pknopp
Diamond Member
- Jul 22, 2019
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CAFE standards. Taxes on cars that USD more gas. (Trucks do not lay these taxes.)You still haven't backed up your position.
Game, set, match. You lose.
Yes, we increased CAFE standards. That didn't ban big cars like you said so what are you saying? That you miss the days of smog filled cities?
For nearly generations ships produced steam by burning coal. Then after World War One, those ships went away quickly. It wasn’t the result of legislation. It wasn’t the result of requirements. It was the result of economic reality. Oil was better than coal. A new and more reliable system was developed. The market developed a newer and better system that was embraced by the world. Military, Private, and Commercial ships all used this new system.
Oil fired ships have gone the way of the Dodo too. Why? Diesel. Newer, more reliable Diesel engines were produced. Oil became too expensive to maintain, and it went away. Again, not the result of legislation, or requirements.
You say smog filled cities. Before the cars, those cities were awash with disease and the stench of horse droppings. The horses were not legislated away. Sure we have legislation now, but it came long after the fact that the Cars had replaced the horses. Cars were better. Faster, more reliable, and without the problems associated with horses.
Progress will get there. It takes time, and patience. Those smog filled cities were not good, but they were infinitely better than the disease ridden cesspools that existed when horses were the main source of transportation.
Coal fired steam engines driving trains are gone. Oh there are a few left around more for those souls who love the romance of the things. But they are more for tourists than true use as commercial engines.
That is the truth of the world. When you develop something better, you don’t need to legislate it. It will be adapted by the world quickly. Airplanes? No one legislated that they must be used. But after World War II the days of the large Ocean Liners, like the ill fated Titanic, were numbered, and everyone knew it. Why spend days crossing the Atlantic if you could do it in hours? Why spend weeks crossing the Pacific if you could do it in a couple days?
Time and again, progress has eradicated something that was used. Until this century, it was never by Legislation.
The Royal Navy of the United Kingdom. The creators of Pax Britannia in history. They resisted the switch from Sail to Steam for a long time. But once they made the first steam powered iron sided ship, everyone was going to. HMS Warrior was built, and instantly every other ship on the oceans of the world was obsolete. No legislation required it. No international agreements were hammered out. Either you had a steam powered armored ship, or you were not an ocean going sea power.
That has happened many many times in history. Progress happens like that. Warrior was replaced by other newer and improved ships. HMS Dreadnaught, and against instantly all other ships were obsolete. In another decade, Dreadnaught was obsolete by the newer standards foisted upon the world by progress and development.
Aircraft Carriers replaced the big gun battleships, and then missiles replaced bombs.
Cars? You say that Cafe Standards were just to fix a small problem. Nonsense. What CAFE standards have done is make it impossible for the people to fix their own cars. People could learn to tear down a carburetor and fix it. Nobody knows how to fix a computer component. All we can do is replace the thing. Creating more waste, hazardous waste I might add.
Electric Cars are coming, and when they are an improvement over the existing systems, you won’t need to legislate them. People will buy them because they are better. Nobody sells a computer with a paltry 8088 chip anymore. Why? Was it legislated out? No, it was superseded by Pentiums.
Legislation is used when Progress isn’t going fast enough for the impatient Progressives among us. People who don’t want to wait. People who don’t want to let the Market develop new and improved items. They want to force the progress.
The most recent increase to those CAFE standards you are so proud of. They require technology that does not yet exist. Now, it was one thing for Kennedy to call on the nation to go to the moon, and the nation to invest in that non existent technology. But to demand that private companies fund the research, out of their own pockets, while decrying the expense of their products, is ridiculous.
Ford responded to those new standards by developing a new transmission. Ten speed transmission. Ten speed. Seriously? The idea is that with those transmissions, the car can always use the lowest possible RPM’s to maintain speed. But to do so you have to have a computer talking to other computers, and that means more of that hazardous waste you don’t seem to care about.
The biggest problem with Progressives, is that they can’t agree among themselves. The Solar advocates are opposed to wind farms. Why? The wind farms kill birds and that is bad. The Wind guys think Solar folks are idiots. Solar panels only last about twenty years, and then they are nothing but landfill fodder. The Solar folks point out the fiberglass blades on the wind mills are huge problems when they wear out and point to the expense and pollution to get the items shipped to Wyoming where they are similarly landfill fodder.
Electric, Fuel Cell, Partridge in a Pear Tree. Everyone is convinced only they are right, and the rest of the world must be forced to go along with them.
Want to change the world? Develop an engine that gets a hundred miles to a gallon of gas. You won’t need legislation to force it on the people. You won’t need to mandate that the companies adapt their cars to that engine. All you will have to do is hire a lot of security to keep those pounding on your doors for an engine like that from breaking the doors down.
Why don’t we have a ton of Nuclear Reactors providing electricity to the nation? Why are we still building Natural Gas plants? And we are. Whenever one of those awesome solar plants are built, a natural gas plant is also built. You see, they can’t rely on the solar, so they need the natural gas plant to back it up, and the backup becomes the primary. Same thing with wind farms. building a wind farm? Guess what is also being built. Why not build nuclear plants and have greenhouse gas free electrical production going on?
Nah. We’re going to focus on the cars, because CAFE will save us, or something.
LOL, CAFE ratings helped save the American car industry. For some odd reason they refused to deliver what people wanted. Higher efficient cars. It's why people turned to Toyota and Honda. GM had the arrogant belief that people would simply buy that they produced.
Choosing a Corolla over a Vega was an easy choice.
Trump brags about how we are now oil independent. That's great but we don't get there without the push of higher CAFE ratings.
It was not CAFE that saved the car industry. It was the adaptation of foreign manufacturing techniques. Robots as one example. Today the bodies of the cars are welded and painted by robots. An assembly line was more efficient than a single mechanic building something. Robots are more efficient than a line of workers.
If you want proof look at the history of the English car companies. They all went belly up despite making fuel efficient cars. Now the brands are owned by foreign companies and building using those same techniques they resisted in the 1970’s. The Government did not legislate those companies into receivership. The market picked the better product.
The amount of ignorance in your replies is often difficult to grasp.
People bought Hondas and Toyotas because they were more efficient.
Manufactures argued that people weren't interested in hybrids either until Toyota built one and we found out they were.