Zone1 Does Jesus Love Everyone? Does He Love Everyone EQUALLY?

[toobfreak]

Would love your answers on this. Cite Bible verses if you can.

I would say yes, because what Jesus sees is the same in all of us. He does not see what you've done, but what you /could/ be, which is the same in all of us as all plenary portions of God.

 

[Hafar1014]

There is original sin in Genesis.

Where I can read Hebrew and its not there. The Orthodox Rabbis who study it state there is no original sin or fall of man.

Adam eating the fruit was Gods plan to teach Adam morals. It cant be sin to obey Gods plan
Before Adam ate the fruit he couldnt know right from wrong therefore he cant sin. He had no ideas it was wrong.
Gods command thou shalt not eat the fruit or you will die was to test Adams free will. Disobedience is the test for free will. He didnt die did he. Thats because it was Gods intent he eat the fruit and learn morals.
Then comes the trial for mans freedom. Adam must admit he ate the fruit and take responsibility. He does
Free will must have moral values. Thats the message of the allegory

 

[onefour1]

What people view as original sin is the partaking of the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. God taught Adam and Eve that if they would partake of the tree of knowledge of good and evil that they would surely die. When Adam and Eve partook of the fruit, they became mortal and were subject unto physical death but they also suffered a spiritual death in that they no longer were allowed in the presence of God. Not only did Adam and Eve become subject to death but all living things in the earth also became subject to death, ie animals and plants. The fall of Adam and Eve becoming mortal carried on with all the children of God who were born through their lineage. It is this fall that is considered "original sin". However, it can be questioned as to whether it was a sin or simply a transgression of God's commandment to not partake of the fruit. Adam and Eve were in a state of innocence not know good or evil before the partook of the fruit. It wasn't until after partaking of the fruit that they gained a knowledge of good and evil. If sin is breaking the commandments of God while having a knowledge of good and evil, then it may be that they simply transgressed a commandment but did not fully understand maybe what dying was or the consequences of partaking of the fruit. At any rate, when we use the phrase, "original sin" I think we all know what is being referred to even if it was not an actual sin but only a transgression of God's command.

 

[sparky]

Adam and Eve were in a state of innocence not know good or evil before the partook of the fruit. It wasn't until after partaking of the fruit that they gained a knowledge of good and evil.

Genesis was a grand metaphor 1in4

~S~

 

[SweetSue92]

In the Sermon on the Mount, Jesus is contrasting the behaviors and attitudes of his followers to the behaviors and attitudes of the Jews. Dogs and swine are Jews.

Jesus regards the Syophoenician woman as he does the Jews – a dog. This is one of a few, or maybe the only incident in the New Testament, in which Jesus lumps Gentiles with apostate Judea.

Again, the Jews, i.e, apostate Judea.

That’s not you. It’s the Jews. The Jews were the hypocrites, the dogs, the broods of vipers. The text is quite plain. The Jews were the ones who persecuted Jesus and the primitive Christians. They were the ones against whom Jesus railed.

Yes, but Jesus DID "lump Gentiles with apostate Jews". Made even more clear throughout the entire NT

 

[SweetSue92]

I would say yes, because what Jesus sees is the same in all of us. He does not see what you've done, but what you /could/ be, which is the same in all of us as all plenary portions of God.

He absolutely sees what we have done. And we will all be judged for it. From Matthew 25:

“When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his glorious throne. All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left.

“Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. ;For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, ;I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’

 

[toobfreak]

He absolutely sees what we have done. And we will all be judged for it.

I was not referring to God judging us at the end of life, Sue, I was referring to how God sees each of us for our equal potential starting as a plenary portion of his own being. God's love and good wishes and compassion for each of us.

 

[sofia]

I am not a theologian, but I have always understood the answer is yes. The people more in the know than me also discuss mercy and justice with subject.

The justice (or just part) is something they really distinguish from love. They will say "How can God be just if he treats everyone the same in the afterlife?"

I really don't know that answer. Do people who stray experience their own hell on earth while continuing what they do for decades? I don't know.

Interesting question.

 

[onefour1]

I am not a theologian, but I have always understood the answer is yes. The people more in the know than me also discuss mercy and justice with subject.

The justice (or just part) is something they really distinguish from love. They will say "How can God be just if he treats everyone the same in the afterlife?"

I really don't know that answer. Do people who stray experience their own hell on earth while continuing what they do for decades? I don't know.

Interesting question.

Here is one verse that Jesus taught that not everyone will go to the kingdom of heaven but only they who do the will of our Father in Heaven:

Matthew 7:21
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

Here Jesus clearly teaches that not everyone will be coddled and allowed into the kingdom heaven. Only those who do the will of our Father in Heaven will be allowed access into his kingdom.

 

[SweetSue92]

I am not a theologian, but I have always understood the answer is yes. The people more in the know than me also discuss mercy and justice with subject.

The justice (or just part) is something they really distinguish from love. They will say "How can God be just if he treats everyone the same in the afterlife?"

I really don't know that answer. Do people who stray experience their own hell on earth while continuing what they do for decades? I don't know.

Interesting question.

God loves everyone. But He doesn't love everyone the same. This is taught explicitly and implicitly throughout the Bible, from cover to cover.

God is perfectly just and He does NOT treat everyone the same in the afterlife. He sent His very own Son so that we can be forgiven and join Him in the afterlife. If you don't accept His Son.....well, you're basically doomed.

 

[forkintheroad7]

To love a proper life. I don’t believe in the Abrahamic deity and really never have.

Not really. By 13 I preferred to hang out with the adults. I was the kid who hated recess and preferred reading my books or watching the news to playing outside.

Definitely. I’m guessing most of us have been here many times trying to finally get it right.

not being with Christ (via the rosary, via the Real Presence in Jesus's [Catholic] Church) means by default you are being in the presence of demons, who use the world, the flesh and the devil to destroy your soul little by little... or maybe not so little by little, as you probably have been going against Jesus for many years.

You will regret it, guaranteed

Jesus did not call it "eternal punishment" for nothing



(Mt 25:31-46)

 

[forkintheroad7]

Here is one verse that Jesus taught that not everyone will go to the kingdom of heaven but only they who do the will of our Father in Heaven:

and the will of the Father is that everyone be in Christ's (Original) Church. In fact, I hate putting it that way because there is only ONE Church-- the Catholic Church (those professing to be Christian but not Catholic are simply called Christian communities, and yet one is not really Christian if not Catholic so they probably shouldn't be called that...)

The Father of Protestantism, Luther, was born in the 15th century

I think Jesus's Church was already established by then... ??? (sarcasm)

and it excommunicated (formally) the faithless heretic Luther.

 

[forkintheroad7]

God loves everyone. But He doesn't love everyone the same. This is taught explicitly and implicitly throughout the Bible, from cover to cover.

God is perfectly just and He does NOT treat everyone the same in the afterlife. He sent His very own Son so that we can be forgiven and join Him in the afterlife. If you don't accept His Son.....well, you're basically doomed.

True story...

and when a person is condemned, it is all on that person... not on God who does everything He can to save people.

Yet, he doesn't force salvation on anyone.

 

[forkintheroad7]

I heard somewhere (probably Most Holy Family Monastery) that

the first thing God created was not the world, but

THE CHURCH

And Jesus says the gates of Hell will not prevail against.... (Mt 16:18)

what?

THE CHURCH

(notice the singular, not plural... He only established ONE Church. One was all God needed... People think they need more than that... the old choice god)

 

[forkintheroad7]

Nobody will ever get it perfect. My guess is that the breakpoint is somewhere between 12-15% at either end to get moved on to somewhere better or designated as irredeemable and sent to eternal torment.

That means if you’re in that 70-74% in the middle you get to come back and try again.

HERESY

+

 

[forkintheroad7]

God loves everyone. But He doesn't love everyone the same. This is taught explicitly and implicitly throughout the Bible, from cover to cover.

God is perfectly just and He does NOT treat everyone the same in the afterlife. He sent His very own Son so that we can be forgiven and join Him in the afterlife. If you don't accept His Son.....well, you're basically doomed.

There are liberal "Christians" (who are not really that) who insist we have to love the sin AND the sinner (the pro LGBT "churches" so called), yet surely they have heard of Jesus saying to the woman caught in adultery: "Go and sin no more."

I mean, you'd think alleged Christians would have heard of that one... ?

guess not

 

[onefour1]

and the will of the Father is that everyone be in Christ's (Original) Church. In fact, I hate putting it that way because there is only ONE Church-- the Catholic Church (those professing to be Christian but not Catholic are simply called Christian communities, and yet one is not really Christian if not Catholic so they probably shouldn't be called that...)

The Father of Protestantism, Luther, was born in the 15th century

I think Jesus's Church was already established by then... ??? (sarcasm)

and it excommunicated (formally) the faithless heretic Luther.

My belief is that after the original apostles were killed or taken from the earth the church that Jesus established fell into a state of apostacy and the priesthood and apostleship was lost. Later in the early 1800's the Father and Son restored their church to the earth through the Prophet Joseph Smith. This restoration was prophesied of in the book of Acts.

Acts 3:19-21
19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;
20 And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:
21 Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.

We believe that Joseph Smith was the prophet through whom Jesus restored his true church and that he ushered in the times of the restitution of all things. My belief is that The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is the true church of Jesus Christ restored to the earth in these last days. The great apostasy from the original church was prophesied by the prophet Amos:

Amos 8:11-12
11 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord God, that I will send a famine in the land, not a famine of bread, nor a thirst for water, but of hearing the words of the Lord:
12 And they shall wander from sea to sea, and from the north even to the east, they shall run to and fro to seek the word of the Lord, and shall not find it.

I believe Martin Luther and many others could recognize that the Catholic Church was in accordance with the word of God and left the Catholic church. However, I don't believe that they were called to restore the true church of Jesus Christ. They simply held to their own interpretations of the Bible.

 

[Hafar1014]

Jesus loves everyone except non Christians who will burn in hell forever and suffer but he loves you.

 

[onefour1]

I heard somewhere (probably Most Holy Family Monastery) that

the first thing God created was not the world, but

THE CHURCH

And Jesus says the gates of Hell will not prevail against.... (Mt 16:18)

what?

THE CHURCH

(notice the singular, not plural... He only established ONE Church. One was all God needed... People think they need more than that... the old choice god)

I don't believe that you and many others interpret Matthew 16 correctly. What Matthew 16 says is:

Matthew 16:13-18
13 When Jesus came into the coasts of Cæsarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, saying, Whom do men say that I the Son of man am?
14 And they said, Some say that thou art John the Baptist: some, Elias; and others, Jeremias, or one of the prophets.
15 He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?
16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Bar-jona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.
18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

Here Jesus asks his disciples whom they would say he is. Simon Peter said, "Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God". To this Jesus replied that flesh and blood did not reveal that truth unto him but it was revealed to him by the Father which is in heaven. Jesus then tells Peter that he is Peter, and upon this rock (the rock of revelation) that he would build his church; and the gates of hell would not prevail against it.

We believe that revelation is the rock upon which Christ would build his church. Satan was able to cause a great apostacy but he did not prevail against the church because of the doctrine of revelation. Through another prophet Jesus Christ would again establish his church again on the earth and thus it was not prevailed against. Revelation brought the church back and Satan could not prevail against revelation. In other words, Satan could not keep the church down due to the rock of revelation which allows God to again and again have the power to reestablish his church and to never have it prevailed against.

 

[Hafar1014]

I don't believe that you and many others interpret Matthew 16 correctly. What Matthew 16 says is:

Matthew 16:13-18
13 When Jesus came into the coasts of Cæsarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, saying, Whom do men say that I the Son of man am?
14 And they said, Some say that thou art John the Baptist: some, Elias; and others, Jeremias, or one of the prophets.
15 He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?
16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Bar-jona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.
18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

Here Jesus asks his disciples whom they would say he is. Simon Peter said, "Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God". To this Jesus replied that flesh and blood did not reveal that truth unto him but it was revealed to him by the Father which is in heaven. Jesus then tells Peter that he is Peter, and upon this rock (the rock of revelation) that he would build his church; and the gates of hell would not prevail against it.

We believe that revelation is the rock upon which Christ would build his church. Satan was able to cause a great apostacy but he did not prevail against the church because of the doctrine of revelation. Through another prophet Jesus Christ would again establish his church again on the earth and thus it was not prevailed against. Revelation brought the church back and Satan could not prevail against revelation. In other words, Satan could not keep the church down due to the rock of revelation which allows God to again and again have the power to reestablish his church and to never have it prevailed against.

THis isnt Christianity its Zoroastrianism (thats not the guy with the sword)