Zone1 If Morality Doesn't Come From God Then Where Does It Come From?

[ChristisKing]

and you could not answer

I was the one asking you the question.

First of all, government isn't society and doesn't define morality. Second, it's certainly possible for a society to adopt bad morals - rules that don't actually promote to their success. The proof is in the pudding. If a government legalized murder and theft, I suspect that country wouldn't last long. What do you think?

Why don't you think that we wouldn't last long as a country if everybody was just taking whatever they felt like and murdering anybody they didn't like. Who decides that that's wrong and that those are bad morals?

Does their existence demand a creator?

Do buildings build themselves? Sorry about that blank space down there btw, I don't know how to get rid of it.

No.

If the Bible gives instructions on owning slaves, does slavery become moral?

Now you're getting it, but God was against slavery from the beginning though. That's why He sent Moses to free the slaves.

No, of course not.

But what is legal and what is moral aren't always the same thing.

It was illegal at one time to help slaves escape from bondage, but it was the moral thing to do.

I personally think getting drunk out of your mind is immoral, you are doing harm to yourself and those who care about you.

But I would hardly want to bring back prohibition.

So you just make up in your own mind what's moral then got it.

 

[Carl in Michigan]

Right, so they're just making things up.

"Everyone did that which SEEMS RIGHT IN THEIR OWN EYES"

 

[shockedcanadian]

Then immorality also comes from God.

Naughty God.

No. Immorality comes primarily from instincts or the reptilian brain.

 

[Dante]

Makes sense. Did you get a diploma?

What did Trump promise?

 

[Blisterfinger]

Yeah, but why? Where does their immorality come from then if it isn't being rebellious to the ten commandments?

I agree that morality comes from God. What's crazy is when people use God as an excuse to be immoral. Human nature can be very confusing.

 

[ChristisKing]

I agree that morality comes from God. What's crazy is when people use God as an excuse to be immoral.

Huh?

 

[Dante]

No. Immorality comes primarily from instincts or the reptilian brain.

Please, even an AI search result shows how ignorant you are on this:

The concept of a "reptilian brain" is a scientifically discredited myth from Paul MacLean's triune brain theory, which proposed humans have three distinct brain layers. While a brain region historically called the basal ganglia handles some ancient functions, such as motor control and basic instincts, it's not a distinct, separate "reptile brain" in humans but rather a set of complex, analogous structures shared with other vertebrates
and btw, "instincts?"
from Dante's neurobiology collection

The neurobiology of moral sense: facts or hypotheses? - PMC

One of the most intriguing frontiers of current neuroscientific research is represented by the investigation of the possible neural substrates of morality. The assumption is that in humans an innate moral sense would exist. If this is true, with no ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

The Neurobiology of Moral Behavior: Review and Neuropsychiatric Implications - PMC

Morality may be innate to the human brain. This review examines the neurobiological evidence from research involving functional magnetic resonance imaging of normal subjects, developmental sociopathy, acquired sociopathy from brain lesions, and ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

You may even want to take a stroll down AI Alley

Human morality is a complex interplay of instincts, emotions, and higher-level reasoning, grounded in a neuromoral network in the brain. Instincts like harm aversion and prosocial behaviors appear innate, forming a foundation for moral sense. Brain regions like the ventromedial prefrontal cortex (VMPFC) are central to mediating emotional aspects of morality, while the dorsolateral prefrontal cortex (DLPFC) is involved in more rational, utilitarian judgments. This "moral brain" integrates signals from emotional centers with higher cognitive functions to guide social behavior and judgmen

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

No. Immorality comes primarily from instincts or the reptilian brain.

False, obviously. The hind brain cannot handle abstract concepts. Only stimulus response and control of autonomous functiosn.

So clearly that's wrong.

No, what one calls immorality, another calls morality. Ask 1,000,000 peope for a list of morals, and you will get 1,000,000 different lists.

So your morals come from god, but those of the 999,999 others dont?

Seems pretty absurd.

 

[Dante]

I was the one asking you the question.

Which question exactly? Do you even remember?

I'll help you: "Then where did all life come from?"

I fist asked you

God? wtf is "God?" Should we ask the Incas?

and you got lost

 

[dblack]

Why don't you think that we wouldn't last long as a country if everybody was just taking whatever they felt like and murdering anybody they didn't like?

Seriously?... call it a hunch. Do you think a society would thrive if everyone did that? I think it would fall into chaos and fail spectacularly.

Who decides that that's wrong and that those are bad morals?

Reality. Good morals will promote the success of the society that adopts them. Bad morals won't.

I think you might understand my position better if you tried to see it from my perspective. I'm not a Christian and I don't believe in gods. So, in my view, the morals expressed in bible are already stuff people "just made up". That doesn't mean those morals are bad. Our culture was (mostly) built on them, and we've done pretty well. But other societies have come up with different morals, from different sources, with varying degrees of success.

 

[ChristisKing]

No. Immorality comes primarily from instincts or the reptilian brain.

You're saying that insects and reptiles are moral? How do they know what's moral and immoral?

God? wtf is "God?" Should we ask the Incas?

No, you should get a copy.

Seriously?... call it a hunch. Do you think a society would thrive if everyone did that? I think it would fall into chaos and fail spectacularly.

Reality. Good morals will promote the success of the society that adopts them. Bad morals won't.

How does this answer either of my questions?

 

[dblack]

How does this answer either of my questions?

You seem to be blocked. Morals are judged by history. Societies with good morals thrive, societies with bad morals fail. I can't really make it more clear than that.

 

[Dante]

No, you should get a copy.

View attachment 1170878



How does this answer either of my questions?

I like what Joseph Campbell once said: "I don’t see any conflict between religion and science...the conflict is between the science of 2000 B.C. and 2000 A.D."

 

[ChristisKing]

You seem to be blocked. Morals are judged by history. Societies with good morals thrive, societies with bad morals fail. I can't really make it more clear than that.

You still haven't told me how they decide that.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

You still haven't told me how they decide that.

The exchange of ideas, informed by facts. Often times, new facts.

 

[ChristisKing]

The exchange of ideas, informed by facts. Often times, new facts.

Facts such as?

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Facts such as?

This is a discussion, not an interrogation.

You can come up with some on your own, I think.

Try it. Come up with two.

As a show of good faith.

 

[ChristisKing]

This is a discussion, not an interrogation.

You can come up with some on your own, I think.

Try it. Come up with two.

As a show of good faith.

So in other words you're running.

 

[shockedcanadian]

False, obviously. The hind brain cannot handle abstract concepts. Only stimulus response and control of autonomous functiosn.

So clearly that's wrong.

No, what one calls immorality, another calls morality. Ask 1,000,000 peope for a list of morals, and you will get 1,000,000 different lists.

So your morals come from god, but those of the 999,999 others dont?

Seems pretty absurd.

If 1M provided a list, you'd find many of the same concepts such as "do not kill", "do not steal", "do not lie" etc.

Now, yes, morality is an objective question, but there will be similar patterns. Of these patterns many of the sources of these moral items will arise over their lifetimes from the bible.

They might not be able to cite history of the source since they will have over their lifetimes ingrained it into their being but it will have been handed down over many generations.

However, the many, perhaps even the majority of these morals will have come from the same biblical source.

 

[Blisterfinger]

Huh?

Happens a lot in in the Old Testament where God tells the Israelites to kill all the people and enslave the women. Still common practice today with Islam.