Student Suspended For Sexual Harrassment - Wearing A Costume To Another School's Prom

[The ClayTaurus]

Yes porn is going to destroy democracy. Not authoritarian rule. You say that the public is littered with porn. Where? I can drive down my street in Bristol (a lower to middle income neighborhood) and not notice a single display of public pornography anywhere. In fact, i can't recall in the last 12 years (my total awareness in my life that such a thing as porn even existed) where i saw a piece of pornographic material in public at all. I see strip clubs but i wouldnt know they were one if someone hadnt told me its there after driving past it 100 times. I notice adult book stores that look like boarded up shops that have gone out of business with discreet signs on the front. You wouldnt even know the place was in business unless you were a patron of the establishment. The point is that public pornography is pretty much non-existent except for an occasional drunken loon that goes streaking.

That's probably because your definition of porn and someone else's definition of porn are different. Some people think a Victoria's secret billboard is porn. Some think beer advertisements are porn.

 

[insein]

That's probably because your definition of porn and someone else's definition of porn are different. Some people think a Victoria's secret billboard is porn. Some think beer advertisements are porn.

And there in lies the problem with laws based on morality. ITs not society's responsibility to dictate moral code. Its society's responsibility to protect and punish against those that commit crimes that harm others.

 

[ScreamingEagle]

And there in lies the problem with laws based on morality. ITs not society's responsibility to dictate moral code. Its society's responsibility to protect and punish against those that commit crimes that harm others.

Problem with laws based on morality? There you go again with the same full of big holes logic. I suppose since laws based on morality such as "thou shalt not kill" is a problem too. So let's get rid of the murder laws right along with the pornography laws...

...getting kinda windy in here?

 

[The ClayTaurus]

Problem with laws based on morality? There you go again with the same full of big holes logic. I suppose since laws based on morality such as "thou shalt not kill" is a problem too. So let's get rid of the murder laws right along with the pornography laws...

...getting kinda windy in here?

Murder is a crime that harms others.

 

[ScreamingEagle]

Yet you havent poked any holes into the crux of my argument. How does criminalizing porn help society? Ive read your posts from the Baptistpillar (hardly objective on the issue) and what they THINK of the matter but i have yet to hear from YOU why you think pornography is such a danger to society.


Yes like murder, rape, child rape, theft, etc. All crimes that punish those that cause damage to society. A law should extablish a means to punish those that attack society. IT should not prevent those from committing those crimes at all. If a criminal wants to steal a car, he's not worrying about a law that says don't steal cars. So if the government enacts a law that says you can't stand near other people's cars to prevent auto theft, is that going to stop a criminal from STILL stealing a car? No but it will criminalize innocent people for standing near car's they had no intention of stealing.



Conservatives don't have an anything goes approach. They want tough penalties for those that committ crimes. They don't want penalties for those that we THINK are going to commit crimes. Then we get into a grey area where we criminalize people that were causing no harm but were perceived to have been wanting to. How do we now police people's intentions? Who are we God? No.



You obviously do have a problem with these things because most people don't care what someone does in the privacy of their own home. Its only a minority of individuals that has a problem with the way other people are living. The only things being "shoehorned" are the moral laws that restrict the majority's will by bending it in line with their moral code. Worry about your life. Live it according to your religion and you have nothing to worry about. God will take pity on you and send the rest of the poor slobs to hell when the time comes. In the meantime, don't tread on me.

Perhaps you don't read so good. Where have i defended the ACLU? Where have i stated that im a libertarian? Im an American. I think for myself. I fight for what I believe is right and true in this country. I don't take marching orders unlike some people in this world. Live your own life man. Don't follow a cause because people tell you too. Follow one because you believe its right. You telling people to live to your will is not going to make people morally higher. Its going to make them into criminals because they will live their own lives the way they always did. Its just that someone says their life is now not as good as someone elses and therefore it is criminal.

Yes porn is going to destroy democracy. Not authoritarian rule. You say that the public is littered with porn. Where? I can drive down my street in Bristol (a lower to middle income neighborhood) and not notice a single display of public pornography anywhere. In fact, i can't recall in the last 12 years (my total awareness in my life that such a thing as porn even existed) where i saw a piece of pornographic material in public at all. I see strip clubs but i wouldnt know they were one if someone hadnt told me its there after driving past it 100 times. I notice adult book stores that look like boarded up shops that have gone out of business with discreet signs on the front. You wouldnt even know the place was in business unless you were a patron of the establishment. The point is that public pornography is pretty much non-existent except for an occasional drunken loon that goes streaking.

Porn in and of itself does not degrade the mind anymore than regular sexual urges do. You havent given me evidence that proves that any sexual predator used porn as a "gateway" drug to his/her behavior. Those people were already fucked up in the head and should be locked away from society so that society doesnt have to deal with them. But regular citizens going about their daily routines do not care on an average basis what people around them are doing so long as it doesnt interfere with their lives.

Thats the position of a solid Morally Superior, Religious Totalitarian.

Your position is totally based upon the idea that you think pornography does not equate into societal destruction. Wrong.

Look at the destruction happening around porn shows and joints - prostitution, drugs, sex slave trade, crime.

Look at the destruction of families as women are debased and men are turning to vile forms of sex entertainment.

Look at the destruction of innocent children where it has been shown that almost every child molester has child porn in his posession.

Look at the destruction of children's minds and how they have become so wrapped up in sex that their educational achievements are failing miserably.

 

[insein]

Your position is totally based upon the idea that you think pornography does not equate into societal destruction. Wrong.

Really. Lets review then.

Look at the destruction happening around porn shows and joints - prostitution, drugs, sex slave trade, crime.

Proof? From what ive seen, these porn shops are isolated and boarded off. No one stands outside and i never see anyone going in. they must be entering somewhere because the place would go out of business. Strip joints have strippers and patrons. Those that get rowdy get tossed. Unless its in a Hollywood movie, you rarely see prostitution outside of a strip club. But don't get me started on the sexual business between 2 grown adults. How is anyone harmed by that? The women is selling something that the john is buying.

Look at the destruction of families as women are debased and men are turning to vile forms of sex entertainment.

I guess you've never been married. Men turn to pornography instead of cheating. Wives do not want sex every minute of every day. Men do. So in order to control urges, porn is there. You could say that porn saves marriages. I won't go that far but its not the destructive force you make it out to be. Marriages that end are flawed for other reasons. communication, finances, etc. Blaming it on porn is a simple tactic to try and sway your argument. Its no further provable then my claim that it saves marriages.

Look at the destruction of innocent children where it has been shown that almost every child molester has child porn in his posession.

Really? Child molestors that have a fetish for young child have child porn in their possession? Stop the fucking pressess. Next your going to tell me that christians have bibles in their homes.

Look at the destruction of children's minds and how they have become so wrapped up in sex that their educational achievements are failing miserably.

Umm try focusing on the schools that force them to learn it at a young edge "for their own good" by the government. Young children, especially boys have been getting into their dad's porn stash since the begining of print. Besides which why not focus on the actual causes of educational degradation like stupid kids being taught PC history instead of math and science.

That was a load of BS. This is growing tiresome. Provide some evidence of the degradation of society at the hands of the evil porn monster or be done with this futile argument of yours.

 

[Bonnie]

Insein......I guess you've never been married. Men turn to pornography instead of cheating. Wives do not want sex every minute of every day. Men do. So in order to control urges, porn is there. You could say that porn saves marriages. I won't go that far but its not the destructive force you make it out to be. Marriages that end are flawed for other reasons. communication, finances, etc. Blaming it on porn is a simple tactic to try and sway your argument. Its no further provable then my claim that it saves marriages.

Porn does not save marriages and I can give you many statistics to prove that out if you like. I think you really do buy into the stereotype that women once married don't want sex, maybe for a small portion but that isn't always so cut and dry. Many married women enjoy sex with their husbands if the marriage is good and trust me it won't be good if the man is always purposefully looking and getting turned on by other nude women instead of seeing their wives in that way. I don't think the government should ban or outlaw it, I do however think porn comes with freedom and not everything that comes with freedom is a good or postive thing. Porn is addictive and it can be very destructive to marriages and families.

 

[The ClayTaurus]

Porn does not save marriages and I can give you many statistics to prove that out if you like. I think you really do buy into the stereotype that women once married don't want sex, maybe for a small portion but that isn't always so cut and dry. Many married women enjoy sex with their husbands if the marriage is good and trust me it won't be good if the man is always purposefully looking and getting turned on by other nude women instead of seeing their wives in that way. I don't think the government should ban or outlaw it, I do however think porn comes with freedom and not everything that comes with freedom is a good or postive thing. Porn is addictive and it can be very destructive to marriages and families.

It's not one or the other. Porn can do good, porn can do bad.

 

[Abbey Normal]

Porn does not save marriages and I can give you many statistics to prove that out if you like. I think you really do buy into the stereotype that women once married don't want sex, maybe for a small portion but that isn't always so cut and dry. Many married women enjoy sex with their husbands if the marriage is good and trust me it won't be good if the man is always purposefully looking and getting turned on by other nude women instead of seeing their wives in that way. I don't think the government should ban or outlaw it, I do however think porn comes with freedom and not everything that comes with freedom is a good or postive thing. Porn is addictive and it can be very destructive to marriages and families.

Well said, Bonnie. Any marriage counselor can attest to what you just said.

 

[archangel]

Porn does not save marriages and I can give you many statistics to prove that out if you like. I think you really do buy into the stereotype that women once married don't want sex, maybe for a small portion but that isn't always so cut and dry. Many married women enjoy sex with their husbands if the marriage is good and trust me it won't be good if the man is always purposefully looking and getting turned on by other nude women instead of seeing their wives in that way. I don't think the government should ban or outlaw it, I do however think porn comes with freedom and not everything that comes with freedom is a good or postive thing. Porn is addictive and it can be very destructive to marriages and families.

Pornography is akin to going to a candy store without a dime...guess some guys are just short the dime...dunno...then again maybe their sex lives are akin to the sex life of a onion...gives great flavor...but is missing the meat...forget it what the hell do I know anyway!

 

[Bonnie]

It's not one or the other. Porn can do good, porn can do bad.

If both parties are truly on the same page then it I suppose would not be destructive. If one party does not agree or is offended by it and the other party refuses to take that seriously then yes there are big problems having to do with anger, having to do with the idea that after a while men can't get it up with their wives anymore becasue they crave pornographic stimulation as sex is now just getting off not having intimacy with your partner or seeing her as beautiful and sexy anymore, the emotional connection to thier wives disloves. If husbands and wives truly wanted to work at their marriages and sex lives porn is not the best way to go. People had plenty of sex before pornography came along, and no Im not referring to beautful works of art of naked men and women from the past..

 

[The ClayTaurus]

If both parties are truly on the same page then it I suppose would not be destructive. If one party does not agree or is offended by it and the other party refuses to take that seriously then yes there are big problems having to do with anger, having to do with the idea that after a while men can't get it up with their wives anymore becasue they crave pornographic stimulation as sex is now just getting off not having intimacy with your partner or seeing her as beautiful and sexy anymore, the emotional connection to thier wives disloves. If husbands and wives truly wanted to work at their marriages and sex lives porn is not the best way to go. People had plenty of sex before pornography came along, and no Im not referring to beautful works of art of naked men and women from the past..

Porn isn't the best way to go for you, it might be for others... and if something like porn can dissolve the emotional connection between two people, then I submit to you that said emotional connection wasn't that strong in the first place.

 

[Bonnie]

Porn isn't the best way to go for you, it might be for others... and if something like porn can dissolve the emotional connection between two people, then I submit to you that said emotional connection wasn't that strong in the first place.

Well it wasn't the best way to go for many of the couples I have counseled. Im not in this equation. I hear what others tell me and what psychologists write on the subject. If it works for you then great, for many it does not.
I think I have made my point clear in this.

 

[The ClayTaurus]

Well it wasn't the best way to go for many of the couples I have counseled. Im not in this equation. I hear what others tell me and what psychologists write on the subject. If it works for you then great, for many it does not.
I think I have made my point clear in this.

Fair enough, just don't beat me up

 

[Bonnie]

Fair enough, just don't beat me up

Course not your a big boy

Besides I come from the school of make your own porn at home not watch others do it Much more fun wouldn't you agree??

 

[insein]

Course not your a big boy

Besides I come from the school of make your own porn at home not watch others do it Much more fun wouldn't you agree??

Im all for that. I was merely illustrating the point that my allegation that porn saves marriages is no more true than SE's allegation that it tears it apart. Its an easy statement to make and can't be proven either way. Marriages have other more strenuous factors that drive them to divorce before pornography.

 

[Bonnie]

Im all for that. I was merely illustrating the point that my allegation that porn saves marriages is no more true than SE's allegation that it tears it apart. Its an easy statement to make and can't be proven either way. Marriages have other more strenuous factors that drive them to divorce before pornography.

I agree with that!!

 

[ScreamingEagle]

Im all for that. I was merely illustrating the point that my allegation that porn saves marriages is no more true than SE's allegation that it tears it apart. Its an easy statement to make and can't be proven either way. Marriages have other more strenuous factors that drive them to divorce before pornography.

Toxic Porn, Toxic Sex: A Real Look at Pornography

http://www.everystudent.com/pdf/toxic.pdf

 

[insein]

Toxic Porn, Toxic Sex: A Real Look at Pornography

http://www.everystudent.com/pdf/toxic.pdf

Not exactly an unbiased source on the subject.

Gene McConnell, founder and president of Authentic Relationships International, is a former pastor and recovered sex addict. Gene's story of recovery has helped countless people deal with the difficulty of sexual addiction and relational brokeness. He is respected nationally as an expert on the issues of pornography, sexual addiction and abuse, and understanding the roots of shame. He has developed highly successful programs addressing these issues, which he has used to lead accountability and shame reduction support groups for the last 13 years. Gene shares his years of experience while training therapists, pastors, law enforcement officers, hospital officials and small group leaders. Gene has been a speaker at three world conferences for the American Association of Christian Counselors and two national conferences for the National Association for Christian Recovery and teaches quarterly at Focus on the Family Institute.

From his site of course so I take the "expert on issues of pornography" as meaning amongst his peers he's an expert. To me his an ex-pastor who was ashamed of his actions. Great for him. He feels bad about it but his hypothesis' do not apply to MOST situations.

With expert analysis like "Porn's outlook is stupid and shallow," I find his opinions alittle biased towards a certain point of view and lacking actual evidence. His over emphasis on women makes me think that he has dealt with these feelings inside of him and feels guilty about it. This is not how most men view women. Porn does not change that either. Porn is simply to entertain. It is not to substitute marriage.

This is not evidence but merely an opinion from someone else who agrees with you.

 

[dilloduck]

And there in lies the problem with laws based on morality. ITs not society's responsibility to dictate moral code. Its society's responsibility to protect and punish against those that commit crimes that harm others.

So who is the final arbiter on what is harmful "to others" ? Is there any kind of sexual behavior that even YOU would consider harmful to others? How about having sex knowing full well that you have aids but not telling your partner?