Should Palestine be recognized as a state?

[Donald H]

That's bullshit. The UN does not have the authority to give away someone's land. If the Muslim UN decides they want Ontario, are you going to give it to them?

That's the power of being able to negotiate from a position of strength. Do you understand that?

If so then maybe you can tell us who holds the winning hand in the ME now?

Can the Zioniit regime take on Iran all by itself?

 

[Donald H]

Why would you think that Hamas will leave Israel alone if we take a chunk out of Israeli land and hand it over to terrorists?

I think it's most likely that Iran and their dozens of proxies are not going to stop short of eliminating the Zionist regime.

The thing is that the rest of the world doesn't GAF anymore.

That's not what I'm hoping for but we have to be reallistic about it.

 

[Donald H]

Why would you think that Hamas will leave Israel alone if we take a chunk out of Israeli land and hand it over to terrorists?

Confusion or typos?

 

[Shusha]

There's no debate to be had. The UN has decided and none of the naysayers have any chance of changing its decision.

The UN decided nothing. Individual States have chose to "recognize" the fragile idea of "Palestine". But they will have no idea how to implement it. As examples:

If Palestine is a State, and the government of Palestine is the PA, and the PA is living "in peace and security with its neighbors" then the PA needs to be pressured to release the hostages immediately should it not be at war with Israel.

If Palestine is a State and that State includes all the territory of Areas A, B and C, does that make all of residents of that territory citizens of Palestine? Will they be able to vote in their new State? Or is the new State of Palestine going to deny citizenship based on ethnicity?

If Palestine is a State, but unable to apply control and sovereignty over significant portions of the territory it wants to claim, does it forfeit that territory? Should Israel have a better legal claim to that territory and can apply control and sovereignty, does the territory revert to Israel?

If treaties can be dissolved by "recognition" by individual States, how will that affect international law going forward? Can the UK, France, Canada, or any combination of a majority of States, unilaterally dissolve treaties of other UN member States? Could a coalition of States dissolve the NATO treaty, as example? This seems to be a fantastically anarchist road to go down.

 

[Donald H]

No, international law does not permit Israel to keep expanding. International law and the UN Charter require member States to respect the territorial integrity of other States. The most sure way to achieve this is with a peace treaty, but until that happens the borders of the British Mandate are in effect.

It's never been important what international law says, and never will.

America and the Zionists no longer hold all the marbles anymore.

China, Russia, and Iran won't move to aggression but if the US and/or the Zionists do, the Brics three will damn well move to finish the fight!

 

[Shusha]

That's the power of being able to negotiate from a position of strength. Do you understand that?

Are you seriously arguing that "strength" wins over mutual recognition, self-determination, and peaceful negotiation with your neighbors? By this metric, Israel has every right to sovereignty over whatever territory it claims.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

what do you think?

i think .... not yet

Sure, I hear there is some land available in Syria.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

There's no debate to be had. The UN has decided and none of the naysayers have any chance of changing its decision.

What did the UN decide?

 

[Donald H]

If treaties can be dissolved by "recognition" by individual States, how will that affect international law going forward? Can the UK, France, Canada, or any combination of a majority of States, unilaterally dissolve treaties of other UN member States? Could a coalition of States dissolve the NATO treaty, as example? This seems to be a fantastically anarchist road to go down.

Thanks for the attempt at a rational response.

The punishment being meted out by both sides will continue to happen until one side either has had enough, or decides to do something to end their enemy's existence.

The grownups don't need to argue which side wins, we just need to understand that power over the ME is shared now.

 

[Donald H]

What did the UN decide?

Go play Todd, I don't have time for you.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Go play Todd, I don't have time for you.

You're just initforyou, eh?

 

[Shusha]

Thanks for the attempt at a rational response.

Sure, but answer the question.

What happens to international law if coalitions of member States can unilaterally dissolve the treaties of other States?

 

[Donald H]

Are you seriously arguing that "strength" wins over mutual recognition, self-determination, and peaceful negotiation with your neighbors? By this metric, Israel has every right to sovereignty over whatever territory it claims.

Yes. The Zionist regime has no power needed to win, without America's involvement. And America's involvement gets Russia, China, and Iran for America's troubles.

 

[Zebra]

seven of ten say no now

now 3 of 19 say yes

 

[Donald H]

Sure, but answer the question.

What happens to international law if coalitions of member States can unilaterally dissolve the treaties of other States?

Don't try that bullshit with me.

Int law didn't make a fkn bit of difference when the US attacked VietNam or Iraq.

This is over! You fkers are in denial of the fact that Iran has become a superpower.

Ukraine rules apply.

 

[Shusha]

Don't try that bullshit with me.

Int law didn't make a fkn bit of difference when the US attacked VietNam or Iraq.

This is over! You fkers are in denial of the fact that Iran has become a superpower.

Ukraine rules apply.

Hey, I'm just trying to sort out the contradictions in your own arguments. "The UN decided" and "strength of weapons" seem to be polar opposites.

I * think * what you are trying to communicate is that recognition of Palestine by a country like Canada is entirely pointless if Canada is not willing to go to war against Israel to enforce its recognition.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Don't try that bullshit with me.

Int law didn't make a fkn bit of difference when the US attacked VietNam or Iraq.

This is over! You fkers are in denial of the fact that Iran has become a superpower.

Ukraine rules apply.

Iran? LOL!

 

[Redfish]

there is not now, and has never been, a country named Palestine

 

[The Irish Ram]

Confusion or typos?

Neither.
If Putin decided that Alaska was his, do we send him to the White House to negotiate?
The UN is a Muslim organization that supports and helps Hamas terrorize Israel. It is not the UN's decision concerning what to do with Israel.

I think it's most likely that Iran and their dozens of proxies are not going to stop short of eliminating the Zionist regime.

The thing is that the rest of the world doesn't GAF anymore.

That's not what I'm hoping for but we have to be reallistic about it.

Hamas wants it all. What happens if "Palestine" grows and needs more room? Will the UN cut off another slice of the pie for them.

Obviously, the whole world does GAF. And is weighing in. The whole world will vote against Israel. And Israel will give away their own land in exchange for a peace deal. Good luck with that, Israel...

 

[Donald H]

Hey, I'm just trying to sort out the contradictions in your own arguments. "The UN decided" and "strength of weapons" seem to be polar opposites.

Good. There's no debate then. We just have different opinions.

I * think * what you are trying to communicate is that recognition of Palestine by a country like Canada is entirely pointless if Canada is not willing to go to war against Israel to enforce its recognition.

I'm actually saying that Iran has the hearts and minds of the world over the Zionist regime and America. The UNGA said so, that's all.

That's not pointless, and the only way of deciding the question is for America and the Zionists to make it right for them is to start a war against Iran.

I just don't see any way they could get away with it. But you do!

Are you suggesting something to debate? I'm not going to get into an armchair war over which superpower now holds the power to win a war. That's as pointless as this clusterfk forum.