It matters not who got our economy to this point

[thereisnospoon]

Fiscal conservative means having enough revenue to cover your expenses. Enough money in to cover money out

Borrowing money to pay for tax cuts to the wealthy is not fiscal conservatism

In other words, a so-called "fiscal conservative" wants to raise my taxes. No liberal who claimed to be a "fiscal conservative" ever talks about cutting government spending. So a liberal "fiscal conservative" is just another tax and spend liberal. How does that differ from any other kind of liberal?

A true fiscal conservative understands that a balanced budget involves both revenue and expendetures.

Yeah, and your point is?
Look, you libs have already been exposed. In another thread I blasted a lib for saying that people who own second homes should be punished through taxation for even having that home.
Punishment. That is how liberals view taxation.
I support taxation as a means to raise revenue for essential functions of government.
This federal government fails miserably at the test for fiscal responsibility.

 

[JoeNormal]

Whether I may need assistance at some point isn't the issue. If I do, I don't necessarily have to get it from government. Before welfare existed, we had private charity in this country. Welfare is theft.

BTW, I doubt you understand the meaning of the term "non sequitur."

I think I do but why don't you enlighten me?

I ask this of many people on this site and rarely get a response: What's your situation?

I think most conservatives see themselves as these independent, self sufficient entities that will somehow overcome whatever adversity comes their way. In my hometown, there are entire communities that were once filled with these types on conservatives that are now half foreclosed.

Our own Tea Party senator (Mike Lee) shorted his bank out of $400,000 because his paltry congressional salary of $174k (which he asked for) was supposedly insufficient to cover the mortgage. Is that the kind of fiscal conservative you'd prefer?

Most foreclosed middle and upper middle class people got into trouble when they bought too much house, went into revolving debt to pay for things they should not have bought but did so because they had to maintain an image or they "just wanted it"...
I have seen it far too often. Ridiculous spending habits. Buying cars when the one they had ran perfectly. Running up credit cards buying toys. Taking out loans for boats or RV's...
Example. I have a friend who is a real estate appraiser. Most of the assignments are foreclosures. It was common to see a boat and an Rv parked in the yard of a home that was about to be foreclosed. I have been in large homes for work purposes where some of the rooms had no furniture in them. Homes with $50k in upgrades.
These people spent unwisely and got burned.
My empathy goes out to people who through... no fault of their own ( illness, loss of income or tragedy)...IMO those are ther ONLY people who deserve loan modifications and other help to keep their homes.
If someone was greedy or overspent, screw 'em. They should have thought about that before they whipped out the plastic.
I have spent over half my life living beneath my means just to have something put away for a rainy day. I never spend without looking at the potential consequences. If that means I cannot buy something, so be it.

You are to be congratulated on your responsibility. I wish there were more people like you. However, are you out of the woods yet? Is there still time to find yourself without a job, no money for the mortgage, not many job prospects available?

Even for people like me who already own all the big ticket items, it could still be lost due to catastrophic illness. You don't think an advanced society should have some safeguards built in to prevent that?

 

[thereisnospoon]

Stimulus, healthcare bill, DADT, Bush tax cuts

ROFL! In other words, nothing. Democrats voted against the Bush tax cuts almost to a man. The other bills were supported only by Democrats.

The left demands we move 90% of the way to complete socialism, and when the Republican party agrees to move only 80% of the way, the left calls that a "compromise." When does the left ever agree to move away from socialism? It doesn't. Once government programs are created, the are considered immutable by the left.

The Bush tax cuts were extended weren't they?

I didn't see universal healthcare or a Government option in the Healthcare Plan

The 2009 stimulus included 45% set aside for tax cuts

What have Republicans compromised on?

t t

First, the stimulus were both neither. They were slush funds for the Administration to pay back those groups who threw their support to Obama in the 2008 election.
Second, the admin NEVER considered universal health care. Obama was warned many times any move toward single payer was a political disaster waiting to happen.
Obamacare will not survive intact. That's for sure.
And given the $880 million to be budgeted to the IRS for compliance brings us to the conclusion that Obamacare is a TAX.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Lots of polls and blame to go around. Enough to keep partisans on both sides pointing fingers for years.
What SHOULD matter at this point is why we are doing so poorly in our recovery. Blaming Bush is pointless to our recovery. The historians can decide who and what it will be viewed like later. In the meantime lets focus on the here and now and decide which path we need to take to expidite our recovery.

All the posts about BOOOOOOOOOSH are just pointless. For example I believe Frank, dems and many spinless pubs are to blame but starting such threads serves no purpose as its water under the bridge now and blame cant fix shit. Congress and Obama can however.

usually, unless you get to the ROOT of a problem, the problem will persist....

It is important to truly and honestly figure out what happened and once identified you can kill the root of the problem.....not repeat your mistakes.

soooo, until we are honest with ourselves on who caused what, and what followed, I'm afraid there will be no good solution.

Tell those on the Left that wisdom.

 

[ClosedCaption]

So many of you on the left dont realize there is a difference between playing the blame game for political points and understanding mistakes?

got it

You can't understand something when you say it doesn't matter how it happened.

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

So many of you on the left dont realize there is a difference between playing the blame game for political points and understanding mistakes?

got it

You can't understand something when you say it doesn't matter how it happened.

The thread title is WHO dumbass

You see the who is subjective and also pointless since he cant lead us again. Now stick your head back in the sand.

 

[rightwinger]

So many of you on the left dont realize there is a difference between playing the blame game for political points and understanding mistakes?

got it

You can't understand something when you say it doesn't matter how it happened.

The thread title is WHO dumbass

You see the who is subjective and also pointless since he cant lead us again. Now stick your head back in the sand.

When you understand how it happened and one party wants to repeat the mistakes that got us where we are today......that is your WHO

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

You can't understand something when you say it doesn't matter how it happened.

The thread title is WHO dumbass

You see the who is subjective and also pointless since he cant lead us again. Now stick your head back in the sand.

When you understand how it happened and one party wants to repeat the mistakes that got us where we are today......that is your WHO

I will accept BOOOOOOOSH was a **** up!

When will Obama and his supporters accept that his job performance is lacking and it ISNT BOOOOOOOOOOOOSHS fault??????????

 

[The T]

The thread title is WHO dumbass

You see the who is subjective and also pointless since he cant lead us again. Now stick your head back in the sand.

When you understand how it happened and one party wants to repeat the mistakes that got us where we are today......that is your WHO

I will accept BOOOOOOOSH was a **** up!

When will Obama and his supporters accept that his job performance is lacking and it ISNT BOOOOOOOOOOOOSHS fault??????????

NEVER. They can't abandon ALL HOPE they've given the failed Obama.

 

[LoneLaugher]

Obama's job performance isn't lacking. You are misinformed. You are relying on falsehoods when you come to that conclusion.

The economy is better now than it was when he took office. He has had no cooperation from the opposition party.

If you look at the facts, you must conclude that he deserves a second term. Fortunately, America will give him the honor.

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Obama's job performance isn't lacking. You are misinformed. You are relying on falsehoods when you come to that conclusion.

The economy is better now than it was when he took office. He has had no cooperation from the opposition party.

If you look at the facts, you must conclude that he deserves a second term. Fortunately, America will give him the honor.

Economies like ours recover naturally due to growth. This recover has been so slow that a ******* snail could have been president and the recovery would look no different.

 

[Nosmo King]

I have seen some ideas from both sides that might have helped. Sadly election season is not known for reason and comprimise.

When then is the time for reason and compromise? If it's right now, please tell the House Republicans!

And we should know exactly which policies were responsible for the financial sector collapse. Prior to this catastrophe, few if any banks actually failed. But since de-regulation and the repeal of Glass-Steagall, hundreds of banks have failed? Are there lessons to be learned, or should we blindly go forth de-regulating some more?

And if indeed de-regulation is the solution, can we learn anything from the effects it has had on other sectors of the economy? We de-regulated savings and loans back in the late 1980s and then they promptly began to fail. We de-regulated the airlines. Maybe we should ask some former employees of Pan Am and Eastern how that worked out.

If we go all ostrich and ignore the sources of our problems, how can we ever find workable solutions?

Ask Clinton, he knew how to get shit done. Thus far Obama has told the GOP to take a seat in the back of the bus and be quite because "he won"

Does that sound like the voice of someone seeking comprimise?

Ask Reid why he wont bring 30 some house bills to the floor and find comprimise in them then return them to the house......LIKE HE IS SUPPOSED TO DO.

There is plenty of blame to go around and I assure you its doesnt all lie at the doorstep to the house.

Just so we're clear; it's far more important to keep track of political petulance than it is to understand which policies were responsible for economic collapse.

I suppose that's because it's not a real solution being sought but a scorecard of idiocy in the political arena.

After all, accountability ain't fun! Finger pointing is what's important! That way one can still feel good about supporting poor policy decisions.

 

[francoHFW]

Not important to know history, just the horseshytte Pubs are spouting...

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

When then is the time for reason and compromise? If it's right now, please tell the House Republicans!

And we should know exactly which policies were responsible for the financial sector collapse. Prior to this catastrophe, few if any banks actually failed. But since de-regulation and the repeal of Glass-Steagall, hundreds of banks have failed? Are there lessons to be learned, or should we blindly go forth de-regulating some more?

And if indeed de-regulation is the solution, can we learn anything from the effects it has had on other sectors of the economy? We de-regulated savings and loans back in the late 1980s and then they promptly began to fail. We de-regulated the airlines. Maybe we should ask some former employees of Pan Am and Eastern how that worked out.

If we go all ostrich and ignore the sources of our problems, how can we ever find workable solutions?

Ask Clinton, he knew how to get shit done. Thus far Obama has told the GOP to take a seat in the back of the bus and be quite because "he won"

Does that sound like the voice of someone seeking comprimise?

Ask Reid why he wont bring 30 some house bills to the floor and find comprimise in them then return them to the house......LIKE HE IS SUPPOSED TO DO.

There is plenty of blame to go around and I assure you its doesnt all lie at the doorstep to the house.

Just so we're clear; it's far more important to keep track of political petulance than it is to understand which policies were responsible for economic collapse.

I suppose that's because it's not a real solution being sought but a scorecard of idiocy in the political arena.

After all, accountability ain't fun! Finger pointing is what's important! That way one can still feel good about supporting poor policy decisions.

Which completely explains Obamas administration to a T. Well done

 

[uscitizen]

I think Obama is deliberately making things worse. It's like he's trying to overwhelm the system and I've heard some on the left start talking about completely tearing down our capitalist system and rebuilding it differently.

What we need is to have the government taking back control of the federal reserve. If things were as they were meant to be, perhaps we wouldn't be in this mess. Both sides are equally to blame over the years, but Obama seems hellbent on destroying the country completely. I think it's by design.

Obama's goal has always been to increase the size and scope of of the federal government and increase dependency on government.

Same as Bush did.
Patriot act ring a bell?
Spending nearly 5 trillion in borrowed money at a time when the right claimed the economy was doing great?

?

 

[uscitizen]

Obama's job performance isn't lacking. You are misinformed. You are relying on falsehoods when you come to that conclusion.

The economy is better now than it was when he took office. He has had no cooperation from the opposition party.

If you look at the facts, you must conclude that he deserves a second term. Fortunately, America will give him the honor.

Economies like ours recover naturally due to growth. This recover has been so slow that a ******* snail could have been president and the recovery would look no different.

Growth ? We are a consumer spending driven economy and most of what we buy is not made here.

 

[LeftofLeft]

But it does matter in that many who contributed to the problem on both sides are still trying to do the same things that got us into this mess.
And many are running for election or reelection.

No one yet has produced any viable options/plans for fixing the mess.

It will only continue and grow worse by following the current path.

I have seen some ideas from both sides that might have helped. Sadly election season is not known for reason and comprimise.

Compromise has become a word the right cannot even say unless deriding someone for compromising.

The Left always holds The Right accountable on compromise yet we never see the Left show compromise.

 

[rdean]

Lots of polls and blame to go around. Enough to keep partisans on both sides pointing fingers for years.
What SHOULD matter at this point is why we are doing so poorly in our recovery. Blaming Bush is pointless to our recovery. The historians can decide who and what it will be viewed like later. In the meantime lets focus on the here and now and decide which path we need to take to expidite our recovery.

All the posts about BOOOOOOOOOSH are just pointless. For example I believe Frank, dems and many spinless pubs are to blame but starting such threads serves no purpose as its water under the bridge now and blame cant fix shit. Congress and Obama can however.

It matters SS. Because the people who got our economy into this state have no other plans besides taking us back to where we have barely begun to crawl out of.

Is that clear SS?

 

[LoneLaugher]

Obama's job performance isn't lacking. You are misinformed. You are relying on falsehoods when you come to that conclusion.

The economy is better now than it was when he took office. He has had no cooperation from the opposition party.

If you look at the facts, you must conclude that he deserves a second term. Fortunately, America will give him the honor.

Economies like ours recover naturally due to growth. This recover has been so slow that a ******* snail could have been president and the recovery would look no different.

Growth ? We are a consumer spending driven economy and most of what we buy is not made here.

True. Once upon a time we were the leading IMPORTER OF RAW MATERIALS and the leading EXPORTER OF FINISHED GOODS. Not any more. We are now the leading IMPORTER OF FINISHED GOODS. This is bad for business. Much worse than "uncertainty".

One of the candidates has emphasized that fact and has introduced ways to promote manufacturing in this country. One of the candidates has a record of shipping jobs overseas. Learn which is which............and you'll have no difficulty in choosing a candidate.

 

[ClosedCaption]

So many of you on the left dont realize there is a difference between playing the blame game for political points and understanding mistakes?

got it

You can't understand something when you say it doesn't matter how it happened.

The thread title is WHO dumbass

You see the who is subjective and also pointless since he cant lead us again. Now stick your head back in the sand.

Sorry about that. Who matters alot when there is only two choices. One is the policies that got us here and the other did not. History and who, when, what matters all the time except when someone is attempting to absolve themselves