Kremlin says Russia is open to dialogue with Trump on Ukraine

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

Inevitably, the West will have to demilitarize and denazify Russia.

 

[Zavulon]

Denigrating Ukrainians is a bad idea. Ever see the Nazi propaganda film "Global Jew" or "Eternal Jew"? Its on youtube, its what Nazis did.

I don't "denigrate" Ukrainians. My mom was a Ukrainian. Ukrainians are ordinary Russian people, living in Ukraine. If I "denigrate" anybody its not "Ukrainians", but "Banderovci" - military/criminal/political group. And, say, after Volyn massacre its quite difficult to denigrate them more then they denigrated themselves.

Its possible to rebuild war damage, but it takes a lot of money.

Money is not a problem. You can print as much money as we need and a bit more.

No one lost, it was a stalemate.

It's not a stalemate. Kievan regime is running out of the biomass.

Ethnicity doesn't matter. Ukraine is a sovereign country whose army battled Russia to a stalemate.

Ethnicity matter for Ukrainian and European Nazies. Ukraine is no more a sovereign state - its a NATO's proxy. And no, they are defeated. You are defeated.

The Jewish comedian won in 2020.

I thought you said that ethnicity doesn't matter?

Russia invaded.

According official Ukrainian myth - Russia invaded in 2014. And, by the way, DPR and LPR declared independence in 2014.

We'll see what happens next.

Basically there are only two options - you can de-escalate, and then we'll defeat Ukraine. Or you can escalate - and then we'll defeat both Ukraine and NATO.

There is Jewish DNA, there are Jewish customs, I believe they are automatically citizens of Israel via "dual citizenship?", they have their own religion at synagogues, I have no clue how they view their citizenship loyalty. Not very patriotic?

There is no specifically Jewish DNA. Say, my "Jewish" Y-chromosome is most common among Saudi Arabs. And as my Jewish cousin, who left Ukraine back in 2014, said "I was a Jew in Ukraine, but here in Israel I'm a Russian".

True. Would you count on EU countries to send troops if one was attacked? Their armies are not good enough.

It depends. In fact, I'm not an expert of European xenopsychology. I don't really understand even American psychology (despite all those American books I've read). That's what the term "alien" means. They are unpredictable. You are unpredictable for us, we are unpredictable for you.
Hence, I prefer to calculate all possibilities.

LOL. We have a "triad" and always have bombers in the air and "boomer" subs at sea. Actual capabilities are very scary, devastating, life ending, not to be tested.

Funny. Really funny. Try to read actual books, like, say, "US Nuclear Forces, 2025".

Catholic, no. We hear bible passages at Mass. Primarily New Testament. (my wife's bible has brief summaries before each book, I read those, we'd call those the Cliff Notes version)

So, was it your priest, who told you all those scary tales about Nuclear Winter and Air Alert Bombers?

I prefer not to test that theory.

If so, you need to make few steps back.

Musk wants to replace the old FAA radar systems for air traffic control with space-based satellite systems. Saying that we see and monitor all of Russia's nuclear capabilities is not an exaggeration. We both watch each other, all the time.

So, you priest told you this?

 

[Zavulon]

Inevitably, the West will have to demilitarize and denazify Russia.

They have been trying to do it at least twice a century for the thousand of years, starting with Northern Crusades. Nothing new. May be, this attempt will be last point in their history. You know, like the final solution of the western problem.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

Going to have to send the Rus east of the Volga, far east of the Volga.

 

[Zavulon]

Going to have to send the Rus east of the Volga, far east of the Volga.

Do you mean Alaska and California?

 

[kyzr]

It's not a stalemate. Kievan regime is running out of the biomass.

OK, so no peace deal.

Ethnicity matters for Ukrainian and European Nazies. Ukraine is no more a sovereign state - its a NATO's proxy. And no, they are defeated. You are defeated. I thought you said that ethnicity doesn't matter?

For patriotic citizens ethnicity doesn't matter, we have many many ethnic groups here, but we're all loyal Americans, its just an ethnic last name. In Europe people seem to put ethnicity before citizenship? Keeping separate instead of mixing ethnic groups like here in the US.

According official Ukrainian myth - Russia invaded in 2014. And, by the way, DPR and LPR declared independence in 2014.

Russia rejoices at Trump-Putin call as Zelenskyy rejects talks without Ukraine present

Russian officials and state media have taken a triumphant tone after President Donald Trump jettisoned three years of U.S. policy and announced he would likely meet soon with Russian President Vladimir Putin to negotiate a peace deal in the almost three-year-long war in Ukraine.

apnews.com

Russia rejoices at Putin’s spotlight role​

(looks like most Russians are looking for the war to end?)

Basically there are only two options - you can de-escalate, and then we'll defeat Ukraine. Or you can escalate - and then we'll defeat both Ukraine and NATO.

Stop the empty threats.

There is no specifically Jewish DNA. Say, my "Jewish" Y-chromosome is most common among Saudi Arabs. And as my Jewish cousin, who left Ukraine back in 2014, said "I was a Jew in Ukraine, but here in Israel I'm a Russian".

Actually I had my DNA analyzed. I'm surprisingly 0.01% Ashkenazim?!
You type like a Russian, probably to keep the GRU from knocking on your door.

It depends. In fact, I'm not an expert of European xenopsychology. I don't really understand even American psychology (despite all those American books I've read). That's what the term "alien" means. They are unpredictable. You are unpredictable for us, we are unpredictable for you.
Hence, I prefer to calculate all possibilities.

Americans stratify by generation. I'm a "boomer" I don't understand younger generations. Our values are much different.

So, was it your priest, who told you all those scary tales about Nuclear Winter and Air Alert Bombers? If so, you need to make few steps back.
So, your priest told you this?

Priests don't discuss war or military subjects. We learn most things from television.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

Do you mean Alaska and California?

As indentured serfs?

 

[JimH52]

Putin has to make a deal soon, and he has the perfect American administration in place for that.

Hell, they've already given away the store -- no NATO for Ukraine, Russia can keep the land it has taken, let's get Russia back into the world.

Zelensky will demand some kind of security guarantees, for obvious reasons, but Trump will keep them as weak as possible and Putin will ultimately ignore any deal.

Vlad lucked out in November, that's for sure. Europe needs to move quickly. They should start their own version of NATO. America's no longer an ally to anyone.

Poootin knows he is going to negotiate with a fool. He is celebrating. trump will give him whatever he wants.

 

[Zavulon]

OK, so no peace deal.

Yes. Highly likely there will be no peace deal.

For patriotic citizens ethnicity doesn't matter, we have many many ethnic groups here, but we're all loyal Americans, its just an ethnic last name. In Europe people seem to put ethnicity before citizenship? Keeping separate instead of mixing ethnic groups like here in the US.

There are no "Ukrainian patriots". There are some Russian people, living under pressure of the discriminative regime, and there are European collaborants, who do discriminate and abuse Russians. Nobody care about existence of the "independent Ukraine". Some people see it as a part of EU, other see it as a part of Russian Federation.

Russia rejoices at Trump-Putin call as Zelenskyy rejects talks without Ukraine present

Russian officials and state media have taken a triumphant tone after President Donald Trump jettisoned three years of U.S. policy and announced he would likely meet soon with Russian President Vladimir Putin to negotiate a peace deal in the almost three-year-long war in Ukraine.

apnews.com

Russia rejoices at Putin’s spotlight role​

(looks like most Russians are looking for the war to end?)

It is not "most of Russians", and no, people don't want "peace". They want "wealth and safety".

Stop the empty threats.

They are not empty.

Priests don't discuss war or military subjects. We learn most things from television.

So, you don't believe your priests, you believe your TV?

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

Nope.

 

[Zavulon]

As indentured serfs?

Vice versa. As liberators.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

Vice versa. As liberators.

Yes, they would like to be liberated in America.

Ever been to Brighton Beach.

 

[kyzr]

There are no "Ukrainian patriots". There are some Russian people, living under pressure of the discriminative regime, and there are European collaborants, who do discriminate and abuse Russians. Nobody care about existence of the "independent Ukraine". Some people see it as a part of EU, other see it as a part of Russian Federation.

I disagree. The Ukrainian military is doing very well against a superior Russian military. Our generals say the Ukes are very tough.

It is not "most of Russians", and no, people don't want "peace". They want "wealth and safety".

Ok, I showed you the link. You disagree.

So, you don't believe your priests, you believe your TV?

We don't talk to priests much. We just attend mass and throw our envelopes in the basket. Our TV has a lot of nonsense, but occasionally some good "unclassified" information. Nuclear Winter has been a topic of discussion since the 1950s, here is one article that discusses it:

"Nuclear weapons are usually fused to detonate several thousand meters above the target zone, thus maximizing the destructive effect of the heat and shockwave. However this doesn't cause much dust and particulates to be carried into the stratosphere compared to a device detonated at or below ground level, or compared to a volcanic eruption.
However this would likely ignite widespread fires, and the social chaos that followed would prevent these fires from being contained. This could easily wrap the globe in a veil of smoke that would lower global temperature enough to cause major weather changes and crop failures."

So its not all "ice and snow", but a cool-down enough -3C to prevent crops from a growing season. Not to mention the destroyed cities.

 

[Zavulon]

I disagree. The Ukrainian military is doing very well against a superior Russian military. Our generals say the Ukes are very tough.

Ukrainians are tough mostly because they are Russians. But, I'm almost sure that Americans could be very tough if they are fighting on their own land.

Ok, I showed you the link. You disagree.

You see, you are repeating the same mistake. You take opinion of the very limited group of Russians for opinion of all Russians. Say, Left net, with Zachary Prilepin are actually against any peace deal with Americans.
And even this opinion is, as I think, the result of misperception. They think: "Americans are getting sober, they are going to get off from our way, and soon we'll (may be with the newly elected Kievan government) finish Banderlogs and establish good peace with equal rights and equal safety for everyone, especially for Russian speakers".
But, if we assume you (and other American members of US MB) are more or less adequate representation of the American society, then, of course, you are not "getting sober" in any meaningful (for the Russians) sense. You are still the same stoned in sh-t Junkies deliriously dancing and jumping on the very thin ice. You just sing the different song. May be, you don't understand that this solid surface under your feet is not marble but ice. May be, significant part of you never saw ice without whiskey and don't even understand the possible danger. May be, it's (in the delirious mindset of your decision-makers) just a "well-calculated strategy Rationality of Irrationality". Everything is possible. I don't even pretend that I do understand your actual motivations and further possible actions. What I do know - you'd better lay down and crawl to the safe beach, and it's highly unlikely that you'll do it.

We don't talk to priests much. We just attend mass and throw our envelopes in the basket.

Yes. That's what I mean "Christian in name only". No offence. You don't believe Bible (you'd never read it), you don't believe Pope and priests - you don't even listen them. You believe in environmentalistic scary tales, you've been listening from TV. So, in fact, your religion (the things you actually believe in) is not Christianity (Roman Catholic), but Environmentalism (Nuclear Winter cult).

Our TV has a lot of nonsense, but occasionally some good "unclassified" information. Nuclear Winter has been a topic of discussion since the 1950s, here is one article that discusses it:

"Nuclear weapons are usually fused to detonate several thousand meters above the target zone, thus maximizing the destructive effect of the heat and shockwave. However this doesn't cause much dust and particulates to be carried into the stratosphere compared to a device detonated at or below ground level, or compared to a volcanic eruption.
However this would likely ignite widespread fires, and the social chaos that followed would prevent these fires from being contained. This could easily wrap the globe in a veil of smoke that would lower global temperature enough to cause major weather changes and crop failures."

So its not all "ice and snow", but a cool-down enough -3C to prevent crops from a growing season. Not to mention the destroyed cities.

You see, the weak point of all quasi-scientific cults is that they use one or few factors but ignore all others, and they don't do actual calculations.
First of all, and most importantly, they simply ignore greenhouse gases - water vapour and CO_2, which are, actually warming up atmosphere. Say, even ten gigaton-class torpedoes bursts in the ocean will evapore enough of water to, according some guestimations, raise temperature up to three Celsius degrees.
Second, also very important point, it that shock-wave decreasing its energy slower than light flash and radiation. It means - more yield - more destruction from shockwave and lesser destruction from fire. For typical 100 kt burst over a typical modern city there will be no "wide-spread city fires". There will be "smoldering in rubbles". And fires in forests are absolutely the same if they were caused by a match or by a nuclear blast.
Third point - we are all more or less reasonable people and I hope that you'll accept Russia-prefered peace deal after Russian counter-force strike and elimination of the significant part of your nuclear forces.
Fourth - neither raising/decreasing temperature nor lack of crops actually kill people. Unpreparedness do. You should have reserves of food, fuel and other resources and weapons to take it from your allies and/or enemies.

 

[kyzr]

Ukrainians are tough mostly because they are Russians. But, I'm almost sure that Americans could be very tough if they are fighting on their own land.

That is a fact we can agree on.

You see, you are repeating the same mistake. You take opinion of the very limited group of Russians for opinion of all Russians. Say, Left net, with Zachary Prilepin are actually against any peace deal with Americans.
And even this opinion is, as I think, the result of misperception. They think: "Americans are getting sober, they are going to get off from our way, and soon we'll (may be with the newly elected Kievan government) finish Banderlogs and establish good peace with equal rights and equal safety for everyone, especially for Russian speakers".
But, if we assume you (and other American members of US MB) are more or less adequate representation of the American society, then, of course, you are not "getting sober" in any meaningful (for the Russians) sense. You are still the same stoned in sh-t Junkies deliriously dancing and jumping on the very thin ice. You just sing the different song. May be, you don't understand that this solid surface under your feet is not marble but ice. May be, significant part of you never saw ice without whiskey and don't even understand the possible danger. May be, it's (in the delirious mindset of your decision-makers) just a "well-calculated strategy Rationality of Irrationality". Everything is possible. I don't even pretend that I do understand your actual motivations and further possible actions. What I do know - you'd better lay down and crawl to the safe beach, and it's highly unlikely that you'll do it.

You keep threatening nuclear war, even though Putin agreed to discuss peace. Putin sees that Russia's economy can't support years more of war, knowing that NATO can keep Ukraine well supplied. Its a simple economic calculation, we'll see how it plays out.

Yes. That's what I mean "Christian in name only". No offence. You don't believe Bible (you'd never read it), you don't believe Pope and priests - you don't even listen them. You believe in environmentalistic scary tales, you've been listening from TV. So, in fact, your religion (the things you actually believe in) is not Christianity (Roman Catholic), but Environmentalism (Nuclear Winter cult).
You see, the weak point of all quasi-scientific cults is that they use one or few factors but ignore all others, and they don't do actual calculations.
First of all, and most importantly, they simply ignore greenhouse gases - water vapour and CO_2, which are, actually warming up atmosphere. Say, even ten gigaton-class torpedoes bursts in the ocean will evapore enough of water to, according some guestimations, raise temperature up to three Celsius degrees.
Second, also very important point, it that shock-wave decreasing its energy slower than light flash and radiation. It means - more yield - more destruction from shockwave and lesser destruction from fire. For typical 100 kt burst over a typical modern city there will be no "wide-spread city fires". There will be "smoldering in rubbles". And fires in forests are absolutely the same if they were caused by a match or by a nuclear blast.
Third point - we are all more or less reasonable people and I hope that you'll accept Russia-prefered peace deal after Russian counter-force strike and elimination of the significant part of your nuclear forces.
Fourth - neither raising/decreasing temperature nor lack of crops actually kill people. Unpreparedness do. You should have reserves of food, fuel and other resources and weapons to take it from your allies and/or enemies.

I don't need to read the bible. Genesis was written by Moses 1400 BC, 3425 years ago. The world was different back then. Priests have sermons, and they do not discuss "nuclear winter" or war strategies, or science topics. Is global warming real? Some scientists say yes, others say no.
3rd point: after a major nuclear exchange no one is left to discuss anything
4th point: we preppers do have stores of food and water, just in case

 

[Zavulon]

That is a fact we can agree on.

Ok.

You keep threatening nuclear war, even though Putin agreed to discuss peace.

Putin never refused to "discuss peace". NATO did. Our peace terms were know from the very beginning, and if they did changed - they changed in the worst (for you) side. But nuclear war is still on table, and as for me - its much more likely than reliable peace or even cheesefire.

Putin sees that Russia's economy can't support years more of war, knowing that NATO can keep Ukraine well supplied.

Actually, Russian economy is doing pretty good. And no, NATO can't give Ukraine enough weapons to defeat Russia or change the possible outcome of the war. The only thing those supplies can change - is the price Russia will pay for liberation of Ukraine and the price Europe and USA will pay for that support.

Its a simple economic calculation, we'll see how it plays out.

The war is profitable for now (both in human lives and natural resources) and elimination of the western threat (or even a final solution of the European problem) is priceless.

I don't need to read the bible. Genesis was written by Moses 1400 BC, 3425 years ago. The world was different back then. Priests have sermons, and they do not discuss "nuclear winter" or war strategies, or science topics.

If so, why do make it a point of faith?

Is global warming real? Some scientists say yes, others say no.

Same with "Nuclear winter". Actually, nuclear winter speculations are even worse science than "global warming theory".

3rd point: after a major nuclear exchange no one is left to discuss anything

Who told you this nonsense?

4th point: we preppers do have stores of food and water, just in case

You have family storages. Russia has national wide reserves.

 

[John Edgar Slow Horses]

This guarantees a war in Eastern Europe.

 

[kyzr]

Putin never refused to "discuss peace". NATO did. Our peace terms were know from the very beginning, and if they did changed - they changed in the worst (for you) side. But nuclear war is still on table, and as for me - its much more likely than reliable peace or even ceasefire.

Apparently the first meeting went well In Saudi Arabia. But the real deal makers Putin and Trump need to schedule talks.

What We Learned From High-Stakes U.S.-Russia Talks In Saudi Arabia

U.S. and Russian officials have finished their first talks on ending the war in Ukraine, with Kyiv and its European allies watching anxiously from the sidelines.

www.rferl.org

Actually, Russian economy is doing pretty good. And no, NATO can't give Ukraine enough weapons to defeat Russia or change the possible outcome of the war. The only thing those supplies can change - is the price Russia will pay for liberation of Ukraine and the price Europe and USA will pay for that support.

So lets hope they end the war and avoid unnecessary deaths.

The war is profitable for now (both in human lives and natural resources) and elimination of the western threat (or even a final solution of the European problem) is priceless.

Stop with your nuclear war option. We both know that is Russian suicide.

If so, why do make it a point of faith?

If you believe humans have souls, you should believe in God, and practice a religion. I see Putin bless himself occasionally, which means he must have a very complex relationship between his God, his church and his job. Trump takes God and religion much more seriously after the bullet went thru his ear because he turned his head at the exact instant the shot was fired. However, I don't think their meeting will start with a prayer.

Same with "Nuclear winter". Actually, nuclear winter speculations are even worse science than "global warming theory".

We don't know what we don't know about the long term effects of nuclear radiation. Or how severe a "nuclear winter" would be after an all-out nuclear war. Your assumption of a few strategic strikes is probably very optimistic.

Who told you this nonsense? (very few people left after a nuclear exchange)

How many US and Russian cities would be destroyed after a major nuclear exchange? How much of the militaries would remain intact and operational? I don't want to find out.

You have family storage. Russia has national wide reserves.

You have bomb shelters and fallout shelters for large populations? Seriously?

 

[Mac1958]

Inevitably, the West will have to demilitarize and denazify Russia.

Before November, that day was getting closer and closer.

Now, Putin has a new lease on life.

 

[JimH52]

Before November, that day was getting closer and closer.

Now, Putin has a new lease on life.

Yeah, Poootin has his boy back in the White House. Zelensky better stock up on petroleum jelly. He is about to be reamed.