Was Christ faking it when he was crucified?

[hazlnut]

First off, let me say that I believe the story of Christ is meant to inspire us to be better people. Take the sermon on the mount to heart and let is guide your daily lives. It doesn't matter if he was real or not, follow his teachings on unconditional love and tolerance and you'll be a better person and lead a more purposeful life.

However...

I was thinking about the gospels the other day, everything that we are told about Christ specifically the super-hero powers he had to produce food, raise the dead, and cure the sick.

It's possible that on Good Friday (which was really a shitty day), that Christ didn't really feel any pain at all. He was just putting on a show for all his followers.

Showmanship means you finish big and leave them wanting more. You create suspense and drama, then have a big twist at the end. He has all these super powers and magic abilities but he didn't like showing off too much and only used his powers when needed to really convince people he was the real deal. It may have served his purpose to appear to be in pain and agony when he was really feeling nothing at all. Then, when the dust settled, he just gets up and flies away, making sure a few people see him. M. Night Shamalan couldn't cook up a better twist then that. Although, it would have been better if all of Rome had seen Christ fly up in the air like Kal-El, and he could have thrown the cross he was crucified on right through Pilate's roof and then swooped down on Herod, picked him and dropped him in the Sea.

I hope that Christ used his magic powers to make sure the others being crucified on the same day, the thieves, felt no pain. Crucification was brutal and Christ really should have gone all Moses on the Romans and rained some frogs and hellfire down on them.

Let's face it, Moses was a bad ass. Once he got his powers via the magic staff, he went to town on the oppressors. Christ, the pacifist, was all about being martyred, and given all the super powers described in the gospels, I'm thinking Christ was feeling nothing and just putting on a show to gin up his followers.

If Christ was nailed to the cross laughing at the Romans and cracking jokes about how they can't hurt him, he would have come off as less sympathetic and kind of a dick.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Some have argued that was the case.

 

[Avatar4321]

If you know a way to fake being crucified, let me know. Till then im willing to assume it hurt like hell. Literally.

 

[Big Black Dog]

hazlnut, did you take your medications this morning?

 

[BreezeWood]

If Christ was nailed to the cross laughing at the Romans and cracking jokes about how they can't hurt him, he would have come off as less sympathetic and kind of a dick.

your statement belies what that would actually have accomplished, otherwise offers the proof for the delusions of a chosen person.

.

 

[hazlnut]

If you know a way to fake being crucified, let me know. Till then im willing to assume it hurt like hell. Literally.

They hammered nails through his hands and feet, put a crown of thorns on him, he just didn't feel anything. He was just acting for the crowd, pretending to be mortal, to be human.

If you saw the movie Prometheus, they hinted that ETs had planned to come back to earth 2000 years ago to destroy us because we did something to piss them off. We crucified to one they sent to earth to show us how to live. Jesus' super powers could be explained by excepting that ETs visited us, didn't like what they saw, the anger, wrath, and brutality of the OT, and hedonistic Roman society, and thus created a new mythology for, giving stories that would push us in a moral and right direction and become a better society.

History is reported to us by people who believe their personal account to be the one future generation need to hear -- thus unreliable as far as fact or accuracy. Four Gospels, only one mentions a virgin mother?

What's interesting is how much God himself shows up in the Old Testament and the New Testament is about someone who is the Son of God. And God himself only communicated via proxy, angles and Jesus.

 

[hazlnut]

If Christ was nailed to the cross laughing at the Romans and cracking jokes about how they can't hurt him, he would have come off as less sympathetic and kind of a dick.

your statement belies what that would actually have accomplished, otherwise offers the proof for the delusions of a chosen person.

.

Martyrdom is a powerful symbol to inspire the underclass to rise up.

Also, the drama of having the crowd mock him and stone him as a fraud. Then hear he rose from the dead 3 days later. That story gathers some traction, gets told over and over, and people obviously went nuts for it.

He knew what he was doing.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Thank you for your witness that "He knew what he was doing."

 

[The Irish Ram]

First off, let me say that I believe the story of Christ is meant to inspire us to be better people. Take the sermon on the mount to heart and let is guide your daily lives. It doesn't matter if he was real or not, follow his teachings on unconditional love and tolerance and you'll be a better person and lead a more purposeful life.

However...

I was thinking about the gospels the other day, everything that we are told about Christ specifically the super-hero powers he had to produce food, raise the dead, and cure the sick.

It's possible that on Good Friday (which was really a shitty day), that Christ didn't really feel any pain at all. He was just putting on a show for all his followers.

Showmanship means you finish big and leave them wanting more. You create suspense and drama, then have a big twist at the end. He has all these super powers and magic abilities but he didn't like showing off too much and only used his powers when needed to really convince people he was the real deal. It may have served his purpose to appear to be in pain and agony when he was really feeling nothing at all. Then, when the dust settled, he just gets up and flies away, making sure a few people see him. M. Night Shamalan couldn't cook up a better twist then that. Although, it would have been better if all of Rome had seen Christ fly up in the air like Kal-El, and he could have thrown the cross he was crucified on right through Pilate's roof and then swooped down on Herod, picked him and dropped him in the Sea.

I hope that Christ used his magic powers to make sure the others being crucified on the same day, the thieves, felt no pain. Crucification was brutal and Christ really should have gone all Moses on the Romans and rained some frogs and hellfire down on them.

Let's face it, Moses was a bad ass. Once he got his powers via the magic staff, he went to town on the oppressors. Christ, the pacifist, was all about being martyred, and given all the super powers described in the gospels, I'm thinking Christ was feeling nothing and just putting on a show to gin up his followers.

If Christ was nailed to the cross laughing at the Romans and cracking jokes about how they can't hurt him, he would have come off as less sympathetic and kind of a dick.

Yeah that's it. He was pretending to be beaten so badly He wasn't recognizable as human.

 

[hazlnut]

Thank you for your witness that "He knew what he was doing."

The story changed rather abruptly from a superman who could change matter, animate life, and heal -- a demigod with knowledge and powers beyond any man -- to a helpless victim of an oppressive society at the mercy of a bunch of soldiers.

Christ was capable of changing matter -- why not turn their swords into snakes, ala Moses?

Christ was capable making the dead living, just reverse the magic in front of Harod and he would have backed off.


The other possibility is that all the stories about magic and supernatural powers are bullshit. And Christ was just a man, like all of us, a son of the creator, and his life and death became an inspirational story for gentiles and Jews.


One big fallacy in the evangelical literalist view is that if you don't accept Jesus into your heart you're going to hell. Native American Indians could not have known the story of Christ until Columbus and later the Pilgrims landed on their shore. How are Buddhists, Hindus, Native Americans supposed to be saved if they were never able to hear the 'Good Word'?? Seems kind of unfair that the loving and forgiving God would create a world with societies separated by water and expect early tribes without the technology to cross an ocean to all believe in a man they've never heard of. But I digress. This is a topic for another thread.

 

[jwoodie]

The OP is obviously a flame job, but it does raise the question of Jesus' physical identity. Was he a human being with 64 chromosomes? Did he have an individual soul? Did he actually "die" on the Cross? Was his physical body then reconstituted and transported to Heaven? Does Heaven have a physical location?

It is easy to say "I believe" but difficult to describe exactly what it is you believe.

 

[Chuckt]

Hazlnut,

The Romans knew death and if Jesus wasn't dead, they would have broke his legs. When you have your bowels ripped open and a spear go through your side, you just don't roll a bolder away from your tomb, scare the soldiers away and make people believe you are a super hero. If he came out of the tomb and rolled the bolder away, I would assure you he would be feeling pain which would have been so noticeable that He wouldn't have appeared a super hero to anyone let alone scare the guards of his tomb away.

Chuck

 

[Avatar4321]

If you know a way to fake being crucified, let me know. Till then im willing to assume it hurt like hell. Literally.

They hammered nails through his hands and feet, put a crown of thorns on him, he just didn't feel anything. He was just acting for the crowd, pretending to be mortal, to be human.

If you saw the movie Prometheus, they hinted that ETs had planned to come back to earth 2000 years ago to destroy us because we did something to piss them off. We crucified to one they sent to earth to show us how to live. Jesus' super powers could be explained by excepting that ETs visited us, didn't like what they saw, the anger, wrath, and brutality of the OT, and hedonistic Roman society, and thus created a new mythology for, giving stories that would push us in a moral and right direction and become a better society.

History is reported to us by people who believe their personal account to be the one future generation need to hear -- thus unreliable as far as fact or accuracy. Four Gospels, only one mentions a virgin mother?

What's interesting is how much God himself shows up in the Old Testament and the New Testament is about someone who is the Son of God. And God himself only communicated via proxy, angles and Jesus.

God didn't show up that often at all in the Old Testament either. Most who saw God were lifted up to see Him. In fact, the only reference to the Lord appearing on earth to people in the OT is with Moses and the congregation when the Israelites called upon Moses to not have the Lord show up.

However, back on point, why on earth should we believe your prometheus hypothesis and not believe that actual record?

 

[theword]

First off, let me say that I believe the story of Christ is meant to inspire us to be better people. Take the sermon on the mount to heart and let is guide your daily lives. It doesn't matter if he was real or not, follow his teachings on unconditional love and tolerance and you'll be a better person and lead a more purposeful life.

However...

I was thinking about the gospels the other day, everything that we are told about Christ specifically the super-hero powers he had to produce food, raise the dead, and cure the sick.

It's possible that on Good Friday (which was really a shitty day), that Christ didn't really feel any pain at all. He was just putting on a show for all his followers.

Showmanship means you finish big and leave them wanting more. You create suspense and drama, then have a big twist at the end. He has all these super powers and magic abilities but he didn't like showing off too much and only used his powers when needed to really convince people he was the real deal. It may have served his purpose to appear to be in pain and agony when he was really feeling nothing at all. Then, when the dust settled, he just gets up and flies away, making sure a few people see him. M. Night Shamalan couldn't cook up a better twist then that. Although, it would have been better if all of Rome had seen Christ fly up in the air like Kal-El, and he could have thrown the cross he was crucified on right through Pilate's roof and then swooped down on Herod, picked him and dropped him in the Sea.

I hope that Christ used his magic powers to make sure the others being crucified on the same day, the thieves, felt no pain. Crucification was brutal and Christ really should have gone all Moses on the Romans and rained some frogs and hellfire down on them.

Let's face it, Moses was a bad ass. Once he got his powers via the magic staff, he went to town on the oppressors. Christ, the pacifist, was all about being martyred, and given all the super powers described in the gospels, I'm thinking Christ was feeling nothing and just putting on a show to gin up his followers.

If Christ was nailed to the cross laughing at the Romans and cracking jokes about how they can't hurt him, he would have come off as less sympathetic and kind of a dick.

God only told us to obey ALL His commandments. He didn't say to go worship false gods (deities such as Jesus, Virgin Mary's, angels, prophets, saints, buildings built with human hands, golden altars, or anything of this world.).

Religious people love this world and all the deities that they imagine within their minds.

Acts 17:
24: The God who made the world and everything in it, being Lord of heaven and earth, does not live in shrines made by man,
25: nor is he served by human hands, as though he needed anything, since he himself gives to all men life and breath and everything.


Jeremiah 10
10: But the LORD is the true God; he is the living God and the everlasting King. At his wrath the earth quakes, and the nations cannot endure his indignation.
11: Thus shall you say to them: "The gods who did not make the heavens and the earth shall perish from the earth and from under the heavens."
12: It is he who made the earth by his power, who established the world by his wisdom, and by his understanding stretched out the heavens.
13: When he utters his voice there is a tumult of waters in the heavens, and he makes the mist rise from the ends of the earth. He makes lightnings for the rain, and he brings forth the wind from his storehouses.
14: Every man is stupid and without knowledge; every goldsmith is put to shame by his idols; for his images are false, and there is no breath in them.
15: They are worthless, a work of delusion; at the time of their punishment they shall perish.

 

[Delta4Embassy]

First off, let me say that I believe the story of Christ is meant to inspire us to be better people. Take the sermon on the mount to heart and let is guide your daily lives. It doesn't matter if he was real or not, follow his teachings on unconditional love and tolerance and you'll be a better person and lead a more purposeful life.

However...

I was thinking about the gospels the other day, everything that we are told about Christ specifically the super-hero powers he had to produce food, raise the dead, and cure the sick.

It's possible that on Good Friday (which was really a shitty day), that Christ didn't really feel any pain at all. He was just putting on a show for all his followers.

Showmanship means you finish big and leave them wanting more. You create suspense and drama, then have a big twist at the end. He has all these super powers and magic abilities but he didn't like showing off too much and only used his powers when needed to really convince people he was the real deal. It may have served his purpose to appear to be in pain and agony when he was really feeling nothing at all. Then, when the dust settled, he just gets up and flies away, making sure a few people see him. M. Night Shamalan couldn't cook up a better twist then that. Although, it would have been better if all of Rome had seen Christ fly up in the air like Kal-El, and he could have thrown the cross he was crucified on right through Pilate's roof and then swooped down on Herod, picked him and dropped him in the Sea.

I hope that Christ used his magic powers to make sure the others being crucified on the same day, the thieves, felt no pain. Crucification was brutal and Christ really should have gone all Moses on the Romans and rained some frogs and hellfire down on them.

Let's face it, Moses was a bad ass. Once he got his powers via the magic staff, he went to town on the oppressors. Christ, the pacifist, was all about being martyred, and given all the super powers described in the gospels, I'm thinking Christ was feeling nothing and just putting on a show to gin up his followers.

If Christ was nailed to the cross laughing at the Romans and cracking jokes about how they can't hurt him, he would have come off as less sympathetic and kind of a dick.

If Yeshua was G-d incarnate, or a relative of G-d, then by definition he cannot die. And any appearance he was, was for dramatic effect. Thus no self-sacrifice, no forgiveness of everyone's sins. You can't sacrifice (theologically speaking) if you're not loosing or giving up anything.

 

[Chuckt]

First off, let me say that I believe the story of Christ is meant to inspire us to be better people. Take the sermon on the mount to heart and let is guide your daily lives. It doesn't matter if he was real or not, follow his teachings on unconditional love and tolerance and you'll be a better person and lead a more purposeful life.

However...

I was thinking about the gospels the other day, everything that we are told about Christ specifically the super-hero powers he had to produce food, raise the dead, and cure the sick.

It's possible that on Good Friday (which was really a shitty day), that Christ didn't really feel any pain at all. He was just putting on a show for all his followers.

Showmanship means you finish big and leave them wanting more. You create suspense and drama, then have a big twist at the end. He has all these super powers and magic abilities but he didn't like showing off too much and only used his powers when needed to really convince people he was the real deal. It may have served his purpose to appear to be in pain and agony when he was really feeling nothing at all. Then, when the dust settled, he just gets up and flies away, making sure a few people see him. M. Night Shamalan couldn't cook up a better twist then that. Although, it would have been better if all of Rome had seen Christ fly up in the air like Kal-El, and he could have thrown the cross he was crucified on right through Pilate's roof and then swooped down on Herod, picked him and dropped him in the Sea.

I hope that Christ used his magic powers to make sure the others being crucified on the same day, the thieves, felt no pain. Crucification was brutal and Christ really should have gone all Moses on the Romans and rained some frogs and hellfire down on them.

Let's face it, Moses was a bad ass. Once he got his powers via the magic staff, he went to town on the oppressors. Christ, the pacifist, was all about being martyred, and given all the super powers described in the gospels, I'm thinking Christ was feeling nothing and just putting on a show to gin up his followers.

If Christ was nailed to the cross laughing at the Romans and cracking jokes about how they can't hurt him, he would have come off as less sympathetic and kind of a dick.

If Yeshua was G-d incarnate, or a relative of G-d, then by definition he cannot die. And any appearance he was, was for dramatic effect. Thus no self-sacrifice, no forgiveness of everyone's sins. You can't sacrifice (theologically speaking) if you're not loosing or giving up anything.

Except God took on an additional nature and became a man and had His own human spirit and having a human body, His body died and the experienced death.

Hebrews 4:15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as [we are, yet] without sin.

Philippians 2:8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

He humbled or veiled Himself in human flesh and basically put on the form of a servant.

 

[Delta4Embassy]

According to the Bible, when a human dies they rot in the Earth until ressurection day. "And the sea shall give up its' dead..." et al. Thus, a human dying is an end of that human until that day. But if Yeshua came back to life 3 days later, he didn't actually die and was never truly dead like real humans would be. Plus the point of sacrificing your life is that you don't really know what happens when you die and are basically hoping for the best. If a deity sacrifices their human form, thye know absolutely they'll just revert to their divine form so no big deal. Thus it isn't the same level of personal sacrifice as if a real human did it.

 

[Chuckt]

According to the Bible, when a human dies they rot in the Earth until ressurection day. "And the sea shall give up its' dead..." et al. Thus, a human dying is an end of that human until that day. But if Yeshua came back to life 3 days later, he didn't actually die and was never truly dead like real humans would be. Plus the point of sacrificing your life is that you don't really know what happens when you die and are basically hoping for the best. If a deity sacrifices their human form, thye know absolutely they'll just revert to their divine form so no big deal. Thus it isn't the same level of personal sacrifice as if a real human did it.

But He is the resurrection.

Matthew 22:32 I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.

King James Bible
And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. - Revelation 20:13

The sea is representative of the flood where the unbelieving wouldn't get on the Ark and the earth was filled with violence so judgment came (those dead) or the Egyptians that died in the Red Sea chasing Moses. The context is death and hell with death meaning separation from God.

Before the resurrection of Jesus, there were two compartments and salvation wasn't paid for so the dead had to wait in one of the two compartments. When Jesus died, He led captivity captive and paradise was the throne room of God and it was emptied out.

2 Corinthians 5:8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

Luke 23:43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.

What is referred to as soul sleep is the body sleeping in the grave. Our souls are conscious and do not "sleep" as in soul sleep.

Revelation 6:9 ¶ And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:

Revelation 6:10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?

 

[Avatar4321]

First off, let me say that I believe the story of Christ is meant to inspire us to be better people. Take the sermon on the mount to heart and let is guide your daily lives. It doesn't matter if he was real or not, follow his teachings on unconditional love and tolerance and you'll be a better person and lead a more purposeful life.

However...

I was thinking about the gospels the other day, everything that we are told about Christ specifically the super-hero powers he had to produce food, raise the dead, and cure the sick.

It's possible that on Good Friday (which was really a shitty day), that Christ didn't really feel any pain at all. He was just putting on a show for all his followers.

Showmanship means you finish big and leave them wanting more. You create suspense and drama, then have a big twist at the end. He has all these super powers and magic abilities but he didn't like showing off too much and only used his powers when needed to really convince people he was the real deal. It may have served his purpose to appear to be in pain and agony when he was really feeling nothing at all. Then, when the dust settled, he just gets up and flies away, making sure a few people see him. M. Night Shamalan couldn't cook up a better twist then that. Although, it would have been better if all of Rome had seen Christ fly up in the air like Kal-El, and he could have thrown the cross he was crucified on right through Pilate's roof and then swooped down on Herod, picked him and dropped him in the Sea.

I hope that Christ used his magic powers to make sure the others being crucified on the same day, the thieves, felt no pain. Crucification was brutal and Christ really should have gone all Moses on the Romans and rained some frogs and hellfire down on them.

Let's face it, Moses was a bad ass. Once he got his powers via the magic staff, he went to town on the oppressors. Christ, the pacifist, was all about being martyred, and given all the super powers described in the gospels, I'm thinking Christ was feeling nothing and just putting on a show to gin up his followers.

If Christ was nailed to the cross laughing at the Romans and cracking jokes about how they can't hurt him, he would have come off as less sympathetic and kind of a dick.

If Yeshua was G-d incarnate, or a relative of G-d, then by definition he cannot die. And any appearance he was, was for dramatic effect. Thus no self-sacrifice, no forgiveness of everyone's sins. You can't sacrifice (theologically speaking) if you're not loosing or giving up anything.

I thought God could do anything

 

[GISMYS]

Only the body dies,the soul and spirit are eternal.