Facts About Judaism

[ding]

Shulchan Aruch For Bnei Noach Set To Be Published

The “Shulchan Aruch” is a halachic rulebook which contains all the daily routines, and also the practices for holidays and the life cycle. What is permitted and what is forbidden? This book will be a collection of halacha specifically for Noahides.

The “Shulchan Aruch” will be written by the Director of Brit Olam – Noahide World Center – Rav Oury Cherki. a result of many years of mutual efforts with many Noahides. It is being written with the advice and guidance of a forum of rabbis who are experts in the subject of Bnei Noach and the universal message of Judaism.

Shulchan Aruch For Bnei Noach Set To Be Published

The Brit Olam organization is in contact with thousands of Bnei Noach who seek spiritual and halachic guidance.

www.jewishpress.com

You provided an interesting link. What I liked the most is mentioning of the commandment not to murder in regard with prohibition to embarrass someone in public.

Of course, embarrassment of a fellow is considered murder.

And it's multifaceted, aside from what seems today as apparent moral digression,
as much as with murder today, there's a physiological explanation to why embarrassment is considered murder as well, but it doesn't end there as well.

There's a method to Jewish law, and the Rabbinic argumentation is infinitely complex and meticulous , way beyond what can possibly expanded in such a forum.

Only to start grasping the initial thread of a single debate on a single subject on one page of the Gmara, which can be centered at a single phrase or even word of the law, on its initial literal level- can take at best several months (and I'm being large here), even that is virtually impossible without prior grasp of some minimal basis.

But that's if I'm being large here, in reality, if after 3-4 months You grasp 20% that's a significant intellectual achievement. And a person will know this on his own, once that's starts rolling, the feeling of growing up to a rigorous intellectual challenge, as it's commonly expressed - 'it starts tasting like honey'.

Anyway, as already said this is not the platform capable enough of containing such a detailed discourse in the correct way, and I'm certainly not the one fit to take the position.

But to go back to what You've previously pointed out, I'll conclude with another simple example- there're many kinds of theft, as with murder explained above, some are not as obvious initially, namely - there's whats called 'theft of mind' as well, which I think fits more for the example You've previously given.

Hope I didn't confuse it, or made it overly complicated.
We can always take back, and expand as we proceed with the conversation.

Thanks for your input. Frankly, my knowledge is too low for meaningful conversations, to say nothing about discussions. I tried several times to read the Bible (both OT and NT), but have never managed to get it through completely.

Though, during this period significant shift in my mind happened. I no longer consider Judaism as primitive and purely tribal religion compared with Christianity. The contrary is true, it seems.

I am not a religious person. And I think that never will be. There are some aspects of religious life I can't accept (they are common to all religions). Though, it should be interesting to read the book mentioned when it appears. And follow the rules it provides which get along with my feelings and mind.

I am fascinated. What led you to believe that Judaism is primitive
and tribal?

Primitive? No

Tribal? 100%. That’s understandable until they put the tribe above G-d.

What do you mean by 'tribal'?

By the way, it's G-d who prescribes, with exception of 3 conditions,
that the life of a single member of His tribe takes precedent over His entire Torah.

Cliquish.

it’s the conditions.

Too much contempt clouds your ability to form thoughts
that go beyond shallow infantile projection.

But I'll answer anyway - the 3 exceptional conditions are:

1. Sexual immorality
2. Idol worship
3. Murder

Not specifically in that order.
G-d gave Torah to Israel, to live in it, not otherwise.

Except for the above, value of life takes precedent over any Torah law.

I have no contempt but I agree that contempt is one of the things that can cloud objectivity just as unplaced loyalty to a tribal member can cloud objectivity which is what I was referring to in my prior post.

Man’s original sin was worshipping created things instead of the creator. It’s a little more than gold calf’s.

That has nothing to do with a tribe.
Rather a natural human trait, or for that matter of living creatures.

I'm not going to discus the subject of sin,
with a person who thinks G-d of Israel was "born".

It's just not of potential depth, let alone intellectually interesting.

I'm sorry, but move on.

Being looked down upon by Jews for my religious beliefs isn’t anything new. But it is still surprising and ironic each time it happens.

I am fascinated. Can you describe some incident in your life which
involved "Being looked down upon by Jews for...{your} religious
beliefs......" ??? Did it happen in school, on the 'playground' -----
in the street?

No. I never had any contact with Jews until I joined USMB. So imagine my surprise.

Well, you do seem to be especially drawn
to every thread that has to do with Judaism.

What's the motivation?

To understand your beliefs about God. For instance, it has been argued on these boards that the G-d of Abraham is cruel. I have argued that’s not how the Jews of the OT saw it. Unfortunately I have yet to find a Jew who is willing to discuss anything on this subject.

Already explained that.

I don't have "beliefs" about G-d.
The commandment is not to believe, rather to know G-d.,

Maybe if you actually read the answers returned, people had interest in interaction.

Nice dodge. I didn’t think you could discuss it, but your pride wouldn’t allow you to say so.

I can answer it in probably 25 words or less. In my own words. Not a video link to a rabbi who never really answers it either.

You see, you just keep talking in an echo chamber,
ignoring anything people answer.

What do you need me for?
Sure not for conversation.

dingbat------rylah offered you an important insight into the ethos
of Judaism ------the RELIGION is not based on "FAITH" ------it is based on KNOWLEDGE. Christianity does emphasize FAITH as
THE IDEAL

So I have to disagree on that. If you read the catechism you will discover that we believe that God can be known through reason by studying what he has created. That’s sounds strangely like knowledge to me.

Yes, there are aspects of our beliefs which rely on faith. Specifically the nature of God. Although we can ascertain certain attributes of God through reason and studying his creation. Additionally, the power of faith is what manifests activating God’s spirit inside us and is a very powerful tool.

So while I rely on knowledge to inform my faith, I would never scoff at someone else’s faith because I have first hand experience of the power that faith holds. Not to mention how rude it would be to mock the faith of another for no other reason than their perception of the creator was different than mine.

I don’t wish to find myself on judgement day being asked why I interfered with his work.

 

[ding]

Shulchan Aruch For Bnei Noach Set To Be Published

The “Shulchan Aruch” is a halachic rulebook which contains all the daily routines, and also the practices for holidays and the life cycle. What is permitted and what is forbidden? This book will be a collection of halacha specifically for Noahides.

The “Shulchan Aruch” will be written by the Director of Brit Olam – Noahide World Center – Rav Oury Cherki. a result of many years of mutual efforts with many Noahides. It is being written with the advice and guidance of a forum of rabbis who are experts in the subject of Bnei Noach and the universal message of Judaism.

Shulchan Aruch For Bnei Noach Set To Be Published

The Brit Olam organization is in contact with thousands of Bnei Noach who seek spiritual and halachic guidance.

www.jewishpress.com

You provided an interesting link. What I liked the most is mentioning of the commandment not to murder in regard with prohibition to embarrass someone in public.

Of course, embarrassment of a fellow is considered murder.

And it's multifaceted, aside from what seems today as apparent moral digression,
as much as with murder today, there's a physiological explanation to why embarrassment is considered murder as well, but it doesn't end there as well.

There's a method to Jewish law, and the Rabbinic argumentation is infinitely complex and meticulous , way beyond what can possibly expanded in such a forum.

Only to start grasping the initial thread of a single debate on a single subject on one page of the Gmara, which can be centered at a single phrase or even word of the law, on its initial literal level- can take at best several months (and I'm being large here), even that is virtually impossible without prior grasp of some minimal basis.

But that's if I'm being large here, in reality, if after 3-4 months You grasp 20% that's a significant intellectual achievement. And a person will know this on his own, once that's starts rolling, the feeling of growing up to a rigorous intellectual challenge, as it's commonly expressed - 'it starts tasting like honey'.

Anyway, as already said this is not the platform capable enough of containing such a detailed discourse in the correct way, and I'm certainly not the one fit to take the position.

But to go back to what You've previously pointed out, I'll conclude with another simple example- there're many kinds of theft, as with murder explained above, some are not as obvious initially, namely - there's whats called 'theft of mind' as well, which I think fits more for the example You've previously given.

Hope I didn't confuse it, or made it overly complicated.
We can always take back, and expand as we proceed with the conversation.

Thanks for your input. Frankly, my knowledge is too low for meaningful conversations, to say nothing about discussions. I tried several times to read the Bible (both OT and NT), but have never managed to get it through completely.

Though, during this period significant shift in my mind happened. I no longer consider Judaism as primitive and purely tribal religion compared with Christianity. The contrary is true, it seems.

I am not a religious person. And I think that never will be. There are some aspects of religious life I can't accept (they are common to all religions). Though, it should be interesting to read the book mentioned when it appears. And follow the rules it provides which get along with my feelings and mind.

I am fascinated. What led you to believe that Judaism is primitive
and tribal?

Primitive? No

Tribal? 100%. That’s understandable until they put the tribe above G-d.

What do you mean by 'tribal'?

By the way, it's G-d who prescribes, with exception of 3 conditions,
that the life of a single member of His tribe takes precedent over His entire Torah.

Cliquish.

it’s the conditions.

Too much contempt clouds your ability to form thoughts
that go beyond shallow infantile projection.

But I'll answer anyway - the 3 exceptional conditions are:

1. Sexual immorality
2. Idol worship
3. Murder

Not specifically in that order.
G-d gave Torah to Israel, to live in it, not otherwise.

Except for the above, value of life takes precedent over any Torah law.

I have no contempt but I agree that contempt is one of the things that can cloud objectivity just as unplaced loyalty to a tribal member can cloud objectivity which is what I was referring to in my prior post.

Man’s original sin was worshipping created things instead of the creator. It’s a little more than gold calf’s.

That has nothing to do with a tribe.
Rather a natural human trait, or for that matter of living creatures.

I'm not going to discus the subject of sin,
with a person who thinks G-d of Israel was "born".

It's just not of potential depth, let alone intellectually interesting.

I'm sorry, but move on.

Being looked down upon by Jews for my religious beliefs isn’t anything new. But it is still surprising and ironic each time it happens.

I am fascinated. Can you describe some incident in your life which
involved "Being looked down upon by Jews for...{your} religious
beliefs......" ??? Did it happen in school, on the 'playground' -----
in the street?

No. I never had any contact with Jews until I joined USMB. So imagine my surprise.

Well, you do seem to be especially drawn
to every thread that has to do with Judaism.

What's the motivation?

To understand your beliefs about God. For instance, it has been argued on these boards that the G-d of Abraham is cruel. I have argued that’s not how the Jews of the OT saw it. Unfortunately I have yet to find a Jew who is willing to discuss anything on this subject.

Already explained that.

I don't have "beliefs" about G-d.
The commandment is not to believe, rather to know G-d.,

Maybe if you actually read the answers returned, people had interest in interaction.

Nice dodge. I didn’t think you could discuss it, but your pride wouldn’t allow you to say so.

I can answer it in probably 25 words or less. In my own words. Not a video link to a rabbi who never really answers it either.

You see, you just keep talking in an echo chamber,
ignoring anything people answer.

What do you need me for?
Sure not for conversation.

I never saw your answer. I only saw your claim that you answered. You don’t strike me as trustworthy so pardon my skepticism.

Did you really ask a question?
Nope, read your own post again,
therefore no answer to a non-existent question.

Ding, I've already told you -
such interaction is of neither potential depth, nor intellectually challenging.

Move on.

Actually you didn’t answer it. If you did you would have linked to it by now to prove me wrong.

So while you claim it wouldn’t be a challenge, your actions say otherwise.

 

[ding]

Well, you do seem to be especially drawn
to every thread that has to do with Judaism.

What's the motivation?

To understand your beliefs about God. For instance, it has been argued on these boards that the G-d of Abraham is cruel. I have argued that’s not how the Jews of the OT saw it. Unfortunately I have yet to find a Jew who is willing to discuss anything on this subject.

Already explained that.

Nice dodge. I didn’t think you could discuss it, but your pride wouldn’t allow you to say so.

Did you really ask a question?

So you go from you already answered it to did I ask a question?

But you aren’t scared, right?

 

[irosie91]

you make VERY important points----in my extensive experience with
jew haters (grew up in a WASP town and worked with lots of muzzies
from south east asia)--------they are DRAWN to jews like flies to honey.
They talk about jews even in church "sermons" and in mosques

Since you are apparently an expert on Jew haters, in your expert opinion am I Jew hater?

you, like all people, are, largely, the child of your society. Read
"Childhood and Society" Eric Erikson

Im pretty sure I don’t fit into any molds, Rosie.

I like to challenge everything. It’s how I learn. I don’t solely rely on what others before me have said. Although I do like to start there because I do not scoff at accepting knowledge on authority, I scoff at blindly accepting knowledge on authority.

So people who do blindly accept knowledge on authority usually don’t fare well in conversations with me as I am no child of society. I am a child of truth.

you are a child of your Christian grandmother. Acceptance of
"knowledge on authority" is the central feature of her religion

 

[rylah]

Shulchan Aruch For Bnei Noach Set To Be Published

The “Shulchan Aruch” is a halachic rulebook which contains all the daily routines, and also the practices for holidays and the life cycle. What is permitted and what is forbidden? This book will be a collection of halacha specifically for Noahides.

The “Shulchan Aruch” will be written by the Director of Brit Olam – Noahide World Center – Rav Oury Cherki. a result of many years of mutual efforts with many Noahides. It is being written with the advice and guidance of a forum of rabbis who are experts in the subject of Bnei Noach and the universal message of Judaism.

Shulchan Aruch For Bnei Noach Set To Be Published

The Brit Olam organization is in contact with thousands of Bnei Noach who seek spiritual and halachic guidance.

www.jewishpress.com

You provided an interesting link. What I liked the most is mentioning of the commandment not to murder in regard with prohibition to embarrass someone in public.

Of course, embarrassment of a fellow is considered murder.

And it's multifaceted, aside from what seems today as apparent moral digression,
as much as with murder today, there's a physiological explanation to why embarrassment is considered murder as well, but it doesn't end there as well.

There's a method to Jewish law, and the Rabbinic argumentation is infinitely complex and meticulous , way beyond what can possibly expanded in such a forum.

Only to start grasping the initial thread of a single debate on a single subject on one page of the Gmara, which can be centered at a single phrase or even word of the law, on its initial literal level- can take at best several months (and I'm being large here), even that is virtually impossible without prior grasp of some minimal basis.

But that's if I'm being large here, in reality, if after 3-4 months You grasp 20% that's a significant intellectual achievement. And a person will know this on his own, once that's starts rolling, the feeling of growing up to a rigorous intellectual challenge, as it's commonly expressed - 'it starts tasting like honey'.

Anyway, as already said this is not the platform capable enough of containing such a detailed discourse in the correct way, and I'm certainly not the one fit to take the position.

But to go back to what You've previously pointed out, I'll conclude with another simple example- there're many kinds of theft, as with murder explained above, some are not as obvious initially, namely - there's whats called 'theft of mind' as well, which I think fits more for the example You've previously given.

Hope I didn't confuse it, or made it overly complicated.
We can always take back, and expand as we proceed with the conversation.

Thanks for your input. Frankly, my knowledge is too low for meaningful conversations, to say nothing about discussions. I tried several times to read the Bible (both OT and NT), but have never managed to get it through completely.

Though, during this period significant shift in my mind happened. I no longer consider Judaism as primitive and purely tribal religion compared with Christianity. The contrary is true, it seems.

I am not a religious person. And I think that never will be. There are some aspects of religious life I can't accept (they are common to all religions). Though, it should be interesting to read the book mentioned when it appears. And follow the rules it provides which get along with my feelings and mind.

I am fascinated. What led you to believe that Judaism is primitive
and tribal?

Primitive? No

Tribal? 100%. That’s understandable until they put the tribe above G-d.

What do you mean by 'tribal'?

By the way, it's G-d who prescribes, with exception of 3 conditions,
that the life of a single member of His tribe takes precedent over His entire Torah.

Cliquish.

it’s the conditions.

Too much contempt clouds your ability to form thoughts
that go beyond shallow infantile projection.

But I'll answer anyway - the 3 exceptional conditions are:

1. Sexual immorality
2. Idol worship
3. Murder

Not specifically in that order.
G-d gave Torah to Israel, to live in it, not otherwise.

Except for the above, value of life takes precedent over any Torah law.

I have no contempt but I agree that contempt is one of the things that can cloud objectivity just as unplaced loyalty to a tribal member can cloud objectivity which is what I was referring to in my prior post.

Man’s original sin was worshipping created things instead of the creator. It’s a little more than gold calf’s.

That has nothing to do with a tribe.
Rather a natural human trait, or for that matter of living creatures.

I'm not going to discus the subject of sin,
with a person who thinks G-d of Israel was "born".

It's just not of potential depth, let alone intellectually interesting.

I'm sorry, but move on.

Being looked down upon by Jews for my religious beliefs isn’t anything new. But it is still surprising and ironic each time it happens.

I am fascinated. Can you describe some incident in your life which
involved "Being looked down upon by Jews for...{your} religious
beliefs......" ??? Did it happen in school, on the 'playground' -----
in the street?

No. I never had any contact with Jews until I joined USMB. So imagine my surprise.

Well, you do seem to be especially drawn
to every thread that has to do with Judaism.

What's the motivation?

To understand your beliefs about God. For instance, it has been argued on these boards that the G-d of Abraham is cruel. I have argued that’s not how the Jews of the OT saw it. Unfortunately I have yet to find a Jew who is willing to discuss anything on this subject.

Already explained that.

I don't have "beliefs" about G-d.
The commandment is not to believe, rather to know G-d.,

Maybe if you actually read the answers returned, people had interest in interaction.

Nice dodge. I didn’t think you could discuss it, but your pride wouldn’t allow you to say so.

I can answer it in probably 25 words or less. In my own words. Not a video link to a rabbi who never really answers it either.

You see, you just keep talking in an echo chamber,
ignoring anything people answer.

What do you need me for?
Sure not for conversation.

I never saw your answer. I only saw your claim that you answered. You don’t strike me as trustworthy so pardon my skepticism.

Did you really ask a question?
Nope, read your own post again,
therefore no answer to a non-existent question.

Ding, I've already told you -
such interaction is of neither potential depth, nor intellectually challenging.

Move on.

Actually you didn’t answer it. If you did you would have linked to it by now to prove me wrong.

So while you claim it wouldn’t be a challenge, your actions say otherwise.

Asking for answer to a non existent question, again?
Yeah...that's a worthy challenge.

They should hire you to NASA.

 

[rylah]

Well, you do seem to be especially drawn
to every thread that has to do with Judaism.

What's the motivation?

To understand your beliefs about God. For instance, it has been argued on these boards that the G-d of Abraham is cruel. I have argued that’s not how the Jews of the OT saw it. Unfortunately I have yet to find a Jew who is willing to discuss anything on this subject.

Already explained that.

Nice dodge. I didn’t think you could discuss it, but your pride wouldn’t allow you to say so.

Did you really ask a question?

So you go from you already answered it to did I ask a question?

But you aren’t scared, right?

Oh dingy dingy,
you've quoted 2 of my questions,
and none of yours.

Definitely NASA material...

 

[ding]

you make VERY important points----in my extensive experience with
jew haters (grew up in a WASP town and worked with lots of muzzies
from south east asia)--------they are DRAWN to jews like flies to honey.
They talk about jews even in church "sermons" and in mosques

Since you are apparently an expert on Jew haters, in your expert opinion am I Jew hater?

you, like all people, are, largely, the child of your society. Read
"Childhood and Society" Eric Erikson

Im pretty sure I don’t fit into any molds, Rosie.

I like to challenge everything. It’s how I learn. I don’t solely rely on what others before me have said. Although I do like to start there because I do not scoff at accepting knowledge on authority, I scoff at blindly accepting knowledge on authority.

So people who do blindly accept knowledge on authority usually don’t fare well in conversations with me as I am no child of society. I am a child of truth.

you are a child of your Christian grandmother. Acceptance of
"knowledge on authority" is the central feature of her religion

Actually, I’m not. Try again.

 

[ding]

Well, you do seem to be especially drawn
to every thread that has to do with Judaism.

What's the motivation?

To understand your beliefs about God. For instance, it has been argued on these boards that the G-d of Abraham is cruel. I have argued that’s not how the Jews of the OT saw it. Unfortunately I have yet to find a Jew who is willing to discuss anything on this subject.

Already explained that.

Nice dodge. I didn’t think you could discuss it, but your pride wouldn’t allow you to say so.

Did you really ask a question?

So you go from you already answered it to did I ask a question?

But you aren’t scared, right?

Oh dingy dingy,
you've quoted 2 of my questions,
and none of yours.

Definitely NASA material...

I’m good with that as long as you don’t explain why your predecessors believed God is loving.

Actually I will win either way.

 

[rylah]

Well, you do seem to be especially drawn
to every thread that has to do with Judaism.

What's the motivation?

To understand your beliefs about God. For instance, it has been argued on these boards that the G-d of Abraham is cruel. I have argued that’s not how the Jews of the OT saw it. Unfortunately I have yet to find a Jew who is willing to discuss anything on this subject.

Already explained that.

Nice dodge. I didn’t think you could discuss it, but your pride wouldn’t allow you to say so.

Did you really ask a question?

So you go from you already answered it to did I ask a question?

But you aren’t scared, right?

Oh dingy dingy,
you've quoted 2 of my questions,
and none of yours.

Definitely NASA material...

I’m good with that as long as you don’t explain why your predecessors believed God is loving.

Actually I will win either way.

My predecessors knew the words of G-d's prophets
and His commandments that speak of love.

 

[luchitociencia]

Instead of looking for worthless free stuff - Jews sweat and suffer for knowledge,
and that's why the worth of their knowledge is infinitely significant.

You just said it, you found your knowledge and be happy with it.

But you'll never acquire WISDOM, and your Judaism is just kindergarten level in front of my graduated diploma and experience.

That's exactly what I'm saying.
You neither know nor understand -just blowing hot air.

That kid already can tie knots around you, and you won't even know what happened.

Put the boy as being your teacher then. That is as far as you will reach.

Why do you constantly have to change the subject?
You've made it about me, now desperately complaining.

I'm not complaining, from the very beginning here I'm laughing of Judaism.

The law G-d gave to Israel is for Israel to be His nation not like any other.
The law G-d gave to the entire humanity is for mass consumption.

I guess you think you shit gold. Come on, what was given to Israel was taken from Israel because they were good for nothing. Many times it is told that God will have MERCY of Israel and what will be given to Israel again won't be by merit but MERCY.

So be it: beg, keep begging. I want to see you imploring more and more... remember... will be by MERCY...

G-d chose to bear His Name on the name of His nation,
knowledge of the name of His nation fulfills the entire purpose.

What a deception for God, He even tried to erase Israel from the face of earth, and Moses had to beg to Make God change his mind.

The Name by which G-d is known to His nation, is reserved to them.

YHWH wanted his name to be known by the entire world. If you think was given to you to keep it in secret, then you truly are a complete ignorant. How many like you are complete ignorant? I'm curious. Make your list.

Of course Jews did,
and as all skillful teachers do - even tricked your egos to think you've reached that on your own.

I did it when I found the key of understanding. No need of Judaism.

And totally the contrary, after receiving understanding I checked Judaism and Judaism showed me its vain ignorance ruling thru centuries and how prisoners are its followers of such "acknowledging cult".

That's called leverage by contractors.
Again how many knots are required, before you start realizing the order of things?
The nations also build car, planes, chairs and tables - while Israel takes the burden of Torah.

Torah was not before creation but Torah came after the depart of Israel from Egypt. With this WISDOM the primeval doctrines of the sect known as Judaism are debunked. If Israel thinks different, then no wonder why God will redeem by MERCY. Such a knowledge reached by you is so... so... so infantile.

Because the thought about Israel preceded Torah itself.
I don't think you can even understand the 1st word in it, let alone anything beyond.

Turn on your engines!!! BRRRRRR! BRRRR! BRRRRR!!! Ah! Beginning... no, better opening... wait, what about emerging? ... perhaps sounds better clearing? I want to start Torah saying: "At the grand opening elohim blah blah blah..."

Look, we can take years and we won't agree with the meaning of the first word. Not because I can't discuss it but because to me will be hard to give you wise insight when your mind has been filled with rigid and fixed ideas.

If you want to learn Torah, then you must clean up your mind first.

This is both desecration of G-d's Name,
and logical inconsistency of lowest order.

Why should I waste my time on such worthless none sense?

Torah is not based in logic but WISDOM.

Your knowledge acquired from expired to date thoughts of former rabbis won't go further unless your attitude or behavior changes. Receiving the key of understanding it won't make you know "everything", but surely what you will reach is truth at every step you walk in life.

Unfortunately, because pride you will reject WISDOM.

So be it.

 

[ding]

Well, you do seem to be especially drawn
to every thread that has to do with Judaism.

What's the motivation?

To understand your beliefs about God. For instance, it has been argued on these boards that the G-d of Abraham is cruel. I have argued that’s not how the Jews of the OT saw it. Unfortunately I have yet to find a Jew who is willing to discuss anything on this subject.

Already explained that.

Nice dodge. I didn’t think you could discuss it, but your pride wouldn’t allow you to say so.

Did you really ask a question?

So you go from you already answered it to did I ask a question?

But you aren’t scared, right?

Oh dingy dingy,
you've quoted 2 of my questions,
and none of yours.

Definitely NASA material...

I’m good with that as long as you don’t explain why your predecessors believed God is loving.

Actually I will win either way.

My predecessors knew the words of G-d's prophets
and His commandments that speak of love.

Interesting. So you have no idea that Moses recorded in writing the history that all Jews already knew? You do realize that the account of Genesis was passed down orally from generation to generation for thousands of years before Moses recorded it, right?

Or were you taught that God revealed to Moses the accounts of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and that no one ever knew of that history until Moses revealed it?

But putting that aside, you have skipped thousands of years where your prophets had no name. Or are you suggesting that your people did not know God is loving before Moses?

Are you suggesting that God was loving when he condemned mankind to suffer?

Are you suggesting that God was loving when he brought forth a flood to kill mankind?

Are you suggesting that God was loving when he made Moses wander in the desert for 40 years?

Are you suggesting that God was loving when he gave the command to kill every man, woman and child in Canaan?

so if I am to understand you, your only basis in believing that your people believed God is loving is because your prophets told you so? That doesn’t sound like knowledge. That sounds like you are blindly parroting what you were told. sounds like you are what Rosie would call a child of society.

How do you believe the prophets knew God was loving? What was their basis for that belief?

I know.

 

[rylah]

Instead of looking for worthless free stuff - Jews sweat and suffer for knowledge,
and that's why the worth of their knowledge is infinitely significant.

You just said it, you found your knowledge and be happy with it.

But you'll never acquire WISDOM, and your Judaism is just kindergarten level in front of my graduated diploma and experience.

Indeed kindergarten level...

Before WISDOM - Reading comprehension 101:
Where is the word "found" found in my post?

That's exactly what I'm saying.
You neither know nor understand -just blowing hot air.

That kid already can tie knots around you, and you won't even know what happened.

Put the boy as being your teacher then. That is as far as you will reach.

I might as well, have no problem with that whatsoever.
That's actually one of the main purposes of Jewish education - turn kids into grown up teachers.

Though I have Rabbi and I thank G-d every day for the great merit.
He's from the tribe of Levi, the tribe that was specifically set to be the teachers in Israel.

A true educator, You know like they used to be once, in who's mere presence You feel awe and fear of respect, before he even says a word. Not to mention one of the sharpest minds I had the opportunity to witness in my entire life. Paired with wit and sense of humor, love and kindness that melts any blown out ego preventing one from accepting the most harsh and direct criticism and the opportunity to learn and grow.

Five out of his ten sons are judges, so are several of his sons in law - in what merit G-d granted me the opportunity to be seated at the table of such giants and suckle from them Torah is beyond me - probably by merit of previous generations.

Why do you constantly have to change the subject?
You've made it about me, now desperately complaining.

I'm not complaining, from the very beginning here I'm laughing of Judaism.

Be my guest, laughter is good for Your health.
One of our forefathers' name is Yitzhak - meaning "he will laugh".

The law G-d gave to Israel is for Israel to be His nation not like any other.
The law G-d gave to the entire humanity is for mass consumption.

I guess you think you shit gold. Come on, what was given to Israel was taken from Israel because they were good for nothing. Many times it is told that God will have MERCY of Israel and what will be given to Israel again won't be by merit but MERCY.

So be it: beg, keep begging. I want to see you imploring more and more... remember... will be by MERCY...

Be careful, strong contempt has the potential to drive one crazy,
to the point of inability to string coherent sentences.

G-d chose to bear His Name on the name of His nation,
knowledge of the name of His nation fulfills the entire purpose.

What a deception for God, He even tried to erase Israel from the face of earth, and Moses had to beg to Make God change his mind.

That's why G-d chose Mosheh Rabbenu A"H to be the shepherd of His nation in the first place. Exactly the wisdom You bang about so much, yet slipping between Your fingers.

Abraham Avinu A"H argued with G-d,
Mosheh Rabbenu A"H argued with G-d.

All is fine, all according to the plan.
You see if G-d wanted someone to simply nod in a robot-like manner, He'd make angels his "people", instead of creating the world for humanity to experience freedom of choice, and Israel as the pinnacle of creation - exactly because Israel are capable of staying sincere in the midst of a conversation with G-d. A people who are capable of remaining REAL when G-d talks.

Israel ask questions, argue - that's in our name, its meaning.

While on the other hand, other nations just instantly become religious, and fall into blind faith, what interest is in such an interaction?

The Name by which G-d is known to His nation, is reserved to them.

YHWH wanted his name to be known by the entire world. If you think was given to you to keep it in secret, then you truly are a complete ignorant. How many like you are complete ignorant? I'm curious. Make your list.

No, not in secret.
It's just that the world has to reach to a certain point before knowing G-d's Name.
You see, You still of the impression that by merely knowing 4 letters is knowledge of that name.

But that's not what KNOWING one's name really is,
You've yet even penetrated the surface, that's not even knowing what the Name means.

You'll eventually get there, not sure to what level of intimacy, but we're infinitely optimistic.

Of course Jews did,
and as all skillful teachers do - even tricked your egos to think you've reached that on your own.

I did it when I found the key of understanding. No need of Judaism.

And totally the contrary, after receiving understanding I checked Judaism and Judaism showed me its vain ignorance ruling thru centuries and how prisoners are its followers of such "acknowledging cult".

Is it the source of that insecurity,
the urge to try and force everyone to be like You?

That's called leverage by contractors.
Again how many knots are required, before you start realizing the order of things?
The nations also build car, planes, chairs and tables - while Israel takes the burden of Torah.

Torah was not before creation but Torah came after the depart of Israel from Egypt. With this WISDOM the primeval doctrines of the sect known as Judaism are debunked. If Israel thinks different, then no wonder why God will redeem by MERCY. Such a knowledge reached by you is so... so... so infantile.

Has nothing to do with what Israel may or may not think.

Torah is the 'manufacturer's guide', the plan.
according to which the world itself was created.

Because the thought about Israel preceded Torah itself.
I don't think you can even understand the 1st word in it, let alone anything beyond.

Turn on your engines!!! BRRRRRR! BRRRR! BRRRRR!!! Ah! Beginning... no, better opening... wait, what about emerging? ... perhaps sounds better clearing? I want to start Torah saying: "At the grand opening elohim blah blah blah..."

Look, we can take years and we won't agree with the meaning of the first word. Not because I can't discuss it but because to me will be hard to give you wise insight when your mind has been filled with rigid and fixed ideas.

If you want to learn Torah, then you must clean up your mind first.

Or- You can simply learn Torah.
And better in its original form and language.
Might as well help You grow out of that infantile state of mind.

This is both desecration of G-d's Name,
and logical inconsistency of lowest order.

Why should I waste my time on such worthless none sense?

Torah is not based in logic but WISDOM.

Your knowledge acquired from expired to date thoughts of former rabbis won't go further unless your attitude or behavior changes. Receiving the key of understanding it won't make you know "everything", but surely what you will reach is truth at every step you walk in life.

Unfortunately, because pride you will reject WISDOM.

So be it.

Torah is not "based"..
.
What it is, is the word of G-d, a communication.
And as I've mentioned above - the plan of the creation.

Simple as that,
yet infinitely complex.

So "Be it".

 

[LittleNipper]

You may wish to regard the following: Messianic Life

See...that's exactly what I'm talking about,
missionaries have not the least integrity to be straightforward,
trolling around seeking to disconnect Jews from their heritage, always sneaky.

What is that about Islam and Christianity that makes them so unsure
of themselves that they absolutely must try and turn everyone to be like them?

What heritage are you concerned about? I note that Mary and Joseph were a Jewish couple. Jesus was raised Jewish. He was dedicated at the Temple at Jerusalem... All the prophetic heritage of the Old Testament point to the coming of the Messiah who I firmly believe has come and will return again (likely sooner than later). The Messiah/Christ fulfilled every requirement of the Mosaic/GOD's Law. I note that many Jews are still seeking the Messiah's coming. Yet if indeed He came this day would Jews be anymore receptive than they were 2000 years ago? Would they not expect things to change at His revelation?

I see true Christianity as the pinnacle, or fruition of the history of the nation of Israel, and its part of bringing the SAVIOR to the ENTIRE world (the gentiles) --- and not just so it (Israel) can wallow in exclusive "traditions" for tradition sake... I as an evangelical christian love the Jewish people and their traditions, but I also realize that most of these traditions point to the Messiah. This is something I personally feel many Jews miss. They see them as family gatherings and shinning a spotlight upon themselves. But believers should be shining the light upon HIM who save us an not fret that we will somehow lose traditional identity. This is because we are all made whole when we spotlight G-D's grace to everyone.

If the episode of Mary barging her way onto the Temple Mount actually occurred, the Kohanim would have executed her or had her executed by the Romans.
The Kohanim were not known for being shy.
If you actually studied the Torah you would know how preposterous this "episode" sounds.

And where exactly does that episode appear in any of the Gospel narratives? I've never read of it. If you are speaking of some Hollywood movie, where have they ever stuck to the Bible without "artistic license". Look at NOAH and also the Ten Commandments. There are problems and I read the Bible and do not depend on even the best that Hollywood has to offer as sticking to the original script.

Luke?
The fact is that you have not read the NT at all if you don’t even know about this episode.

What I've read is that Mary and Joseph returned to Jerusalem when they realized that the 12 year old Jesus was missing from among the relatives and friends with whom they were traveling. Joseph and Mary found Jesus in the Temple days later astounding the learned men there with HIS knowledge of scripture. That is hardly barging in anywhere. We are not told of exactly where in the Temple complex this occurred. There was also a women's court.

you got a specific PART of the NT for that story? I read the NT
(long ago) and I remember the incident simply as being something
like "Jesus was in a synagogue talking to "grown up" educated
people and EXPOUNDING on scriptures in a manner beyond his years. I do not recall this incident as taking place in the central temple
in Jerusalem. I think your problem here is a matter of TRANSLATION

Lukas 2:41-52 Orthodox Jewish Bible (OJB)
41 And his horim (parents) used to make aliyah leregel (pilgrimage) to Yerushalayim shanah bshanah (year by year) for Chag HaPesach (the Feast of Pesach). [SHEMOT 23:15; DEVARIM 16:1-8]
42 And when he became a bocher of twelve years of age, they made aliyah leregel (pilgrimage), as usual, according to the mitzvah and minhag of the Chag.
43 And as they were returning, having fulfilled the prescribed number of yamim (days), the bocher Yehoshua stayed behind in Yerushalayim. And his horim (parents) did not have daas (knowledge) of this,
44 But supposed him to be in the caravan, and went a day’s journey. And they began looking for him among the krovim (relatives) and acquaintances.
45 And, not having found him, they returned to Yerushalayim, looking for him.
46 And it came about, that after shlosha yamim (three days) they found him in the courts of the Beis HaMikdash, sitting in the midst of the rabbis, both listening to them and asking them she’elot (kashes, questions).
47 And all the ones listening to him where amazed at his binah and at his teshuvot (answers).
48 And when his horim (parents) saw him, they were astounded, and his Em (mother) said to him, Beni, why did you do thus to us? Hinei, your abba and I were anxiously looking for you.
49 And he said to them, Why is it that you were looking for me? Did you not have daas that I must be in the Beis Avi [i.e., dealing with His affairs]?
50 And they did not have binah of the dvar which he spoke to them.
51 And he went down with them, and they came to Natzeret; and he continued in mishmaat (obedience) to his horim (parents). And his Em (mother) was treasuring all these things in her lev (heart).
52 And Yehoshua kept increasing in chochmah VGADEL VATOV GAM IM HASHEM VGAM IM ANASHIM (and stature and favor with Hashem and men, SHMUEL ALEF 2:26).
Orthodox Jewish Bible (OJB)

 

[rylah]

Well, you do seem to be especially drawn
to every thread that has to do with Judaism.

What's the motivation?

To understand your beliefs about God. For instance, it has been argued on these boards that the G-d of Abraham is cruel. I have argued that’s not how the Jews of the OT saw it. Unfortunately I have yet to find a Jew who is willing to discuss anything on this subject.

Already explained that.

Nice dodge. I didn’t think you could discuss it, but your pride wouldn’t allow you to say so.

Did you really ask a question?

So you go from you already answered it to did I ask a question?

But you aren’t scared, right?

Oh dingy dingy,
you've quoted 2 of my questions,
and none of yours.

Definitely NASA material...

I’m good with that as long as you don’t explain why your predecessors believed God is loving.

Actually I will win either way.

My predecessors knew the words of G-d's prophets
and His commandments that speak of love.

Interesting. So you have no idea that Moses recorded in writing the history that all Jews already knew? You do realize that the account of Genesis was passed down orally from generation to generation for thousands of years before Moses recorded it, right?

Or were you taught that God revealed to Moses the accounts of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and that no one ever knew of that history until Moses revealed it?

But putting that aside, you have skipped thousands of years where your prophets had no name. Or are you suggesting that your people did not know God is loving before Moses?

Are you suggesting that God was loving when he condemned mankind to suffer?

Are you suggesting that God was loving when he brought forth a flood to kill mankind?

Are you suggesting that God was loving when he made Moses wander in the desert for 40 years?

Are you suggesting that God was loving when he gave the command to kill every man, woman and child in Canaan?

so if I am to understand you, your only basis in believing that your people believed God is loving is because your prophets told you so? That doesn’t sound like knowledge. That sounds like you are blindly parroting what you were told. sounds like you are what Rosie would call a child of society.

How do you believe the prophets knew God was loving? What was their basis for that belief?

I know.

Seriously ding,
it doesn't matter what I would answer,
You just totally neglect it, and reserve to dumping strawman fallacies.

All these leading talking points You get from the church,
are simple questions dealt with when children study the Humash.

All I can suggest, is try actually reading the book, slowly and carefully,
and refer You to Rashi - because otherwise it's just meaningless waste of time.

 

[rylah]

You may wish to regard the following: Messianic Life

See...that's exactly what I'm talking about,
missionaries have not the least integrity to be straightforward,
trolling around seeking to disconnect Jews from their heritage, always sneaky.

What is that about Islam and Christianity that makes them so unsure
of themselves that they absolutely must try and turn everyone to be like them?

What heritage are you concerned about? I note that Mary and Joseph were a Jewish couple. Jesus was raised Jewish. He was dedicated at the Temple at Jerusalem... All the prophetic heritage of the Old Testament point to the coming of the Messiah who I firmly believe has come and will return again (likely sooner than later). The Messiah/Christ fulfilled every requirement of the Mosaic/GOD's Law. I note that many Jews are still seeking the Messiah's coming. Yet if indeed He came this day would Jews be anymore receptive than they were 2000 years ago? Would they not expect things to change at His revelation?

I see true Christianity as the pinnacle, or fruition of the history of the nation of Israel, and its part of bringing the SAVIOR to the ENTIRE world (the gentiles) --- and not just so it (Israel) can wallow in exclusive "traditions" for tradition sake... I as an evangelical christian love the Jewish people and their traditions, but I also realize that most of these traditions point to the Messiah. This is something I personally feel many Jews miss. They see them as family gatherings and shinning a spotlight upon themselves. But believers should be shining the light upon HIM who save us an not fret that we will somehow lose traditional identity. This is because we are all made whole when we spotlight G-D's grace to everyone.

If the episode of Mary barging her way onto the Temple Mount actually occurred, the Kohanim would have executed her or had her executed by the Romans.
The Kohanim were not known for being shy.
If you actually studied the Torah you would know how preposterous this "episode" sounds.

And where exactly does that episode appear in any of the Gospel narratives? I've never read of it. If you are speaking of some Hollywood movie, where have they ever stuck to the Bible without "artistic license". Look at NOAH and also the Ten Commandments. There are problems and I read the Bible and do not depend on even the best that Hollywood has to offer as sticking to the original script.

Luke?
The fact is that you have not read the NT at all if you don’t even know about this episode.

What I've read is that Mary and Joseph returned to Jerusalem when they realized that the 12 year old Jesus was missing from among the relatives and friends with whom they were traveling. Joseph and Mary found Jesus in the Temple days later astounding the learned men there with HIS knowledge of scripture. That is hardly barging in anywhere. We are not told of exactly where in the Temple complex this occurred. There was also a women's court.

you got a specific PART of the NT for that story? I read the NT
(long ago) and I remember the incident simply as being something
like "Jesus was in a synagogue talking to "grown up" educated
people and EXPOUNDING on scriptures in a manner beyond his years. I do not recall this incident as taking place in the central temple
in Jerusalem. I think your problem here is a matter of TRANSLATION

Lukas 2:41-52 Orthodox Jewish Bible (OJB)
41 And his horim (parents) used to make aliyah leregel (pilgrimage) to Yerushalayim shanah bshanah (year by year) for Chag HaPesach (the Feast of Pesach). [SHEMOT 23:15; DEVARIM 16:1-8]
42 And when he became a bocher of twelve years of age, they made aliyah leregel (pilgrimage), as usual, according to the mitzvah and minhag of the Chag.
43 And as they were returning, having fulfilled the prescribed number of yamim (days), the bocher Yehoshua stayed behind in Yerushalayim. And his horim (parents) did not have daas (knowledge) of this,
44 But supposed him to be in the caravan, and went a day’s journey. And they began looking for him among the krovim (relatives) and acquaintances.
45 And, not having found him, they returned to Yerushalayim, looking for him.
46 And it came about, that after shlosha yamim (three days) they found him in the courts of the Beis HaMikdash, sitting in the midst of the rabbis, both listening to them and asking them she’elot (kashes, questions).
47 And all the ones listening to him where amazed at his binah and at his teshuvot (answers).
48 And when his horim (parents) saw him, they were astounded, and his Em (mother) said to him, Beni, why did you do thus to us? Hinei, your abba and I were anxiously looking for you.
49 And he said to them, Why is it that you were looking for me? Did you not have daas that I must be in the Beis Avi [i.e., dealing with His affairs]?
50 And they did not have binah of the dvar which he spoke to them.
51 And he went down with them, and they came to Natzeret; and he continued in mishmaat (obedience) to his horim (parents). And his Em (mother) was treasuring all these things in her lev (heart).
52 And Yehoshua kept increasing in chochmah VGADEL VATOV GAM IM HASHEM VGAM IM ANASHIM (and stature and favor with Hashem and men, SHMUEL ALEF 2:26).
Orthodox Jewish Bible (OJB)

Read slowly and carefully - then repeat several times -
THERE'S NO SUCH THING AS 'ORTHODOX JEWISH BIBLE'

No versions.
Anything else is product of corrupt church's late inventions.

There's only one Torah - written in Hebrew, and it's the same word for word.

 

[irosie91]

for the record-----the OJB is a Christian perversion in which
some idiot tries to impress jews by adding in simple Hebrew words
and sometimes even yiddishisms Reading that crap is annoying.

 

[irosie91]

Well, you do seem to be especially drawn
to every thread that has to do with Judaism.

What's the motivation?

To understand your beliefs about God. For instance, it has been argued on these boards that the G-d of Abraham is cruel. I have argued that’s not how the Jews of the OT saw it. Unfortunately I have yet to find a Jew who is willing to discuss anything on this subject.

Already explained that.

Nice dodge. I didn’t think you could discuss it, but your pride wouldn’t allow you to say so.

Did you really ask a question?

So you go from you already answered it to did I ask a question?

But you aren’t scared, right?

Oh dingy dingy,
you've quoted 2 of my questions,
and none of yours.

Definitely NASA material...

I’m good with that as long as you don’t explain why your predecessors believed God is loving.

Actually I will win either way.

My predecessors knew the words of G-d's prophets
and His commandments that speak of love.

Interesting. So you have no idea that Moses recorded in writing the history that all Jews already knew? You do realize that the account of Genesis was passed down orally from generation to generation for thousands of years before Moses recorded it, right?

Or were you taught that God revealed to Moses the accounts of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and that no one ever knew of that history until Moses revealed it?

But putting that aside, you have skipped thousands of years where your prophets had no name. Or are you suggesting that your people did not know God is loving before Moses?

Are you suggesting that God was loving when he condemned mankind to suffer?

Are you suggesting that God was loving when he brought forth a flood to kill mankind?

Are you suggesting that God was loving when he made Moses wander in the desert for 40 years?

Are you suggesting that God was loving when he gave the command to kill every man, woman and child in Canaan?

so if I am to understand you, your only basis in believing that your people believed God is loving is because your prophets told you so? That doesn’t sound like knowledge. That sounds like you are blindly parroting what you were told. sounds like you are what Rosie would call a child of society.

How do you believe the prophets knew God was loving? What was their basis for that belief?

I know.

Seriously ding,
it doesn't matter what I would answer,
You just totally neglect it, and reserve to dumping strawman fallacies.

All these leading talking points You get from the church,
are simple questions dealt with when children study the Humash.

All I can suggest, is try actually reading the book, slowly and carefully,
and refer You to Rashi - because otherwise it's just meaningless waste of time.

dingbat should do some JUMAH things in a mosque-----he can
get a whole bunch more moronic talking points from the weekly
khutbah jumaat feces fling

 

[Indeependent]

You may wish to regard the following: Messianic Life

See...that's exactly what I'm talking about,
missionaries have not the least integrity to be straightforward,
trolling around seeking to disconnect Jews from their heritage, always sneaky.

What is that about Islam and Christianity that makes them so unsure
of themselves that they absolutely must try and turn everyone to be like them?

What heritage are you concerned about? I note that Mary and Joseph were a Jewish couple. Jesus was raised Jewish. He was dedicated at the Temple at Jerusalem... All the prophetic heritage of the Old Testament point to the coming of the Messiah who I firmly believe has come and will return again (likely sooner than later). The Messiah/Christ fulfilled every requirement of the Mosaic/GOD's Law. I note that many Jews are still seeking the Messiah's coming. Yet if indeed He came this day would Jews be anymore receptive than they were 2000 years ago? Would they not expect things to change at His revelation?

I see true Christianity as the pinnacle, or fruition of the history of the nation of Israel, and its part of bringing the SAVIOR to the ENTIRE world (the gentiles) --- and not just so it (Israel) can wallow in exclusive "traditions" for tradition sake... I as an evangelical christian love the Jewish people and their traditions, but I also realize that most of these traditions point to the Messiah. This is something I personally feel many Jews miss. They see them as family gatherings and shinning a spotlight upon themselves. But believers should be shining the light upon HIM who save us an not fret that we will somehow lose traditional identity. This is because we are all made whole when we spotlight G-D's grace to everyone.

If the episode of Mary barging her way onto the Temple Mount actually occurred, the Kohanim would have executed her or had her executed by the Romans.
The Kohanim were not known for being shy.
If you actually studied the Torah you would know how preposterous this "episode" sounds.

And where exactly does that episode appear in any of the Gospel narratives? I've never read of it. If you are speaking of some Hollywood movie, where have they ever stuck to the Bible without "artistic license". Look at NOAH and also the Ten Commandments. There are problems and I read the Bible and do not depend on even the best that Hollywood has to offer as sticking to the original script.

Luke?
The fact is that you have not read the NT at all if you don’t even know about this episode.

What I've read is that Mary and Joseph returned to Jerusalem when they realized that the 12 year old Jesus was missing from among the relatives and friends with whom they were traveling. Joseph and Mary found Jesus in the Temple days later astounding the learned men there with HIS knowledge of scripture. That is hardly barging in anywhere. We are not told of exactly where in the Temple complex this occurred. There was also a women's court.

you got a specific PART of the NT for that story? I read the NT
(long ago) and I remember the incident simply as being something
like "Jesus was in a synagogue talking to "grown up" educated
people and EXPOUNDING on scriptures in a manner beyond his years. I do not recall this incident as taking place in the central temple
in Jerusalem. I think your problem here is a matter of TRANSLATION

Lukas 2:41-52 Orthodox Jewish Bible (OJB)
41 And his horim (parents) used to make aliyah leregel (pilgrimage) to Yerushalayim shanah bshanah (year by year) for Chag HaPesach (the Feast of Pesach). [SHEMOT 23:15; DEVARIM 16:1-8]
42 And when he became a bocher of twelve years of age, they made aliyah leregel (pilgrimage), as usual, according to the mitzvah and minhag of the Chag.
43 And as they were returning, having fulfilled the prescribed number of yamim (days), the bocher Yehoshua stayed behind in Yerushalayim. And his horim (parents) did not have daas (knowledge) of this,
44 But supposed him to be in the caravan, and went a day’s journey. And they began looking for him among the krovim (relatives) and acquaintances.
45 And, not having found him, they returned to Yerushalayim, looking for him.
46 And it came about, that after shlosha yamim (three days) they found him in the courts of the Beis HaMikdash, sitting in the midst of the rabbis, both listening to them and asking them she’elot (kashes, questions).
47 And all the ones listening to him where amazed at his binah and at his teshuvot (answers).
48 And when his horim (parents) saw him, they were astounded, and his Em (mother) said to him, Beni, why did you do thus to us? Hinei, your abba and I were anxiously looking for you.
49 And he said to them, Why is it that you were looking for me? Did you not have daas that I must be in the Beis Avi [i.e., dealing with His affairs]?
50 And they did not have binah of the dvar which he spoke to them.
51 And he went down with them, and they came to Natzeret; and he continued in mishmaat (obedience) to his horim (parents). And his Em (mother) was treasuring all these things in her lev (heart).
52 And Yehoshua kept increasing in chochmah VGADEL VATOV GAM IM HASHEM VGAM IM ANASHIM (and stature and favor with Hashem and men, SHMUEL ALEF 2:26).
Orthodox Jewish Bible (OJB)

I read Luke many years ago; every verse, not just the cherry picked verses.
It's a very funny book.

 

[rylah]

Well, you do seem to be especially drawn
to every thread that has to do with Judaism.

What's the motivation?

To understand your beliefs about God. For instance, it has been argued on these boards that the G-d of Abraham is cruel. I have argued that’s not how the Jews of the OT saw it. Unfortunately I have yet to find a Jew who is willing to discuss anything on this subject.

Already explained that.

Nice dodge. I didn’t think you could discuss it, but your pride wouldn’t allow you to say so.

Did you really ask a question?

So you go from you already answered it to did I ask a question?

But you aren’t scared, right?

Oh dingy dingy,
you've quoted 2 of my questions,
and none of yours.

Definitely NASA material...

I’m good with that as long as you don’t explain why your predecessors believed God is loving.

Actually I will win either way.

My predecessors knew the words of G-d's prophets
and His commandments that speak of love.

Interesting. So you have no idea that Moses recorded in writing the history that all Jews already knew? You do realize that the account of Genesis was passed down orally from generation to generation for thousands of years before Moses recorded it, right?

Or were you taught that God revealed to Moses the accounts of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and that no one ever knew of that history until Moses revealed it?

But putting that aside, you have skipped thousands of years where your prophets had no name. Or are you suggesting that your people did not know God is loving before Moses?

Are you suggesting that God was loving when he condemned mankind to suffer?

Are you suggesting that God was loving when he brought forth a flood to kill mankind?

Are you suggesting that God was loving when he made Moses wander in the desert for 40 years?

Are you suggesting that God was loving when he gave the command to kill every man, woman and child in Canaan?

so if I am to understand you, your only basis in believing that your people believed God is loving is because your prophets told you so? That doesn’t sound like knowledge. That sounds like you are blindly parroting what you were told. sounds like you are what Rosie would call a child of society.

How do you believe the prophets knew God was loving? What was their basis for that belief?

I know.

Seriously ding,
it doesn't matter what I would answer,
You just totally neglect it, and reserve to dumping strawman fallacies.

All these leading talking points You get from the church,
are simple questions dealt with when children study the Humash.

All I can suggest, is try actually reading the book, slowly and carefully,
and refer You to Rashi - because otherwise it's just meaningless waste of time.

dingbat should do some JUMAH things in a mosque-----he can
get a whole bunch more moronic talking points from the weekly
khutbah jumaat feces fling

By the way, have You heard about the abbreviations in the beginning of several chapter in the Quran, and because they make no sense in Arabic, therefore Muslims believe will be explained with the arrival of Mahdi - yet can be read in Hebrew?

That sense of humor Ka'ab had...

 

[luchitociencia]

Indeed kindergarten level...

Before WISDOM - Reading comprehension 101:

Memorizing Torah doesn't mean you understood it.

I might as well, have no problem with that whatsoever.
That's actually one of the main purposes of Jewish education - turn kids into grown up teachers.

That kid taught you to memorize Torah by hearth. Follow your teacher and please don't try to reason in this discussion because you have not been taught to understand what you read... but only to memorize it.

One of our forefathers' name is Yitzhak - meaning "he will laugh".

At this moment he might be laughing of Judaism as well.

Be careful, strong contempt has the potential to drive one crazy,
to the point of inability to string coherent sentences.

Advice is always welcomed.

So listen carefully, you are a new generation and you have in front of you the same Scriptures the former rabbis had centuries ago. Your job is not to insert their insight as the sole interpretation but your responsibility if for you yourself to acquire wisdom directly from Torah, Prophets and Scriptures.

Let YHWH talk to you and you understand the meaning of those words.

Up to the 60's, even in universities, in classes of medicine, the words of Aristotle still had great respect if not importance. But knowledge in this branch of science grew up and the words of the Greek philosopher caused only smiles a decade later, and today he is not even mentioned at all.

Judaism is Aristotle.

That's why G-d chose Mosheh Rabbenu A"H to be the shepherd of His nation in the first place. Exactly the wisdom You bang about so much, yet slipping between Your fingers.

Moses understood only one thing: he was not in control, he was not the shepherd, but YHWH was. When he forgot his place in the story, that is the moment when he lost all privileges.

Abraham Avinu A"H argued with G-d,
Mosheh Rabbenu A"H argued with G-d.

All is fine, all according to the plan.

A "plan".

You know, you are saying that the "plan" started with Adam. A "plan".

Lets play it hard.

IF, conditional, if Adam never disobeyed, then, can you be so kind to explain what was the "plan" then?

(You don't need to answer, it will be vain from your part trying to justify the "plan" idea.)

You see if G-d wanted someone to simply nod in a robot-like manner, He'd make angels his "people", instead of creating the world for humanity to experience freedom of choice, and Israel as the pinnacle of creation - exactly because Israel are capable of staying sincere in the midst of a conversation with G-d. A people who are capable of remaining REAL when G-d talks.

Israel ask questions, argue - that's in our name, its meaning.

While on the other hand, other nations just instantly become religious, and fall into blind faith,
what interest is in such an interaction?

But, after your prayers the virus still coming inside people's bodies. If Israel prayed (had a sincere conversation with YHWH) and the virus still traveling even when the current transportation restrictions, then YHWH is not listening to Israel, His "budy", His chosen one, His selected sons.

How long for you to accept it?

No, not in secret.
It's just that the world has to reach to a certain point before knowing G-d's Name.
You see, You still of the impression that by merely knowing 4 letters is knowledge of that name.

The knowing of the Name is in its pronunciation, and is not Jehovah, nor Yaweh (Yahweh) and others.

Same as well, several passages of Tanach are obscure and even erroneous because the "traditional pronunciation" of some words are incorrect and have been inherited that way. Even Yeshu (Jesus) used the correct pronunciation to understand Torah the proper way.

But that's not what KNOWING one's name really is,
You've yet even penetrated the surface, that's not even knowing what the Name means.
You'll eventually get there, not sure to what level of intimacy, but we're infinitely optimistic.

Oxygen alone won't define air. Defining air by finding the characteristic of each element will show details of its composition, not so its behavior as a whole. An airplane is not defined by the parts used to build it.

Use this analogy and you will go further in this topic.

Is it the source of that insecurity,
the urge to try and force everyone to be like You?

What happened then with your "plan" with free will and no robots obeying a fixed old knowledge acquired centuries ago?

Judaism means "This is it", "don't go forward".

Encouraging to go forward to increase knowledge and understanding is even what the prophets oratory was. As a simple, humble, unknown human being, am I prohibited to encourage others -including you- to go forward? Do you want me to charge you for it thru a expensive book so you will consider my words as "worthy" because you paid for them?

Has nothing to do with what Israel may or may not think.

Torah is the 'manufacturer's guide', the plan.
according to which the world itself was created.

In past century, the electric code was totally different in several aspects. The main purpose of "safety" was included, but with low voltage used, the regulations were according to the power of the electricity. In classes, electricians learned to recognize voltage in cables not with a voltmeter but using the tongue. They learned the "flavor" of 5 volts compared to 9 volts.

Today you won't use your tongue to recognize 110 volts from 220 volts. Today, the electric code is different to the one from past centuries.

We are just living in accord to the last edition of the teaching of YHWH for humanity. This last edition was published after the depart of Israel from Egypt.

Or- You can simply learn Torah.
And better in its original form and language.
Might as well help You grow out of that infantile state of mind.

So, you admire that child memorizing Torah by heart and accept he can be a great "teacher", but call infantile the act of learning and consulting Torah with understanding.

I think you better take some classes of pedagogy.

Torah is not "based"..
.
What it is, is the word of G-d, a communication.
And as I've mentioned above - the plan of the creation.

Simple as that,
yet infinitely complex.

So "Be it".

You are fine: communication.

The teacher instructing and the students learning.

It is an "interactive" class where teacher and students participate.

The ones who understand the most go and help the one who is behind classes.