What A Hit

[mudwhistle]

Easy to say when you are not moving 30 mph flying through the air already committed not knowing how it will exactly end up when you two finally meet as the runner changes position, and all within a second.

I would be more OK with these penalties if they also gave the QB a penalty for a late slide. All the NFL looks at is OUTCOMES instead of causes and effects. And the NFL itself never blames themselves.

EVERY WEEK I see games where flags are thrown and penalties called and no one in the booth, including the experts and consultants in the rules knows what the fuck or where the penalty even occurred!

Nobody is moving 30 mph. The fastest players can only run 22 mph.

 

[toobfreak]

If they are going to continue these unjust penalties, maybe they should change the rules to forbid the QB from leaving the pocket.

My problem is that they keep changing the rules every year. Each year they institute new rules for a desired outcome then they don't work so they change the rules again.

If the rules were good, they wouldn't need to change them.

The NFL has become a laboratory for social engineering and the players are the guinea pigs, except, the players pay for their mistakes.

Just today, I saw a defender literally grab a receiver by the shoulders and THROW HIM TO THE GROUND before the ball arrived, then turn to catch the ball for himself then run it back for a TD!

Illegal use of hands?
Defensive Pass Interference?

Nope. No flag was thrown, the refs had no issue and allowed the TD to stand.

Same game as the one where they blew a play dead as a RB was literally feet from the end zone running in for a TD.

In one fell swoop, the refs change the game by 14 bullshit points.

There are so many rules now and they have gotten so complex, the refs don't know what the fuck they are doing, and it is penalty after penalty after penalty, many of them bullshit.

And players are fed up.

Just get off the fucking field and let the guys play. Throw a flag when you see an obvious, egregious penalty. If a QB tries to run with the ball like a RB then waits until the very last second trying to get 1st down before he slides and ends up taking a tough hit, that was HIS gamble.

 

[toobfreak]

Nobody is moving 30 mph. The fastest players can only run 22 mph.

So if two players are running at each other at 22 mph, what is the speed of the final impact?

 

[mudwhistle]

So if two players are running at each other at 22 mph, what is the speed of the final impact?

If one of them has slid to a near stop....roughly 22 mph

 

[gtopa1]

Easy to say when you are not moving 30 mph flying through the air already committed not knowing how it will exactly end up when you two finally meet as the runner changes position, and all within a second.

I would be more OK with these penalties if they also gave the QB a penalty for a late slide. All the NFL looks at is OUTCOMES instead of causes and effects. And the NFL itself never blames themselves.

EVERY WEEK I see games where flags are thrown and penalties called and no one in the booth, including the experts and consultants in the rules knows what the fuck or where the penalty even occurred!

I've done "flying tackles" many times but I never braced my forearm like that prior to contact with neck/chin.

Greg

 

[Concerned American]

I'm sick and tired of players getting stiff penalties for legal hits because they no longer know how to do their jobs without drawing a penalty because there is no legal way of making contact with human physiology.

Me too. Another BS NFL policy is when they eject and fine a player for retaliating after being punched while not ejecting and fining the player who was originally responsible. Especially when it is clearly shown on the jumbotron. You and I are totally on the same page on this debate.

 

[toobfreak]

Then it's clear you didn't play much, because if you lead with your helmet you're going to fuck somebody up, including yourself.

Why would anyone intentionally fuck themselves up?
You lead with your head because your head is at the top of your body leading the rest of it. It is anatomical. Best you can try to do is twist at the last second so as to not hit the other guys helmet with your own or aim that you hit the chest, but the head will always be leading.

It is mostly plays that happened so quick that get called for that because they simply didn't have time to change body direction or position.

 

[toobfreak]

If one of them has slid to a near stop....roughly 22 mph

But you are still moving. The QB was sliding forward when hit so didn't stop. If he was only moving 8 mph, there is your 30 mph.

 

[toobfreak]

I've done "flying tackles" many times but I never braced my forearm like that prior to contact with neck/chin.

So if you didn't put your arm out ahead of you in a tackle like the one in question, what did you plan on hitting the runner with? Your helmet or your shoulder?

I would rather be hit with an arm than a helmet or a shoulder.

 

[mudwhistle]

Why would anyone intentionally fuck themselves up?
You lead with your head because your head is at the top of your body leading the rest of it. It is anatomical. Best you can try to do is twist at the last second so as to not hit the other guys helmet with your own or aim that you hit the chest, but the head will always be leading.

It is mostly plays that happened so quick that get called for that because they simply didn't have time to change body direction or position.

Most of the time when guys get hurt it's because they were driven into the ground and banged their head on the turf. Or somebody grabs then by the shoulder pads and pulls them down from behind with their entire body weight. Detroit's DE Hutchinson broke his own leg by doing this.

 

[Concerned American]

Hi CA; it looked like the defender braced his forearm and that was the initial contact; I see upon about half a dozen replays that it hit around his chin guard...am I correct? Are you sure that is legal? I'm a Rugby chappy and that'd be a sendoff every time.

Greg

It isn't illegal to hit someone with one or both of your arms crossed in front of you. The problem is where on the offensive player those arms contact. In this instance, the hit was launched while the QB was standing and if he had continued to run upright, the arm would have hit on the numbers where it has the most impact. The QB sliding a split second before the contact was the reason the arm hit the facemask. The problem is with a BS sliding rule that was designed for no other reason than to protect the owner's multi million dollar investment in the QB.

 

[mudwhistle]

But you are still moving. The QB was sliding forward when hit so didn't stop. If he was only moving 8 mph, there is your 30 mph.

Wishful thinking.

 

[mudwhistle]

It isn't illegal to hit someone with one or both of your arms crossed in front of you. The problem is where on the offensive player those arms contact. In this instance, the hit was launched while the QB was standing and if he had continued to run upright, the arm would have hit on the numbers where it has the most impact. The QB sliding a split second before the contact was the reason the arm hit the facemask. The problem is with a BS sliding rule that was designed for no other reason than to protect the owner's multi million dollar investment in the QB.

If he was aiming for his chest then he would have gone over the top of him.

Nope....he knew he was going to slide and he wanted to crack him a good one. Then as soon as he did it, he threw his hands up like saying "Waaaaaaaaaa,,..I dinnit do nuffin".

 

[toobfreak]

Me too. Another BS NFL policy is when they eject and fine a player for retaliating after being punched while not ejecting and fining the player who was originally responsible. Especially when it is clearly shown on the jumbotron. You and I are totally on the same page on this debate.

The NFL is full of bullshit. Just a few years ago, they tried penalizing players for being exuberant in a big score! They called it "excessive celebration." What a crock.
Just today, I saw a WR catch a ball against the defender's best efforts and the defender fell down. So the WR jawed something at him and dropped the ball, so much as saying: "There, tough guy! Beat you ass on that one!" The ref called either unsportsmanlike conduct on him or taunting (I think the first), a 15 yard penalty, and warning of a possible ejection if it happened again.

BULLSHIT. Let these guys talk smack and celebrate so long as it doesn't hurt the game or anyone else. This is high stakes competition. Elevated emotions. Millions on the line. The season and careers. I am sick of the grade-school attempts at behavior management and social engineering.

I see penalties called that had NO IMPACT ON THE GAME! Technical penalties for something on the far side of the field that had no impact on the play! I wish people would grow a pair and stop going to the games, stop buying the NFL gear, let the league know we are sick of this crap and will boycott the games until we get the product WE want.

A simple, honest game where the refs play a minimal role and only step in where NECESSARY to maintain GAME RULES and EGREGIOUS play violations.

 

[mudwhistle]

The NFL is full of bullshit. Just a few years ago, they tried penalizing players for being exuberant in a big score! They called it "excessive celebration." What a crock.
Just today, I saw a WR catch a ball against the defender's best efforts and the defender fell down. So the WR jawed something at him and dropped the ball, so much as saying: "There, tough guy! Best you ass on that one!" The ref called either unsportsmanlike conduct on him or taunting (I think the first), a 15 yard penalty, and warning of a possible ejection if it happened again.

BULLSHIT. Let these guys talk smack and celebrate so long as it doesn't hurt the game or anyone else. This is high stakes competition. Elevated emotions. Millions on the line. The season and careers. I am sick of the grade-school attempts at behavior management and social engineering.

I see penalties called that had NO IMPACT ON THE GAME! Technical penalties for something on the far side of the field that had no impact on the play! I wish people would grow a pair and stop going to the games, stop buying the NFL gear, let the league know we are sick of this crap and will boycott the games until we get the production WE want.

A simple, honest game where the refs play a minimal role and only step in where NECESSARY to maintain GAME RULES and EGREGIOUS play violations.

 

[Concerned American]

If he was aiming for his chest then he would have gone over the top of him.

The QB, in his slide put his head at the same height as his numbers used to be. That is why the arm hit the face mask. The QB didn't instantly become prone on the ground until he was put there. To my point of a game of inches. The QB did not gain another inch.

 

[toobfreak]

Wishful thinking.

There is nothing wishful about anything here! The speed of the impact is the COMBINED speed of the two players! And you just said they move up to 22 mph! That means that collisions can occur at up to 44 mph.

At that speed, two players could close together and collide from as far away as 64 feet in ONE SECOND.

Do the math.

These collisions look bad in slo-mo, but the fact of the matter is that they happen VERY QUICKLY, far more quickly than the players can plan out or know how they will end up and faster than the electrochemical system of the brain can react to.

Best a player can do is at the last instant as they see a bad collision coming, is try to alter or brace for it best they can.

 

[mudwhistle]

The QB, in his slide put his head at the same height as his numbers used to be. That is why the arm hit the face mask. The QB didn't instantly become prone on the ground until he was put there. To my point of a game of inches. The QB did not gain another inch.

Nah....the creep hit him with a forearm where his cup would have been.....and I ran the play in slow-motion.....he was intentionally aiming for his face. He was on a downward trajectory when he hit him. He finished on his knees.

 

[Concerned American]

Nah....the creep hit him with a forearm where is cup would have been.....and I ran the play in slow-motion.....he was intentionally aiming for his face. He was on a downward trajectory when he hit him. He finished on his knees.

After launching, physics says your trajectory will fall. It is called gravity. I can see that you are intractable in your position as I am mine. There is no substance to it and it will change nothing. The NFL is what it is and they will continue to degrade the game with these incessant rule changes. It is their game, they make the rules. But I don't have to agree with it or support it. You would think they'd figure that out after the whole Kapaernick woke debacle. Meh.

 

[mudwhistle]

After launching, physics says your trajectory will fall. It is called gravity. I can see that you are intractable in your position as I am mine. There is no substance to it and it will change nothing. The NFL is what it is and they will continue to degrade the game with these incessant rule changes. It is their game, they make the rules. But I don't have to agree with it or support it. You would think they'd figure that out after the whole Kapaernick woke debacle. Meh.

I provided a slow motion view facing the defender in the OP. I see him targeting him with a forearm to the head.

End of story.