Zone1 Question For Catholics

[forkintheroad7]

I just said that because they don't know the meaning of judge not less ye be judged.

You don't know Catholicism

but you despise it anyway... that's what I normally call intellectually vacuous

 

[forkintheroad7]

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Well, there is a strong tendency in Catholics to trust authority. I don't recall which Commandment can be interpreted to mean "Thou Shalt Trust The Authorities". Another question I'll have to ask my priest.

At my first Confession, when I was through with the actual confession part, I asked the priest if speeding is a sin, as many believe it is -- as in disobeying civil authorities -- and that priest rolled his eyes, which confirmed my belief that speeding, as long as you are not endangering another, is not to be considered a sin.

But no, the priest is not likely to withhold absolution in the case of the penitent who has not turned himself in to the authorities. What might be more likely is that the priest could terminate the confession and boot the person out of the confessional before the penitent has the chance to perform the Act of Contrition -- a sincere Act of Contrition is necessary in order to merit absolution. The penitent must tell God how sorry he is for committing the sin and promise to make every effort not to sin again.

Also, it is up to the priest's discretion to withhold the Sacrament of the Eucharist -- Holy Communion -- from that penitent. If someone has every intention of going on committing a mortal sin, they are not in a fit state to receive the Sacrament.

PS -- I'm still a fairly new Catholic, and my opinion is certainly not to be taken as Catholic law.


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novus ordo priests probably roll their eyes a lot. I say that is rude and un-called for. But NO priests are always doing uncharitable things (my experience).

And why was the priest where you could see him? Only novus ordo priests do that and Sedevacantist Catholic priests (who are properly ordained) say the NO ones are not real priests bc not ordained properly.

Strange thing is, the host gets transubstantiated just the same (!) -- at least in some NO churches (maybe all of them, for all I know).

Jesus is a loving Savior who knows we need Him

 

[Donald H]

The normal response in America is to go out and buy another gun.

 

[OhPleaseJustQuit]

I've never heard of a priest kicking someone out of the confessional. That doesn't mean it hasn't happened and I'm sure it has. A good priest would tell the person that he can't help him since he isn't sorry and then politely ask him to leave.

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Yeah, that's kind of what I meant.

It's been said that Padre Pio was know to give a hypocritical "penitent" the bum's rush.

I wish I could have just once made my confession to him.


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[Road Runner]

You don't know Catholicism

but you despise it anyway... that's what I normally call intellectually vacuous

I despise Catholicism but not Catholics. Just like I despise homosexuality but not homosexuals. There's a difference in both those examples.

 

[Meriweather]

I despise Catholicism but not Catholics

Not possible. If you despise Catholicism, you despise me and there is no way around it. Catholicism was founded by Jesus Christ. Do you despise Jesus? How do you justify despising one without despising the other?

Can you name what is it you despise most about Catholicism?

 

[Road Runner]

Not possible. If you despise Catholicism, you despise me and there is no way around it. Catholicism was founded by Jesus Christ. Do you despise Jesus? How do you justify despising one without despising the other?

Can you name what is it you despise most about Catholicism?

Umm I don't despise Catholics or Jesus. I just don't agree with their beliefs.

 

[Meriweather]

Umm I don't despise Catholics or Jesus. I just don't agree with their beliefs.

You disagree with all our beliefs? The ones taught by Jesus and the Apostles? I note you now say "disagree" rather than "despise". Which belief do you disagree with most?

 

[forkintheroad7]

I despise Catholicism but not Catholics. Just like I despise homosexuality but not homosexuals. There's a difference in both those examples.

Irrelevant. My point stands. You despise something you do NOT understand. And you refuse to understand it, so all I can think is that you just want to hate... mindlessly

.. as appears to be the case with ALL anti-Catholics or virtually all.

 

[forkintheroad7]

Umm I don't despise Catholics or Jesus. I just don't agree with their beliefs.

Objectively you DO despise Jesus. How can you not despise the One who said "I will build My Church..."

You are just so entirely SURE that the Church Christ founded is not the Catholic Church. Meanwhile, Catholics are convinced that it is.. And some Catholics like yours truly STUDY the matter to get at the absolute, objective TRUTH.

You do not appear to study such matters at all. You seem to operate on emotions, just like the liberals in Congress.

No one will ever listen to a person who knows nothing of the subject matter on which he or she speaks.

 

[Carl in Michigan]

Not possible. If you despise Catholicism, you despise me and there is no way around it. Catholicism was founded by Jesus Christ

You believe that, but some of us know better. You are trapped in a cult

 

[Carl in Michigan]

Objectively you DO despise Jesus

Says the cult that calls their leaders "Father"
Believes in repetitive prayer
Replaced God's Sabbath with SUNday
Replaced God's Holy Days with christianized pagan holidays

 

[Meriweather]

You are trapped in a cult

In what way? Please be specific.

 

[ding]

You believe that, but some of us know better. You are trapped in a cult

You’re a religious nutjob.

 

[ding]

Says the cult that calls their leaders "Father"
Believes in repetitive prayer
Replaced God's Sabbath with SUNday
Replaced God's Holy Days with christianized pagan holidaysView attachment 1087235

It seems to me that you worship the form of religion rather than the spirit of God.

 

[hadit]

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Well, there is a strong tendency in Catholics to trust authority. I don't recall which Commandment can be interpreted to mean "Thou Shalt Trust The Authorities". Another question I'll have to ask my priest.

At my first Confession, when I was through with the actual confession part, I asked the priest if speeding is a sin, as many believe it is -- as in disobeying civil authorities -- and that priest rolled his eyes, which confirmed my belief that speeding, as long as you are not endangering another, is not to be considered a sin.

But no, the priest is not likely to withhold absolution in the case of the penitent who has not turned himself in to the authorities. What might be more likely is that the priest could terminate the confession and boot the person out of the confessional before the penitent has the chance to perform the Act of Contrition -- a sincere Act of Contrition is necessary in order to merit absolution. The penitent must tell God how sorry he is for committing the sin and promise to make every effort not to sin again.

Also, it is up to the priest's discretion to withhold the Sacrament of the Eucharist -- Holy Communion -- from that penitent. If someone has every intention of going on committing a mortal sin, they are not in a fit state to receive the Sacrament.

PS -- I'm still a fairly new Catholic, and my opinion is certainly not to be taken as Catholic law.


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And this is where I have a problem with the role of the priest in forgiveness of sin. From where does the priest get authority to grant or withhold absolution? It basically puts him in control of the penitent's eternal destination.

 

[OhPleaseJustQuit]

And this is where I have a problem with the role of the priest in forgiveness of sin. From where does the priest get authority to grant or withhold absolution? It basically puts him in control of the penitent's eternal destination.

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Well we believe in apostolic succession. Our priest, via the laying on of hands through an unbroken line of bishops, all the way back to Christ, receives the authority to act in persona Christi, or in the person of Christ.


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[hadit]

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Well we believe in apostolic succession. Our priest, via the laying on of hands through an unbroken line of bishops, all the way back to Christ, receives the authority to act in persona Christi, or in the person of Christ.


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I argued with a Catholic about this recently and was told that the priest does not forgive sin but only proclaims that the sin is forgiven. It sounds like you are saying that is false, that the priest does hold the authority to grant or withhold absolution and impose penance, something that would fly in the face of what Jesus said when He proclaimed He had the power to forgive sin and ticked off the Pharisees.

 

[OhPleaseJustQuit]

I argued with a Catholic about this recently and was told that the priest does not forgive sin but only proclaims that the sin is forgiven. It sounds like you are saying that is false, that the priest does hold the authority to grant or withhold absolution and impose penance, something that would fly in the face of what Jesus said when He proclaimed He had the power to forgive sin and ticked off the Pharisees.

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No, that's actually quite well said.

I'm not much of an apologist, not do I want to be. There are plenty online who are far better at it than I.


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[Meriweather]

No, that's actually quite well said.

Yes. Jesus announced the forgiveness of sins, and priests, to this day are given the authority to proclaim this. Still, we need to look at John 20:23, where Jesus says this to his Apostles: Those whose sins you forgive are forgiven (announces what is already true in Christ). Those sins you retain are retained (not forgiven). Recall Jesus said that sins against the Holy Spirit are not forgiven, and he also taught repentance (turning away from sin) for the forgiveness of sins. Hypocrisy could be what Jesus had in mind when teaching this--where people say one thing, but do the opposite.

What is wonderful about the grace of God and Confession is that when we find ourselves in the position Paul noted (I don't do what I want, but I do what I don't want), we trust God in our weakness. While we have not yet been able to turn away from a sin(s), we are open to and welcoming God's grace in continuing our work to overcome this sin(s).