Cancelling Student Debt is Highly Regressive

[airplanemechanic]

So you just tell the kids that work 2 jobs busting their knuckles to the bone to pay off their loans like responsible adults that life isn't fair? That's your answer?

So the kids who paid off their loans are fucked out of their money and those that don't get a free ride? And "life isn't fair" is a good enough explanation of this?

Your solution is to never make progress because it will be unfair to those that came before? Do you really think people should have to kill themselves working two jobs just to pay for an education in the greatest country on Earth?

They can go to a trade school if they want. A lot of those you can get scholarships for. I don't consider dumping the cost of someone else's higher education on taxpayers as "progress." I call that "socialism."

And with those hefty student loans come hefty degrees that are worth alot and thus they'll make a lot and can pay it off themselves. Why put this on taxpayers? Do you really think a nurse with a nursing degree and 40 grand of student debt needs help paying off that loan when they will start out making 60 grand a year as an RN?

Not everybody needs help paying off loans so maybe not everybody should get it.

What if they go to school for 3 years, incur 20 grand in student debt and drop out? They have no degree, no job and no way to pay for it. Do they get a free ride too?

 

[Anomalism]

Holy shit. You’re close to grasping the concept here. I remember when college was cheaper and you could do it in four years. Yes, cost vs benefit is something to consider when choosing a degree or whether to go at all. Crazy isn’t it?

I think if you grew up in the world today you'd find that it's a lot harder financially. You would not go as far as you did.

 

[Missouri_Mike]

Our nation isn't "healthy" because we're not giving free degrees to every tom dick and harry that wants one and can't afford it?

Funny, my dad stocked shelves at a TG&Y for 4 years to pay for college. He thinks it's bullshit that taxpayers should have to pay for college degrees of kids today. He said if I could bust my ass and pay my own way so can they.

A job stocking shelves these days would earn you 12k/yr if you're lucky. You think a young person today could do what your dad did as easily as he did, or would it be harder?

Why can’t you do that? Your only excuse is you’re too lazy.

 

[airplanemechanic]

Our nation isn't "healthy" because we're not giving free degrees to every tom dick and harry that wants one and can't afford it?

Funny, my dad stocked shelves at a TG&Y for 4 years to pay for college. He thinks it's bullshit that taxpayers should have to pay for college degrees of kids today. He said if I could bust my ass and pay my own way so can they.

A job stocking shelves these days would earn you 12k/yr if you're lucky. You think a young person today could do what your dad did as easily as he did, or would it be harder?

It would be exactly the same. My father started out at 1.25 an hour. At the end of the 4th year he was at 2 dollars an hour because of federal minimum wage.

 

[Anomalism]

What if they go to school for 3 years, incur 20 grand in student debt and drop out? They have no degree, no job and no way to pay for it. Do they get a free ride too?

It seems to me that those people need help the most. It's kind of sad that they're the ones you're least interested in helping.

 

[Anomalism]

Why can’t you do that? Your only excuse is you’re too lazy.

I think you missed the point.

 

[Anomalism]

It would be exactly the same.

That is an objectively false statement.

 

[Jimmy_Chitwood]

It is a transfer of wealth to the richest people in society and should not be done.

View attachment 423955

And a huge moral hazard

 

[Anomalism]

Alright I got shit to do people. Good talk. We can continue later if you're interested.

 

[airplanemechanic]

Alright I got shit to do people. Good talk. We can continue later if you're interested.

I hope you don't expect others to do it for you like you do with paying off people's student debt.

 

[Unkotare]

Good question. What are we doing here? We’re making a college degree the equivalent of a participation trophy. One where you can pick any stupid sport, put zero effort into and have no skills at. But you get a pity trophy for just being there.

So you think the degrees are already worthless yet they are still extremely expensive. Apparently charging 80 thousand dollars for a 6 year degree doesn't make it more useful.

The fact that you assume an undergraduate degree will take 6 years to complete really says a lot about you.

 

[Missouri_Mike]

Holy shit. You’re close to grasping the concept here. I remember when college was cheaper and you could do it in four years. Yes, cost vs benefit is something to consider when choosing a degree or whether to go at all. Crazy isn’t it?

I think if you grew up in the world today you'd find that it's a lot harder financially. You would not go as far as you did.

It’s no harder now than it was then. You’re just a whiner. WTF makes you think it was easy?

 

[Unkotare]

Only a left wing kid would need a study to see the obvious. Government regulation and horrible parents have made you worthless compared to your grandparents. And a large dose of the softest lives ever afforded to a generation in history.

you not only want your waste of four years degree in gender studies paid for (which BTW- there’s fucking two. And they are quite different thank God). But you also want 15 bucks and hour to cook fries at a fucking drive thru.

If you're not open to new information I can't help you. By the way I'm on track to get my PhD from Columbia and likely make more money than you ever have before I turn 30. Maybe be careful when passing judgment on people you don't know; you might end up looking silly.

"On track"

Who can guess the major?

 

[Missouri_Mike]

Only a left wing kid would need a study to see the obvious. Government regulation and horrible parents have made you worthless compared to your grandparents. And a large dose of the softest lives ever afforded to a generation in history.

you not only want your waste of four years degree in gender studies paid for (which BTW- there’s fucking two. And they are quite different thank God). But you also want 15 bucks and hour to cook fries at a fucking drive thru.

If you're not open to new information I can't help you. By the way I'm on track to get my PhD from Columbia and likely make more money than you ever have before I turn 30. Maybe be careful when passing judgment on people you don't know; you might end up looking silly.

If any of that is true then YOU should pay off your loans and fuck off. You’re the first kind of liberal asshole who claims to be rich but wants the working people to pay off your debt. Because you’re all for the working class right?

 

[Missouri_Mike]

See? You act as if those that came before you owe you. We don’t. Yes, work two jobs. Hell, work full time and take night classes. You don’t need to be in school full time. Get your ass out there and earn it.

I won't need to do any of that. I want to help others because I actually care about the health of our nation. It doesn't need to be that way so it shouldn't be that way.

Well if you’re going to be so rich by 30 maybe you can help me by not raising taxes and help some others by paying for their education yourself. Seems like a win for all the poor people you love so much.

 

[Missouri_Mike]

What if they go to school for 3 years, incur 20 grand in student debt and drop out? They have no degree, no job and no way to pay for it. Do they get a free ride too?

It seems to me that those people need help the most. It's kind of sad that they're the ones you're least interested in helping.

So reward failure. Congrats you tried, you failed, let us pick up the tab. Maybe next time fail harder with a new car and a house you can’t afford and we can pay for that too.

 

[ThisIsMe]

Nope, I paid mine off and worked 60 hours a week.

This is a regressive mindset. People like you would stop the world from becoming a better place out of spite and selfishness. We should always seek to make the world better for those that come after us. We should also seek to make it as easy and painless as possible for more Americans to become more educated. That's how we don't get outpaced by China in an ever technologically advancing world.

Theft and redistribution of wealth isnt painless.

Are public schools theft and redistribution of wealth? We are talking about doing things that will lead to more educated Americans. Surely educating more Americans and setting up young people as much as possible is a worthy goal for any nationalist, no? China outnumbers us almost 5 to 1. We will need to have higher quality stock if we're to remain top dog. I don't think anybody wants to find out what it'll be like when a guy like Xi is in charge of the most powerful country on Earth.

Education is going to become more and more vital as the world becomes more and more advanced. Would efforts to make it easier for young people to get educated really hinder your life in any meaningful way, or is it really just a principle thing for you? I want America to be and stay the greatest country on Earth. We can't do that if young people are continually forced to go into debilitating debt for having the audacity to seek more education.

Not everyone can be a CEO, or an IT professional, there has to be truck drivers and ditch diggers, and sanitation workers. What about people who are simply not cut out for college? What about the people who are not smart enough to get through college? Do we look at them and say "sorry, but if you were as smart as other people, you'd get free college too, so since you're not, you'll just have to contribute your tax dollars to help other smarter people pay for their college."

What do we do for those people? When you look at it like that, your idea kind of sounds a bit...elitist...

Free college would have to assume that everyone would be able to go, but, in truth, not everyone is cut out for college. Is it fair to make them pay extra tax dollars to support the smarter people who will go in to make really great money, while the not so smart folks had to work in the labor jobs all their lives to pay their way?

 

[ThisIsMe]

Nope, its a mindset that carries responsibility and accountability for one's actions. People like you are leeches.

People like me get paid to go to college.

Anyway...

Easier access to education would be good for our entire nation. I can't help but roll my eyes at right wingers that think they are nationalists. They're social Darwinists; they don't actually care about anything but themselves.

Why should we give away free money? I mean, if you are going to give away money, I want some too. That student that has $60,000 in student loans that he voluntarily took isn't any better than my home loan that I also voluntarily took.

The government paying off their student loan is no more beneficial to them than the government paying off my home loan is to me. Sure, they get a free education at taxpayer expense and get to enjoy a, generally, higher wage because of education, while I had to go to work and didn't have the money to go to college.

So, if you are going to be in favor of taking my money to give to someone else, then I want you to be in favor of taking someone else's money and give it to me. Heck, let's just give everyone $60,000!

I support things like safety nets that will stop old people from going bankrupt when they get sick. How's that?

Are you talking about universal Healthcare? If so, at least thats a program that everyone could get benefit from. Free education would not be available to everyone because not everyone is college material.

 

[danielpalos]

Solving simple poverty via market friendly means, means more people being able to choose rational options as individuals in our capital based economy.

 

[Anomalism]

It’s no harder now than it was then. You’re just a whiner. WTF makes you think it was easy?

I think you're out of touch.