gop chance of beating obama in 2012?

[blu]

First off, I would love to see obama replaced by almost anyone, the biggest exclusion to that being hillary clinton. With that said, if conservatives don't band behind someone, no matter how bad obama does he is going to get a second term.

The problem I see is that the party is totally split. You have the palin supporters who are socially conservative and make up foreign policy as they go along. Then you have the romney guy who wants to double guantanmo, but allows socialized medicine while governor. You then have the ron paul supporters (myself included) who are against basically everything the government does now making the chance of him winning slim. The best compromise I can see is palin getting the nod, and winning over a decent number of romney and paul supporters.

Both romney and paul are too polarizing by themselves and even a compromise at the VP spot isn't going to sway people past whoever is going to be president. The problem with palin is that I don't see her lasting unscripted debates + getting past the general hatred of her by a large segment of the population.

Are there some other people I am missing that could actual unite the conservatives or will the country be split into some odd combination of three parties - democrats, social conservatives, and libertarians? Maybe the GOP is working on this and I missed it?

 

[xsited1]

I'm still hoping for a viable 3rd Party, but I doubt they'll get any Electoral votes. The GOP can spend their money on weed for all I care.

 

[PeterS]

First off, I would love to see obama replaced by almost anyone, the biggest exclusion to that being hillary clinton. With that said, if conservatives don't band behind someone, no matter how bad obama does he is going to get a second term.

The problem I see is that the party is totally split. You have the palin supporters who are socially conservative and make up foreign policy as they go along. Then you have the romney guy who wants to double guantanmo, but allows socialized medicine while governor. You then have the ron paul supporters (myself included) who are against basically everything the government does now making the chance of him winning slim. The best compromise I can see is palin getting the nod, and winning over a decent number of romney and paul supporters.

Both romney and paul are too polarizing by themselves and even a compromise at the VP spot isn't going to sway people past whoever is going to be president. The problem with palin is that I don't see her lasting unscripted debates + getting past the general hatred of her by a large segment of the population.

Are there some other people I am missing that could actual unite the conservatives or will the country be split into some odd combination of three parties - democrats, social conservatives, and libertarians? Maybe the GOP is working on this and I missed it?

Who ever is going to win has to attract the majority of the middle. Conservatives are already united in their hatred if Obama so uniting conservatives will not be a problem. Palin is an air head and won't get you the middle. Romney may be your best choice. Conservatives just need to figure out which is more important: your principles or defeating Obama?

 

[PeterS]

I'm still hoping for a viable 3rd Party, but I doubt they'll get any Electoral votes. The GOP can spend their money on weed for all I care.

If you can't get any electoral votes then you don't have a viable third party.

 

[frazzledgear]

First off, I would love to see obama replaced by almost anyone, the biggest exclusion to that being hillary clinton. With that said, if conservatives don't band behind someone, no matter how bad obama does he is going to get a second term.

The problem I see is that the party is totally split. You have the palin supporters who are socially conservative and make up foreign policy as they go along. Then you have the romney guy who wants to double guantanmo, but allows socialized medicine while governor. You then have the ron paul supporters (myself included) who are against basically everything the government does now making the chance of him winning slim. The best compromise I can see is palin getting the nod, and winning over a decent number of romney and paul supporters.

Both romney and paul are too polarizing by themselves and even a compromise at the VP spot isn't going to sway people past whoever is going to be president. The problem with palin is that I don't see her lasting unscripted debates + getting past the general hatred of her by a large segment of the population.

Are there some other people I am missing that could actual unite the conservatives or will the country be split into some odd combination of three parties - democrats, social conservatives, and libertarians? Maybe the GOP is working on this and I missed it?

There is no real urgency to find someone at this stage or for the wailing that unless they find someone right now to get behind for 2012 it will all be lost. Plenty of examples in past elections where that person wasn't found until primaries were well underway even - and ended up being someone previously unknown to most in the country until that point where they really started to stand out. And this has been true in several past elections for both Democrats and Republicans.

I'm not even looking for that person right now because I suspect I haven't even seen much of that person yet to know he/she is the one. I just know who it will NOT be and the people I will never get behind no matter what. And that list is getting longer every day. Which at least will help narrow it down when I suspect I have found the candidate I am willing to consider getting behind.

Truthfully I am so angry and only getting angrier with government that I would have no problem with the idea of throwing all career politicians from both parties out of the job and let them go try and find a real job for a change. They have had their shot at this country for WAY too many years now - and have put the feet of this country on the firm path to bankruptcy. Time for an entirely fresh crew who are not more concerned about how to hang on to their job and expand their power and control rather than focus on what is best for this nation.

Anyone who is a lawyer already has a major strike against them in my book and that strike is becoming more important all the time. I despise lawyers in government and it does NOT require a law degree to serve in government! That is certainly what the arrogant and self-serving lawyers have spent years trying to convince voters of though -although our founders believed we would all be best served by having people from all walks of life serving in office. And most importantly -RETURNING TO PRIVATE LIFE and NOT remain permanently in office. Lawyers are THE most over represented occupation in government by far but among the most useless IN government while puffing themselves up and holding themselves out as indispensable to the running of this country. Lawyers are the only people with the sheer arrogance to believe that a law degree means they can do ANY job better than those with the education, training and skill who ARE doing it. Which is why a pack of lawyers think they can our health care system better than those for whom it is their career. Nothing but a pack of arrogant bastards -they are THE most destructive to our Constitution, the government's environment and the fabric of society itself because their single greatest talent lies with dicking around in other people's lives making it more difficult for people to be left alone to live their lives. Kind of like the damage an over population of beavers are known to do to a pristine, free flowing stream and all the species that depend upon it remaining so.

 

[xsited1]

I'm still hoping for a viable 3rd Party, but I doubt they'll get any Electoral votes. The GOP can spend their money on weed for all I care.

If you can't get any electoral votes then you don't have a viable third party.

And therein lies the problem with our two-party monopoly (duopoloy). Ross Perot got nearly 19% of the popular vote in 1992 and not one member of the Electoral College voted for him. Our system is obviously rigged in favor of the two-parties. I seriously doubt it will ever stop, but I'll continue to vote 3rd party nonetheless.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

Hopefully a majority of us Ron Paul supporters will stick with our principles and not be won over by either Romney, Palin, or any other statists on the off chance that they'll be able to beat Obama. If the Republican Party fails us again then I suggest we support the Libertarian Party, the Constitution Party, or write in Ron Paul.

 

[blu]

First off, I would love to see obama replaced by almost anyone, the biggest exclusion to that being hillary clinton. With that said, if conservatives don't band behind someone, no matter how bad obama does he is going to get a second term.

The problem I see is that the party is totally split. You have the palin supporters who are socially conservative and make up foreign policy as they go along. Then you have the romney guy who wants to double guantanmo, but allows socialized medicine while governor. You then have the ron paul supporters (myself included) who are against basically everything the government does now making the chance of him winning slim. The best compromise I can see is palin getting the nod, and winning over a decent number of romney and paul supporters.

Both romney and paul are too polarizing by themselves and even a compromise at the VP spot isn't going to sway people past whoever is going to be president. The problem with palin is that I don't see her lasting unscripted debates + getting past the general hatred of her by a large segment of the population.

Are there some other people I am missing that could actual unite the conservatives or will the country be split into some odd combination of three parties - democrats, social conservatives, and libertarians? Maybe the GOP is working on this and I missed it?

There is no real urgency to find someone at this stage or for the wailing that unless they find someone right now to get behind for 2012 it will all be lost. Plenty of examples in past elections where that person wasn't found until primaries were well underway even - and ended up being someone previously unknown to most in the country until that point where they really started to stand out. And this has been true in several past elections for both Democrats and Republicans.

I'm not even looking for that person right now because I suspect I haven't even seen much of that person yet to know he/she is the one. I just know who it will NOT be and the people I will never get behind no matter what. And that list is getting longer every day. Which at least will help narrow it down when I suspect I have found the candidate I am willing to consider getting behind.

Truthfully I am so angry and only getting angrier with government that I would have no problem with the idea of throwing all career politicians from both parties out of the job and let them go try and find a real job for a change. They have had their shot at this country for WAY too many years now - and have put the feet of this country on the firm path to bankruptcy. Time for an entirely fresh crew who are not more concerned about how to hang on to their job and expand their power and control rather than focus on what is best for this nation.

Anyone who is a lawyer already has a major strike against them in my book and that strike is becoming more important all the time. I despise lawyers in government and it does NOT require a law degree to serve in government! That is certainly what the arrogant and self-serving lawyers have spent years trying to convince voters of though -although our founders believed we would all be best served by having people from all walks of life serving in office. And most importantly -RETURNING TO PRIVATE LIFE and NOT remain permanently in office. Lawyers are THE most over represented occupation in government by far but among the most useless IN government while puffing themselves up and holding themselves out as indispensable to the running of this country. Lawyers are the only people with the sheer arrogance to believe that a law degree means they can do ANY job better than those with the education, training and skill who ARE doing it. Which is why a pack of lawyers think they can our health care system better than those for whom it is their career. Nothing but a pack of arrogant bastards -they are THE most destructive to our Constitution, the government's environment and the fabric of society itself because their single greatest talent lies with dicking around in other people's lives making it more difficult for people to be left alone to live their lives. Kind of like the damage an over population of beavers are known to do to a pristine, free flowing stream and all the species that depend upon it remaining so.

great post. I appreciate economists much more (schiff especially) than lawyers, especially with the situations we are in now. I don't think all incumbents are bad, but a good majority of them need to go and I am starting to agree more and more with the idea of term limits. I don't know if I could be persuaded to vote for anyone but Paul (maybe johnson), but if they had a strong voting record it could be enough to swing me. I am very wary of people trying to steal ron paul supporters like the liberal gop did by jumping into the tea party protests even though the GOP was one of the main targets of the original tea parties. I also like people such as schiff b/c his background is running a real business in the real private market someting is greatly lacking with the curren administration.

 

[blu]

Hopefully a majority of us Ron Paul supporters will stick with our principles and not be won over by either Romney, Palin, or any other statists on the off chance that they'll be able to beat Obama. If the Republican Party fails us again then I suggest we support the Libertarian Party, the Constitution Party, or write in Ron Paul.

I am a pretty sure I could never vote for palin or romney (he loves big miltiary and social programs for everything under the sun). I just don't think the religous freaks and warhawks still in control of the GOP are going to give him a very fair chance.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

Hopefully a majority of us Ron Paul supporters will stick with our principles and not be won over by either Romney, Palin, or any other statists on the off chance that they'll be able to beat Obama. If the Republican Party fails us again then I suggest we support the Libertarian Party, the Constitution Party, or write in Ron Paul.

I am a pretty sure I could never vote for palin or romney (he loves big miltiary and social programs for everything under the sun). I just don't think the religous freaks and warhawks still in control of the GOP are going to give him a very fair chance.

Well his stock has only risen since the primaries and the election, so I'm guessing he'd do better a second time around. I doubt he'd win, of course, but he'd certainly have my vote. Whether the Republican Party accepts him or once again denounces him would be interesting to see, however. Though I'm of the opinion that they would once again brand him a kook, and that's why no Ron Paul supporter should sacrifice their principles just to vote against the Democratic Party. If we're "kooks" in their opinion then why should we help them against the Democrats, especially when they're just as bad.

 

[Missourian]

I am unimpressed with any of the top picks.

I with Frazzled, still looking.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

I am unimpressed with any of the top picks.

I with Frazzled, still looking.

Have you looked into former New Mexico Governor Gary Johnson? There's speculation that he may run in 2012.

 

[sealybobo]

Obama is going to win a second term no question about it. And he'll have a positive impact on:

a. Healthcare
b. Unemployment
c. Wages
d. Wallstreet
e. NAFTA
f. global warming
g. illegal employer problem
h. wars
i. rich not paying their fair share of taxes with offshore havens and unfair tax breaks passed by the GOP in 2002. Hell, don't just roll back the Bush tax breaks, roll back the Reagan ones too.

j. Our relationship with Russia and China and the rest of the world
k. housing
l. regulations
m. banks

 

[xsited1]

Hopefully a majority of us Ron Paul supporters will stick with our principles and not be won over by either Romney, Palin, or any other statists on the off chance that they'll be able to beat Obama. If the Republican Party fails us again then I suggest we support the Libertarian Party, the Constitution Party, or write in Ron Paul.

The Republican Party has already lost my vote. I seriously doubt they'll change in the future.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

Hopefully a majority of us Ron Paul supporters will stick with our principles and not be won over by either Romney, Palin, or any other statists on the off chance that they'll be able to beat Obama. If the Republican Party fails us again then I suggest we support the Libertarian Party, the Constitution Party, or write in Ron Paul.

The Republican Party has already lost my vote. I seriously doubt they'll change in the future.

I agree, but I'll have no problem voting for Ron Paul once again in the Republican primary or Gary Johnson.

 

[Missourian]

I am unimpressed with any of the top picks.

I with Frazzled, still looking.

Have you looked into former New Mexico Governor Gary Johnson? There's speculation that he may run in 2012.

No I hadn't Kevin, thanks for mentioning him.

After just a quick look at Wikipedia, he definitely has potential.

A especially liked this part:

Under Johnson's administration, New Mexico experienced the longest period without a tax increase in the state's history, the rate of growth in the state government was cut in half, half of the state's prisons were privatized, state Medicaid was shifted to managed care, and the state was left with approximately 1,000 fewer employees (with no firings) and a budget surplus. Johnson vetoed 750 bills (which was more than all the vetoes of the other 49 Governors in the country at that time, combined), which earned him the nickname Gary "Veto" Johnson.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_E._Johnson#cite_note-race42008.com-5


To this day, Johnson carries with him his "Seven Principles of Good Government":

1. Become reality driven. Don’t kid yourself or others. Find out what’s what and base your decisions and actions on that.


2. Always be honest and tell the truth. It’s extremely difficult to do any damage to anybody when you are willing to tell the truth–regardless of the consequences.


3. Always do what’s right and fair. Remember, the more you actually accomplish, the louder your critics become. You’ve got to learn to ignore your critics. You’ve got to continue to do what you think is right. You’ve got to maintain your integrity.


4. Determine your goal, develop a plan to reach that goal, and then act. Don’t procrastinate.


5. Make sure everybody who ought to know what you’re doing knows what you’re doing. Communicate.


6. Don’t hesitate to deliver bad news. There is always time to salvage things. There is always time to fix things. Henry Kissinger said that anything that can be revealed eventually should be revealed immediately.


7. Last, be willing to do whatever it takes to get your job done. If you’ve got a job that you don’t love enough to do what it takes to get your job done, then quit and get one that you do love, and then make a difference.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_E._Johnson#cite_note-race42008.com-5
​

Gary E. Johnson - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

​

 

[sealybobo]

Obama is going to win a second term no question about it. And he'll have a positive impact on:

a. Healthcare
b. Unemployment
c. Wages
d. Wallstreet
e. NAFTA
f. global warming
g. illegal employer problem
h. wars
i. rich not paying their fair share of taxes with offshore havens and unfair tax breaks passed by the GOP in 2002. Hell, don't just roll back the Bush tax breaks, roll back the Reagan ones too.

j. Our relationship with Russia and China and the rest of the world
k. housing
l. regulations
m. banks

And all of these problems, the GOP created. How we gonna put them back in charge when they created all these negatives? They started the wars, created the economy, hire illegals, excellerated trade deficits, put us in debt, gave the rich the tax breaks, helped companies and the rich hide their money overseas, are in favor of lower wages, deregulated and helped wallstreet loot us and allowed corporations to pollute.

 

[Toronado3800]

Conservatives are already united in their hatred if Obama so uniting conservatives will not be a problem.

The word "Conservative" and a need to collect votes from one issue voters have created the split in the Republican Party. The party has an interesting mix of Constitutional Conservatives all for limiting the power of the government, and Religious Conservatives (John Ashcroft, the Moral Minority & the abortion folks) all for using the power of big government to impose their moral views. Throw in the big Security Agency/Military ignore Constitutional rights folks and these contradictions in bumper sticker ideology weaken the brand name/message.

 

[frazzledgear]

I'm still hoping for a viable 3rd Party, but I doubt they'll get any Electoral votes. The GOP can spend their money on weed for all I care.

If you can't get any electoral votes then you don't have a viable third party.

And therein lies the problem with our two-party monopoly (duopoloy). Ross Perot got nearly 19% of the popular vote in 1992 and not one member of the Electoral College voted for him. Our system is obviously rigged in favor of the two-parties. I seriously doubt it will ever stop, but I'll continue to vote 3rd party nonetheless.

For the first time in my life I am willing to give serious consideration to voting for a third party candidate for President -depending on that candidate and his/her positions I consider of most importance of course. I'd like to see the formation of a new, strong third party even if it still initially lacks the same level of support the other two have. After all, the Republican Party was once that third party in this country - proving a third party CAN drive one of the two major parties into extinction. Where frankly I think both of them belong anyway.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

I am unimpressed with any of the top picks.

I with Frazzled, still looking.

Have you looked into former New Mexico Governor Gary Johnson? There's speculation that he may run in 2012.

No I hadn't Kevin, thanks for mentioning him.

After just a quick look at Wikipedia, he definitely has potential.

A especially liked this part:

Under Johnson's administration, New Mexico experienced the longest period without a tax increase in the state's history, the rate of growth in the state government was cut in half, half of the state's prisons were privatized, state Medicaid was shifted to managed care, and the state was left with approximately 1,000 fewer employees (with no firings) and a budget surplus. Johnson vetoed 750 bills (which was more than all the vetoes of the other 49 Governors in the country at that time, combined), which earned him the nickname Gary "Veto" Johnson.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_E._Johnson#cite_note-race42008.com-5


To this day, Johnson carries with him his "Seven Principles of Good Government":

1. Become reality driven. Don’t kid yourself or others. Find out what’s what and base your decisions and actions on that.


2. Always be honest and tell the truth. It’s extremely difficult to do any damage to anybody when you are willing to tell the truth–regardless of the consequences.


3. Always do what’s right and fair. Remember, the more you actually accomplish, the louder your critics become. You’ve got to learn to ignore your critics. You’ve got to continue to do what you think is right. You’ve got to maintain your integrity.


4. Determine your goal, develop a plan to reach that goal, and then act. Don’t procrastinate.


5. Make sure everybody who ought to know what you’re doing knows what you’re doing. Communicate.


6. Don’t hesitate to deliver bad news. There is always time to salvage things. There is always time to fix things. Henry Kissinger said that anything that can be revealed eventually should be revealed immediately.


7. Last, be willing to do whatever it takes to get your job done. If you’ve got a job that you don’t love enough to do what it takes to get your job done, then quit and get one that you do love, and then make a difference.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_E._Johnson#cite_note-race42008.com-5
​

Gary E. Johnson - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

​

We need someone like Gary "Veto" Johnson in the White House, someone not afraid to use the power of the veto. And I think he's releasing a book later this year or next year called "The Seven Principles of Good Government."