Zone1 Too Bad That God Promised No More Great Floods

[The Original Tree]

no, not while you continue to lie, the false 10 commandments - you are a crucifier and will be dealt with accordingly.

I am crucified with Christ and covered in His atoning blood.

Anyone that rejects Christ and His Atonement is AntiChrist and will share the same fate as AntiChrist when the True Christ returns at Armageddon and throws him, the false prophet and all those who take the mark of the beast in Hell.

 

[The Original Tree]

I think Jews have a different interpretation of Isaiah and feel Christians take it out of context:

Origen, a prominent and influential church father, conceded in the year 248 CE – eight centuries before Rashi was born – that the consensus among the Jews in his time was that Isaiah 53 “bore reference to the whole [Jewish] people, regarded as one individual, and as being in a state of dispersion and suffering, in order that many proselytes might be gained, on account of the dispersion of the Jews among numerous heathen nations.”3

The broad consensus among Jewish, and even some Christian commentators, that the “servant” in Isaiah 52-53 refers to the nation of Israel is understandable. Isaiah 53, which is the fourth of four renowned Servant Songs, is umbilically connected to its preceding chapters. The “servant” in each of the three previous Servant Songs is plainly and repeatedly identified as the nation of Israel.

Isaiah 41:8-9


Isaiah 44:1


Isaiah 44:21


Isaiah 45:4


Isaiah 48:20


Isaiah 49:3​

Zechariah 13

4“On that day every prophet will be ashamed of their prophetic vision. They will not put on a prophet’s garment of hair in order to deceive.

5 Each will say, ‘I am not a prophet. I am a farmer; the land has been my livelihood since my youth.’

6 If someone asks, ‘What are these wounds in thine hand?’ He will answer, ‘The wounds I was given at the house of my friends.'

’Nice Cherry Picking.

Did Israel Die for The Sins of Israel?
Is Israel God of The Whole Earth?
Was Israel a Human Disfigured and Marred beyond recognition?
Was Israel Buried in a Rich Man's Tomb?
Has Israel after dying and being buried, was resurrected and "saw the light of life"?
Does Israel hide their face from Israel?
Has Israel suffered and "justified the sins of many?"
Did The "Lord make Israel's Life an Offering for Sin?"
Has Israel "bore the iniquities of Israel?
How can sinful Israel pay for Israel's sins?
Was Israel The Stone The Builders Rejected and has become The Cornerstone?

Was Israel "given a portion among the great,
and (did Israel) divide the spoils with the strong,
because (Israel) poured out (Israel's) life unto death,
and (Israel) was numbered with the transgressors.
For (Israel) bore the sin of many,
and made intercession for the transgressors."

Zechariah 13

Cleansing From Sin​

1 “On that day a fountain will be opened to the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem, to cleanse them from sin and impurity.
2 “On that day, I will banish the names of the idols from the land, and they will be remembered no more,” declares the Lord Almighty. “I will remove both the prophets and the spirit of impurity from the land. 3 And if anyone still prophesies, their father and mother, to whom they were born, will say to them, ‘You must die, because you have told lies in the Lord’s name.’ Then their own parents will stab the one who prophesies.
4 “On that day every prophet will be ashamed of their prophetic vision. They will not put on a prophet’s garment of hair in order to deceive. 5 Each will say, ‘I am not a prophet. I am a farmer; the land has been my livelihood since my youth.[a]’ 6 If someone asks, ‘What are these wounds in thine hands?’ He will answer, ‘The wounds I was given at the house of my friends.’

The Shepherd Struck, the Sheep Scattered​

7 “Awake, sword, against my shepherd,
against the man who is close to me!”
declares the Lord Almighty.
“Strike the shepherd,
and the sheep will be scattered,
and I will turn my hand against the little ones.
8 In the whole land,” declares the Lord,
“two-thirds will be struck down and perish;
yet one-third will be left in it.
9 This third I will put into the fire;
I will refine them like silver
and test them like gold.
They will call on my name
and I will answer them;
I will say, ‘They are my people,’
and they will say, ‘The Lord is our God.’”

​

Behold The Hand
Behold The Nail

The Suffering and Glory of the Servant​

Isaiah 52

13 See, my servant will act wisely
he will be raised and lifted up and highly exalted.

Are you exalting Israel every day?
Jesus is exalted now but will be even more exalted in the coming kingdom.

14 Just as there were many who were appalled at him
his appearance was so disfigured beyond that of any human being
and his form marred beyond human likeness.

So Israel is a disfigured human being?
Jesus was marred for our transgressions, and bruised for our iniquities

15 so he will sprinkle many nations,
and kings will shut their mouths because of him.

Is Israel sprinkling many nations?
Jesus has sprinkled his blood upon all nations so that anyone who believes shall be saved and the gospel of Jesus Christ has shut the mouths of many kings.
By your interpretation Israel is your Savior and Israel died for your sins.

Isaiah 53

1 Who has believed our message
and to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?
2 He grew up before him like a tender shoot,
and like a root out of dry ground.
He had no beauty or majesty to attract us to him,
nothing in his appearance that we should desire him.
3 He was despised and rejected by mankind,
a man of suffering, and familiar with pain.
Like one from whom people hide their faces
he was despised, and we held him in low esteem.
4 Surely he took up our pain
and bore our suffering,
yet we considered him punished by God,
stricken by him, and afflicted.
5 But he was pierced for our transgressions,
he was crushed for our iniquities;
the punishment that brought us peace was on him,
and by his wounds we are healed.
6 We all, like sheep, have gone astray,
each of us has turned to our own way;
and the Lord has laid on him
the iniquity of us all.
7 He was oppressed and afflicted,
yet he did not open his mouth;
he was led like a lamb to the slaughter,
and as a sheep before its shearers is silent,
so he did not open his mouth.
8 By oppression[a] and judgment he was taken away.
Yet who of his generation protested?
For he was cut off from the land of the living;
for the transgression of my people he was punished.[b]
9 He was assigned a grave with the wicked,
and with the rich in his death,
though he had done no violence,
nor was any deceit in his mouth.
10 Yet it was the Lord’s will to crush him and cause him to suffer,
and though the Lord makes[c] his life an offering for sin,
he will see his offspring and prolong his days,
and the will of the Lord will prosper in his hand.
11 After he has suffered,
he will see the light of life[d] and be satisfied[e];
by his knowledge[f] my righteous servant will justify many,
and he will bear their iniquities.
12 Therefore I will give him a portion among the great,[g]
and he will divide the spoils with the strong,[h]
because he poured out his life unto death,
and was numbered with the transgressors.
For he bore the sin of many,
and made intercession for the transgressors.

Also According to your interpretation Israel is God and you should be praying to Israel.
Do you pray to Israel? Do you face Jerusalem and pray to Israel who according to your interpretation is "The God of All The Earth?"

 

[alang1216]

You want me to prove that one too? Ok. Here it is.

What do you have to say now?

I looks like you've moved the goal posts on me. You said I claimed I had proof that God doesn't exist. That is not true. In fact, I've always said I can neither prove nor disprove the existence of God. What I claimed was sufficient evidence to convince me, nothing more.

As for God/gods, I'd say it is dependent on how you define them. A powerful, immortal being, like Satan, might be considered a god. A single being that has three, independent existences, may be considered a fusion of 3 gods as well.

 

[alang1216]

Nice Cherry Picking.

Did Israel Die for The Sins of Israel?
Is Israel God of The Whole Earth?
Was Israel a Human Disfigured and Marred beyond recognition?
Was Israel The Stone The Builders Rejected and has become The Cornerstone?
Behold The Hand
Behold The Nail

There was a reason Jews did not convert to Christianity in large numbers. They knew their scripture, the pagans that converted to Christianity did not. The Greek speaking converts read the Septuagint and made the same errors in the NT that the translators of the Septuagint made.

 

[The Original Tree]

There was a reason Jews did not convert to Christianity in large numbers. They knew their scripture, the pagans that converted to Christianity did not. The Greek speaking converts read the Septuagint and made the same errors in the NT that the translators of the Septuagint made.

The God of The Old Testament in The Old Testament declared that the Jews do not know The Scriptures and placed them in blindness until Messiah comes again. See Zechariah 13 also.

If they knew The Scriptures they would have believed Daniel and Knew the very Day Messiah would come and be crucified "cut off" by The Pharisees and Saducees.

 

[ding]

I looks like you've moved the goal posts on me. You said I claimed I had proof that God doesn't exist. That is not true. In fact, I've always said I can neither prove nor disprove the existence of God. What I claimed was sufficient evidence to convince me, nothing more.

As for God/gods, I'd say it is dependent on how you define them. A powerful, immortal being, like Satan, might be considered a god. A single being that has three, independent existences, may be considered a fusion of 3 gods as well.

You can try to spin your words however you want but you said what you said. And you didn't place any caveats on what you said. In fact you seemed quite adamant about it. You even used the phrase "overwhelming evidence."

See?

This is America, I grew up with the assumption that God exists. Later, I found evidence He doesn't so I changed my beliefs. Since then, all the overwhelming evidence points to as single conclusion.

 

[alang1216]

The God of The Old Testament in The Old Testament declared that the Jews do not know The Scriptures and placed them in blindness until Messiah comes again. See Zechariah 13 also.

If they knew The Scriptures they would have believed Daniel and Knew the very Day Messiah would come and be crucified "cut off" by The Pharisees and Saducees.

I can't say your interpretations are correct or not but I can say the Messiah the Jews expected was very different from Jesus. They were looking for another Cyrus the Great to liberate them.

 

[alang1216]

You can try to spin your words however you want but you said what you said. And you didn't place any caveats on what you said. In fact you seemed quite adamant about it. You even used the phrase "overwhelming evidence."

See?

I'll stick with what I wrote. The evidence I've seen, I've judged to be overwhelming. I suspect you look at the same evidence and are not overwhelmed. So be it. Proof is a very different animal and I never make that claim.

 

[ding]

I looks like you've moved the goal posts on me. You said I claimed I had proof that God doesn't exist. That is not true. In fact, I've always said I can neither prove nor disprove the existence of God. What I claimed was sufficient evidence to convince me, nothing more.

As for God/gods, I'd say it is dependent on how you define them. A powerful, immortal being, like Satan, might be considered a god. A single being that has three, independent existences, may be considered a fusion of 3 gods as well.

And for the record I didn't say "proof" I said, "you have evidence that proves God doesn't exist." So there was no goal post moving at all. You were the one who concluded your evidence was proof God didn't exist. Otherwise you wouldn't have changed your beliefs. I don't believe you can help being dishonest about this subject. Your bias runs deep.

you actually said you have evidence that proves God doesn't exist.

 

[ding]

I'll stick with what I wrote. The evidence I've seen, I've judged to be overwhelming. I suspect you look at the same evidence and are not overwhelmed. So be it. Proof is a very different animal and I never make that claim.

Evidence - especially overwhelming evidence as you called it - doesn't change people's minds unless they see that "overwhelming" evidence as proof. So tell me some more lies.

 

[ding]

Apparently overwhelming evidence means that unless everyone believes the same thing God doesn't exist which might just be the dumbest argument ever made.

 

[ding]

"We must know how to combat religion..." Vladimir Lenin

I guess one of the ways to combat religion is to lie about it.

 

[alang1216]

Evidence - especially overwhelming evidence as you called it - doesn't change people's minds unless they see that "overwhelming" evidence as proof. So tell me some more lies.

You're very knowledgeable on what other people think and feel. Would you prefer if I had said the evidence is beyond reasonable doubt? That better?

 

[ding]

You're very knowledgeable on what other people think and feel. Would you prefer if I had said the evidence is beyond reasonable doubt? That better?

It's just definitions and logic.

Evidence is data or facts that assist us in determining the reality or existence of something. A total collection of evidence can prove a claim. Proof is a conclusion that a certain fact is true or not.

So you concluded God doesn't exist based on your evidence, right? That is literally the definition of proof.

 

[The Original Tree]

I can't say your interpretations are correct or not but I can say the Messiah the Jews expected was very different from Jesus. They were looking for another Cyrus the Great to liberate them.

They did not study the scriptures. Jesus even told them that even referencing in part Daniel's Prophecy which predicted the day Messiah would enter Jerusalem and be cut off, from the going out of the decree. This is why Jesus called them Blind Guides, and also rebuked them saying because they say they can see but are blind, if they were really blind God would forgive them, but because they said they could see He would not.

40 years (the number of judgment and the number of repentance) after the crucifixion of Messiah The Temple was destroyed fulfilling Jesus prophecy that Not One Stone would be left upon another.

Messiah entered Jerusalem at the 69th week year of 483rd year and was crucified "cut off" but not of Himself (He was crucified to make an atonement for sin for others)

Daniel 9
Gabriel's Prophecy of the Seventy Weeks
…24b Seventy weeks are decreed for your people and your holy city to stop their transgression, to put an end to sin, to make atonement for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy, and to anoint the Most Holy Place. 25 Know and understand this: From the issuance of the decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem, until the Messiah, the Prince, there will be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks. It will be rebuilt with streets and a trench, but in times of distress. 26 Then after the sixty-two weeks the Messiah will be cut off and will have nothing. Then the people of the prince who is to come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. The end will come like a flood, and until the end there will be war; desolations have been decreed.

Remember, 70 weeks (490 Years) total determined upon Israel for judgement because of their stubbornness, disobedience and sin, but 7 plus 62 or 69 Week Years until Messiah is cut off or 483 years from the decree to rebuild Jerusalem until Messiah.

But what does it mean for Him to be first cut off, and then "have nothing?" It means that at that time, His Kingdom of Righteousness would not be established, and The Holy Place, would not be anointed (the Temple of God for Israel and The World in Jerusalem). Oh but it will be established at the end of The Tribulation, at the end of the last week The Time of Jacob's Trouble when He arrives with His armies at Armageddon as The Son of David. Heavenly Jerusalem will come down and The King will reign not only on David's Throne in Jerusalem but He will wear Adam's Lost Crown and be Anointed King over The Whole Earth. Or as Isaiah says, God of The Whole Earth.

There are 7 years left of judgment and repentance left to fulfill upon Israel. The last 7 years were paused after Messiah was cut off to allow for the Diaspora, The Age of The Gentiles, and Church Age. The Diaspora is over, and The Dry Bones are coming back to Israel, and the Church Age, and Time of The Gentiles has been coming to a conclusion since 1948 when scripture was fulfilled when a Nation (Israel) was born in a day.

The Tribulation or Jacob's Trouble for The Salvation of Israel and return of Messiah begins when The Church Age and Time of the Gentiles is over.
That 7 year period is predominant in Daniel and Revelation and elsewhere mirrored in scripture.

Genesis 41:30 - Joseph Interprets Pharaoh's Dreams

but seven years of famine will follow them. Then all the abundance in the land of Egypt will be forgotten, and the famine will devastate the land.

www.biblehub.com

Genesis 41
29 Behold, seven years of great abundance are coming throughout the land of Egypt, 30 but seven years of famine will follow them. Then all the abundance in the land of Egypt will be forgotten, and the famine will devastate the land. 31 The abundance in the land will not be remembered, since the famine that follows it will be so severe.

Jeremiah is very revealing
Jeremiah 30:1-6

The word which came to Jeremiah from the LORD, saying, 2 "Thus says the LORD, the God of Israel, 'Write all the words which I have spoken to you in a book. 3 'For behold, days are coming,' declares the LORD, 'when I will restore the fortunes of My people Israel and Judah.' (see comments on importance of this phrase) The LORD says, 'I will also bring them back to the land that I gave to their forefathers and they shall possess it.'" 4 Now these are the words which the LORD spoke concerning Israel and concerning Judah: 5 "For thus says the LORD, 'I have heard a sound of terror, Of dread, and there is no peace. 6 'Ask now, and see If a male can give birth. Why do I see every man With his hands on his loins, as a woman in childbirth? And why have all faces turned pale?"

What was the book Daniel was told to seal up? What book is that? The Book of Revelation.

The Tribulation according to the Book of Revelation

letusreason.org

Teaching on Jacob's Trouble.

The 7-Year Tribulation | Trouble Is on the Way

What do you know about the 7-year tribulation? The Bible has a lot to say about it. Discover how bad it will get, how long it will last, and how you can respond.

livingproof.co

God will not break His Covenant with Abraham, even though they rejected His servant.

Messiah Bar Joseph came and The Builders Rejected the Stone that will become The Cornerstone.
He is coming back as Messiah Bar David!
Glory To God, and Pray for The Peace of Israel.
His Kingdom Come! The Prince of Peace draws near!

 

[alang1216]

It's just definitions and logic.

Evidence is data or facts that assist us in determining the reality or existence of something. A total collection of evidence can prove a claim. Proof is a conclusion that a certain fact is true or not.

So you concluded God doesn't exist based on your evidence, right? That is literally the definition of proof.

So I 'proved' that God does not exist. Are you now an atheist?

 

[ding]

So I 'proved' that God does not exist. Are you now an atheist?

You proved it to yourself. Your argument that God can't exist unless everyone believes the same thing is ridiculous. It's the argument you would expect a child to make. Which not coincidentally was what you were when you developed that argument.

Besides I will never accept the atheist belief that the needs of an individual and society in general do not go beyond the satisfaction of material needs and primitive instincts. I know better.

 

[alang1216]

They did not study the scriptures. Jesus even told them that even referencing in part Daniel's Prophecy which predicted the day Messiah would enter Jerusalem and be cut off, from the going out of the decree. This is why Jesus called them Blind Guides, and also rebuked them saying because they say they can see but are blind, if they were really blind God would forgive them, but because they said they could see He would not.

40 years (the number of judgment and the number of repentance) after the crucifixion of Messiah The Temple was destroyed fulfilling Jesus prophecy that Not One Stone would be left upon another.

Messiah entered Jerusalem at the 69th week year of 483rd year and was crucified "cut off" but not of Himself (He was crucified to make an atonement for sin for others)

Daniel 9
Gabriel's Prophecy of the Seventy Weeks
…24b Seventy weeks are decreed for your people and your holy city to stop their transgression, to put an end to sin, to make atonement for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy, and to anoint the Most Holy Place. 25 Know and understand this: From the issuance of the decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem, until the Messiah, the Prince, there will be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks. It will be rebuilt with streets and a trench, but in times of distress. 26 Then after the sixty-two weeks the Messiah will be cut off and will have nothing. Then the people of the prince who is to come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. The end will come like a flood, and until the end there will be war; desolations have been decreed.

Remember, 70 weeks (490 Years) total determined upon Israel for judgement because of their stubbornness, disobedience and sin, but 7 plus 62 or 69 Week Years until Messiah is cut off or 483 years from the decree to rebuild Jerusalem until Messiah.

But what does it mean for Him to be first cut off, and then "have nothing?" It means that at that time, His Kingdom of Righteousness would not be established, and The Holy Place, would not be anointed (the Temple of God for Israel and The World in Jerusalem). Oh but it will be established at the end of The Tribulation, at the end of the last week The Time of Jacob's Trouble when He arrives with His armies at Armageddon as The Son of David. Heavenly Jerusalem will come and The King will reign not only on David's Throne but He will wear Adam's Crown and be King over The Whole Earth. Or as Isaiah says, God of The Whole Earth.

There are 7 years left of judgment and repentance left to fulfill upon Israel. The last 7 years were paused after Messiah was cut off to allow for the Diaspora, The Age of The Gentiles, and Church Age. The Diaspora is over, and The Dry Bones are coming back to Israel, and the Church Age, and Time of The Gentiles has been coming to a conclusion since 1948 when scripture was fulfilled when a Nation (Israel) was born in a day.

The Tribulation or Jacob's Trouble for The Salvation of Israel and return of Messiah begins when The Church Age and Time of the Gentiles is over.
That 7 year period is predominant in Daniel and Revelation and elsewhere mirrored in scripture.

Genesis 41:30 - Joseph Interprets Pharaoh's Dreams

but seven years of famine will follow them. Then all the abundance in the land of Egypt will be forgotten, and the famine will devastate the land.

www.biblehub.com

Genesis 41
29 Behold, seven years of great abundance are coming throughout the land of Egypt, 30 but seven years of famine will follow them. Then all the abundance in the land of Egypt will be forgotten, and the famine will devastate the land. 31 The abundance in the land will not be remembered, since the famine that follows it will be so severe.

Jeremiah is very revealing
Jeremiah 30:1-6

The word which came to Jeremiah from the LORD, saying, 2 "Thus says the LORD, the God of Israel, 'Write all the words which I have spoken to you in a book. 3 'For behold, days are coming,' declares the LORD, 'when I will restore the fortunes of My people Israel and Judah.' (see comments on importance of this phrase) The LORD says, 'I will also bring them back to the land that I gave to their forefathers and they shall possess it.'" 4 Now these are the words which the LORD spoke concerning Israel and concerning Judah: 5 "For thus says the LORD, 'I have heard a sound of terror, Of dread, and there is no peace. 6 'Ask now, and see If a male can give birth. Why do I see every man With his hands on his loins, as a woman in childbirth? And why have all faces turned pale?"

What was the book Daniel was told to seal up? What book is that? The Book of Revelation.

The Tribulation according to the Book of Revelation

letusreason.org

Teaching on Jacob's Trouble.

The 7-Year Tribulation | Trouble Is on the Way

What do you know about the 7-year tribulation? The Bible has a lot to say about it. Discover how bad it will get, how long it will last, and how you can respond.

livingproof.co

God will not break His Covenant with Abraham, even though they rejected His servant.

Messiah Bar Joseph came and The Builders Rejected the Stone that will become The Cornerstone.
He is coming back as Messiah Bar David!
Glory To God, and Pray for The Peace of Israel.
His Kingdom Come! The Prince of Peace draws near!

Seems to me you're taking everything out of context. This is all about return from the Babylonian captivity, not predicting Jesus.

 

[The Original Tree]

Seems to me you're taking everything out of context. This is all about return from the Babylonian captivity, not predicting Jesus.

I think you call Daniel and God a Liar.

 

[alang1216]

You proved it to yourself. Your argument that God can't exist unless everyone believes the same thing is ridiculous. It's the argument you would expect a child to make. Which not coincidentally was what you were when you developed that argument.

Did God reveal himself to Moses? What about the other Hebrew prophets? What about Mohammad, Zoroaster, or Joseph Smith? Did God reveal himself to Hindus, Aztecs, Polynesians, or Neanderthals?

Besides I will never accept the atheist belief that the needs of an individual and society in general do not go beyond the satisfaction of material needs and primitive instincts. I know better.

Did God reveal himself to you?