism, of losing prestige and economic advantages to remain faithful to the Gospel, no, but of wasting your existence in the pursuit of trivial things that do not fill life with meaning.

This is important for us today. Even today, in fact, some are ridiculed or discriminated against for not following certain fads, which, however, place second-rate realities at the centre – for example, to follow after things instead of people, achievement instead of relationships. Let us give an example: I am thinking of some parents who need to work to maintain their family, but who cannot live for work alone – they need enough time to be with their children. I am also thinking of a priest or a sister who need to dedicate themselves to their service, without, however, forgetting to dedicate time to be with Jesus, otherwise, they will fall into spiritual worldliness and lose the sense of who they are. And again, I am thinking of a young man or woman who have thousands of commitments and passions – school, sports, various interests, cell phones and social networks – but who need to meet people and achieve great dreams, without losing time on passing things that do not leave their mark.

All of this, brothers and sisters, requires some renunciation regarding the idols of efficiency and consumerism. But this is necessary so as not to get lost in things that end up getting thrown out, as they threw things out in Gehenna back then. And people often end up in today’s Gehenna’s, instead. Let’s think, of the least who are often treated like waste products and unwanted objects. There is a cost to remain faithful to what counts. The cost is going against the tide, the cost is freeing oneself from being conditioned by popular opinion, the cost is being separated from those who “follow the current”. But it does not matter, Jesus says. What matters is not to throw away the greatest good: life. This is the only thing that should frighten us. (Antipope Francis.. June 25, 2023)

…Perhaps we should be grateful that Bergoglio didn’t turn Christ’s warning about Gehenna into a sermon about the importance of recycling!

Francis… tries to get his hearers’ thoughts away from the supernatural and ..focused on [earthly] life

In today’s Gospel, Jesus repeats to his disciples three different times: “have no fear” (Mt 10:26, 28, 31). Shortly prior to this, he had spoken to them about the persecutions they would have to undergo for the Gospel, a fact that is still a reality. Since its beginning, in fact, the Church has experienced, together with joys – of which she has had many – many persecutions. It seems paradoxical: the proclamation of the Kingdom of God is a message of peace and justice, founded on fraternal charity and on forgiveness; and yet it meets with opposition, violence, persecution. Jesus, however, says not to fear, not because everything will be all right in the world, no, but because we are precious to his Father and nothing that is good will be lost. He therefore tells us not to let fear block us, but rather to fear one other thing, only one. What is the thing Jesus tells us we should fear?

… Certainly, peace, justice, charity, and forgiveness are part of the Gospel, but it cannot be reduced to that. The Good News of Jesus Christ is not the Kiwanis club with prayer.

If Francis actually taught the… full Gospel… he would see.. quickly why it meets with opposition from the world.

Christ was hated because, unlike Bergoglio, He did not preach a ‘hippie’ gospel. Rather, His preaching convicted the world of sin (cf. Jn 3:19; 16:8) and demanded the strictest standards of morality. For example, not only did Jesus condemn the external act of murder, but even uncharitable speech and hateful thoughts (see Mt 5:21-22); not only did He condemn the external act of adultery, as did the Jews as well, He made clear that even the least deliberately-willed impure thought was already an infraction of the divine law, and that it would be better to suffer any temporal sacrifice rather than commit mortal sin (see Mt 5:27-30). He sanctified matrimony by raising it to a grace-giving sacrament and restoring to it its original indissolubility (see Mt 5:31-32).

Christ preached the way of the Cross. He demanded not a merely external sanctity but one that consists in a true and inward renewal (rebirth) of the whole person (see Mt 5:20; Jn 3:5-6). He condemned vengeance… (see Mt 5:38-39). He demanded that we conform our lives to His (see Mt 11:29), exhorted all who can take it to perfect chastity (see Mt 19:11-12), and demanded that we love our neighbor as we love our very own selves (see Mk 12:31), even our enemies (see Mt 5:43-47). .

..He demanded that God be loved first and above all things (see Mk 12:29-30), including one’s family, relations, friends, and even life itself:

Do not think that I came to send peace upon earth: I came not to send peace, but the sword. For I came to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. And a man’s enemies shall be they of his own household. He that loveth father or mother more than me, is not worthy of me; and he that loveth son or daughter more than me, is not worthy of me. And he that taketh not up his cross, and followeth me, is not worthy of me. He that findeth his life, shall lose it: and he that shall lose his life for me, shall find it. (Matthew 10:34-39)

That is not the gospel preached by Bergoglio. No wonder the fake pope can’t figure out why anyone would oppose the Gospel! The true Gospel is not popular, not attractive to fallen man because it convicts him of sin and demands that he amend his ways under pain of eternal damnation. It requires self-denial, obedience to ecclesiastical authority, and sometimes even heroic sacrifices to save one’s soul: “…the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent bear it away” (Mt 11:12).

“Gehenna” is used by our Lord as a metaphor for hell. The Catholic Encyclopedia explains:

…in the New Testament the term Gehenna is used more frequently in preference to hades, as a name for the place of punishment of the damned. Gehenna is the Hebrew gê-hinnom (Nehemiah 11:30), or the longer form gê-ben-hinnom (Joshua 15:8), and gê-benê-hinnom (2 Kings 23:10) “valley of the sons of Hinnom”. Hinnom seems to be the name of a person not otherwise known. The Valley of Hinnom is south of Jerusalem and is now called Wadi er-rababi. It was notorious as the scene, in earlier days, of the horrible worship of Moloch. For this reason it was defiled by Josias (2 Kings 23:10), cursed by Jeremias (Jeremiah 7:31-33), and held in abomination by the Jews, who, accordingly, used the name of this valley to designate the abode of the damned (Targ. Jon., Gen., iii, 24; Henoch, c. xxvi). And Christ adopted this usage of the term. (The Catholic Encyclopedia, s.v. “Hell”)

Interestingly enough, even Bergoglio’s own so-called Catechism of the Catholic Church notes:

Jesus often speaks of “Gehenna,” of “the unquenchable fire” reserved for those who to the end of their lives refuse to believe and be converted, where both soul and body can be lost. Jesus solemnly proclaims that he “will send his angels, and they will gather . . . all evil doers, and throw them into the furnace of fire,” and that he will pronounce the condemnation: “Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire!” (Catechism of the Catholic Church, n. 1034)

So, when Francis says that Christ speaks about Gehenna “in order to say that the true fear we should have, is that of throwing away one’s own life”, that is inaccurate — He specifically warns against throwing one’s soul away, and He distinguishes it clearly from the life of the body. Notice how the false pope omits this crucial distinction and instead conflates both into “life”, hoping no one will notice.

Why Francis does this becomes apparent when we look at what he says immediately after, namely: “It was like saying: you do not need so much to be afraid of suffering misunderstanding and criticism, of losing prestige and economic advantages to remain faithful to the Gospel, no, but of wasting your existence in the pursuit of trivial things that do not fill life with meaning.”

Now it is clear: Bergoglio had to erase Christ’s contrast between the life of the body and the life of the soul in order to be able to make the divine warning about throwing your soul away (namely, into hell) into something about not “wasting your existence in the pursuit of trivial things that do not fill life with meaning”. Obviously, that is not what Christ said… Nor does life have to be “filled” with meaning, as if the meaning of our existence were something to be produced by us and not found in God and the Beatific Vision to which He has called us. But then those are supernatural things, and Francis wants to steer souls away from the supernatural and keep them focused on the things of the earth, lest they be saved: “He that is of the earth, of the earth he is, and of the earth he speaketh” (Jn 3:31).

The whole point of Christ’s warning in the Gospel passage is that one can spend one’s entire life doing non-trivial things — things that are good, legitimate, and important in themselves — and still go to hell! For example, a surgeon who saves lives every day for thirty years, or a social worker who frequently feeds the hungry, or an architect who designs the most magnificent cathedrals, all these people are doing good things but if they do not die in the state of sanctifying grace, they will merit only eternal damnation — not for the good things they did, of course, but for their mortal sins, which can only be blotted out with sanctifying grace, which cannot be “purchased” with naturally good works. Denial of this would constitute the heresy of Pelagianism — salvation by works without grace.

Francis:

... Even today, in fact, some are ridiculed or discriminated against for not following certain fads, which, however, place second-rate realities at the centre – for example, to follow after things instead of people, achievement instead of relationships. Let us give an example: I am thinking of some parents who need to work to maintain their family, but who cannot live for work alone – they need enough time to be with their children. I am also thinking of a priest or a sister who need to dedicate themselves to their service, without, however, forgetting to dedicate time to be with Jesus, otherwise, they will fall into spiritual worldliness and lose the sense of who they are. And again, I am thinking of a young man or woman who have thousands of commitments and passions – school, sports, various interests, cell phones and social networks – but who need to meet people and achieve great dreams, without losing time on passing things that do not leave their mark.

So here Francis simply doubles down on his distortion of the holy words of our Lord. One can follow after “people” and “relationships” instead of things and achievements all one’s life long — but if one dies in the state of mortal sin, everything will be lost… Francis is diverting people’s attention from the actual words of Christ to a fanciful reading that is compatible with his own [narrative].

The false pope is bluntly taking Christ’s exhortation not to lose one’s eternal life for the sake of one’s temporal life and twisting it into a Naturalist message of not to spend one’s temporal life on the trivial but rather on the meaningful. That is not what Christ said, nor is it what He meant! And Bergoglio knows it, obviously. All temporal life will end at death, “and after this the judgment” (Heb 9:27). If the soul is in the state of mortal sin, hell will be its eternal destiny. But that is a pesky little detail Bergoglio is bending over backwards to conceal from those who are unhappily seeking instruction from his blasphemous mouth.

Francis denounces figurative “idols”… (not so much literal idols):

All of this, brothers and sisters, requires some renunciation regarding the idols of efficiency and consumerism. But this is necessary so as not to get lost in things that end up getting thrown out, as they threw things out in Gehenna back then. And people often end up in today’s Gehenna’s, instead. Let’s think, of the least who are often treated like waste products and unwanted objects. There is a cost to remain faithful to what counts. The cost is going against the tide, the cost is freeing oneself from being conditioned by popular opinion, the cost is being separated from those who “follow the current”. But it does not matter, Jesus says. What matters is not to throw away the greatest good: life. This is the only thing that should frighten us.

So here the pseudo-papal shyster desperately tries to introduce one of his favorite talking points, which hinges on Gehenna having been a garbage dump. He then blatantly lies again by claiming that Christ’s teaching is: “What matters is not to throw away the greatest good: life.” No, this earthly life is not the greatest good, eternal life in Heaven is:

And calling the multitude together with his disciples, he said to them: If any man will follow me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. For whosoever will save his life, shall lose it: and whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel, shall save it. For what shall it profit a man, if he gain the whole world, and suffer the loss of his soul. Or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul? For he that shall be ashamed of me, and of my words, in this adulterous and sinful generation: the Son of man also will be ashamed of him, when he shall come in the glory of his Father with the holy angels. (Mark 8:34-38)

Francis adds insult to injury when in his very last paragraph he warns against “not putting [the] Gospel in first place”:

So let us ask ourselves: I, what do I fear? Not having what I like? Not reaching the goals society imposes? The judgement of others? Or rather of not pleasing the Lord, and not putting his Gospel in first place? Mary, ever Virgin, Mother most Wise, help us to be wise and courageous in the choices we make.

This false pope is a master deceiver, and he is audacious in his deception, for he denies the Gospel straight to your face and then exhorts you never to deny the Gospel. Bergoglio preaches “a charity without faith, very accommodating to unbelievers, which unfortunately opens the way to eternal ruin for all”, as Pope St. Pius X warned in his allocution of Apr. 17, 1907.

‘Pope’ Francis, Apostle of Hell

As we have seen, the true Gospel is supernatural; it is concerned first and foremost with eternal salvation, without which all is lost forever. The Gospel is not a sentimental collection of platitudes about human dignity, tolerance, unconditional acceptance and forgiveness, caresses and tenderness, or helping the needy. It is also not about dreaming, welcoming, including, accompanying, or affirming everyone and everything. That is Bergoglio’s false Naturalist gospel of man, not the true supernatural Gospel of Jesus Christ.

Christ became incarnate so we would be freed from the bondage of sin and be able to go to Heaven. He preached the truth about the fallen human condition and the divinely-given remedy, offering Himself as the Divine-Human Sacrifice to atone for our sins and purchase us back from the dominion of the evil one. Christ did not become man in order to preach a generic, interreligious “message of peace and justice, founded on fraternal charity and on forgiveness”.

This past Sunday, it is clear that Francis went out of his way to avoid speaking about eternal damnation; he instead bent over backwards to come up with some other “interpretation” of Christ’s plain words. But why? Who would have an interest in keeping the truth about hell away from souls?

Would it be our dear Lord Jesus, who suffered and died for souls precisely so they would not end up there and who Himself warned of the reality of the danger of hell throughout His earthly ministry? Or would it be Satan, the devil, who wants to see as many souls eternally damned as possible?
Click to expand...
Look after decades dealing with this I see it clearly
THis is Pre-nuptial agreement Chrsitianity.
I will not go to God's Mercy nor will I have the virtue of Hope but I will find some way to tie Jesus' hands so that if I go to Hell it is not forever. These people often think they are revoutionary. IT's just trying to force God's hand. That is the whole thing
 
Forget the loophole, ditch the pre-nuptial agreement with God

ANd just believe in His Mercy and act on it

I am love and mercy itself. ... Let no soul fear to draw near to Me, even though its sins be as scarlet. ... My mercy is greater than your sins, and those of the entire world. ... I let My Sacred Heart be pierced with a lance, thus opening wide the source of mercy for you. Come then with trust to draw graces from this fountain. ... The graces of My mercy are drawn by the means of one vessel only, and that is trust. The more a soul trusts, the more it will receive.
Jesus said to her (entry 1146):

Let the greatest sinners place their trust in My mercy. They have the right before others to trust in the abyss of My mercy. ... Souls that make an appeal to My mercy delight Me. To such souls I grant even more graces than they ask.
[ I was very pleased to find similar statements in St. Fulgentius, St. Idelphonse, and more still in St. Thomas and St. Augustine, who, in commenting on the Psalms, had much to say on Divine Mercy, calling it the greatest of God's greatest attributes.]
 
Why would an omnipotent forever Eternal living God want to destroy Hell and Sa Tann the beautiful Witchy angle.
Where would the challenge to exist go with the Loss of the Beautiful Sa Tann. The eternal religious war,
the survival of the lost souls. Where would they go? An Island of beautiful lost souls.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

The end is near!

< Previous Thread

Moses prophesied about the coming of Christ (as did Malachi & others)

Next Thread >

Similar threads

Weatherman2020
Zone1 "My God, My God, Why Have You Forsaken Me"
2 3 4
Replies
60
Views
898
Cougarbear
C
O
  • Poll
Zone1 Is the Canon of Scripture Closed and Can We Not Receive Any More Revelation From God?
2
Replies
24
Views
383
1srelluc
1srelluc
1miseryindex
Zone1 Jesus was mean.. (I guess) because He said that anyone who does not accept the Gospel is condemned!
6 7 8
Replies
148
Views
2K
irosie91
I
Libby von H
Zone1 the 2 fallacies in saying : All Scripture is inspired by God not sinful men
7 8 9
Replies
167
Views
1K
ding
ding
Votto
Zone1 Will Leftists cause people to turn to God as they destroy society?
Replies
7
Views
71
August West
A

Latest Discussions

Bonzi
Songs: A-Z
183 184 185
Replies
4K
Views
106K
CrazyTrader55
CrazyTrader55
HikerGuy83
Psst…I Think the President Is Totally Senile: Kurt Schlichter
2 3 4
Replies
77
Views
566
Harry Dresden
Harry Dresden
horselightning
Substitute teacher fights student who allegedly used racial slur in crowded Vegas school hallway
Replies
12
Views
51
Deadstick
Deadstick
Freedomisneverfree
BREAKING: The Supreme Court is Likely to Uphold Presidential Immunity for Donald Trump..
11 12 13
Replies
245
Views
1K
AHZ
A
Mortimer
More Romani visibility please
2 3 4
Replies
68
Views
342
frigidweirdo
frigidweirdo
View more…

Forum List

Back
Top