STATISTCAL TRANSCENDENCE #3: Nolan Ryan

[Harry Dresden]

Not what I see
I see teams obsessed with a pitch count. They want starters to go as deep in the game as they can. A pitcher getting out of an inning with only a few pitches saves the Bullpen

if they want them to go as deep into the game as they can, why are there hardly any complete games today?...some pitchers get pulled in the 6th pitching a no hitter....

 

[rightwinger]

if they want them to go as deep into the game as they can, why are there hardly any completes games today?...some pitchers get pulled in the 6th pitching a no hitter....

pitch count

 

[Harry Dresden]

pitch count

no one should get pulled if they are pitching a great game.....

 

[rightwinger]

I grew up a Met fan in the 60s
I saw Nolan Ryan come up in 68 and pitch in the 69 Series

I remember when he was traded to the Angels for Jim Fregosi. Today considered one of the worst trades in history. What I dont remember was anyone complaining at the time.
The Mets were getting an All Star Third Baseman and the Angels were getting the Mets Number 4 starter with control problems

 

[rightwinger]

no one should get pulled if they are pitching a great game.....

I agree

But we live in an era of Bill James and computer models that say pull a pitcher after 90 pitches

 

[Mr. Friscus]

Not what I see
I see teams obsessed with a pitch count. They want starters to go as deep in the game as they can. A pitcher getting out of an inning with only a few pitches saves the Bullpen

Your problem here is, any contact made by the batter has the possibility of being a base hit or home run. Groundouts happen, but they aren’t guaranteed. A strikeout is a guaranteed out.

 

[Mr. Friscus]

Not what I see
I see teams obsessed with a pitch count. They want starters to go as deep in the game as they can. A pitcher getting out of an inning with only a few pitches saves the Bullpen

Yes but again, a batter making contact leaves a possibility for hits, which starts a new batter and elevating the pitch count. You can’t count on an out 100% if the batter makes Contact, but you sure can if you strike him out.

Also, groundouts don’t always happen in a 0-0 or 1-0 count.. a pitcher still could easily get a ground out after having thrown 8-9 pitches, while strikeouts in 4-5 pitches are entirely plausible

 

[Mr. Friscus]

I agree

But we live in an era of Bill James and computer models that say pull a pitcher after 90 pitches

I think the MLB should cut the allowed roster for pitchers from 13 to 10. That way, managers have to keep guys in to eat up innings… because they dont have a million relievers sitting around

 

[lg325]

Nolan Ryan was one of my favorite pitchers to watch, Also this fellow who I just learned passed away recently. Vida Blue. MLB world mourns tragic death of former MVP, six-time All-Star

 

[rightwinger]

Nolan Ryan was one of my favorite pitchers to watch, Also this fellow who I just learned passed away recently. Vida Blue. MLB world mourns tragic death of former MVP, six-time All-Star

Vida Blue was one of the most dominating pitchers I ever saw that didn’t make the HOF

Others include Denny McClain, Guidry, Valenzuela and Gooden

 

[Mr. Friscus]

I grew up a Met fan in the 60s
I saw Nolan Ryan come up in 68 and pitch in the 69 Series

I remember when he was traded to the Angels for Jim Fregosi. Today considered one of the worst trades in history. What I dont remember was anyone complaining at the time.
The Mets were getting an All Star Third Baseman and the Angels were getting the Mets Number 4 starter with control problems

He walked a lot of people in his early career but by the 80’s that was gone.

 

[Jarlaxle]

Not what I see
I see teams obsessed with a pitch count. They want starters to go as deep in the game as they can. A pitcher getting out of an inning with only a few pitches saves the Bullpen

Except Ryan, despite the huge number of pitches he threw, regularly led the league in complete games. He was usually top 5 in innings pitched.

 

[rightwinger]

Except Ryan, despite the huge number of pitches he threw, regularly led the league in complete games. He was usually top 5 in innings pitched.

Ryan was a freak to throw at that level until he was 46
Few fireballers last half as long

 

[Mr. Friscus]

Ryan was a freak to throw at that level until he was 46
Few fireballers last half as long

Indeed, and if you measure his pitches the same way they do today.. his fastball at its best was 105-107 mph.

Meanwhile, from what I recall he had an injury in his late 30’s that supposedly required tommy John surgery, but basically ignored it and somehow just trucked along for many more years until an odd random start in Seattle where something snapped in an early inning, he stopped, and walked off uneventfully never to pitch again