What is it that you fear about 'Obamacare'?

[British_Bloke]

Hi

I have a question on a subject that I am quite baffled on. I live in England where we have a public health service that is completely free at the point of delivery (the NHS). It is paid for out of taxation, government operated and available to everyone based on their medical needs. Private health care is available for anyone who wants it as well.

The NHS is the most cherished institution that exists in this country, and any political party openly calling for it's privatisation would be signing themselves into opposition forever.

So when I hear on the news the controversy that exists in the US about the healthcare reforms proposed by Obama (which actually appear quite modest in scope to me) I really can't understand what the fuss is about. Could someone please explain to me what it is that you fear in regards to these healthcare proposals?

I hope this thread can be kept civil as I am not here to start an argument. I just seek to understand the American mindset a bit more.

Thanks
Dave

 

[California Girl]

Hi

I have a question on a subject that I am quite baffled on. I live in England where we have a public health service that is completely free at the point of delivery (the NHS). It is paid for out of taxation, government operated and available to everyone based on their medical needs. Private health care is available for anyone who wants it as well.

The NHS is the most cherished institution that exists in this country, and any political party openly calling for it's privatisation would be signing themselves into opposition forever.

So when I hear on the news the controversy that exists in the US about the healthcare reforms proposed by Obama (which actually appear quite modest in scope to me) I really can't understand what the fuss is about. Could someone please explain to me what it is that you fear in regards to these healthcare proposals?

I hope this thread can be kept civil as I am not here to start an argument. I just seek to understand the American mindset a bit more.

Thanks
Dave

Firstly, what Obama has done is nothing like your NHS.

Secondly, your NHS is adequate - nothing more.

Thirdly, your beloved NHS is the fourth largest employer IN THE WORLD. For a tiny little island... Can you imagine what size a similar organization would be in the US?

Fourthly, the US has a Constitution. That document tells the Federal Government what it is allowed to do. Forcing Americans to buy a product or service is not contained within that document so his crappy idea to force us all to buy insurance is unConstitutional.

Fifthly, what the hell business is it of yours what we do?

 

[British_Bloke]

Firstly, what Obama has done is nothing like your NHS.

Secondly, your NHS is adequate - nothing more.

Thirdly, your beloved NHS is the fourth largest employer IN THE WORLD. For a tiny little island... Can you imagine what size a similar organization would be in the US?

Fourthly, the US has a Constitution. That document tells the Federal Government what it is allowed to do. Forcing Americans to buy a product or service is not contained within that document so his crappy idea to force us all to buy insurance is unConstitutional.

Fifthly, what the hell business is it of yours what we do?

1) Ok, but the idea is similar no? To make healthcare affordable to everyone?

2) Well it's done well to save my life in the past, as well as several friends and family members. Also, I don't believe the US has a life expectancy any higher than here.

3) Is that a bad thing?

4) Fair enough on that point. Can't say I understand the ins and outs of your constitution.

5) Why so tetchy?

 

[California Girl]

Firstly, what Obama has done is nothing like your NHS.

Secondly, your NHS is adequate - nothing more.

Thirdly, your beloved NHS is the fourth largest employer IN THE WORLD. For a tiny little island... Can you imagine what size a similar organization would be in the US?

Fourthly, the US has a Constitution. That document tells the Federal Government what it is allowed to do. Forcing Americans to buy a product or service is not contained within that document so his crappy idea to force us all to buy insurance is unConstitutional.

Fifthly, what the hell business is it of yours what we do?

1) Ok, but the idea is similar no? To make healthcare affordable to everyone?

2) Well it's done well to save my life in the past, as well as several friends and family members. Also, I don't believe the US has a life expectancy any higher than here.

3) Is that a bad thing?

4) Fair enough on that point. Can't say I understand the ins and outs of your constitution.

5) Why so tetchy?

No, the idea is nothing like your NHS. Our premiums are going through the roof because of his fucking moronic 'plan'.

I'm sure you think your system is great. Your NHS was created some 60 years ago to ensure that everyone got 'life saving' treatment. What is it now? Abortions - yep. Plastic surgery, yep. IVF, yep. In fact lots and lots of stuff - very little of it actually saving peoples lives. Yet, you have cancer patients who have to sue their NHS Trust to force them to provide life saving drugs. I'm sure you love it but it is bleeding your country dry to pay for it.

Fourth largest employer in the world? For a country the size of Britain? Surely, even you can see how ridiculous that is.

I'm not techy. I just don't get why you think you know jack shit about our system. You don't. It is not within our Constitution for the federal government to force us to buy insurance.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

First of all Bloke...there are VERY few Americans who do not want some form of healthcare reform.
We fought this monstrosity because it is a major mess. Just because someone wrote a healthcare reform bill does not mean it is a good one...eh?

It is an overbloated mess that will increase costs and reduce efficiency.
Your question should be "Why is anyone for this bill?"

 

[rdean]

No one could answer the question.

 

[California Girl]

First of all Bloke...there are VERY few Americans who do not want some form of healthcare reform.
We fought this monstrosity because it is a major mess. Just because someone wrote a healthcare reform bill does not mean it is a good one...eh?

It is an overbloated mess that will increase costs and reduce efficiency.
Your question should be "Why is anyone for this bill?"

To be honest, I can understand why the Brits look at us and wonder why we don't just have a system like theirs. They've grown up with it and see no problem with it. As an outsider, I see plenty of problems. Why should I pay for someone else to have an abortion - it's not a life saving procedure. Why should I pay for a childless couple to have treatments to have a child - that's not a live saving procedure. Or plastic surgery? Or gender reassignment? Or any of the plethora of crap that they do on the NHS?

Their NHS was a great idea. It is not workable in the US, because our nation is far bigger. It is unConstitutional. And... as has happened in the UK... what started off as a great idea has become a monstrosity that even the British know is broken but they don't want to face it.

The French, on the other hand, have a much more interesting system and, while again, Constitutionally, it would be tricky (possibly require an Amendment) but.... their system is one I would have been prepared to consider how we could make that work in the US. But.... it should be left to individual states and not the federal government to deal with. Because the Brits don't understand how our government works, I see no way that the OP can actually ever understand this issue.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Hi

I have a question on a subject that I am quite baffled on. I live in England where we have a public health service that is completely free at the point of delivery (the NHS). It is paid for out of taxation, government operated and available to everyone based on their medical needs. Private health care is available for anyone who wants it as well.

The NHS is the most cherished institution that exists in this country, and any political party openly calling for it's privatisation would be signing themselves into opposition forever.

So when I hear on the news the controversy that exists in the US about the healthcare reforms proposed by Obama (which actually appear quite modest in scope to me) I really can't understand what the fuss is about. Could someone please explain to me what it is that you fear in regards to these healthcare proposals?

I hope this thread can be kept civil as I am not here to start an argument. I just seek to understand the American mindset a bit more.

Thanks
Dave

Firstly, what Obama has done is nothing like your NHS.

Secondly, your NHS is adequate - nothing more.

Thirdly, your beloved NHS is the fourth largest employer IN THE WORLD. For a tiny little island... Can you imagine what size a similar organization would be in the US?

Fourthly, the US has a Constitution. That document tells the Federal Government what it is allowed to do. Forcing Americans to buy a product or service is not contained within that document so his crappy idea to force us all to buy insurance is unConstitutional.

Fifthly, what the hell business is it of yours what we do?

I haven't seen a smack down like that since this

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aEOLt2xJ6i4[/ame]

 

[PixieStix]

Hi

I have a question on a subject that I am quite baffled on. I live in England where we have a public health service that is completely free at the point of delivery (the NHS). It is paid for out of taxation, government operated and available to everyone based on their medical needs. Private health care is available for anyone who wants it as well.

The NHS is the most cherished institution that exists in this country, and any political party openly calling for it's privatisation would be signing themselves into opposition forever.

So when I hear on the news the controversy that exists in the US about the healthcare reforms proposed by Obama (which actually appear quite modest in scope to me) I really can't understand what the fuss is about. Could someone please explain to me what it is that you fear in regards to these healthcare proposals?

I hope this thread can be kept civil as I am not here to start an argument. I just seek to understand the American mindset a bit more.

Thanks
Dave

Dude read the bill please, because or law makers haven't. Thanks

 

[iamwhatiseem]

First of all Bloke...there are VERY few Americans who do not want some form of healthcare reform.
We fought this monstrosity because it is a major mess. Just because someone wrote a healthcare reform bill does not mean it is a good one...eh?

It is an overbloated mess that will increase costs and reduce efficiency.
Your question should be "Why is anyone for this bill?"

To be honest, I can understand why the Brits look at us and wonder why we don't just have a system like theirs. They've grown up with it and see no problem with it. As an outsider, I see plenty of problems. Why should I pay for someone else to have an abortion - it's not a life saving procedure. Why should I pay for a childless couple to have treatments to have a child - that's not a live saving procedure. Or plastic surgery? Or gender reassignment? Or any of the plethora of crap that they do on the NHS?

Their NHS was a great idea. It is not workable in the US, because our nation is far bigger. It is unConstitutional. And... as has happened in the UK... what started off as a great idea has become a monstrosity that even the British know is broken but they don't want to face it.

The French, on the other hand, have a much more interesting system and, while again, Constitutionally, it would be tricky (possibly require an Amendment) but.... their system is one I would have been prepared to consider how we could make that work in the US. But.... it should be left to individual states and not the federal government to deal with. Because the Brits don't understand how our government works, I see no way that the OP can actually ever understand this issue.

I agree.
But containing costs must, at first, be job one.
All one has to do is look at medicare and see why our government has absolutely no business in this industry. Can you imagine the breadth of fraud and wastes? I cannot. It would be in the $100 bn's. every year.

 

[Big Black Dog]

To much government involvement into my personal affairs.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

People with Health Savings Accounts now have to get a prescription from a doctor before they can use their HSA to buy aspirins.

Ain't ObamaCare da Bomb??!!

 

[The Infidel]

No one could answer the question.

I can, but I am not going to waste any more time trying to explain why that HC bill is nothing more than a power grab by our own ROUGUE gov't.

 

[California Girl]

Hi

I have a question on a subject that I am quite baffled on. I live in England where we have a public health service that is completely free at the point of delivery (the NHS). It is paid for out of taxation, government operated and available to everyone based on their medical needs. Private health care is available for anyone who wants it as well.

The NHS is the most cherished institution that exists in this country, and any political party openly calling for it's privatisation would be signing themselves into opposition forever.

So when I hear on the news the controversy that exists in the US about the healthcare reforms proposed by Obama (which actually appear quite modest in scope to me) I really can't understand what the fuss is about. Could someone please explain to me what it is that you fear in regards to these healthcare proposals?

I hope this thread can be kept civil as I am not here to start an argument. I just seek to understand the American mindset a bit more.

Thanks
Dave

Dude read the bill please, because or law makers haven't. Thanks

Be fair, Pix, he's British.... Even our own Senators didn't understand the Bill.... how the hell is a Brit gonna get it?

 

[California Girl]

First of all Bloke...there are VERY few Americans who do not want some form of healthcare reform.
We fought this monstrosity because it is a major mess. Just because someone wrote a healthcare reform bill does not mean it is a good one...eh?

It is an overbloated mess that will increase costs and reduce efficiency.
Your question should be "Why is anyone for this bill?"

To be honest, I can understand why the Brits look at us and wonder why we don't just have a system like theirs. They've grown up with it and see no problem with it. As an outsider, I see plenty of problems. Why should I pay for someone else to have an abortion - it's not a life saving procedure. Why should I pay for a childless couple to have treatments to have a child - that's not a live saving procedure. Or plastic surgery? Or gender reassignment? Or any of the plethora of crap that they do on the NHS?

Their NHS was a great idea. It is not workable in the US, because our nation is far bigger. It is unConstitutional. And... as has happened in the UK... what started off as a great idea has become a monstrosity that even the British know is broken but they don't want to face it.

The French, on the other hand, have a much more interesting system and, while again, Constitutionally, it would be tricky (possibly require an Amendment) but.... their system is one I would have been prepared to consider how we could make that work in the US. But.... it should be left to individual states and not the federal government to deal with. Because the Brits don't understand how our government works, I see no way that the OP can actually ever understand this issue.

I agree.
But containing costs must, at first, be job one.
All one has to do is look at medicare and see why our government has absolutely no business in this industry. Can you imagine the breadth of fraud and wastes? I cannot. It would be in the $100 bn's. every year.

The British NHS is rife with fraud and waste.... That's one of the major problems with it. Then there's the fact that they employ more beancounters than nurses, they have 'communications' people instead of doctors, it is incredibly bureaucratic.

Example: Friend of mine has a swelling on her knuckle. She got sent for an ex ray. That took 3 weeks to get an appointment! That was almost three weeks ago and her doctor still has not got the results of her ex ray. That's six weeks and she's still waiting.

 

[PixieStix]

It is unconstitutional to start with, I especially, have a huge problem the individual mandate

 

[PixieStix]

Hi

I have a question on a subject that I am quite baffled on. I live in England where we have a public health service that is completely free at the point of delivery (the NHS). It is paid for out of taxation, government operated and available to everyone based on their medical needs. Private health care is available for anyone who wants it as well.

The NHS is the most cherished institution that exists in this country, and any political party openly calling for it's privatisation would be signing themselves into opposition forever.

So when I hear on the news the controversy that exists in the US about the healthcare reforms proposed by Obama (which actually appear quite modest in scope to me) I really can't understand what the fuss is about. Could someone please explain to me what it is that you fear in regards to these healthcare proposals?

I hope this thread can be kept civil as I am not here to start an argument. I just seek to understand the American mindset a bit more.

Thanks
Dave

Dude read the bill please, because or law makers haven't. Thanks

Be fair, Pix, he's British.... Even our own Senators didn't understand the Bill.... how the hell is a Brit gonna get it?

That is exactly my point CG

 

[Skull Pilot]

i don't "fear" anything about the bill. I know that it will cause health care costs to increase.

I know I will not be able to keep the insurance I have

I know that this is nothing more than the government trying to exert more control over the public.

All reasons not to support it.

 

[RDD_1210]

Firstly, what Obama has done is nothing like your NHS.

Secondly, your NHS is adequate - nothing more.

Thirdly, your beloved NHS is the fourth largest employer IN THE WORLD. For a tiny little island... Can you imagine what size a similar organization would be in the US?

Fourthly, the US has a Constitution. That document tells the Federal Government what it is allowed to do. Forcing Americans to buy a product or service is not contained within that document so his crappy idea to force us all to buy insurance is unConstitutional.

Fifthly, what the hell business is it of yours what we do?

1) Ok, but the idea is similar no? To make healthcare affordable to everyone?

2) Well it's done well to save my life in the past, as well as several friends and family members. Also, I don't believe the US has a life expectancy any higher than here.

3) Is that a bad thing?

4) Fair enough on that point. Can't say I understand the ins and outs of your constitution.

5) Why so tetchy?

You can't pay much attention to California Girl. She has nothing better to do then post on this site 40+ times a day with 98% of her posts being hateful and ignorant. She may be representative of many on this board who idolize her, but she does not represent the views of logical thinking, compassionate Americans.

 

[RDD_1210]

Hi

I have a question on a subject that I am quite baffled on. I live in England where we have a public health service that is completely free at the point of delivery (the NHS). It is paid for out of taxation, government operated and available to everyone based on their medical needs. Private health care is available for anyone who wants it as well.

The NHS is the most cherished institution that exists in this country, and any political party openly calling for it's privatisation would be signing themselves into opposition forever.

So when I hear on the news the controversy that exists in the US about the healthcare reforms proposed by Obama (which actually appear quite modest in scope to me) I really can't understand what the fuss is about. Could someone please explain to me what it is that you fear in regards to these healthcare proposals?

I hope this thread can be kept civil as I am not here to start an argument. I just seek to understand the American mindset a bit more.

Thanks
Dave

The problem is people have been lied to about what the bill is and what it will do. When polled, people agree with almost everything that is in the bill when looking at each individual aspect of it. However, when asked about what is wrong with the bill, you hear fear language about death panels, doctor shortages and it being unconstitutional. They are parrots who don't understand the bill at all, but do understand how to repeat things they hear others say.

These are the same people who don't want the government involved in healthcare but are on Medicare themselves. It's ignorance and selfishness from people who just aren't educated and have fallen behind the times.