Zone1 Why is it so tough to believe in God?

[BreezeWood]

In the Bible belief is not an excuse ... And it pisses off the atheists.

could it be you were once an atheist and now have found your way through the christian bible. the excuse having once being a ---- is not relevant for what now is certain.

* clue - your life story is an excuse irregardless any connection with christianity.

 

[Quantrill]

could it be you were once an atheist and now have found your way through the christian bible. the excuse having once being a ---- is not relevant for what now is certain.

* clue - your life story is an excuse irregardless any connection with christianity.

No, I never was an atheist. And, belief is not an excuse.

Something is an excuse only if one tries to make it. But even though one tries to make it, doesn't mean it is valid.

Apparently you have some 'excuse' issues to support your atheism. I know, I know...they all begin 'If God were real'...'Why does God do that'....'How could God'?

The problem with that is, an excuse is only good if the one you're making it to is satisfied with it and acknowledges it. Else it's of no value. It may satisfy you, but the excuse is not for you.

(Rom. 1:19-20) "Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them.

"For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse."

(Rom. 1:22) "Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools."

(Rom. 1:32) "Who knowing the judgement of God..."

(Rom. 2:1) "Therefore thou art inexcusable, O man..."

So, work on your 'excuses' as much as you can. But, as you see, they won't work. And once face to face with Him, I doubt anything will be able to come out of your mouth.

Quantrill

 

[hobelim]

As for Lucifer in (Is. 14:12) being 'son of the morning', that is describing Lucifer before his fall. (Ez. 28:13-15). He was the morning star. But no more. Now it is given to the Man Jesus Christ, the God/Man. And Jesus in turn will give it to His followers. (Rev. 2:28)

The Jesus that you worship is the Antichrist conjured from the depths of a Roman hell created in the image and likeness of Mithras and unleashed on the world in 325ce. Mithraism was the secret Babylonian MYSTERY RELIGION of the Roman government and military. An ascetic anti-female religion whose priesthood consisted of celibate (pft) men only.

Jesus warned his disciples of a test. True? He also warned that he would become the object of idolatry when he said, "Just as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so the Son of Man must be lifted up." John 3:14. Moses lifted up the bronze serpent during the time of testing in the wilderness for the people to turn to for healing. 500 years later Hezekiah, the subject of the prophecy "A young maiden is with child" did what was right in Gods eyes by destroying the bronze serpent which, like Jesus, became the object of idolatry. Here's the thing. If it was right for Hezekiah to destroy the bronze serpent then it was never right to turn to it for healing. It was a test. A test failed as miserably as every Christian who worships Jesus as if he was a almighty yet edible mangod.

So all that you or any Christian has to do to be saved is ask yourself, "What would Hezekiah do." And then. do it.

 

[hobelim]

. You say the term the first and the last in (Is. 44:6), "Thus saith the LORD...I am the first and I am the last; and beside me there is no God.", does not equate with what Jesus called Himself in (Rev. 22:13). "I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last."

One of the defining characteristics of the Antichrist created when Caesar conferred power and authority to the papacy and assimilated and perverted Christianity with Mithraism is that it was a man that claimed to be God.

You base your entire religion on the lie that Jesus claimed to be God. Even falsely claiming that a prophecy in Isaiah about the future king Hezekiah was about Jesus or Jesus saying "the Father and I are one" was proof. lol.

Tsk tsk.

 

[hobelim]

Jesus equates Himself as God in (Is. 44:6) and (Rev. 22:13).

in Jn 20:17 Jesus clearly refutes that crap. Aside from that anyone who equates themselves with God is insane.

"Go and tell my brothers that I am ascending to my Father and your Father; My God and your God."

By saying that his God is their God Jesus effectively eliminated any possibility that he either thought of himself as or claimed to be God.

Thats the way the cookie crumbles.

You are a murderer in the same exact way that Jesus meant when he said, "Satan was a murderer from the beginning." even though the talking serpent in Eden, Satan, did not kill anyone, at least according to the fairy tale.

He just fucked up their minds and lives real good for the rest of their days on earth which in many ways is worse.

 

[ding]

You base your entire religion on the lie that Jesus claimed to be God.

Jesus said and behaved as if he were equal to God. Not that he is God.

Jesus showed equality with God through statements like "I and the Father are one," claiming divine authority to give life, judge, and heal on the Sabbath, and saying "He who has seen me has seen the Father," all leading to Jewish leaders accusing him of blasphemy for making himself God. Key instances include John 5:18-23, where he links his work to God's; John 10:30, the "one" statement; and John 14:9, "seeing Jesus means seeing the Father," highlighting shared essence, power, and roles.

• "I and the Father are one." (John 10:30): This direct claim of unity in essence and purpose led Jews to try and stone him for blasphemy.
• "My Father is working until now, and I myself am working." (John 5:17): By equating his Sabbath healing work with God's ongoing work, Jesus claimed divine authority, infuriating leaders who saw it as breaking the Sabbath and making himself God's equal.
• "As the Father raises the dead and gives life, so also the Son gives life to whomever he wants." (John 5:21): This shows Jesus possessing the same power over life and death as God.
• "The Father has given all judgment to the Son, so that all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father." (John 5:22-23): Giving the Son the authority of final judgment mirrors God's role and demands equal honor.
• "He who has seen me has seen the Father." (John 14:9): Jesus's presence reveals God's character and nature, implying he perfectly represents God.
• "I am" (John 8:58): When Jesus said, "Before Abraham was, I am," the Jews understood the divine name ("I AM") and sought to stone him for blasphemy.

• Miracles: He performed supernatural acts like feeding thousands, calming storms, and healing the sick, demonstrating power over creation.
• Power over Death: Jesus raised people from the dead, a power attributed to God (John 11), and claimed the power to raise Himself (John 2:19).
• Forgiveness of Sins: He claimed the authority to forgive sins, an act the Jews believed only God could do (Mark 2:5-12).
• Accepting Worship: He allowed people to worship Him (Matthew 14:33) and did not correct those who treated Him as God (Matthew 26:63-65).
• Accepting Blasphemy Charges: When accused of making Himself equal with God, Jesus did not deny the charge but explained His unity with the Father, indicating He accepted the implication of deity (John 5:18, 8:58).

 

[hobelim]

Jesus said and behaved as if he were equal to God. Not that he is God.

How is that any better? How does that make you less of a dimwit? God has no equal. Don't worry dingbat.

Help is on the way.

 

[ding]

How is that any better? How does that make you less of a dimwit? God has no equal. Don't worry dingbat.

Help is on the way.

Do you have a rebuttal to the multitude of verses that support that Jesus said and behaved as if he were equal to God?

Do you have an alternate explanation for the multitude of verses that support that Jesus said and behaved as if he were equal to God?

Because all you are doing is waving your arms and expecting others to believe you because you say so.

Where's your evidence?

 

[hobelim]

Do you have a rebuttal to the multitude of verses that support that Jesus said and behaved as if he were equal to God?

Yes.

I have already shown you many times how those few verses can be interpreted in a way that does not make Jesus out to be insane. "The Father and I are one" means they are of one accord. "If you have seen me you have seen the Father" just means if you understand, perceive, Jesus you will understand, perceive, God. Simple. damn

If Jesus claimed equality with God or to be God, a scurrilous false charge made to discredit him, he was INSANE.

So every time one of you numbskulls goes around saying, "Jesus is God" KNOW that you are bringing his name into disrepute among intelligent people embarrassing yourself by cluelessly exposing your shame completely naked in public. You might as well be drooling and jerking off, religiously, shrieking foul obscenities with families and children playing all around trying to have a picnic in a public park on an otherwise beautiful Sunday afternoon

 

[Quantrill]

The Jesus that you worship is the Antichrist conjured from the depths of a Roman hell created in the image and likeness of Mithras and unleashed on the world in 325ce. Mithraism was the secret Babylonian MYSTERY RELIGION of the Roman government and military. An ascetic anti-female religion whose priesthood consisted of celibate (pft) men only.

Jesus warned his disciples of a test. True? He also warned that he would become the object of idolatry when he said, "Just as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so the Son of Man must be lifted up." John 3:14. Moses lifted up the bronze serpent during the time of testing in the wilderness for the people to turn to for healing. 500 years later Hezekiah, the subject of the prophecy "A young maiden is with child" did what was right in Gods eyes by destroying the bronze serpent which, like Jesus, became the object of idolatry. Here's the thing. If it was right for Hezekiah to destroy the bronze serpent then it was never right to turn to it for healing. It was a test. A test failed as miserably as every Christian who worships Jesus as if he was a almighty yet edible mangod.

So all that you or any Christian has to do to be saved is ask yourself, "What would Hezekiah do." And then. do it.

No, the Jesus I worship is the Jesus of the Bible. The Bible presents the True God and Christ. Which is why you are opposed to it, though you use it when you think you can get away with it. The Bible is not the Mystery Religion of Mithra. And what I give you is the Bible.

No, that is a lie. Jesus didn't relate Himself to the 'bronze serpent' that became idolatry. Jesus related Himself to the 'bronze serpent on the pole' that God commanded Moses to make in order to save them from the poisonous snake bites. No wonder you didn't give the Scripture for it, as you once again pervert the Scriptures. (Num. 21:5-9)

(Num. 21:8-9) "And the LORD said unto Moses, Make thee a fiery serpent, and set it upon a pole: and it shall come to pass, that every one that is bitten, when he looketh upon it, shall live. And Moses made a serpent of brass, and put it upon a pole, and it came to pass, that if a serpent had bitten any man, when he beheld the serpent of brass, he lived."

To this Jesus said: (John 3:14) "And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:"

A beautiful picture of the Sacrifice and the Faith that will heal. Christ will be on the pole in Sacrifice. And any who look to Him will be saved. It is a perfect definition of the faith that saves. A look. That was all that was required. For to look, was to obey God's command, (Num. 21:8)

So, as usual you don't know what you're talking about. Keep applying that 'preparation H' to that lying ass you're talking out of.

In (2 Kings 18:4) Hezekiah did destroy the bronze serpent as it became a point of worship, an idol. But that doesn't remove its original purpose which was to save, and it pointed to Jesus Christ Who will save by faith. Which is what it did/does do.

Again you pervert the Scriptures. More lip balm for you.

Quantrill

 

[Hafar1014]

No, the Jesus I worship is the Jesus of the Bible. The Bible presents the True God and Christ. Which is why you are opposed to it, though you use it when you think you can get away with it. The Bible is not the Mystery Religion of Mithra. And what I give you is the Bible.

No, that is a lie. Jesus didn't relate Himself to the 'bronze serpent' that became idolatry. Jesus related Himself to the 'bronze serpent on the pole' that God commanded Moses to make in order to save them from the poisonous snake bites. No wonder you didn't give the Scripture for it, as you once again pervert the Scriptures. (Num. 21:5-9)

(Num. 21:8-9) "And the LORD said unto Moses, Make thee a fiery serpent, and set it upon a pole: and it shall come to pass, that every one that is bitten, when he looketh upon it, shall live. And Moses made a serpent of brass, and put it upon a pole, and it came to pass, that if a serpent had bitten any man, when he beheld the serpent of brass, he lived."

To this Jesus said: (John 3:14) "And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:"

A beautiful picture of the Sacrifice and the Faith that will heal. Christ will be on the pole in Sacrifice. And any who look to Him will be saved. It is a perfect definition of the faith that saves. A look. That was all that was required. For to look, was to obey God's command, (Num. 21:8)

So, as usual you don't know what you're talking about. Keep applying that 'preparation H' to that lying ass you're talking out of.

In (2 Kings 18:4) Hezekiah did destroy the bronze serpent as it became a point of worship, an idol. But doesn't remove its original purpose which was to save, and it pointed to Jesus Christ Who will save by faith. Which is what it did do.

Again you pervert the Scriptures. More lip balm for you.

Quantrill

The New Testament isnt the Bible

 

[hobelim]

The Bible is not the Mystery Religion of Mithra. And what I give you is the Bible.

No.

You've been trying to peddle superstitious archaic lore perpetuated by Rome specifically to subjugate the nations, brazenly express pure hatred for the Hebrew God, my God, and openly desecrate the words of Jesus

* Mithra was born on December 25th. Called "Birthday of the Unconquered Sun", it was incorporated into the church in the 4th century AD as the birthday of Christ. Although Jesus was born in October, christians today celebrate Mithra' birthday, believing it was Jesus' birthday.

* Mithra' birth was witnessed by shepherds and by Magi (the root of the word magician) who brought gifts to his sacred birth-cave of the Rock

* He was considered a great travelling teacher and master.

* He had 12 companions or disciples, which in Mithraism were represented by the 12 astrological signs.

* He performed miracles.

* He was buried in a tomb.

* After three days he rose again, but with no witnesses to the event

* His triumph over death and ascension to heaven were celebrated at the Mithran's most important festival, Easter, held at the spring equinox when the sun rises toward its apogee

* Mithra was called "the Good Shepherd."

* He was considered "the Way, the Truth and the Light, the Redeemer, the Savior, the Messiah."

* In the cult's rituals, Mithra was identified with both the Lion and the Lamb.

* His sacred day was Sunday, and was called "the Lord's Day" hundreds of years before the appearance of Christ.

* Mithraism had a Eucharist or "Lord's Supper" in which bread was eaten as a symbol of Mithra' body, and wine was drunk as a symbol of the blood shed when Mithra overpowered and killed the bull

* Mithra performed many miracles, including raising the dead, healing the sick, making the blind see and the lame walk, casting out devils.

* Mithra was said to carry keys to the kingdom of heaven.

* Mithra was called the god of light and truth, the god of mediation between god and man. He was to his worshippers The creator of life; The Mediator between man and the higher gods; The God of light; The All-seeing one; The Guardian of oaths (covenants); The Protector of the righteous in this world and also in the next.

* A trinity godhead comprised of Mithra (divine god of truth), Rashnu (divine god of justice, judgement and righteousness), Vohu Manah (divine spirit of enlightenment). These three persons were separate yet they were one.

Before returning to heaven, Mithra was said to have celebrated a Last Supper with followers, who represented the twelve signs of the zodiac. In memory of this, his worshippers partook of a sacramental meal of bread marked with the Mithran cross of light. This was one of the seven Mithraic sacraments, believed to be the models for the Christians' seven sacraments, which follow them identically. It was called mizd, latin missa, English mass. Mithra' image was buried in a rock tomb, the same sacred cave that represented his mother's womb. He was withdrawn from it and said to live again.

Mithraism was an ascetic, anti-female religion. Its priesthood consisted of celibate men only.

 

[Hafar1014]

No.

You have been trying to peddle ignorant superstitious archaic lore perpetuated by Rome specifically to subjugate the nations, brazenly express pure hatred for the Hebrew God, and openly desecrate the teachings of Jesus.

* Mithra was born on December 25th. Called "Birthday of the Unconquered Sun", it was incorporated into the church in the 4th century AD as the birthday of Christ. Although Jesus was born in October, christians today celebrate Mithra' birthday, believing it was Jesus' birthday.

* Mithra' birth was witnessed by shepherds and by Magi (the root of the word magician) who brought gifts to his sacred birth-cave of the Rock

* He was considered a great travelling teacher and master.

* He had 12 companions or disciples, which in Mithraism were represented by the 12 astrological signs.

* He performed miracles.

* He was buried in a tomb.

* After three days he rose again, but with no witnesses to the event

* His triumph over death and ascension to heaven were celebrated at the Mithran's most important festival, Easter, held at the spring equinox when the sun rises toward its apogee

* Mithra was called "the Good Shepherd."

* He was considered "the Way, the Truth and the Light, the Redeemer, the Savior, the Messiah."

* In the cult's rituals, Mithra was identified with both the Lion and the Lamb.

* His sacred day was Sunday, and was called "the Lord's Day" hundreds of years before the appearance of Christ.

* Mithraism had a Eucharist or "Lord's Supper" in which bread was eaten as a symbol of Mithra' body, and wine was drunk as a symbol of the blood shed when Mithra overpowered and killed the bull

* Mithra performed many miracles, including raising the dead, healing the sick, making the blind see and the lame walk, casting out devils.

* Mithra was said to carry keys to the kingdom of heaven.

* Mithra was called the god of light and truth, the god of mediation between god and man. He was to his worshippers The creator of life; The Mediator between man and the higher gods; The God of light; The All-seeing one; The Guardian of oaths (covenants); The Protector of the righteous in this world and also in the next.

* A trinity godhead comprised of Mithra (divine god of truth), Rashnu (divine god of justice, judgement and righteousness), Vohu Manah (divine spirit of enlightenment). These three persons were separate yet they were one.

Before returning to heaven, Mithra was said to have celebrated a Last Supper with followers, who represented the twelve signs of the zodiac. In memory of this, his worshippers partook of a sacramental meal of bread marked with the Mithran cross of light. This was one of the seven Mithraic sacraments, believed to be the models for the Christians' seven sacraments, which follow them identically. It was called mizd, latin missa, English mass. Mithra' image was buried in a rock tomb, the same sacred cave that represented his mother's womb. He was withdrawn from it and said to live again.

Mithraism was an ascetic, anti-female religion. Its priesthood consisted of celibate men only.

Classic hero myth used many time in history to create religious beliefs

 

[Quantrill]

in Jn 20:17 Jesus clearly refutes that crap. Aside from that anyone who equates themselves with God is insane.

"Go and tell my brothers that I am ascending to my Father and your Father; My God and your God."

By saying that his God is their God Jesus effectively eliminated any possibility that he either thought of himself as or claimed to be God.

Thats the way the cookie crumbles.

You are a murderer in the same exact way that Jesus meant when he said, "Satan was a murderer from the beginning." even though the talking serpent in Eden, Satan, did not kill anyone, at least according to the fairy tale.

He just fucked up their minds and lives real good for the rest of their days on earth which in many ways is worse.

No. Another lie. (John 20:17) does not refute Jesus equating Himself with God. (Is. 44:6) (Rev. 22:13

Through the Death and Resurrection and Ascension of Jesus Christ, Christ brought His followers into the same relationship He has to the Father. They are now His brethren. God is their Father now also. And Jesus the God/Man, that 2nd person of the Trinity, has forever taken that place willingly. When He took on that body and became a Man, He did it forever. Placing Him as a Man subject to the Father as His God also.

Quantrill

 

[Quantrill]

The New Testament isnt the Bible

Who says? Gee, I've got this Book next to me and it is titled 'The Bible'. And lo and behold, the New Testament is in it.

What Bible do you have that doesn't have the New Testament in it? Is it the Word of God also?

Quantrill

 

[hobelim]

Another lie. (John 20:17) does not refute Jesus equating Himself with God. (Is. 44:6) (Rev. 22:13

Yes it does.

It's Jesus making it very clear that his God is their God which means he wasn't God and didn't claim to be God.

YOU are a ******* liar.

Consider yourself defrocked.

 

[Hafar1014]

The Pentateuch 5 Books of Moses the real Bible

Who says? Gee, I've got this Book next to me and it is titled 'The Bible'. And lo and behold, the New Testament is in it.

What Bible do you have that doesn't have the New Testament in it? Is it the Word of God also?

Quan

 

[Quantrill]

No.

You've been trying to peddle superstitious archaic lore perpetuated by Rome specifically to subjugate the nations, brazenly express pure hatred for the Hebrew God, my God, and openly desecrate the words of Jesus

* Mithra was born on December 25th. Called "Birthday of the Unconquered Sun", it was incorporated into the church in the 4th century AD as the birthday of Christ. Although Jesus was born in October, christians today celebrate Mithra' birthday, believing it was Jesus' birthday.

* Mithra' birth was witnessed by shepherds and by Magi (the root of the word magician) who brought gifts to his sacred birth-cave of the Rock

* He was considered a great travelling teacher and master.

* He had 12 companions or disciples, which in Mithraism were represented by the 12 astrological signs.

* He performed miracles.

* He was buried in a tomb.

* After three days he rose again, but with no witnesses to the event

* His triumph over death and ascension to heaven were celebrated at the Mithran's most important festival, Easter, held at the spring equinox when the sun rises toward its apogee

* Mithra was called "the Good Shepherd."

* He was considered "the Way, the Truth and the Light, the Redeemer, the Savior, the Messiah."

* In the cult's rituals, Mithra was identified with both the Lion and the Lamb.

* His sacred day was Sunday, and was called "the Lord's Day" hundreds of years before the appearance of Christ.

* Mithraism had a Eucharist or "Lord's Supper" in which bread was eaten as a symbol of Mithra' body, and wine was drunk as a symbol of the blood shed when Mithra overpowered and killed the bull

* Mithra performed many miracles, including raising the dead, healing the sick, making the blind see and the lame walk, casting out devils.

* Mithra was said to carry keys to the kingdom of heaven.

* Mithra was called the god of light and truth, the god of mediation between god and man. He was to his worshippers The creator of life; The Mediator between man and the higher gods; The God of light; The All-seeing one; The Guardian of oaths (covenants); The Protector of the righteous in this world and also in the next.

* A trinity godhead comprised of Mithra (divine god of truth), Rashnu (divine god of justice, judgement and righteousness), Vohu Manah (divine spirit of enlightenment). These three persons were separate yet they were one.

Before returning to heaven, Mithra was said to have celebrated a Last Supper with followers, who represented the twelve signs of the zodiac. In memory of this, his worshippers partook of a sacramental meal of bread marked with the Mithran cross of light. This was one of the seven Mithraic sacraments, believed to be the models for the Christians' seven sacraments, which follow them identically. It was called mizd, latin missa, English mass. Mithra' image was buried in a rock tomb, the same sacred cave that represented his mother's womb. He was withdrawn from it and said to live again.

Mithraism was an ascetic, anti-female religion. Its priesthood consisted of celibate men only.

I'm not giving you verses from any writing from or about Mithra. I am giving you the Bible. I don't care about Mithra. And it's the Bible that proves you to be a phony.

Quantrill

 

[Quantrill]

The Pentateuch 5 Books of Moses the real Bible

Where does the Pentateuch say the New Testament is not the Bible?

And is the Pentateuch the Word of God?

So, why is the New Testament not the Bible?

Quantrill

 

[Hawkins]

Humans are idiots.
Among all the civilizations ever existed on the surface of Earth, only the Chinese and the Jews can have a rather complete set of history. Both are canonized (I doubt that humans know what it is). Overall, humans are incapable of writing, keeping and passing histories. The Chinese claim to have a history of 5000 years, yet the first 2500 years of the canonized history was written by a single person who never set foot outside of the palace. You can imagine how you sit home alone to write a history of 2500 years ahead of you. This however represents the maximum level of human capability in terms of writing history.

That said. If God is true, God would choose one of the two sets of complete history written by the 2 peoples respectively to convey His truth. For the matter, Israel is called "the chosen people" for a reason (stupid humans can hardly get a grasp). The Bible is an employment of the maximum level of human capability for God to convey a complete theology of salvation, which otherwise won't convey through humans to today's world to save today's humans. To put it another way, if God's theology of salvation is conveyed with maximum level of human capability, it's thus a valid account of human testimony which would be reckoned by the Court of Heaven, and for the theology to be legitimately used as the standard for the Final Judgment of humankind.