Debate Now What does MAGA mean ? Specifically ?

[Foxfyre]

If MAGA means making America great again, and the majority of women in this country, want the great America when they had the right to privacy if they get pregnant, and restoring privacy to women is Biden‘s agenda, then how can you say Trump is making America great again to all Americans. You can’t it’s a freaking con game.

I can say it because my whole focus and belief system does not revolve around killing unborn babies. Abortion is one of hundreds of issues that are important to people. That meanspirited Marxist numbnuts think they can make it about abortion and nothing else says a LOT about the disingenuousness of their argument.

America was America for a long time before abortion on demand was legal. Right now I am guessing the huge majority of people are far more concerned about the economy, crime, invasion by millions of migrants, an unpopular healthcare system, and concerns about war far more than they care about abortion laws regardless of what they think they should say to the pollsters.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

America was America for a long time before abortion on demand was legal.

But did America lose it’s former “greatness” when Roe v Wade established legal abortion as a right to privacy making I it none of the government’s business?

 

[HikerGuy83]

I rather did-not-enjoy this. People didn't have good answers.

Of course, the scarier thing is for a reporter to walk up and ask what defines greatness.

Now what would that look like ?

I could not tell if MAGA was connected to this conversation or not (assume it was as the question was about when America became great or less great).

 

[task0778]

And I am not so sure American was any greater then than it is today.

A lot of other people are pretty sure that America is nowhere near as great now as it once was. We did not have the illegal immigration problem we have now. We didn't have the President ignoring the Supreme Court ruling against his student loan forgiveness program and doing it anyway. We didn't have one political party weaponizing the judicial system against a political opponent and dispensing social justice that favors some over others. We didn't have one political party using various federal agencies such as the DOJ, IRS, and ATF to go after those with a different political view that we do now. Even concerned parents were singled out if they opposed a certain ideology. Our military was more concerned with fighting and winning wars than they were about inclusion. And our press didn't stigmatize people with a different perspective that did not agree with the agenda of the progressive liberals. Maybe I'm wrong, but our institutions of higher learning used to welcome people with different points of view; now they are denied an audience and some get ostracized or fired. Used to be we were against discrimination, now we're for it if your skin color is white. Used to be your religion didn't matter, but now it does if you are a Christian or Jewish. And for God's sake, how in Hell have we descended to the point where a group can commit heinous atrocities and yet are cheered in the streets. People are chanting Death to America and you think this country is as great as it ever was?

There's a whole lot of people that are not satisfied with what's been going on for some time now. If you're okay with all that, well this is America and you're entitled to your opinion. But I and a whole lot of other people disagree. We are MAGA people and not ashamed to want a better life for everybody, even you.

 

[Foxfyre]

But did America lose it’s former “greatness” when Roe v Wade established legal abortion as a right to privacy making I it none of the government’s business?

Roe V Wade didn't do that. It ruled that the government backs off in the first trimester but the state has increased interest in the second trimester and a great deal of interest in the third trimester. It is the Democrats' corruption and ignorance of or ignoring of the exquisite language of Roe that created an impossible situation for anybody with any integrity. The Democrats ignored Roe to make abortion somehow a constitutional right which it never was and still isn't.

SCOTUS did not outlaw abortion in any way. It just struck down their own ill advised rule and returned the matter to the states where constitutionally it should have remained.

 

[HikerGuy83]

A lot of other people are pretty sure that America is nowhere near as great now as it once was. We did not have the illegal immigration problem we have now. We didn't have the President ignoring the Supreme Court ruling against his student loan forgiveness program and doing it anyway. We didn't have one political party weaponizing the judicial system against a political opponent and dispensing social justice that favors some over others. We didn't have one political party using various federal agencies such as the DOJ, IRS, and ATF to go after those with a different political view that we do now. Even concerned parents were singled out if they opposed a certain ideology. Our military was more concerned with fighting and winning wars than they were about inclusion. And our press didn't stigmatize people with a different perspective that did not agree with the agenda of the progressive liberals. Maybe I'm wrong, but our institutions of higher learning used to welcome people with different points of view; now they are denied an audience and some get ostracized or fired. Used to be we were against discrimination, now we're for it if your skin color is white. Used to be your religion didn't matter, but now it does if you are a Christian or Jewish. And for God's sake, how in Hell have we descended to the point where a group can commit heinous atrocities and yet are cheered in the streets. People are chanting Death to America and you think this country is as great as it ever was?

There's a whole lot of people that are not satisfied with what's been going on for some time now. If you're okay with all that, well this is America and you're entitled to your opinion. But I and a whole lot of other people disagree. We are MAGA people and not ashamed to want a better life for everybody, even you.

I don't have time to address all of your points, many of which are very valid, I will say thank you for listing out some specific areas that we can possibly identify as things we've fallen down on.

 

[HikerGuy83]

Roe V Wade didn't do that. It ruled that the government backs off in the first trimester but the state has increased interest in the second trimester and a great deal of interest in the third trimester. It is the Democrats' corruption and ignorance of or ignoring of the exquisite language of Roe that created an impossible situation for anybody with any integrity. The Democrats ignored Roe to make abortion somehow a constitutional right which it never was and still isn't.

SCOTUS did not outlaw abortion in any way. It just struck down their own ill advised rule and returned the matter to the states where constitutionally it should have remained.

I can't see what he wrote because I have him on ignore. He wastes a lot of bandwidth.

1. Ginsburg did not like the reasonsing. She liked the conclusion but said the decision itself was a POS.
2. Ever since Roe, many states have quietly been hemming it in to the point that some called it dead. Nebraska did a good job in this regard. No fanfare, just slowly walking it back.

3. The left never challenged because they feared that the SCOTUS would turn on them. And they were right. The decision was a turd and the case never should have been heard.

4. As I said.....Gorsuch, Kavennaugh, Bennett.....

 

[NotfooledbyW]

Image Right now I am guessing the huge majority of people are far more concerned about the economy, crime, invasion by millions of migrants, an unpopular healthcare system, and concerns about war far more than they care about abortion laws regardless of what they think they should say to the pollsters.

But the separation of the political parties is not clear on all those issues as to which one is better than the other.

MAGA worked in 2016 because HRC was associated with the first black President who was vilified by the impoverished white folk in flyover country because Obama took away from them to give it all to black people.

There was nothing Obama could do right and nothing Trump could do wrong to flyover MAGA.

​

https://www.news.com.au/world/north-america/the-littleknown-history-of-make-america-great-again/news-story/fb8a09b40aa59defd39ef0bcdeaeb281

“Make America Great Again” meant America First, better trade deals, strict immigration laws, secure borders, a bigger and better military, less gun control and religious freedom. To supporters of Mr Trump, Mr Obama stole these things from them and in doing so, destroyed American prestige. ‘Make America Great Again’ was a decision; a decision that enough was enough.​

Mr Trump’s use of ‘Make America Great Again’ is a sly condemnation of the Obama Presidency. Picture: AP Photo/Pablo Martinez Monsivais.

Mr Reagan and Mr Trump’s use of “Make America Great Again” are eerily similar. They were both a backlash to their predecessors, both of whom were Democratic presidents who were blamed for the decline of American prestige.​

​

If Mr Reagan’s use of the slogan had everything to do with Mr Carter, Mr Trump’s had everything to do with Mr Obama.​

​

Trump: 'We Will Make America Great Again'​

 

[NotfooledbyW]

The Democrats ignored Roe to make abortion somehow a constitutional right which it never was and still isn't.

It’s an inherent right.

1. Ginsburg did not like the reasonsing. She liked the conclusion but said the decision itself was a POS.

Where did she say the decision was a POS?

Justice Ginsburg: 'Unelected Old Men' Decided Roe v. Wade​

​

Ginsburg told law students that the Constitution Supreme Court should have directly affirmed a woman’s right to abortion rather than an alleged “right to privacy.”​

​

The Roe decision “wasn’t woman-centered,” Ginsburg said. “It was physician-centered.”​

 

[NotfooledbyW]

4. As I said.....Gorsuch, Kavennaugh, Bennett...

What does MAGA mean Specifically to 240415 {post•205}. Woodznutz Apr’24 Swdmms: I think the nation has already received God's blessing. It's pretty much over now. Those blessings weren't meant to be perpetual. God will continue to bless individuals as he always has, but the nation is no longer being blessed. wdzntz 240415 Swdmms00205


Sant Woodznutz captures what MAGA means to white Christian Nationalists from what they call a Biblical worldview.

It was the 1950s when white Protestant Christians had a lock on political power. It began to slip away in the next decade so that’s why Trump promised to make Christianity powerful again.

"The power of our group of people together, I mean, if you add it up ... it could be 240, 250 million. And yet we don't exert the power that we should have. Now, I think some of the churches are afraid of their tax status, to be honest,"

"But you know the fact is that there is nothing the politicians can do to you if you band together. You have too much power. But the Christians don't use their power," "We have to strengthen. Because we are getting — if you look, it's death by a million cuts — we are getting less and less and less powerful in terms of a religion, and in terms of a force,"

"I'll tell you one thing: I get elected president, we're going to be saying 'merry Christmas' again. Just remember that," he said. "And by the way, Christianity will have power, without having to form."

"Because if I'm there, you're going to have plenty of power. You don't need anybody else. You're going to have somebody representing you very, very well. Remember that."

TRUMP: If I'm president, 'Christianity will have power' in the US

 

[NotfooledbyW]

Before LBJ wrecked the Democratic Party.

racism, sexism, and all manner of discrimination

authoritarian

Before LBJ wrecked the Democratic Party.

I am all for the idea of talking about our character as much as I am about our people.

What does MAGA mean Specifically 240415 {post•206}. task0778 Apr’24 Swdmms: “One could make a serious case that America was never that great.” tvsknnnn 240415 Swdmms00206

But what nation under every form of authoritarianism has ever been the slightest bit better on the task of preserving individual rights up until MAGA’s role on J6 for defending the idea of having a strongman restore order?

If MAGA is a reality, then any Surveillance and profiling on you while they say you are free, and you must comply is totalitarianism.

Oh my!

 

[NotfooledbyW]

Is Trump the 2nd Coming? 240422 {post•1}

Trump does everything Christians would expect a good president to do.

I tend to think that Trump is the one who will usher in the 2nd Coming

What does MAGA mean Specifically 240415 {post•206}. task0778 Apr’24 Swdmms: Throughout our history, things have been done that were reprehensible, racism, sexism, and all manner of discrimination has occurred. But until now, women, children, and the elderly mostly could at least walk the streets unmolested. People didn't walk into a store and walk out with whatever they wanted without paying for it and they did so without consequence or conscience. tvsknnnn 240415 Swdmms00206


Saint Hikerguy83 is frustrated that no one will tell him what MAGA means.

How can an absurd dog whistle like MAGA have meaning to meaningful people when many of the folks who wear the red MAGA hats are Bible believing right wing Christian’s who believed
Trump is someone related to a second coming of Jesus Christ.

 

[HikerGuy83]

Another failure of MAGA.

When do we hear how they are going to remove government from the clutches of big business.

A recent article reminded me how they cater to huge corporations and make it hard for small businesses to succeed.

Just look at Cali's idiot 20/Hr law.

MAGA says nothing about that.

 

[task0778]

Another failure of MAGA.

When do we hear how they are going to remove government from the clutches of big business.

A recent article reminded me how they cater to huge corporations and make it hard for small businesses to succeed.

Just look at Cali's idiot 20/Hr law.

MAGA says nothing about that.

"Another failure of MAGA."

Not sure what failure you're talking about, but for most things it's a failure of our gov't to do what's best for us rather than their respective parties. Not just MAGA.



"When do we hear how they are going to remove government from the clutches of big business."

I thought it was the democrats hating on big biz, not the GOP. Is anybody talking this up?


"A recent article reminded me how they cater to huge corporations and make it hard for small businesses to succeed."

I'd be interested in reading that article, cuz I think it's a crock of shit. Seems to me that applies more to the democrats.



"Just look at Cali's idiot 20/Hr law."

I don't think MAGA has anything to do with this.

 

[HikerGuy83]

"Another failure of MAGA."

Not sure what failure you're talking about, but for most things it's a failure of our gov't to do what's best for us rather than their respective parties. Not just MAGA.

O.K.

Fair point.

To be clear, I am trying to figure out what MAGA stands for.

In this thread, some of us have identified specifics that MAGA probably considers part of it's agenda, but has not articulated. We are doing them a favor.

But, you are correct in your statement and I should have said things differently.

I thought it was the democrats hating on big biz, not the GOP. Is anybody talking this up?

I have to deal with this all the time. Government and Big Business are almost inseparable. The GOP needs to step away from large corporations as they are trying to control things. But, underneath, they (big business) fund these corrupt GOPers and that is why we have idiots in congress.

Democrats, in the end, love big business. They both want more control (of us) and they are working together to that end.

Obama bailed out GM when he should have let it sink. Why ? Ask yourself. The government also bailed out Chrysler many years earlier (to big to fail was the term). Ask yourself why ?

I'd be interested in reading that article, cuz I think it's a crock of shit. Seems to me that applies more to the democrats.

Don't get fooled. GOP at the federal level is as corrupt as it gets. Do you know that 20% of our GDP runs through DC ? 20% !!!!!!!!! That is incredible. Democrat and Republican mean little at the federal level.

I don't think MAGA has anything to do with this.

Yes, you are correct and I was not trying to hang it on MAGA. It's more a general example.

Thank you for your clarrifying questions.

 

[MarathonMike]

Specifically, MAGA means getting the anti-American Democrats out of power. Simple as that.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

Obama bailed out GM when he should have let it sink.

Because Bush left him the worst economic disaster since the Great Depression.

Make America Great Again by eliminating jobs in heavy industry like auto manufacturing. Does that make much sense?

Ford was solvent at the time but they supported the bailout of their competition because they feared supply chain failure would cause them to shut down too.

 

[task0778]

To be clear, I am trying to figure out what MAGA stands for.

The slogan 'Make America Great Again' did not start with Trump, but began much earlier by Reagan. During his acceptance speech at the 1980 Republican convention, Reagan said, "For those without job opportunities, we'll stimulate new opportunities, particularly in the inner cities where they live. For those who've abandoned hope, we'll restore hope and we'll welcome them into a great national crusade to make America great again." Trump basically commandeered the expression to attract the disaffected people who were unhappy with the direction the country was moving in. He promoted the idea of 'America First', which I take to mean protectionism of domestic American enterprises (which I oppose) and the curtailment of immigration, especially illegal immigration across our southern border.

So, MAGA has it's roots in economic distress, but has expanded to other issues: abortion, immigration, and a host of others. MAGA people are a diverse group with differing priorities. Much like the Democratic Party, MAGA as it's moderates but also it's extremists. So, it's a bit difficult to define what MAGA stands for, but it's easier to specify what they are against. Which in their eyes essentially is the progressive liberal agenda. There isn't much that both sides want.

Me? I don't like Trump and would rather see someone else as the GOP nominee. I do support much of his agenda to varying degrees but oppose others. My problem is that I believe the progressive Left is driving their party and I cannot support their policies at all. So, I'm left with the choice between 2 evils, which is worse. If Trump is elected, he's not going to have a 60-vote Senate majority even if the republicans win back the House. And whatever executive actions he takes will be challenged in court and I do not believe the current Supreme Court will always rule in his favor. So, whatever he wants to do will be restricted and as we saw with Biden, the next democrat president will wipe it all away.

But - my overriding concern is if and when a democrat wins the WH and controls the house and has a Senate majority. If they change the Senate rules to abolish the filibuster then they can pretty much do as they please and that is when America turns into a one-party gov't. IMHO, if and when that happens we are fucked.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

Specifically, MAGA means getting the anti-American Democrats out of power. Simple as that.

By storming the Capitol on counting the electors day in conjunction with submitting fake elector certificates to Mike Pence so he can declare Trump/Pence the winner of the 2020 election.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

So, MAGA has it's roots in economic distress, but has expanded to other issues: abortion

Abortion = Saving Baby Fetus from godless Democrat mommies was the primary vote getting fuel for the Republican Party that has become the MAGA Party of Trump until Dobbs.

So far the Saving Baby Fetus Cult is staying with MAGA for now but the shiny MAGA object that is Trump is losing some of its appeal.