Judaism 101

[Viktor]

The doctrine of salvation is not part of Judaism.

I don't know about modern Judaism, but for ancient Israel, the hope of salvation lay in territory, i.e., a promised land.

They already had it-ancient Israel.

 

[Votto]

The doctrine of salvation is not part of Judaism.

I don't know about modern Judaism, but for ancient Israel, the hope of salvation lay in territory, i.e., a promised land.

They already had it-ancient Israel.

I think we are just trying to figure out the appeal you have for your faith that is devoid of salvation.

What is the appeal then?

 

[norwegen]

The doctrine of salvation is not part of Judaism.

I don't know about modern Judaism, but for ancient Israel, the hope of salvation lay in territory, i.e., a promised land.

They already had it-ancient Israel.

You know Assyria took that land, right? And Babylon? And others?

For Israel, salvation was in a political empire that would never be defeated.

 

[norwegen]

The Jewish Messiah foretold in the OT will be a political and military leader who will defeat the enemies of The Jews, restore them to Jerusalem and rebuild the Temple in Jerusalem.
Jesus was a pacifist.

Yea, that so-called Messiah would come around the time of the temple's destruction, which was in AD 70. Obviously, their expectations of a warrior-messiah didn't pan out.

 

[Viktor]

The Jewish Messiah foretold in the OT will be a political and military leader who will defeat the enemies of The Jews, restore them to Jerusalem and rebuild the Temple in Jerusalem.
Jesus was a pacifist.

Yea, that so-called Messiah would come around the time of the temple's destruction, which was in AD 70. Obviously, their expectations of a warrior-messiah didn't pan out.

They said rebuild the temple, idiot

 

[norwegen]

The Jewish Messiah foretold in the OT will be a political and military leader who will defeat the enemies of The Jews, restore them to Jerusalem and rebuild the Temple in Jerusalem.
Jesus was a pacifist.

Yea, that so-called Messiah would come around the time of the temple's destruction, which was in AD 70. Obviously, their expectations of a warrior-messiah didn't pan out.

They said rebuild the temple, idiot

Salvation was in territory, plain and simple. It was in escaping Pharaoh, for example, and never seeing the Egyptians again (Ex 14:10-14).

And wake us up when they rebuild the temple, will ya'? Christians already worship in the rebuilt temple (a few of them do, anyway). The Messianic Age saw one messiah after another rise and fall, and none of them rebuilt their temple; their new brick-and-mortar temple isn't going to happen. They will never again sacrifice animals or stone women to death. It's done. Over. Dead.

 

[TNHarley]

Judaism 101

All you need to know if you are interested

No thanks, not willing to deny Christ.

You dont find that odd?
You think the Jews got their own prophecies wrong?

 

[Meriweather]

No thanks, not willing to deny Christ.

Because Jews cannot accept Christ, I cannot convert to Judaism either. However, studying Judaism and the Old Testament from the Jewish perspective is one of the most enriching studies to embark upon. I highly recommend it for Christians. It has only served to deepen my faith and the trust I have in God and His ways.

 

[Viktor]

No thanks, not willing to deny Christ.

Because Jews cannot accept Christ, I cannot convert to Judaism either. However, studying Judaism and the Old Testament from the Jewish perspective is one of the most enriching studies to embark upon. I highly recommend it for Christians. It has only served to deepen my faith and the trust I have in God and His ways.

The Old Testament is much longer than the NT, but Judaism is muich simpler than Christianity.
Only God is divine and he has no son. There are no saints and no Trinity. There is no Satan and no Hell.

 

[Meriweather]

The Old Testament is much longer than the NT, but Judaism is muich simpler than Christianity.
Only God is divine and he has no son. There are no saints and no Trinity. There is no Satan and no Hell.

Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Moses, David, Esther, Susannah, and more.... These Jews are equivalent to the Sports Hall of Fame just like Saints are the equivalent to the Sports Hall of Fame. I am not familiar with the current Jewish belief about the afterlife. In Biblical times we read that some Jews held no belief in an afterlife, and good Jews had an afterlife with wherever Abraham was. They seemed to believe to reach the Bosom of Abraham might require some purification, and set that time of purification as no more than a year. I think the truly evil were thought to remain forever in the shadowy place of death? The place of purification remains in Catholic theology (referenced as purgatory) whereas Protestant Christian dropped this at the time of the Reformation.

Catholic theology also teaches that we don't know who, if anyone, is in hell. Catholics do believe in Satan, but the prevailing thought (unlike Protestant teaching) is that he is not the ruler of world; that in fact his power is severely limited. There have been (and they still occur but rarely) exorcisms. Books on Exorcism, even those that occur in non-Catholic denominations, there is a common truth--that Satan cannot just enter into anyone on his own--there has to be an invitation, a willingness to join with him.

Jesus seems to reference both Satan (as a tempter) and demons (unclean spirits) as seemed common for his time. Do Jews still believe God can send a Tempter (Ha-satan) as well as a Messenger (angel)?

Christian perspective of God as One is (for the most part) just as strong and emphatic that God is One. I know the term Trinity is confusing. The best I can explain this is that one cube is referenced as one--even though it has twelve edges and six faces. No one insists that only a line can be one, any other object one has to count the edges and faces. In other words, metaphorically speaking God is not one line--He is much more than that. (Giving Him twelve (or three) edges doesn't make Him a plural.

I am not asking Jews to change their description (let alone their minds) of God--just trying to give them a better understanding of how Christians insist God is One despite using a description of Trinity.

 

[surada]

The Jewish Messiah foretold in the OT will be a political and military leader who will defeat the enemies of The Jews, restore them to Jerusalem and rebuild the Temple in Jerusalem.
Jesus was a pacifist.

Yea, that so-called Messiah would come around the time of the temple's destruction, which was in AD 70. Obviously, their expectations of a warrior-messiah didn't pan out.

They said rebuild the temple, idiot

You mean after the Babylonian exile?

Revelation 21:22 KJV: And I saw no temple therein: for the ...

And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it.

 

[DudleySmith]

Christianity should represent the metaphysical evolution of the Hebrew faith and its fulfillment. "I Am" is the deity of Judaism, "I Am saves" is the name of Christ. That says it all.
That division is rife in the world serves whom? Who profits from dividing Jews from Christians (or any people from another)? Only the "Adversary".

They started it. They said a Messiah was coming and even gave a calendar for it in Daniel 9:24-27 that pointed to him coming at the time Jesus walked the earth.

Then when it happened they threw a fit and had a conniption over it.

However, Trump is really to blame. FYI.

The messiah described in the Old Testament has not come yet. Jesus does not fit the OT description.

In truth, he is the only one that could have fit the description


Who has believed our message
and to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?
2 He grew up before him like a tender shoot,
and like a root out of dry ground.
He had no beauty or majesty to attract us to him,
nothing in his appearance that we should desire him.
3 He was despised and rejected by mankind,
a man of suffering, and familiar with pain.
Like one from whom people hide their faces
he was despised, and we held him in low esteem.
4 Surely he took up our pain
and bore our suffering,
yet we considered him punished by God,
stricken by him, and afflicted.
5 But he was pierced for our transgressions,
he was crushed for our iniquities;
the punishment that brought us peace was on him,
and by his wounds we are healed.
6 We all, like sheep, have gone astray,
each of us has turned to our own way;
and the Lord has laid on him
the iniquity of us all.
7 He was oppressed and afflicted,
yet he did not open his mouth;
he was led like a lamb to the slaughter,
and as a sheep before its shearers is silent,
so he did not open his mouth.
8 By oppression[a] and judgment he was taken away.
Yet who of his generation protested?
For he was cut off from the land of the living;
for the transgression of my people he was punished.[b]
9 He was assigned a grave with the wicked,
and with the rich in his death,
though he had done no violence,
nor was any deceit in his mouth.
10 Yet it was the Lord’s will to crush him and cause him to suffer,
and though the Lord makes[c] his life an offering for sin,
he will see his offspring and prolong his days,
and the will of the Lord will prosper in his hand.
11 After he has suffered,
he will see the light of life[d] and be satisfied[e];
by his knowledge[f] my righteous servant will justify many,
and he will bear their iniquities.
12 Therefore I will give him a portion among the great,[g]
and he will divide the spoils with the strong,[h]
because he poured out his life unto death,
and was numbered with the transgressors.
For he bore the sin of many,
and made intercession for the transgressors.

The Jewish Messiah foretold in the OT will be a political and military leader who will defeat the enemies of The Jews, restore them to Jerusalem and rebuild the Temple in Jerusalem.
Jesus was a pacifist.

The temple fantasy is a lie, and has nothing to do with the Hebrew religion as handed down by Moses and the Prophets; it's purely a Babylonian cult invention, meant to promote the private interests of a fabricated Babylonian aristocracy and priesthood.

 

[foggedinn]

Read the OT long before I read the NT. It gave me a clear understanding of what a nazzerine was. Then I read the NT and it confused me. I suppose that because Jesus drank wine, Christians could not accept that Jesus was a nazzerine in the OT sense. Remember Samson. The nazzerite vow was usually for a specified period of time. As soon as they broke the vow, the clock reset. When someone belongs to God for the rest of their lives, the so-called punishment for breaking the vow is meaningless.

There were two spotless lambs brought forward on the Day of Atonement. Christians are only interested in prophesies of the Lamb which was slaughtered. There are also prophesies of the scapegoat.