Open Minded Agnostic Atheist

[Meriweather]

Just like I accuse christians during slavery of being silent

All Christians were not silent. But I hear you. The silence you heard drowned out the words of those who were speaking out.

 

[Meriweather]

I would feel like I’m not doing right by sitting silent and not calling bs on your fairytale.

Labeling something a fairy tale based on one's own conclusions does not make it so--nor does it give a valid reason for speaking out. You are going to have to come up with something better than "fairy tale" before being taken seriously. Those words alone tell me someone has not done their homework--and since I have lived with atheists all my life, I know who has done their homework--and who is simply blowing off steam. However, since you have disclosed you spent more than enough time depending, I'll concede there is a lot of steam that needs to blow away.

 

[Meriweather]

im sure not one theist agrees with you in heaven by the way. You say your soul lives for all eternity, you never get sick mad or die

Not what I said. I said we do not have a physical body, which means we no longer suffer from physical injury and illness. I said I did not know if anyone ever became angry, but an emotionless spirit did not seem compatible with free will--but again I didn't know.

I doubt that any theist would argue with anything I actually said, but may have their own ideas in matters where I indicated I do not know, but could only offer an opinion.

 

[Meriweather]

you don’t think you are a god in waiting?

Correct. I have no belief that any human is a "god in waiting." But, I'll bet you are going to pretend that I do. (Old habits and all that... )

 

[Meriweather]

my mom used to do what you do. Cherry pick and explain away anything that didn’t make sense. And ultimately you all know it’s crazy talk and you can’t prove the amazing stories in the Bible are real so you all say eventually, you just have to have faith.

First, I am not your mom. Second, I do not cherry pick. We have gone over this before. "Fairy tale" and "Cherry pick" are terms you throw out when it's the best you have. Personally, under such circumstances, I prefer to say ‘Supercalifragilisticexpialidocious’.

Second, I am not a Bible literalist and have never felt any need to prove any of its stories true. (You really must have had a rough childhood when it came to religion.) A Rabbi said long ago that the Bible can be summed up with, "Love God; love your fellowman. The rest is simply commentary." I find love God, love your fellowman words to live by; and I find the commentary quite fascinating.

 

[sealybobo]

For your kind of talk I have no patience or open mind. Utter nonsense. And I had an open mind for over half my life. How much longer should I continue to pretend I believe something I don’t?

Let's start here, then.

You seem proud that you had an open mind. Someone once told me, "Keep an open mind--but not so open your brains fall out."

Another place we diverge is that I never had to pretend to believe something I did not. I either believed, or I lacked belief. In fact, I cannot even imagine what you went through, because I cannot imagine putting myself through that kind of hell.

the worst is the guilt that you feel like you are disrespecting this god you grew up with.

or I feel like my priest at my church knows I don’t believe. I don’t attend or pay dues.

for awhile you catch yourself going to talk to god then you realize you have woken up to the fact gods don’t exist. I’m just talking to myself.

 

[sealybobo]

you don’t think you are a god in waiting?

Correct. I have no belief that any human is a "god in waiting." But, I'll bet you are going to pretend that I do. (Old habits and all that... )

So your spirit doesn’t live on for the rest of eternity? The Bible doesn’t say it’s paradise?

Doesnt the Bible teach you not to lie? You’re just lying to yourself now. You know that you believe you are going to live for all eternity. That’s a god my friend.

 

[sealybobo]

my mom used to do what you do. Cherry pick and explain away anything that didn’t make sense. And ultimately you all know it’s crazy talk and you can’t prove the amazing stories in the Bible are real so you all say eventually, you just have to have faith.

First, I am not your mom. Second, I do not cherry pick. We have gone over this before. "Fairy tale" and "Cherry pick" are terms you throw out when it's the best you have. Personally, under such circumstances, I prefer to say ‘Supercalifragilisticexpialidocious’.

Second, I am not a Bible literalist and have never felt any need to prove any of its stories true. (You really must have had a rough childhood when it came to religion.) A Rabbi said long ago that the Bible can be summed up with, "Love God; love your fellowman. The rest is simply commentary." I find love God, love your fellowman words to live by; and I find the commentary quite fascinating.

Ah so you don’t really believe Jesus walked on water or that Mary was a Virgin?

 

[Meriweather]

well I don’t. But I have an open mind to logical and reasonable comments. So stop with the Bible. Tall me what the book of Mormons says. And tell me why their book proves god is real. After all he visited them last and told Joseph smith your religion has lost its moral authority and conn3ction to god because of corrupt popes so god told Joseph this.

I believe I told you of my first contact with The Book of Mormon when I was 14 and knew nothing about Mormons or the LDS faith--had never heard of it. The book was lying on the table at a public library. I flipped through and read a few pages, was not impressed, and put it back down thinking, "Sounds like something written by a 14-year-old boy."

Later, when I did learn that Mormons were Christian denomination, someone said I should pray about reading the Book of Mormon, because they felt sure I would feel drawn to reading it. I did pray, and what came across very strongly was, "Not for you." Notice the words didn't say, Not for anyone--they said not for you. Thus I kept on the path I had been following and respected those whose path followed The Book of Mormon.

 

[Grumblenuts]

ultimately you all know it’s crazy talk and you can’t prove the amazing stories in the Bible are real so you all say eventually, you just have to have faith.

Or in effect..

Ja, ja, ja. Nein. Rouse! You stupid American atheists. Gut thing Hänsel und Gretel are no longer around. They'd kick sorry American buttocks from Munich to Timbuktu. Your beer tastes like piss soaked strudel. Ooo, how dat makes meine calf muscles flex und quiver in anger! Why don't you just put Arnold in charge over dare? Schnell!

 

[Meriweather]

i believe you peeked into heaven like I believe Joseph smith

Which is fine. There is a noticeable difference between any experience I had and Joseph Smith. Joseph Smith was given an entire book that apparently says quite a lot about everything. My own experiences do not verify God created the world, Trinity, or any other Biblical account--and I don't pretend they do. They have been quite limited and I strictly observe those limits--that I witnessed this bit and no more.

God is love and that love is amazing. That is my testimony. (Your best argument against me is that eye-witness testimony is notoriously unreliable. You know, so that you won't have to result to "fairy tale", "cherry picking" or "Supercalifragilisticexpialidocious". )

 

[Meriweather]

You do understand a non believer is not going to be moved by your eye witness testimony right? Or what your ancient books say. So what else do you have?

Ha, Captain Obvious! I've known that for decades. You forget, I live with atheists. Are you really hoping I have something else, because if so, you are going to be disappointed. All I have is a willingness to discuss and listen to various perspectives, which is why I am here. If you think I am online to convince or convert--above my pay grade, such that it is, because I really don't have that much.

The best that can be taken from me is the encouragement that God Is, and that He can be found. Another thing I have said before is that Blessed are those who believe without seeing. This is truth. Seeing comes with a craving--I think far greater than any addiction--to see more. Faith is the blessing.

 

[Meriweather]

So your spirit doesn’t live on for the rest of eternity? The Bible doesn’t say it’s paradise?

I do believe in eternity. Jesus spoke of that as well, that the way of life he teaches is eternal. Let's go back to the Hebrew where we get the word "Paradise". It means the garden of God, and describes the dwelling place of Adam and Eve.

Jesus mentions that in his Father's place there are many dwelling places (or mansions), and that a place will be prepared for us.

 

[Meriweather]

Doesnt the Bible teach you not to lie? You’re just lying to yourself now. You know that you believe you are going to live for all eternity. That’s a god my friend.

An eternal life for a spirit is not a God. For example, angels are spirits, and the Bible defines them more as messengers than a God. Somewhere in the Bible it says mankind are a little lower than the angels.

Trust me or not as you please, but there is more to God than just His eternal existence. What He has, I have not.

 

[Meriweather]

Ah so you don’t really believe Jesus walked on water or that Mary was a Virgin?

My personal belief is that there is good reason to believe Mary was a virgin. There are two thoughts about Jesus walking on water. There are places on the Sea of Galilee where the shoreline, also dotted with reeds, makes it possible for someone to walk out into the sea. Especially if mist is present, it can give an impression of walking on water. Or, Jesus may have walked on water. I let it go at that, because the lesson and theme of the story is not walking on water, but about faith.

I worked on faith a lot as a child. I was determined to move one of the small mountains in Nevada--one no one would ever miss. It took me years to figure out that wasn't the kind of mountain faith moved. And, by the way, that wasn't my greatest misunderstanding. Jesus had some harsh things to say about Scribes, so imagine my horror when I was awarded the Scribe and Pen Award for something I had written back in high school.

The Bible is a tricky place, which is why I am such a strong advocate of studying the languages, history, and cultures of Biblical times. It really does lend one a much different perspective.

 

[Grumblenuts]

There are places to hide and pee along the Sea of Galilee
Where the shoreline, dotted with reeds, makes it possible for none to see
Of course one may walk well into the sea
And just pee relaxed and free

 

[sealybobo]

You do understand a non believer is not going to be moved by your eye witness testimony right? Or what your ancient books say. So what else do you have?

Ha, Captain Obvious! I've known that for decades. You forget, I live with atheists. Are you really hoping I have something else, because if so, you are going to be disappointed. All I have is a willingness to discuss and listen to various perspectives, which is why I am here. If you think I am online to convince or convert--above my pay grade, such that it is, because I really don't have that much.

The best that can be taken from me is the encouragement that God Is, and that He can be found. Another thing I have said before is that Blessed are those who believe without seeing. This is truth. Seeing comes with a craving--I think far greater than any addiction--to see more. Faith is the blessing.

Of course a made up religion is going to say bless those who believe without seeing. Sad.

 

[sealybobo]

So your spirit doesn’t live on for the rest of eternity? The Bible doesn’t say it’s paradise?

I do believe in eternity. Jesus spoke of that as well, that the way of life he teaches is eternal. Let's go back to the Hebrew where we get the word "Paradise". It means the garden of God, and describes the dwelling place of Adam and Eve.

Jesus mentions that in his Father's place there are many dwelling places (or mansions), and that a place will be prepared for us.

Where you will be a Demi god

 

[sealybobo]

Doesnt the Bible teach you not to lie? You’re just lying to yourself now. You know that you believe you are going to live for all eternity. That’s a god my friend.

An eternal life for a spirit is not a God. For example, angels are spirits, and the Bible defines them more as messengers than a God. Somewhere in the Bible it says mankind are a little lower than the angels.

Trust me or not as you please, but there is more to God than just His eternal existence. What He has, I have not.

Ok so you are a Demi god. Do angels get sick jealous and angry?

you know I’m laughing at you now right? The more you explain the sillier it gets.

sure there is more to god than just living forever and never getting sick but i say someone who lives forever and never gets sick is a god. Don’t you?

i think you know what I mean. Im glad I am the first to make you aware that you are literally a god in waiting.

 

[sealybobo]

Doesnt the Bible teach you not to lie? You’re just lying to yourself now. You know that you believe you are going to live for all eternity. That’s a god my friend.

An eternal life for a spirit is not a God. For example, angels are spirits, and the Bible defines them more as messengers than a God. Somewhere in the Bible it says mankind are a little lower than the angels.

Trust me or not as you please, but there is more to God than just His eternal existence. What He has, I have not.

Angels are gods too. Like hera Zeus and Aphrodite