Bible as the "word of God".

[ABikerSailor]

Question for you Christians..............................

If God is forever and unchanging, then shouldn't His Word be forever and unchanging as well?

And....................if the Bible is the actual Word of God, why are there so many different versions of it?

What's even more.....................why are there so many interpretations of it?

 

[irosie91]

are you trying to be stupid Emily?-----some Nazi guards singing songs
they have known from childhood somehow indicates to you that they
thought they were "doing ministry"? or that they had no idea
that they were involved in a genocide? ----well----actually both are true---
they were doing the Christian Nazi equivalent of yelling allahuakbaaar whilst
slitting throats. ----------lots of nuns squealed with delight during the AUTO DE FE
picnics of the Inquisition

Yes, the Jihadists really believe they are doing the will of God when they commit suicidal and homicidal bombings.
they believe they are doing that for God's glory. That is why it is so infuriating and tragic at the same time.

I see photos of the Nazi camp administrators taking a group photo on a bridge, smiling at the camera
as people at work, like people at BP who are told to keep doing their jobs, or people at Enron.
They just march along believing they are doing the best they can, even if it means destruction to others.

it is totally tragic irosie.

Now, I want to make it clear to you, I oppose this genocide.
I oppose any kind of oppression and harm caused to others, whether by religion or politics or whatever
people abuse to do these wrongful destructive acts.

That is not why I am trying to explain it in detail, it is NOT to justify it but the opposite: I am trying to understand
how these things happened so they can be prevented, step by step, before they escalate beyond the point of no return.

I don't agree or tolerate any form of political or religious abuse, irosie.
I believe in consent of the governed, so of course I am against all these wrongs as violating people's consent,
committing rapes, abuses, crimes, violence, theft, oppression, censorship, etc. against people's free will.

Totally wrong.

Because I believe in respecting people's consent, I have no tolerance for any abuse on any level.

That is why I try so hard to understand what went wrong from the very beginning, when the first
sign of abusive attitude could have been detected and corrected.

I believe rape, murder, genocide war can be stopped.

So yes, I was born and brought up in Texas.
I am fortunate to live in Houston, too, where people launch their own
businesses, nonprofits, campaigns, websites and set up schools or programs themselves.

So I learned from the people whose programs have proven to work to stop abuse and violence,
and to heal hurts and injustice so they don't repeat a second and third generation.

It seems you have heard bad things about Texas.
but there are also very good advantages, and I try to make the most of those
while fixing the problems we have.

I happen to live in a black historic district destroyed by corporate politics,
so I had to learn how to deal with corruption and abuses all around me,
and still focus on the people investing in solutions while everyone else sold us out.

I had to forgive all that, even forgive the people I was working with and trusted
who dumped debts on me they were supposed to help pay and never did.

So irosie just because I forgive the wrongs and abuses surrounding me,
yes in Houston Texas where I admit there is a lot of waste and corruption by our local govt,
does NOT mean I agree with it, or justify and enable it. I work very hard to invest in
corrections and standing up and speaking out against the wrongs, even writing up
proposals for how to correct the problems that have gone on for years.

Please do not mistake my willingness to work out solutions
for agreeing with the problems I oppose. Of course I am against
anything wrong, unjust and harmful to people. The reason I forgive
these wrongs is to clear my conscience of bitterness so I can better
understnad and work on solutions instead of collapsing or blowing up emotionally
as I have in the past over these wrongs going on for so long. that doesn't help.

Only working in positive ways to correct and prevent the problems is going to change them.

thanks irosie
I'm glad to know you care so much
that you are willing to fight the good fight

Good for you and I hope to be your ally
in the battles you take on to make a difference in the world

more power to you!
best wishes,
yours truly,
emily

I am not impressed-------you are a nothing more than an islamo Nazi pig-----with
a FACADE

I am not islamic and not nazi or fascist.
I am messy like a pig, my bf and family can attest to that.

But no, I do not believe in forcing any religion on people by coercion.
I believe in respecting people's own faith and beliefs, including atheism,
including opposing views so that people can mediate to resolve conflicts by consensus of all parties.

irosie i have been online for many years, posting my Constitutional
beliefs about isonomy, and my beliefs in Universal inclusion and salvation.
Here are summaries of my beliefs that have been posted since 1999-2009:
http www.houstonprogressive.org
ethics-commission.net
http www.houstonprogressive.org
Some friends do not believe I am a Democrat, but I've never been accused of
being islamic, that is a new one.

irosie if you can find ONE Muslim or ONE Nazi
who believes in Constitutional equal protections of all religions,
then maybe you can find a way to make that label fit my beliefs.

The closest labels I have found for what I believe are
* Constitutionalism
* Isonomy or Isocracy
* Universal Salvation

No, I have not found Nazi's who believe in these things, have you?

I agree with you I am a pig when it comes to making messes in my car and room.
I work two jobs because of debts I racked up trying to help friends with nonprofit
groups to save poor communities from losing their centers and programs during the recession.

so I don't have time to clean up my stuff and yes it looks like a pig's sty.
you are right on that point but not the others.

your posts betray you. ------even your lingo betrays you------I have not yet accessed
your links-----------their titles are highly supicious

 

[irosie91]

If you do not relate to the Bible,
then I suggest that you can connect with others
through studying Constitutional laws and principles,
and that is another way that works. As long as people
agree to respect each other as equals, we can share
freely and learn more from each other that way.

Are you more inclined to discuss universal principles such as
* consent of the governed
* free exercise of religion and equal protections of law for all beliefs
* freedom of speech and of the press (either media, or writing laws
or even discussing things online is using communication freely for peaceful means)
* right to assemble and to petition for redress of grievances
"due process" or democratic process
* conflict resolution to reach agreement or consensus instead of bullying or coercion

Do any of these issues appeal to you?

Do you have any opinions or concerns about any of the
political or religious conflicts you see people discussing or debating.

Do you have ideas on solutions you would like to share with more people?

Thank you, Muslim75
And yes I do believe in doing all things by God's will:
if we can agree point by point what is the greater good,
then we can establish God's truth and will and work together to achieve that.
I believe this is what it means to form agreements in Christ or by Conscience.
And whenever two or three agree on this level it is done collectively by God on a greater scale.
This is one of my favorite Bible Scriptures: Matthew 18:15-20
the closest Constitutional equivalent is to assemble and petition to redress grievances,
so I believe in doing this to reach a consensus by resolving conflicts peaceably
this is both a Christian and Constitutional concept, so if people do not relate
to the Bible, they can still practice democratic due process by the Bill of Rights which a lot of people understand and respect. I was also told that Mohammad taught democratic principles, and laid out points for them. This includes religious freedom or "no compulsion in religion". So we actually share more in common with natural laws of democracy that Mohammad also taught. Somehow this gets lost in religious debates, so maybe we would make more progress by focusing on the democratic laws of government taught using both Constitutional laws and teachings or principles of Mohammad that also respect the same Natural Laws from God.

Emily----your response to muslim75 confirms my statement that you know
nothing at all about ISLAM. ----for the record-----whatever you imagine
muhummad "taught"-----is moot Islam is determined by its scholars----just
as Christianity by its scholars and Judaism by its scholars. We have no idea
what muhummad "taught" ------he did not leave a single written word----
the Koran was written more than 100 years after he died. Muslim scholars
absolutely reject "equality" before "the law" and absolutely advocate
imposition of islam or complete subservience to it -------one or the other. If
you have muslim friends who deny that fact------they are lying. Of course they
could be engaging in wishful thinking

 

[emilynghiem]

If you do not relate to the Bible,
then I suggest that you can connect with others
through studying Constitutional laws and principles,
and that is another way that works. As long as people
agree to respect each other as equals, we can share
freely and learn more from each other that way.

Are you more inclined to discuss universal principles such as
* consent of the governed
* free exercise of religion and equal protections of law for all beliefs
* freedom of speech and of the press (either media, or writing laws
or even discussing things online is using communication freely for peaceful means)
* right to assemble and to petition for redress of grievances
"due process" or democratic process
* conflict resolution to reach agreement or consensus instead of bullying or coercion

Do any of these issues appeal to you?

Do you have any opinions or concerns about any of the
political or religious conflicts you see people discussing or debating.

Do you have ideas on solutions you would like to share with more people?

Thank you, Muslim75
And yes I do believe in doing all things by God's will:
if we can agree point by point what is the greater good,
then we can establish God's truth and will and work together to achieve that.
I believe this is what it means to form agreements in Christ or by Conscience.
And whenever two or three agree on this level it is done collectively by God on a greater scale.
This is one of my favorite Bible Scriptures: Matthew 18:15-20
the closest Constitutional equivalent is to assemble and petition to redress grievances,
so I believe in doing this to reach a consensus by resolving conflicts peaceably
this is both a Christian and Constitutional concept, so if people do not relate
to the Bible, they can still practice democratic due process by the Bill of Rights which a lot of people understand and respect. I was also told that Mohammad taught democratic principles, and laid out points for them. This includes religious freedom or "no compulsion in religion". So we actually share more in common with natural laws of democracy that Mohammad also taught. Somehow this gets lost in religious debates, so maybe we would make more progress by focusing on the democratic laws of government taught using both Constitutional laws and teachings or principles of Mohammad that also respect the same Natural Laws from God.

Emily----your response to muslim75 confirms my statement that you know
nothing at all about ISLAM. ----for the record-----whatever you imagine
muhummad "taught"-----is moot Islam is determined by its scholars----just
as Christianity by its scholars and Judaism by its scholars. We have no idea
what muhummad "taught" ------he did not leave a single written word----
the Koran was written more than 100 years after he died. Muslim scholars
absolutely reject "equality" before "the law" and absolutely advocate
imposition of islam or complete subservience to it -------one or the other. If
you have muslim friends who deny that fact------they are lying. Of course they
could be engaging in wishful thinking

I understood he issued some decrees as a political leader.
Im at work catching up. Im happy to look them up later and post references that were sent to me on this subject. i find it critical that there is agreement on due process in order to stop political abuses of religion by any group including secular parties that do the same things abusing their political beliefs to excludexand bully othets. I oppose this oppression in all forms and support conflict resolution and consensus to settleall grievances including yours.

And irosie whether we believe the Constitutional laws were ibspired by God or just written by man or both, whatever is universally true speakS to human nature or conscience regardless what our religions are or say. So muslims can follow constitutional laws also and still be muslim. Please grow up.

 

[emilynghiem]

are you trying to be stupid Emily?-----some Nazi guards singing songs
they have known from childhood somehow indicates to you that they
thought they were "doing ministry"? or that they had no idea
that they were involved in a genocide? ----well----actually both are true---
they were doing the Christian Nazi equivalent of yelling allahuakbaaar whilst
slitting throats. ----------lots of nuns squealed with delight during the AUTO DE FE
picnics of the Inquisition

Yes, the Jihadists really believe they are doing the will of God when they commit suicidal and homicidal bombings.
they believe they are doing that for God's glory. That is why it is so infuriating and tragic at the same time.

I see photos of the Nazi camp administrators taking a group photo on a bridge, smiling at the camera
as people at work, like people at BP who are told to keep doing their jobs, or people at Enron.
They just march along believing they are doing the best they can, even if it means destruction to others.

it is totally tragic irosie.

Now, I want to make it clear to you, I oppose this genocide.
I oppose any kind of oppression and harm caused to others, whether by religion or politics or whatever
people abuse to do these wrongful destructive acts.

That is not why I am trying to explain it in detail, it is NOT to justify it but the opposite: I am trying to understand
how these things happened so they can be prevented, step by step, before they escalate beyond the point of no return.

I don't agree or tolerate any form of political or religious abuse, irosie.
I believe in consent of the governed, so of course I am against all these wrongs as violating people's consent,
committing rapes, abuses, crimes, violence, theft, oppression, censorship, etc. against people's free will.

Totally wrong.

Because I believe in respecting people's consent, I have no tolerance for any abuse on any level.

That is why I try so hard to understand what went wrong from the very beginning, when the first
sign of abusive attitude could have been detected and corrected.

I believe rape, murder, genocide war can be stopped.

So yes, I was born and brought up in Texas.
I am fortunate to live in Houston, too, where people launch their own
businesses, nonprofits, campaigns, websites and set up schools or programs themselves.

So I learned from the people whose programs have proven to work to stop abuse and violence,
and to heal hurts and injustice so they don't repeat a second and third generation.

It seems you have heard bad things about Texas.
but there are also very good advantages, and I try to make the most of those
while fixing the problems we have.

I happen to live in a black historic district destroyed by corporate politics,
so I had to learn how to deal with corruption and abuses all around me,
and still focus on the people investing in solutions while everyone else sold us out.

I had to forgive all that, even forgive the people I was working with and trusted
who dumped debts on me they were supposed to help pay and never did.

So irosie just because I forgive the wrongs and abuses surrounding me,
yes in Houston Texas where I admit there is a lot of waste and corruption by our local govt,
does NOT mean I agree with it, or justify and enable it. I work very hard to invest in
corrections and standing up and speaking out against the wrongs, even writing up
proposals for how to correct the problems that have gone on for years.

Please do not mistake my willingness to work out solutions
for agreeing with the problems I oppose. Of course I am against
anything wrong, unjust and harmful to people. The reason I forgive
these wrongs is to clear my conscience of bitterness so I can better
understnad and work on solutions instead of collapsing or blowing up emotionally
as I have in the past over these wrongs going on for so long. that doesn't help.

Only working in positive ways to correct and prevent the problems is going to change them.

thanks irosie
I'm glad to know you care so much
that you are willing to fight the good fight

Good for you and I hope to be your ally
in the battles you take on to make a difference in the world

more power to you!
best wishes,
yours truly,
emily

I am not impressed-------you are a nothing more than an islamo Nazi pig-----with
a FACADE

I am not islamic and not nazi or fascist.
I am messy like a pig, my bf and family can attest to that.

But no, I do not believe in forcing any religion on people by coercion.
I believe in respecting people's own faith and beliefs, including atheism,
including opposing views so that people can mediate to resolve conflicts by consensus of all parties.

irosie i have been online for many years, posting my Constitutional
beliefs about isonomy, and my beliefs in Universal inclusion and salvation.
Here are summaries of my beliefs that have been posted since 1999-2009:
http www.houstonprogressive.org
ethics-commission.net
http www.houstonprogressive.org
Some friends do not believe I am a Democrat, but I've never been accused of
being islamic, that is a new one.

irosie if you can find ONE Muslim or ONE Nazi
who believes in Constitutional equal protections of all religions,
then maybe you can find a way to make that label fit my beliefs.

The closest labels I have found for what I believe are
* Constitutionalism
* Isonomy or Isocracy
* Universal Salvation

No, I have not found Nazi's who believe in these things, have you?

I agree with you I am a pig when it comes to making messes in my car and room.
I work two jobs because of debts I racked up trying to help friends with nonprofit
groups to save poor communities from losing their centers and programs during the recession.

so I don't have time to clean up my stuff and yes it looks like a pig's sty.
you are right on that point but not the others.

your posts betray you. ------even your lingo betrays you------I have not yet accessed
your links-----------their titles are highly supicious

Hi irosie91
Go ahead and read and rip me up all you want. I appreciate your honest feedback. I'm all for correcting and refining whatever isnt clear or is missing.

The closest labels I have found for my views are isonomy or isocracy.

Nazi cannot hande the level of inclusion and consensus I seek by free will not by coersion. Most ppl practice exclusion and bullying so they think I am weak or idealistic to believe in coming to agreements by free choice. Most ppl dont think its possible to make peace and want to punish and force things on people.

So you wont find a lot of ppl who agree my views are even possible.

Thanks irosie

Btw i believe in holding ppl to their own views, let ppl speak fir themselves and apply their rules to themselves. So we dont have to compete or impose on anyone else. Form agreements on common points we share, and agree to separate where we want different choices. And stop all forms of bullying and abuse by governing by civil agreement, by consent of the governed and informed consent.

 

[Avatar4321]

Dear Muslim75: Thank you for your honest answer.

Thank you.

"In the name of God, the Most Merciful, the Great Merciful" means whatever we do, we do it with the help of God Almighty and only thanks to the help of God Almighty.

have you read the bible?

I told you already, I don't wish to.

so you are going to make a judgment about something you've never read? How do you know if you're correct if you haven't educated yourself on the matter?

 

[Muslim75]

The Question is, how do you dare say prophethood ended with Jesus ? How do you dare say the Bible is the word of God ? How do you dare say the Qur'an is not the word of God ? How do you dare say Jesus was killed ? And how do you openly find fault with the absolute king of 1.2 billion Muslims (Muhammad, peace be upon him and his family) ?

 

[Muslim75]

Emily,

Who talked about constitutions and laws ? Islam teaches to obey the laws of your country. That is why you have all these Muslim people who took part in World War I and II. They had to obey the laws of the British and the French and go to war alongside them.

 

[Avatar4321]

Question for you Christians..............................

If God is forever and unchanging, then shouldn't His Word be forever and unchanging as well?

And....................if the Bible is the actual Word of God, why are there so many different versions of it?

What's even more.....................why are there so many interpretations of it?

the Word of God is Jesus Christ. He is everlasting to everlasting. The bible is the recorded testimony of the prophets and apostles of Jesus Christ.

as for versions, it's been translated many times. Some translations are better than others. That is precisely why we have been given the Holy Ghost to help us understand them.

people interpret passages differently because not everyone listens to the Spirit.

 

[Avatar4321]

The Question is, how do you dare say prophethood ended with Jesus ? How do you dare say the Bible is the word of God ? How do you dare say the Qur'an is not the word of God ? How do you dare say Jesus was killed ? And how do you openly find fault with the absolute king of 1.2 billion Muslims (Muhammad, peace be upon him and his family) ?

I haven't said prophethood ended with Jesus. In fact I have been very clear that God still calls prophets and that the spirit of prophesy is still manifest in the world. That's why Christ told us how to tell a true prophet from a false one. "By their fruits ye shall know them"

I say that the bible is the word of God because it testifies of Jesus the Christ. It contains the revelations from God to the prophets and apostles. I say the Book of Mormon is the word of God for the same reasons. Both records teach the doctrine of Christ. And the record of Judah and the record of Joseph shall be in the hands of Ephraim as prophesied to put down false doctrine and restore Israel as a united kingdom.

most importantly the Lord has revealed to me that both books are true by the Holy Spirit.

I say the Qur'an is not the word of God because ive read it and it denies the divinity of Jesus Christ the Son of God when the spirit of prophesy is a testimony of Jesus Christ.

I testify that Jesus atoned and died for the sins of the world because the spirit has revealed it to me. I've uses the power of the atonement in my life. And I know for myself from the Spirit that He rose from the dead. That He sacrifices Himself out of love for us.

as for finding fault with your king, I have no clue who your king is. I assume you mean Mohammed. And I don't care about him enough to find fault with him. He is accountable to God for His sins. As are all mortal men. I choose to serve the Lord and not a mortal man. Particularly not a dead one.

 

[emilynghiem]

Emily----your response to muslim75 confirms my statement that you know
nothing at all about ISLAM. ----for the record-----whatever you imagine
muhummad "taught"-----is moot Islam is determined by its scholars----just
as Christianity by its scholars and Judaism by its scholars. We have no idea
what muhummad "taught" ------he did not leave a single written word----
the Koran was written more than 100 years after he died. Muslim scholars
absolutely reject "equality" before "the law" and absolutely advocate
imposition of islam or complete subservience to it -------one or the other. If
you have muslim friends who deny that fact------they are lying. Of course they
could be engaging in wishful thinking

Dear irosie91:

Neither do you, nor many Muslims for that matter, know what is in the teachings of Mohammad. My friend Mustafaa Carroll clearly stated that many Muslims are in need of reform! The problem is with how Islam is mistaught and not corrected (similar to problems pointed out with Christianity -- the message says one thing: to love and forgive one another and have faith that God's will and Justice is done by agreement in Christ, but many followers practice the opposite, thus confusing the message.)

[I can't find the email that explained that faith can never be forced or it is not true faith; for faith to be real it must be freely chosen or it's not sincere, it is false faith. That is just common logic and independent of any religion. I credit Mustafaa, who speaks publicly as a leader in the peace and justice community as well as the Muslim community, for explaining this in plain terms.

But that is what is meant by "no compulsion in religion, which is the Muslim way of teaching what the Buddhists also teach by avoiding "indoctrination" and exercising "independent investigation" -- to study what is true and adopting what is found to be consistent. I am still looking for the email that explained the democratic principles that were contained in the Medina Charter.]

Here is one response explaining that the Medina Charter was a constitution drawn up by Mohammad, including the principles of democracy and "no compulsion in religion"

=======================
Mustafaa Carroll response to emails:
1. "...there is nothing in Islam that says we need to agree in order to be respectful. Additionally, tell your friend to look up the Medina Charter. This was a constitution drawn up by Prophet Muhammed (pbuh) that include Jews, Christians, Pagans, etc... The purpose was that they would support and defend all of the citizens of Medina regardless of faith and ethnicity..”

On peaceful coexistence, which Islam specifies between Jews Christians and Muslims:

2. "This is true. The Qur'an specifically cites peoples of the book. Qur'an Chapter 2 Verse 62: "Surely those who believe (in the Qur'an), and those who follow the Jewish (scriptures), and the Christians and the Sabians, any who believe in God and the Last Day and work righteousness, shall have their reward with their Lord; on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve."

"As I have stated many times before Islam promotes peace with all of humanity whether they believe or not. Islam does permit Muslims to fight in defense (only) of themselves, their families, their property, and oppression. Chapter 2:190 & 193:"fight in the cause of God against those who fight against you, but begin not hostilities. Lo, God loveth not the aggressors." "And fight them until there is no more oppression or persecution and until justice and faith in God prevails. But if they desist, let there be no hostility except against those wrongdoers who practice oppression."

3. "The Qur'an specifies Judaism, Christianity, and Islam because they have monotheistic beginnings and share many of the same prophets. Kind, fair and just treatment of all people is implied and stated throughout the Qur'an even those who do not believe or worship "false gods". For example Qur'an Chapter 9:6 - "If any one of the pagans ask thee for asylum, then grant him protection so that he may hear the word of God, then escort him to where he can be safe and secure. That is because there are those who know not."
===================
Dear irosie: to resolve these conflicts, it helps if the people are committed to seeking true and resolving error in Christ Jesus or Restorative Justice. My friend Mustafaa Carroll above does believe in establishing truth and resolving error to create peace and justice in relations with all others. This is the correct teachings in both Christianity and in Islam as he teaches and practices it.

I have other friends who are Muslim and practice the same principles in Christianity and Constitutional law we all agree are given by God, so these are in agreement and Harmony. Two of my Muslim friends also believe in Buddhism as true or divine wisdom from God. Buddhism does not teach or practice any coercion, violence or oppression in any form; in fact it has been criticized for being too passive and thus allowing too much freedom for wrongs to continue. So practitioners have specified to expand Buddhism into "engaged Buddhism" so this peace is extended into the community. Like the Jewish Zen peacemaker Bernie Glassman who actively seeks conflict resolution and inclusion to address the causes and prevent oppression, not just remain so passive that it continues unchecked.

The only people that get in conflict are ones that cannot forgive, but fear and reject each other. I find this among people of all faiths or no faiths. It is not caused by the religion. It is caused by fear and unforgiveness among people and projected through religion and politics onto whole groups. The bullying behavior happens everywhere, not just by religion.

Lastly it is ironic that you see me as a Nazi oppressor of some sort. Very few people misunderstand me to that degree as you do. Most people criticize me for the opposite!

Because I respect your free will and consent, and believe you and all people should have freedom to change your mind if you accept explanation or information and not by force, bullying or insult (as you have repeatedly accused and insulted me of things I am not),

My friends will jump on me for being too open, too willing to work with "idiots online" which they consider people like you, who jump to accusations without even knowing.

Most people will not tolerate this abuse, forgive it, and still agree to try to work with such persons. But because I have faith I am NOT the "Nazi" fascist or islamo-whatever you have declared me to be, then I don't let it bother me. I trust you will figure it out, and it is just this internet culture where everyone is used to people lying on here.

It makes no sense because that's not what I believe, so OBVIOUSLY to me it is because you do not know me, so you suspect I must be "up to something awful" if I am that naively nice to you. Of course you must think it is lying to cover up for something malicious, because nobody is that nice online. And uses real names? Who does that?

I do, because of all the falseness online, I decided to stand for who I am and have nothing to hide. If I make mistakes, my real name is on my messages and I have to answer to them. I believe in complete "Transparency" in order to have honest open and free communications.

When you get over the shock I am actually an honest open person, trying to find ways to make peace with everyone I meet online, so these same solutions can be shared with others to form a consensus on God and all other religions, then you might understand why it made no sense to me your accusing me of things I do not even believe in -- like forcing false beliefs on people as form of "Nazi" oppression -- which is against everything I believe which I have openly posted online, using my real name, for the past several years so there is no mistaking what I stand for.

I don't mind corrections, in fact that is why I interact online in order to receive and share corrections to help me and everyone equally. So I appreciate your feedback, and I do apologize for whatever caused you to misunderstand and fear I was trying to oppress, mislead or otherwise harm anyone by possibly spreading false propaganda as religion.

My apologies for this which I understand happens over the Internet and is not the fault of the people trying our best. Thank you, irosie for your efforts, and I hope it gets easier after this!

Yours truly,
May you be richly blessed with even greater
abundance of God's love truth and wisdom.

Emily

Emily Nghiem

 

[irosie91]

Emily-----you are a propagandaist for the filth of islamo Nazism-----you disgust me

For those who do not know-----Emily is more dangerous than is ISIS. I know
because I have rubbed shoulders with muslims for more than 45 years and read their
propaganda more than 55 years ago. same crap

 

[emilynghiem]

Yes, Muslim75: Agreed and well explained, Thank you for this!

There are two or three ways to connect with the same Constitutional laws as a common authority to be respected:

1. One is by the rule you cite, to respect the laws of the country, and this is also taught in Christian scripture to submit to human institutions, obey civil authority "render unto Caesar that which is Caesar's and unto God that which is God's"

2. Also, if one believes that Natural Laws were given by God, then the Constitutional laws (and also democratic principles from Mohammad) are based on these Natural Laws that are universal for all humanity by our human nature given by God. so they still reflect universal truths for all mankind.

Either way, we can use these same principles to reach agreement
and do not need to suffer oppression or abuses caused by conflicts; we can correct these problems peaceably by resolving them civilly and democratically between the people.

Thank you, and I am glad you are here to share from your perspective and understanding of God, so we can see all sides and learn more from each other.

Yours truly,
Emily

 

[irosie91]

muhummad was a thief, rapist and murderer----nice hero you got there Emily. As
a leader----he was more sociopathic than Stalin and the Islamic all time fave---
Adolf Hitler

 

[emilynghiem]

Emily-----you are a propagandaist for the filth of islamo Nazism-----you disgust me

For those who do not know-----Emily is more dangerous than is ISIS. I know
because I have rubbed shoulders with muslims for more than 45 years and read their
propaganda more than 55 years ago. same crap

????

Dear irosie91: Can you find me ONE ISIS person who believes in civil due process and conflict resolution to prevent abuse and violence by Consensus between parties.

I am the exact opposite of ISIS. That is why everyone makes fun of me!
My boyfriend tells me my ideas won't work because Jihadist ISIS would rape and kill me on the spot. for asking all parties to make peace, between Jews Christians and Muslims. They think I am dangerously naive for trying to work with people, including liberal Democrats and conservative Republicans. and Prolife with Prochoice. But I have friends on all sides, we find solutions, and we share them with others. There is no violence between us, so what is this comparison with ISIS? these people abuse teenagers, get them pregnant, and force them to fight. I work with nonprofit groups, including Jewish and Christian, to reverse the damage of gangs.

What are you talking about, irosie91?
What is this 55 years of whatever, can you explain to me what beliefs you THINK I have?

Irosie: I posted to you my beliefs, and have found NOBODY who teaches the Constitution that way, that it empowers all people to solve our problems together as sharing equal responsibility for govt, including fix govt problems instead of fighting over them which I do not believe in.

Who teaches consensus by due process and free choice? Most people teach to depend on Bullies to fight each other "for you." Or like Obama, they IMPOSE consensus "against people's will" which makes no sense at all! True consensus means people naturally agree, like how the Greens practice consensus decision making: nothing is coerced, it is arrived at by discussing all objections and working them out until an agreed solution is reached.

If you are mistaking me for Obama, excuse me but no! I think Rush Limbaugh and others have more respect for Obama as President, while I feel sorry for him and think he should have been VP and worked with the people across the States to rebuild communities and let someone else run the country. I didn't vote for Obama either time because he sends the wrong message, and goes about govt the wrong way: we should work from the bottom up, not mandate from top down. So I am against imposing mandates and calling that consensus, that is unconstitutional.

I promote conflict resolution and consensus, to the point people MOCK me for my beliefs in "Restorative Justice" as the peaceful means to help all people form agreements by free will.

irosie I hate to embarrass you in the Bullring,
but you are like trying to tell me day is night, and night is day,
by equating me with ISIS and any NAZI anything.

Most people mock me for being too nice; while you accuse me of the opposite?
For enabling "Nazi or Islamist oppression" when I seek to prevent it at ALL LEVELS?

Are we talking about the same emilynghiem?

The only way I am "more dangerous" than ISIS is if they are unraveled by a harmless "overgrown Girl Scout" who wants to make peace with everyone, and set up voluntary restitution for all wrongs committed. If I undo them by being "so kind" it makes them laugh, and drop their guns to grab their stomachs and split sides from laughing, maybe I could be more dangerous in that sense! My friends who know me DO think I could have this comic effect on people as my most 'dangerous' weapon.

My boyfriend says otherwise, and that they wouldn't hesitate to clobber me.

So I do not understand what it will take to get this image out of your mind! My goodness!

Sorry irosie, this is not me. The only thing dangerous about me is I am dangerously naive. I think you are simply misunderstanding me, but other people would say I am naive and you are an idiot for assuming such things. They would say awful things about you, while I give you the benefit of the doubt.

I'm sorry if I do a disservice to you by continuing to be naive and thinking you simply misunderstand me because you do not know me. Sorry for this, but it is not my way .

Here are my websites for what I am working on, to set up sustainable campuses to convert slave labor factories into schools where people can rebuild their communities themselves. No oppression needed, sorry to disappoint you irosie but I don't believe in coercion or violence:

Earned Amnesty

music video for Sustainable Campus converting sweatshop labor to workstudy jobs

Freedmen s Town Historic Churches and Vet Housing

 

[emilynghiem]

muhummad was a thief, rapist and murderer----nice hero you got there Emily. As
a leader----he was more sociopathic than Stalin and the Islamic all time fave---
Adolf Hitler

Bill Clinton is also a rapist in the minds of many people.

But after he saved those two journalists and brought them home from North Korea
by negotiating because he was seen as a "rock star" going over there, then he's a hero to those women and families, while a criminal to any women who report he raped them.

irosie91: many people blame me for when I was forced to abort a baby against my will including my personal religious beliefs. to other people who do not know me (and don't know I was forced like rape because my boyfriend at that time threatened to kill himself and verbally and emotionally bullied and coerced me until I gave up) I am considered a murderer even though this was completely against my will.

So you can judge me also, if you want. But because of that incident, that is why I work with everybody I know to stop coercion because it happened to me. So I am against bullying and will do everything I can to stop abuse, especially relationship fraud and coercion that caused unwanted abortion in my case, and in many others where women like me were forced.

If you feel you must judge me as a murderer, I respect your views, and have put up with that a lot. I see it as blaming the rape victim for the rape, but understand people believe I had the choice not to give in to the pressure when my boyfriend threatened me and himself. Many women go through that and don't abort, so next to them I compromised.

I don't see how that does any good, to judge me in negative ways for something that was forced on me, but if it makes you feel better, maybe that's good! I respect your beliefs.

I know a family whose dad and uncle molested two of the daughters when they were in their teens. Today, that would be prosecuted as incest, pedophilia, and sexual abuse and these men would be registered as "sex offenders" on their records.

Today the family is reconciled, and they all agreed to put that in the past, though it still hurts some of the next generation, who carry some of that same sickness in the form of drug abuse. The other family members are pretty much resolved with it and don't have criminal issues.

Just because they FORGIVE the dad and uncle does not mean they support sex crimes.
Everyone I know is opposed to anyone who commits such acts. Forgiveness does not mean advocating wrongs, it means letting go emotionally. the wrongs are still wrong.

Here is a whole website by my friend Juda who is prolife (I am prochoice but we work together on ways to stop rape and promote help for women in recovery from crisis):
Home

This website is filled with stories of women raped by strangers or family members, and had to reconcile with family anyway. Just because people FORGIVE rape and incest, does not mean we promote it! We are against it, but we work with all people and to do that means to forgive all people.

Juda and Olivia both come from Jewish Christian faith background. They both help victims of sex abuse by forgiveness in order to heal, while remaining opposed to the abuse which is illegal.

I think you have forgiveness issues and that is why you judge me so harshly

BTW for Mohammad I understand that
1. he was a military leader during wartime so those actions and strategies in war
are different from the laws that people follow during peacetime. our US soldiers
are sometimes instructed to shoot to kill without question, and that would be illegal
under civilian Constitutional law where you follow due process and don't shoot people yourself.
What we teach citizens to follow as the law, is different from what soldiers in war are commanded to do. So many people consider Bush to be a murderer as Commander in Chief ordering the Iraqi War, yet most Americans do not support seeking charges against him. He goes to church and participates in charity like any other citizen or Christian, and is well respected for that.

2. the 9 year old that was given to him in marriage was an old cultural tradition.
in those days, and practiced in some countries today, you give your daughters to men as a gift, as an honor. I don't agree with that cultural practice, and to most people it is outdated.

I would compare this to how the Founding Fathers were part of a slave culture
that bred slaves and raped both Irish and Black slave women to breed more slaves.

I forgive that slavery in the founding and building of our country, but that doesn't mean I promote more slavery! The Constitutional laws are still good and valid, even though the slavery was and is still bad by oppressing people as unequal, which is against Constitutional laws of equal protection and free exercise, and no involuntary servitude or deprivation of liberty without due process of laws.

Today we have slave labor producing most of our electronics, and I don't want that to continue.

That is why I promote the idea of converting factories into campuses and work-study jobs in order to gradually convert cheap labor into livable wages and support for community workers: http www.houstonprogressive.org

Just because I FORGIVE slavery does not mean I promote it going on.

 

[irosie91]

try again Emily-----I judge you for the FACT that you are an islamo Nazi----nothing to
do with abortion. Bill Clinton is not a rapist ----but he committed an act so
unethical that he should have been impeached ----simply because ANY ADMIRAL
in the USA Navy who did what he did would wind up in jail. In fact the captain of the
NAVAL HOSPITAL in which I worked decades ago------did

as regards your idiot friend who imagines that muhummad was a nice guy-----
my very own husband was born a DHIMMI-------a concept taken directly from the
filth that the writers of the Koran claim that muhummad taught. ---here is an idea---
ask that disgusting dog about the "BEAUTY OF DHIMMA"

 

[emilynghiem]

Do you support slavery irosie? if you believe in supporting the US govt, and the govt once defended slavery, and enforced laws treating people like property, does that mean you are supporting rape and slavery because this is part of US history?

try again Emily-----I judge you for the FACT that you are an islamo Nazi----nothing to
do with abortion. Bill Clinton is not a rapist ----but he committed an act so
unethical that he should have been impeached ----simply because ANY ADMIRAL
in the USA Navy who did what he did would wind up in jail. In fact the captain of the
NAVAL HOSPITAL in which I worked decades ago------did

as regards your idiot friend who imagines that muhummad was a nice guy-----
my very own husband was born a DHIMMI-------a concept taken directly from the
filth that the writers of the Koran claim that muhummad taught. ---here is an idea---
ask that disgusting dog about the "BEAUTY OF DHIMMA"

I didn't say he was a nice guy.
He was a military commander and had to go to war very viciously to build an empire.

What I'm saying is that it is completely possible to have a person act as a warmonger in political and military contexts, like Bush commanding US soldiers to kill without question.

And then turn around and have this same person teach the right thing with spiritual laws also.

Bush came out and talked about ending the oppression that caused terrorism to take over,
by ADDRESSING the poverty and supporting faith-based groups to help. He included the work of faith-based groups to help people integrate back into society from prison.

So the same person who can command soldiers to go to war,
can also teach and practice charity.

The Jihadists who are wrong take Mohammad's military commands out of context,
and they try to take justice into their own hands and declare war on innocent civilians.

irosie, that is like the people who commit school shootings, thinking they are bringing justice. Or David Koresh. That is criminal to act like soldiers in a civilian context.

Most civilians know better than to try to take the Constitution into our own hands and try to declare govt to be the enemy and start shooting up places in protest. We know that's illegal.

So the Jihadists are wrong, and that has nothing to do with Muslims who are following God and trying and learning to live in peace like how everyone else is.

irosie did you see my message about how our Constitutional govt was built on slavery?

Do you support slavery irosie? if you believe in supporting the US govt, and the govt once defended slavery, and enforced laws treating people like property, does that mean you are supporting rape and slavery because this is part of US history?

 

[emilynghiem]

BTW irosie91 THANKS
you remind me why I am NOT Muslim.
Why I stick to Buddhism, Constitutionalism and Christianity.

There is too much work to fix what is wrong with how Islam is taught.
I believe you would have to add Christianity and Constitutionalism to it
to make sure people didn't abuse Islam the way it is by militant terrorists.

So if it takes adding Christianity and Constitutionalism to end abuses of Islam,
you might as well practice those directly and save the trouble.

But for those practicing Islam correctly, I respect their culture and language
and recognize the Muslim traditions and teachings are part of that culture.

But it cannot conflict with or usurp/supercede Christianity or the Constitution.

Like Atheism, Hinduism, Buddhism etc. can be practiced peaceably so can Islam or any other religion under the Constitution and respect the religious freedom and due process of others equally.

Nobody has to endorse or practice the bad things in the history of the Bible, or the history of Islam or the history of the Constitution, that are NEGATIVE. And we can agree to practice the positive teachings we agree are correct and which prevent the problems and oppression in the past from repeating, even which occurred within our own systems. We can correct all those things!

 

[irosie91]

Do you support slavery irosie? if you believe in supporting the US govt, and the govt once defended slavery, and enforced laws treating people like property, does that mean you are supporting rape and slavery because this is part of US history?



I didn't say he was a nice guy.
He was a military commander and had to go to war very viciously to build an empire.

****off topic

What I'm saying is that it is completely possible to have a person act as a warmonger in political and military contexts, like Bush commanding US soldiers to kill without question.

And then turn around and have this same person teach the right thing with spiritual laws also.

Bush came out and talked about ending the oppression that caused terrorism to take over,
by ADDRESSING the poverty and supporting faith-based groups to help. He included the work of faith-based groups to help people integrate back into society from prison.

So the same person who can command soldiers to go to war,
can also teach and practice charity.

The Jihadists who are wrong take Mohammad's military commands out of context,
and they try to take justice into their own hands and declare war on innocent civilians.

irosie, that is like the people who commit school shootings, thinking they are bringing justice. Or David Koresh. That is criminal to act like soldiers in a civilian context.

Most civilians know better than to try to take the Constitution into our own hands and try to declare govt to be the enemy and start shooting up places in protest. We know that's illegal.

So the Jihadists are wrong, and that has nothing to do with Muslims who are following God and trying and learning to live in peace like how everyone else is.

irosie did you see my message about how our Constitutional govt was built on slavery?

Do you support slavery irosie?

****no Emily----you support slavery as do all islamo nazis

if you believe in supporting the US govt, and the govt once defended slavery, and enforced laws treating people like property, does that mean you are supporting rape and slavery because this is part of US history?

*****Islam did not "ONCE" support slavery and rape----it still does
You got a muslim over there in Houston willing to admit
that shariah law STINKS? --------btw---in the land in which
my very own husband was born------so saying is a capital crim

Emily-----you are a propagandaist for the filth of islamo Nazism-----you disgust
me


For those who do not know-----Emily is more dangerous than is ISIS. I know
because I have rubbed shoulders with muslims for more than 45 years and read their
propaganda more than 55 years ago. same crap

????

Dear irosie91: Can you find me ONE ISIS person who believes in civil due process and conflict resolution to prevent abuse and violence by Consensus between parties.

I am the exact opposite of ISIS. That is why everyone makes fun of me!
My boyfriend tells me my ideas won't work because Jihadist ISIS would rape and kill me on the spot. for asking all parties to make peace, between Jews Christians and Muslims. They think I am dangerously naive for trying to work with people, including liberal Democrats and conservative Republicans. and Prolife with Prochoice. But I have friends on all sides, we find solutions, and we share them with others. There is no violence between us, so what is this comparison with ISIS? these people abuse teenagers, get them pregnant, and force them to fight. I work with nonprofit groups, including Jewish and Christian, to reverse the damage of gangs.

What are you talking about, irosie91?
What is this 55 years of whatever, can you explain to me what beliefs you THINK I have?

Irosie: I posted to you my beliefs, and have found NOBODY who teaches the Constitution that way, that it empowers all people to solve our problems together as sharing equal responsibility for govt, including fix govt problems instead of fighting over them which I do not believe in.

Who teaches consensus by due process and free choice? Most people teach to depend on Bullies to fight each other "for you." Or like Obama, they IMPOSE consensus "against people's will" which makes no sense at all! True consensus means people naturally agree, like how the Greens practice consensus decision making: nothing is coerced, it is arrived at by discussing all objections and working them out until an agreed solution is reached.

If you are mistaking me for Obama, excuse me but no! I think Rush Limbaugh and others have more respect for Obama as President, while I feel sorry for him and think he should have been VP and worked with the people across the States to rebuild communities and let someone else run the country. I didn't vote for Obama either time because he sends the wrong message, and goes about govt the wrong way: we should work from the bottom up, not mandate from top down. So I am against imposing mandates and calling that consensus, that is unconstitutional.

I promote conflict resolution and consensus, to the point people MOCK me for my beliefs in "Restorative Justice" as the peaceful means to help all people form agreements by free will.

irosie I hate to embarrass you in the Bullring,
but you are like trying to tell me day is night, and night is day,
by equating me with ISIS and any NAZI anything.

Most people mock me for being too nice; while you accuse me of the opposite?
For enabling "Nazi or Islamist oppression" when I seek to prevent it at ALL LEVELS?

Are we talking about the same emilynghiem?

The only way I am "more dangerous" than ISIS is if they are unraveled by a harmless "overgrown Girl Scout" who wants to make peace with everyone, and set up voluntary restitution for all wrongs committed. If I undo them by being "so kind" it makes them laugh, and drop their guns to grab their stomachs and split sides from laughing, maybe I could be more dangerous in that sense! My friends who know me DO think I could have this comic effect on people as my most 'dangerous' weapon.

My boyfriend says otherwise, and that they wouldn't hesitate to clobber me.

So I do not understand what it will take to get this image out of your mind! My goodness!

Sorry irosie, this is not me. The only thing dangerous about me is I am dangerously naive. I think you are simply misunderstanding me, but other people would say I am naive and you are an idiot for assuming such things. They would say awful things about you, while I give you the benefit of the doubt.

I'm sorry if I do a disservice to you by continuing to be naive and thinking you simply misunderstand me because you do not know me. Sorry for this, but it is not my way .

Here are my websites for what I am working on, to set up sustainable campuses to convert slave labor factories into schools where people can rebuild their communities themselves. No oppression needed, sorry to disappoint you irosie but I don't believe in coercion or violence:


Emily-----you should read the propaganda written by your colleagues
in Egypt and Syria in the post World War II era by Nazis who
escaped the Nuremburg trials--------you will find yourself. I read it as a child---
and then heard it from the mouths of young Pakistani and Indian muslim doctors.
All very "reasonable"------if the listener is an idiot

the first Indian muslim I knew well was from New Dehli------one of the first
things he said to me was ISLAM HAS THE MOST TOLERATIONS
(kinda awkward English---but I got the idea) That was before the
1971 civil war between West and East Pakistan----East Pakistan is now
Bangla Desh ------before MUSLIM CLERICS in west Pakistan ----
BY ISLAMIC LAW----declared the people of east Pakistan
"TAKFIR"---------thus making them eligible for rape, murder and
pillage by the army of allah-------1/4 million girls were raped over
a few months------I was horrified-----but that's ok----it was just
a military thing from the mouth of muhummad. BTW---the
Armenian genocide was also LEGAL by Islamic law------which is
why turks deny it took place----it was JUSTICE by islam

BTW-----according to Islamic law----it is legal for any muslim
in the world to kill any jew in the world----because all jews are
potential Zionists---------here's another example of the laws you
love------a muslim who decides to chop one of your children to
pieces has not committed a capital crime----muslims can kill non
muslims------if you can prove you love islam----you might be eligible
for a payment of 1/4 the value of a muslim life-----maybe---but
probably not Ask your muzzie friend to spit on that law


I read the Koran ---age 19----I learned about islam from muslims---
I was such a nice kid that I got invited to a mosque where I almost
threw up listening to the "wisdom" of Islamic law from the
GENIUS QADI IMAM ------ (qadi is judge of Islamic law) ---he was not
Isis-------he was not a JIHADIST----he was an Egyptian QADI----
HE SPOKE NICELY----about justice and compassion -----well--not
for everyone and certainly not for Coptic christians