Is America A Christian Nation?

[sealybobo]

Christopher Hitchens was a guest on Hardball tonight along with Kenneth Blackwell, from the Family Research Council, to discuss Newsweek's recent cover story titled "The End of Christian America." The story highlighted a poll showing that while 62 percent of Americans considered the U.S. a Christian nation, a staggering 68 percent say religion is losing its influence on American life.

Hitchens debated Blackwell about this, with Hitchens declaring a crisis of faith in the country, one that shows a decisive tide is turning against the forces of religion. Blackwell disputed this, arguing that the influence of religion ebbs and flows but won't ever really fade away because we are fundamentally a Christian nation going all the way to the Founding Fathers. Hitchens vehemently fought back against this notion.

As usual with Hitchens, the debate was heated and interesting. Watch it below.

Christopher Hitchens Debates Kenneth Blackwell About Religious Influence In America (VIDEO)

Christopher Hitchens took Ken Blackwell to school last night. He made the religous right look stupid.

 

[Sky Dancer]

Some Christians like to think America is a Christian nation. America is a plurality. We have no state religion.

 

[xsited1]

It depends on how you define 'Christian Nation'.

 

[Iriemon]

There was just recently a thread on this same subject.

http://www.usmessageboard.com/relig...-us-not-a-christian-nation-2.html#post1139826

I'll refer to the post I made there rather than regurgitate it here.

 

[sealybobo]

Some Christians like to think America is a Christian nation. America is a plurality. We have no state religion.

The more I learn, the more I realize that the GOP is wrong about just about everything. They talk about the founding fathers and the constitution, and really, they don't know what they are talking about.

This guy from England last night took Ken Blackwell to school with his knowledge on this subject. Ken Blackwell was doing the typical Republican thing, talking in broad generalities, and this English guy was using facts to shoot down everything Ken had to say.

For those of you who don't know Ken Blackwell, he's the black guy who was in charge of Ohio during the 2004 election. He gave Bush Ohio's electoral votes before Kerry could ask for a recount.

In other words, he's a neo nut. And it is so obvious that the GOP are trying to stay on their message.

And i think that's great, because all the new young voters don't give a rats ass about abortion, stem cell, gay marriage, etc. So the GOP are going to fall flat on their faces again in the next few elections.

 

[midcan5]

I think religion is failing for some people because it has lost its positive Christian elements, today it is just another show, a business, and its substance and purpose empty. TV Evangelist preachers making lots of money, building huge babels, giving spirited sermons, grows tiring when the world is full of poverty death and despair. How many of these so called Christians do good things for the people of the world I wonder. And I know many do, but religion is irrelevant when money and war are its objects of worship. What happened to spirit? Given the current emphasis on Armageddon should we care and do they?


wrote this long ago
Has Religion become a political party and a business? – Political Pass

 

[HUGGY]

Christopher Hitchens was a guest on Hardball tonight along with Kenneth Blackwell, from the Family Research Council, to discuss Newsweek's recent cover story titled "The End of Christian America." The story highlighted a poll showing that while 62 percent of Americans considered the U.S. a Christian nation, a staggering 68 percent say religion is losing its influence on American life.

Hitchens debated Blackwell about this, with Hitchens declaring a crisis of faith in the country, one that shows a decisive tide is turning against the forces of religion. Blackwell disputed this, arguing that the influence of religion ebbs and flows but won't ever really fade away because we are fundamentally a Christian nation going all the way to the Founding Fathers. Hitchens vehemently fought back against this notion.

As usual with Hitchens, the debate was heated and interesting. Watch it below.

Christopher Hitchens Debates Kenneth Blackwell About Religious Influence In America (VIDEO)

Christopher Hitchens took Ken Blackwell to school last night. He made the religous right look stupid.

Blackwell is a sack of steaming liquid shit for many reasons ..his religious views being the least of it.

 

[Toro]

It depends on how you define 'Christian Nation'.

Exactly.

There may be no official state religion but there is little doubt IMHO that America is a Christian nation to some degree.

 

[Sky Dancer]

I think religion is failing for some people because it has lost its positive Christian elements, today it is just another show, a business, and its substance and purpose empty. TV Evangelist preachers making lots of money, building huge babels, giving spirited sermons, grows tiring when the world is full of poverty death and despair. How many of these so called Christians do good things for the people of the world I wonder. And I know many do, but religion is irrelevant when money and war are its objects of worship. What happened to spirit? Given the current emphasis on Armageddon should we care and do they?


wrote this long ago
Has Religion become a political party and a business? – Political Pass

I think religion fails when the mystical aspects of it go. That has to do with having real Christians whose aim is to be 'Christ-like".

There is nothing wrong with the basic teachings of Christ--Love God (or put another way--love goodness--love the essence nature of awareness) and Love others as Thyself.

Religion has been a poltical football for a long time.

 

[Sky Dancer]

It depends on how you define 'Christian Nation'.

Exactly.

There may be no official state religion but there is little doubt IMHO that America is a Christian nation to some degree.

If that were so, if we were a Christian nation, it would be in the Constitution.
Do some Christians want to dominate America? Sure.

We are not a Christian nation--even if Judeo-Christianity is the predominant faith. We have Muslims, Hindus, Jains, Mormons and all manner of other faiths--including the freedom to not practice any religion.

 

[xsited1]

It depends on how you define 'Christian Nation'.

Exactly.

There may be no official state religion but there is little doubt IMHO that America is a Christian nation to some degree.

I'm with you. The Framers of the Constitution clearly did not want a State religion. However, the majority of the people in the US have always been Christian.

 

[sealybobo]

It depends on how you define 'Christian Nation'.

Exactly.

There may be no official state religion but there is little doubt IMHO that America is a Christian nation to some degree.

They even discussed people like me, and just about everyone else I know. We were born to christian parents, we may go on Xmas and Easter, but really, most of us aren't practicing Christians.

And many of us doubt the story of organized religion.

It is important to note that back in the day, it was us christians vs. the godless commies. Today, we need to realize that our enemies are even more religious than we are. And that's scary, because Bush was too religious IMO, and he isn't anywhere near being as hard core as the radical muslims are.

 

[Sky Dancer]

It depends on how you define 'Christian Nation'.

Exactly.

There may be no official state religion but there is little doubt IMHO that America is a Christian nation to some degree.

I'm with you. The Framers of the Constitution clearly did not want a State religion. However, the majority of the people in the US have always been Christian.

That's irrelevant. We are not a Christian nation. We are a nation that has freedom of religion. The framers of the Constitution were Deists--not Christians.

We have laws in America that protect minorities from the tyranny of the majority.

 

[sealybobo]

It depends on how you define 'Christian Nation'.

Exactly.

There may be no official state religion but there is little doubt IMHO that America is a Christian nation to some degree.

I'm with you. The Framers of the Constitution clearly did not want a State religion. However, the majority of the people in the US have always been Christian.

Doesn't matter that the majority were christians.

One of the key questions is why did George Washington refuse to take communion for most of his adult life? For the serious Christian, such refusal is an act of self-excommunication.

More important, defenders have to explain why George Washington occupied the rank of Grand Master in the Masonic lodge. Each promotion in the Masonic lodge requires taking an anti-Christian oath?

In spite of right-wing Christian attempts to rewrite history to make Jefferson into a Christian, little about his philosophy resembles that of Christianity. Although Jefferson in the Declaration of Independence wrote of the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God, there exists nothing in the Declaration about Christianity.

 

[Toro]

It depends on how you define 'Christian Nation'.

Exactly.

There may be no official state religion but there is little doubt IMHO that America is a Christian nation to some degree.

If that were so, if we were a Christian nation, it would be in the Constitution.
Do some Christians want to dominate America? Sure.

We are not a Christian nation--even if Judeo-Christianity is the predominant faith. We have Muslims, Hindus, Jains, Mormons and all manner of other faiths--including the freedom to not practice any religion.

America is not defined solely by the constitution. The freedom to practice any religion has always been one of the great hallmarks of America. However, most Americans are Christians. We organize our calendar around Christianity - Friday is a holiday for example and Sunday is a day off for most people. Even if America officially recognizes no religion, it does not invalidate the fact that Christianity is deeply interwoven into the culture of American daily life.

 

[Sky Dancer]

Exactly.

There may be no official state religion but there is little doubt IMHO that America is a Christian nation to some degree.

If that were so, if we were a Christian nation, it would be in the Constitution.
Do some Christians want to dominate America? Sure.

We are not a Christian nation--even if Judeo-Christianity is the predominant faith. We have Muslims, Hindus, Jains, Mormons and all manner of other faiths--including the freedom to not practice any religion.

America is not defined solely by the constitution. The freedom to practice any religion has always been one of the great hallmarks of America. However, most Americans are Christians. We organize our calendar around Christianity - Friday is a holiday for example and Sunday is a day off for most people. Even if America officially recognizes no religion, it does not invalidate the fact that Christianity is deeply interwoven into the culture of American daily life.

WE ARE NOT A CHRISTIAN NATION. We a plurality. That's the whole point of America. Religious freedom. It doesn't mean because there happens to be a numbers majority of one faith that the majority gets to shove itself into everyone elses faith.

 

[sealybobo]

Exactly.

There may be no official state religion but there is little doubt IMHO that America is a Christian nation to some degree.

If that were so, if we were a Christian nation, it would be in the Constitution.
Do some Christians want to dominate America? Sure.

We are not a Christian nation--even if Judeo-Christianity is the predominant faith. We have Muslims, Hindus, Jains, Mormons and all manner of other faiths--including the freedom to not practice any religion.

America is not defined solely by the constitution. The freedom to practice any religion has always been one of the great hallmarks of America. However, most Americans are Christians. We organize our calendar around Christianity - Friday is a holiday for example and Sunday is a day off for most people. Even if America officially recognizes no religion, it does not invalidate the fact that Christianity is deeply interwoven into the culture of American daily life.

Well more and more of us are leaving the Christian faith and at the same time, more and more muslims are moving in.

Your only hope is that the hispanics continue converting to Catholocism.

And you can't wish for a lot of them to come over, because they vote Democratic.

 

[Toro]

WE ARE NOT A CHRISTIAN NATION. We a plurality.

America is not officially a religious state. Very few nations in the world are. All religions are tolerated in America - even the crazy ones. However, most Americans are Christian and we organize our society around Christianity. For all intents and purposes, we are a Christian nation.

 

[Indiana Oracle]

Hitchens is a convinced aetheist and Blackwell is not in the same league as a debater.

Frankly, I don't care what Hitchens or anyone else thinks of religion. But one thing is clear, there is no reason to question something unless there is motivation to end or replace it.

We can argue here as to whether America is a Christian nation. The arguement is meaningless. Christianity in America will not be unseated and either will their tolerance for others of different or no faith.

 

[AllieBaba]

It depends on how you define 'Christian Nation'.

Exactly.

There may be no official state religion but there is little doubt IMHO that America is a Christian nation to some degree.

If that were so, if we were a Christian nation, it would be in the Constitution.
Do some Christians want to dominate America? Sure.

We are not a Christian nation--even if Judeo-Christianity is the predominant faith. We have Muslims, Hindus, Jains, Mormons and all manner of other faiths--including the freedom to not practice any religion.

And we are a Christian nation because we built this nation on Christian precepts. That all men are created equal BY GOD. It's not because some weird Buddhist sect out of nowhere created the greatest country ever to exist on the planet, and those damn Christians are trying to take credit for it. This country was based on Christian values. The Constitution provides us freedom to practice our religion, whatever it may be, INCLUDING Christianity, with no fear of reprisal, censorship, or restriction on political aspiration.

"As Jefferson so succinctly stated, “Can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that their liberties are a gift of God?”
God, the Constitution, and presidential hopefuls at Firm Foundation

"Amendment 1 - Freedom of Religion, Press, Expression. Ratified 12/15/1791. Note

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

The United States Constitution - The U.S. Constitution Online - USConstitution.net

But before the constititution was the declaration of independence, in which we ESTABLISH the Christian nature of our nation.

And I find it tiresome that every week I have to re-educate ignoramuses that if it weren't for CHRISTIANS there would be no freedom of religion in this country. The BAPTISTS convinced Jefferson and others that it was absolutely necessary to separate church and state, because only by doing so could we be guaranteed that CHRISTIANS would not be persecuted and discriminated against. Luckily for the Buddhists and Muslims and Hindus who have since sought refuge here, those rules apply across the line.

Which they certainly wouldn't if it had been Muslims or Hindus or even Catholics responsible for the inclusion of freedom of religion.
"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed BY THEIR CREATOR with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are LIFE, LIBERTY AND THE PURSUIT OF HAPPINESS." Those sentiments come straight from the Bible, and the creator being referred to is the Christian God.

"We, therefore, the Representatives of the united States of America, in General Congress, Assembled, appealing to the SUPREME JUDGE of the world for the rectitude of our intentions...."

So no, we don't "want" to become a Christian nation. We were created a Christian nation, we have always been a Christian nation, but we provided the oppressed and chagrined the privilege of being able to practice their own religion....so we could continue to practice our own.

And all we get is shit on because of it. You can thank Baptists and a Christian nation for your "right" to be a lesbo Buddhist, Sky, you fucking idiot.