Complaints Complaints! Solutions?

[Founder]

I doubt ObamaCare is the right answer.

I am not looking for "what is not the answer"...I am looking foir the answer.

Local/state-run clinics and referral programs to provide free and low-cost checkups and routine healthcare for the working poor (one possibility is working with medical schools; students in need of real-world experience can work at the clinics for credit and training, supervised by a physician to ensure quality care), denying any medical care to those known to be illegal aliens, and improving the economy overall so that we can afford to invest in such programs.

Good tiny baby step in the right direction, along the lines of let the military take care of the health of the under-class at a fraction of the cost.

 

[Oldandtired]

I doubt ObamaCare is the right answer.

I am not looking for "what is not the answer"...I am looking foir the answer.

Local/state-run clinics and referral programs to provide free and low-cost checkups and routine healthcare for the working poor (one possibility is working with medical schools; students in need of real-world experience can work at the clinics for credit and training, supervised by a physician to ensure quality care), denying any medical care to those known to be illegal aliens, and improving the economy overall so that we can afford to invest in such programs.

Exactly how do you deny care to a 5 year old with 106 fever?

Exactly what do you say to his illegal alien parents?

And how can you do any of it until you improve the economy?

And what happens when we hit the next recession and the states are tapped?

Do not get me wrong...I see your thinking......just as I see the thinking of those that want it free for everyone....but I just dont see how it can work.

 

[☭proletarian☭]

I am not looking for "what is not the answer"...I am looking foir the answer.

Local/state-run clinics and referral programs to provide free and low-cost checkups and routine healthcare for the working poor (one possibility is working with medical schools; students in need of real-world experience can work at the clinics for credit and training, supervised by a physician to ensure quality care), denying any medical care to those known to be illegal aliens, and improving the economy overall so that we can afford to invest in such programs.

Good tiny baby step in the right direction, along the lines of let the military take care of the health of the under-class at a fraction of the cost.

What're you babbling about?

 

[☭proletarian☭]

I am not looking for "what is not the answer"...I am looking foir the answer.

Local/state-run clinics and referral programs to provide free and low-cost checkups and routine healthcare for the working poor (one possibility is working with medical schools; students in need of real-world experience can work at the clinics for credit and training, supervised by a physician to ensure quality care), denying any medical care to those known to be illegal aliens, and improving the economy overall so that we can afford to invest in such programs.

Exactly how do you deny care to a 5 year old with 106 fever?

If they can pay, they get treatment.

Exactly what do you say to his illegal alien parents?

'Sorry, but we don't have the resources to support every wetback who hops the border. Resources are finite and citizens and legal resident/visitors get priority. Get in line and if there's anything left when we're done treating everybody, we'll see what we can do. Alternatively, you're free to leave and go to a private charity, individual, or church and ask for help. The State cannot help you at this time.'

And how can you do any of it until you improve the economy?

You start small and can expand the programs as you fix the economy and can afford to invest further in the system.

And what happens when we hit the next recession and the states are tapped?

If you listened to us, recessions would rarely happen at all, would never be so dramatic save in times of drought and famine (where you have many more things to worry about), and would rarely hit all sektors of the market at once unless access to food and water was lost- in which case yearly physicals and a cold become rather low on the priority list.

Do not get me wrong...I see your thinking......just as I see the thinking of those that want it free for everyone....but I just dont see how it can work.

It used to be done all the time much like I propose. It was oft run by missionaries. The principle is sound.

The answer does not lie in the Fed, a system that is too big to sustain itself.

 

[antagon]

You are just spouting party line talking points that you have not considered or checked.

HEALTH CARE IS NOT AN INDUSTRY AND NEVER HAS BEEN IN THE HISTORY OF THE WORLD AND SHOULD NEVER BE. IT IS LIKE BETTING ON THE LOSING LAME HORSE IN EVERY RACE. IT IS A TOTAL LOSER IN EVERY SENSE EXCEPT AS A CHARITABLE COMPASSION THING.

look, flounder, healthcare is an industry, indeed. just your pointing out the trillions of dollars spent in the healthcare sector underlines the fact. id leave it as a semantic mental block youve got as to spare you some embarrassment.

i think the only fragile component of the ..quasi-para-industry.. is the insurance end of the deal. insurance is still run for a profit, and shouldnt be mistaken for charity, whatsovever. all insurance constitutes a ponzi scheme from my stance. none walks that line closer than health insurance, because of the frequency of use and other preemptive services offered at fractions of the cost to the consumer, and opening the insurer to potential losses only mitigated by other subscribers.

you're clearly a dimwit with the presumption that everyone who disagrees with you is a party hardliner who doesnt know what theyre on about. what makes it so far out is that youre wrong about the most basic shit. how could you appreciate the economic impact of healthcare policy when you cant recognize it as a industry? what party of fools spins your ass-rhetoric?

my conclusions are entirely of my own making. theyre not coated in the righteousness that politicians spin deals with. im not the one calling anything charity, nor stupid enough to term this deal as socialism... movin on..

the proposed H/C plan is one that bolsters my ponzi position, just like the original overture to the HMO in '73. the only thing such a scheme requires is new membership to hedge the bet. in 73 it was an employer mandate, now it is an individual mandate. the other 800 pages of legislation is busy work. in that regard, a mandate is the only measure which would hold the HMO/PPO situation together.

I fail to see the big deal.

 

[Founder]

How many people are interested in fixing things? None? That may be true. I haven't ran across anyone on this forum or others that seem to have any interest in anything but just complaining and chatting. Is that true? If not can you please declare yourself or even send me an email, or Message. I more than just curious, as I would really like to get something done along with all the talk. What do you say?

 

[antagon]

what are you saying is so broke? i think the #1 factor among habitual complainers is a sense of powerlessness to affect a fix. you complain about the complaining, among other things, where are your solutions? how do you feel prepared to address situations with the rickety understanding of things you've demonstrated? wont you be best served by educating yourself?

 

[Founder]

what are you saying is so broke? i think the #1 factor among habitual complainers is a sense of powerlessness to affect a fix. you complain about the complaining, among other things, where are your solutions? how do you feel prepared to address situations with the rickety understanding of things you've demonstrated? wont you be best served by educating yourself?

I have proposed a lot of solutions, just see my signature for one example, and take a look at my other threads.

It seems all you have to offer is snipe, snipe, snipe at others who do propose things, such as myself. As for education, I'm not going to get into listing degrees, but I have spent a lifetime educating myself, which I doubt you have.

I'm new here and don't know people's track record, but I will try to make it a point to see if you have ever started threads, or made any serious proposals to make this a better world. My guess, in advance, is that you have not. If you want to refer me to some such thread that lays out your proposals, please do so.

But, the backseat drivers, snipers, and kibitzers are the source of some of our worst problems in this world. Life is all about attitude much more than intellect, and yours seems pretty negative and contentless as far as I can see.

But thanks for posting to my thread anyway.

 

[sparky]

HEALTH CARE IS NOT AN INDUSTRY

oh gawd....

~S~

 

[Founder]

HEALTH CARE IS NOT AN INDUSTRY

oh gawd....

~S~

What kind of comment is that? Is that intelligent? Does it add any content to this thread? Is it understandable? The answer would be no to all the above. But thanks for the bump, maybe some intelligent post can be scared up as a result of it.

 

[sparky]

Look Founder, if you want to pose HC solutions that's fine, but let's not be presumtious of the system we do have. ~S~

 

[antagon]

what are you saying is so broke? i think the #1 factor among habitual complainers is a sense of powerlessness to affect a fix. you complain about the complaining, among other things, where are your solutions? how do you feel prepared to address situations with the rickety understanding of things you've demonstrated? wont you be best served by educating yourself?

I have proposed a lot of solutions, just see my signature for one example, and take a look at my other threads.

It seems all you have to offer is snipe, snipe, snipe at others who do propose things, such as myself. As for education, I'm not going to get into listing degrees, but I have spent a lifetime educating myself, which I doubt you have.

I'm new here and don't know people's track record, but I will try to make it a point to see if you have ever started threads, or made any serious proposals to make this a better world. My guess, in advance, is that you have not. If you want to refer me to some such thread that lays out your proposals, please do so.

But, the backseat drivers, snipers, and kibitzers are the source of some of our worst problems in this world. Life is all about attitude much more than intellect, and yours seems pretty negative and contentless as far as I can see.

But thanks for posting to my thread anyway.

despite what education you bring to the table, your position on the role of the healthcare sector in the economy has some room for improvement. vast expanses of room. granted that, its hard to see that your proposals on the matter could take a more realistic view on the industry under consideration.

looking past that mess to your take on using public infrastructure like the VA to care for persons without insurance, there's no accounting for the logistics of these groups, the effect on care for the military who already encumber the system and the role that medicare and other public care provisions play in private medicine. any pragmatic proposal must take the private sector into account. we are a long ways on from the new deal, and we should have learned by this point that closed loop government expenditure fails to enhance the economy to the extent of public/private work. by removing this input from the private system, id say you are ruining it at once.

alas, you claim the whole effort is charity. is that the sort of reasoning it takes to be in your 'front seat'? people in government, who i would consider 'front seaters', have already proposed remedies which take what i appraise as considerably better informed perspectives on the industry, its role in the economy, and the relationships between public and private enterprise. i happen to think that their conclusions are alright, as i said earlier.

youre wrapped up in this hubris, probably afforded you by your basketweaving degrees, which paints yourself as some righteous pragmatist, but such people dont talk out of the same end that you seem to. indeed, until you get some basic understandings of 'industry', 'charity', 'profit', etc. you've got to persist in your 'lifetime' quest for education, despite these terms being covered in high school.

 

[Avatar4321]

I doubt ObamaCare is the right answer.

I am not looking for "what is not the answer"...I am looking foir the answer.

I guess I am looking for a congress that does not lie.

I am also looking for a bridge for sale. Know of any?

You're not finding the answer, because the answer isn't in Congress. Government isnt the answer to life's solutions. It would be nice if it was, but it isn't.

You are the only one who can solve the problems in your own life.

 

[Avatar4321]

How many people are interested in fixing things? None? That may be true. I haven't ran across anyone on this forum or others that seem to have any interest in anything but just complaining and chatting. Is that true? If not can you please declare yourself or even send me an email, or Message. I more than just curious, as I would really like to get something done along with all the talk. What do you say?

First, what do you expect people on message boards to do precisely?

Second, what exactly do you think needs to be fixed?

Third, why do you think government is the answer to any of those problems?

 

[uscitizen]

The soloution?

Put all the political pundits in congress.

 

[Samson]

How many people are interested in fixing things? None? That may be true. I haven't ran across anyone on this forum or others that seem to have any interest in anything but just complaining and chatting. Is that true? If not can you please declare yourself or even send me an email, or Message. I more than just curious, as I would really like to get something done along with all the talk. What do you say?

First, what do you expect people on message boards to do precisely?

Second, what exactly do you think needs to be fixed?

Third, why do you think government is the answer to any of those problems?

I think I need more: Money, Fame, Fun

I expect you to handle the Fame and Fun

I expect the Government to send me more money.

 

[uscitizen]

I am still trying to figure out how to fill out my census form.

It says how many people live in the house, apt or mobile home at this address.
I live in a cave.
A very nice cave though.

 

[Founder]

what are you saying is so broke? i think the #1 factor among habitual complainers is a sense of powerlessness to affect a fix. you complain about the complaining, among other things, where are your solutions? how do you feel prepared to address situations with the rickety understanding of things you've demonstrated? wont you be best served by educating yourself?

I have proposed a lot of solutions, just see my signature for one example, and take a look at my other threads.

It seems all you have to offer is snipe, snipe, snipe at others who do propose things, such as myself. As for education, I'm not going to get into listing degrees, but I have spent a lifetime educating myself, which I doubt you have.

I'm new here and don't know people's track record, but I will try to make it a point to see if you have ever started threads, or made any serious proposals to make this a better world. My guess, in advance, is that you have not. If you want to refer me to some such thread that lays out your proposals, please do so.

But, the backseat drivers, snipers, and kibitzers are the source of some of our worst problems in this world. Life is all about attitude much more than intellect, and yours seems pretty negative and contentless as far as I can see.

But thanks for posting to my thread anyway.

despite what education you bring to the table, your position on the role of the healthcare sector in the economy has some room for improvement. vast expanses of room. granted that, its hard to see that your proposals on the matter could take a more realistic view on the industry under consideration.

looking past that mess to your take on using public infrastructure like the VA to care for persons without insurance, there's no accounting for the logistics of these groups, the effect on care for the military who already encumber the system and the role that medicare and other public care provisions play in private medicine. any pragmatic proposal must take the private sector into account. we are a long ways on from the new deal, and we should have learned by this point that closed loop government expenditure fails to enhance the economy to the extent of public/private work. by removing this input from the private system, id say you are ruining it at once.

alas, you claim the whole effort is charity. is that the sort of reasoning it takes to be in your 'front seat'? people in government, who i would consider 'front seaters', have already proposed remedies which take what i appraise as considerably better informed perspectives on the industry, its role in the economy, and the relationships between public and private enterprise. i happen to think that their conclusions are alright, as i said earlier.

youre wrapped up in this hubris, probably afforded you by your basketweaving degrees, which paints yourself as some righteous pragmatist, but such people dont talk out of the same end that you seem to. indeed, until you get some basic understandings of 'industry', 'charity', 'profit', etc. you've got to persist in your 'lifetime' quest for education, despite these terms being covered in high school.

If I couldn't write better than you do, I would never insult the intelligence of people, and shame the nation, with my illiterate stumbling English the way you do.

Your response is so disconnected and illiterate that I won't even dignify it with any response. The word pitiful comes to mind.

It seems you can't put together one single literate sentence, or complete one single thought, unless it is some expletive.

You shame whatever school you attended if, indeed, you ever attended a school at all.

On top of which, you are so lazy you can't even capitalize your sentences, which even a 1st Grader learns to do at 6 years old, and sad to say, you don't even have the excuse of being a foreigner which I could overlook.

 

[Founder]

How many people are interested in fixing things? None? That may be true. I haven't ran across anyone on this forum or others that seem to have any interest in anything but just complaining and chatting. Is that true? If not can you please declare yourself or even send me an email, or Message. I more than just curious, as I would really like to get something done along with all the talk. What do you say?

First, what do you expect people on message boards to do precisely?

Second, what exactly do you think needs to be fixed?

Third, why do you think government is the answer to any of those problems?

First, I expect people to put their money where their mouth is, and their time as well. I see trillions of words spilled and not one action based on them, and not even a single appeal to any action of any sort. As for what needs to be done, see a couple of my websites: www.Precinct.Weebly.Com and Conservative Victory Plan. These are just for starters, but even if you were a Democrat Liberal, or whatever you should be open to some sort of action of some sort.

Second, what needs to be fixed is all over this forum. (Plus see my sites above) Of course they are in the form of whining complaints, and pitiful cries of Ain't it Awful, Ain't it Awful, what Obama or Bush or you name it is doing.

Third, look, the government IS us, and people usually get the government they deserve, and that is sure the case here where we actually have a process for controlling our government if the complainers would get off their butts long enough to use it. I have written on this thread my views on the proper role of government and it does have a role v. the private sector.

Now, don't ask questions if you don't want answers, but be careful what you ask for, you just might get it, and then not like it at all, such that you will be sorry you asked, or just get mad like a child and stomp around.

 

[Avatar4321]

If I couldn't write better than you do, I would never insult the intelligence of people, and shame the nation, with my illiterate stumbling English the way you do.

Your response is so disconnected and illiterate that I won't even dignify it with any response. The word pitiful comes to mind.

It seems you can't put together one single literate sentence, or complete one single thought, unless it is some expletive.

You shame whatever school you attended if, indeed, you ever attended a school at all.

On top of which, you are so lazy you can't even capitalize your sentences, which even a 1st Grader learns to do at 6 years old, and sad to say, you don't even have the excuse of being a foreigner which I could overlook.

In other words, you can't respond to a single thing he said, so you are being a grammar Nazi.