Someone just blew up Ukraine’s Kakhovka hydroelectric power plant and took out a major dam

[skye]

Probably the same people that took out Nordstream

Very possible, yes.

 

[Litwin]

Never mind.

Seriously? Those positions versus what they have to lose?

Let's call the whole thing off. We aren't going to ever agree, so let's just forget it, O.K.?

View attachment 792396

Big Paint Lobbyist?

Mary Carter Paint Company?

can you explain to me this : The flood is expected to subside and drain into the Black Sea within 10-11 days. So what military benefit does blowing the dam provide other than to delay a possible Ukraine assault for 2 weeks? I don't get 's logic

 

[para bellum]

Seriously? Those positions versus what they have to lose?

I posted that in response to your comment wrt did Russia move any forces before the dam was blown. They didn't have to move many troops, because those positions were not selected randomly.

There are 4 canals that are fed by that reservoir. Only one goes to Crimea. Ukraine depends on them for irrigation on both sides of the Dnipro, and for the water supply to the nearby towns and to Kherson City.

Ukraine had way more to lose than Russia, who already stood to lose those positions and the canal to Crimea anyway. And that side of the Dnipro has been a shooting gallery for Ukrainian artillery on the Russian rear positions- they were doing just fine degrading the Russian logistics and hitting rear bases. They didn't need to change anything.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

can you explain to me this : The flood is expected to subside and drain into the Black Sea within 10-11 days. So what military benefit does blowing the dam provide other than to delay a possible Ukraine assault for 2 weeks? I don't get 's logic

Exactly!!! Ukraine is spent force, they have no assault capabilities, this is their excuse to keep the $ flowing

 

[para bellum]

So what military benefit does blowing the dam provide other than to delay a possible Ukraine assault for 2 weeks?

The dam was the only remaining crossing of the Dnipro in Kherson Oblast. It's too wide for assault bridges.

 

[skye]

Exactly!!! Ukraine is spent force, they have no assault capabilities, this is their excuse to keep the $ flowing

Like Scott Ritter said:

Kakhovka Dam Attack Designed to Cure West’s ‘Ukraine Fatigue’​

keep the money flowing...the arms.....the jets.....

 

[Litwin]

Very possible, yes.

Exactly!!! Ukraine is spent force, they have no assault capabilities, this is their excuse to keep the $ flowing

This is a rhetorical question.
(

can never say no to that)

 

[Zincwarrior]

This is pretty serious. I'm hearing that water was being used to cool a nuclear site.

You mean the Russians!

 

[Litwin]

 

[gipper]

I posted that in response to your comment wrt did Russia move any forces before the dam was blown. They didn't have to move many troops, because those positions were not selected randomly.

There are 4 canals that are fed by that reservoir. Only one goes to Crimea. Ukraine depends on them for irrigation on both sides of the Dnipro, and for the water supply to the nearby towns and to Kherson City.

Ukraine had way more to lose than Russia, who already stood to lose those positions and the canal to Crimea anyway. And that side of the Dnipro has been a shooting gallery for Ukrainian artillery on the Russian rear positions- they were doing just fine degrading the Russian logistics and hitting rear bases. They didn't need to change anything.

We've now been told Russia blew up their own bridge, was shelling their own nuclear power plant, blew up their own pipeline and now blew up a dam that cuts off water to Crimea which is one of the places they went to war to protect. Only a fool believes.

 

[JGalt]

We've now been told Russia blew up their own bridge, was shelling their own nuclear power plant, blew up their own pipeline and now blew up a dam that cuts off water to Crimea which is one of the places they went to war to protect. Only a fool believes.

If I'm not mistaken, the area downstream from where the dam was bombed is currently being held by the Russians.

Draw your own conclusions from this.

 

[para bellum]

We've now been told Russia blew up their own bridge, was shelling their own nuclear power plant, blew up their own pipeline and now blew up a dam that cuts off water to Crimea which is one of the places they went to war to protect. Only a fool believes.

And none of those things would have happened if Russia hadn't invaded Ukraine.

I'll allow for the possibility of incompetence. It's not like I can argue with a straight face that the Russian "managers" are competent to operate a structurally weakened dam. It's also possible they intended a smaller flood, just enough to dislodge the AFU from the delta islands, and it got away from them.

I know their story has evolved over the day, from nothing happened at all and everything is normal, to it was shelled by the AFU...

 

[skye]

Very interesting analysis.

Scott Ritter: New EXPLOSION Changes Everything In Ukraine Russia War​

 

[krichton]

Neither of us really knows who did or did not do it.

If you claim to know, you are just a propagandist.

Here is the difference between us.

I condemn it no matter who did it.

If you found out that the Ukrainians did it? You would say, "by what ever means necessary."

But at this point? Neither of us have the forensic evidence to make, 100% positive declarative statements either way.

The irony is the propagandists are the ones who say both sides are equal, as if Russia has even an ounce of credibility. Does the fact that Russia originally rigged this dam to explode several months ago simply fly over all your heads? They are the ones with the greatest motive and will. Why on earth would Zelensky blow the dam to hurt his own people and hinder the movement of his military just before the counteroffensive? They need to cross that river in order to take back lost territory. There's zero logic for Ukraine to blow their own dam, which was already rigged with russian explosives to begin with.

 

[gipper]

And none of those things would have happened if Russia hadn't invaded Ukraine.

I'll allow for the possibility of incompetence. It's not like I can argue with a straight face that the Russian "managers" are competent to operate a structurally weakened dam. It's also possible they intended a smaller flood, just enough to dislodge the AFU from the delta islands, and it got away from them.

I know their story has evolved over the day, from nothing happened at all and everything is normal, to it was shelled by the AFU...

So you still believe this war was unprovoked. Lol.

 

[Ringo]

Neither of us really knows who did or did not do it.

Imagine, the brave ukrainian nazis were successfully preparing for the offensive, which was to finally crush the russian orcs and everything was ready, right down to the ironed shoelaces.
But... the treacherous Putin broke the dam and the waters got in the way of the offensive.
Just damn!
So, gentlemen, sorry, forget about the billions already sent into the money pit and all the weapons.
But we're waiting for more, to prepare a new offensive.
Thanks for attention!

 

[Litwin]

If I'm not mistaken, the area downstream from where the dam was bombed is currently being held by the Russians.

Draw your own conclusions from this.

And none of those things would have happened if Russia hadn't invaded Ukraine.

I'll allow for the possibility of incompetence. It's not like I can argue with a straight face that the Russian "managers" are competent to operate a structurally weakened dam. It's also possible they intended a smaller flood, just enough to dislodge the AFU from the delta islands, and it got away from them.

I know their story has evolved over the day, from nothing happened at all and everything is normal, to it was shelled by the AFU...

They literally banned investigations into incidents at hydroelectrical structures in Kherson Obl. ONE WEEK ago

 

[Ringo]

 

[JohnDB]

In November the Ukranians hit the dam with a HIMARS strike....I'm sure that it didn't leave the dam undamaged.

However, facing a new surge of attacks by Ukranians, the Russians mined and destroyed the top of the dam to prevent the Ukranians from following them as they retreated....inadvertently causing the collapse.
There's a LOT of inexperienced soldiers on the Russian side and serious gaps in trained troops. Where a normally trained engineer would completely destroy the electrical generation capabilities and not the dam itself that isn't what they had....just some dumb schmucks who used too much explosives and accidentally destroyed the dam itself. (Chernobyl, and the recent defensive ditches dug in that area)
The Russians were simply trying to make a protected retreat. Might not have been intentional...but the results of the stupidity are rather plain. Again a young, inexperienced dumb Russian wouldn't necessarily know that Russians would take the greater amount of flooding than the Ukranians. It's not like they were handed out a bunch of topographical maps to know and study. Especially when the men are treated as little more than cannon fodder.

Scorched earth policies are not beyond Russians either. One look at an occupied city Russian fought hard for will tell you that. Bakhmut is only one example....there are plenty more.

 

[Ringo]