Male Front nudity in movies controversy

[sitarro]

I agree that a lot of the nudity that is put into film is not needed . Much of the graphic violence is also overdone . Alfred Hitchcock messed with your mind to scare you , he didn't need to grosse you out .
Mike Myers like Paul Rubens(PeeWee) have always been masters at producing film that could be watched by kids with one meaning and adults with a totally different meaning . The Austin Powers films didn't show any nudity but were always full of sexual innuendoes that made them fun for adults to watch . PeeWee's playhouse was amazing writing . For the kids , they never failed to leave them with a great positive message each week but for the adults the humor was on an adult level , I used to tape the shows because I worked on Saturdays. With people like Phil Hartman(Captain Carl) and Laurence Fishburne (Cowboy Curtis) , this show was on a much higher creative level than the awful cartoons that kids watch today .

 

[Bonnie]

Who gets to judge?




Actually, most of the european film I'm thinking of ( such as "Dreamlife of Angels") is very artistic, and not prurient shock value.

No doubt Hollywood fare (such as Bruckheimer or Schumacher) are pure titillation oriented schlock.



Yes, and it depends ENTIRELY on the individual(s).




Right. Sexually explicit artwork has been around since people have been able to draw. Which this book may draw parallels to centerfold hype, does the book look at the other angles, such as sexual repression as a factor of some religions? I think it's folly to attempt to lay the blame on all of societies sexual ills at the feet of the "centerfold industry".




The problem is Bonnie, that line lies in a different place for each individual.



Regards,


Andy

Actually Andy I don't give a shit what kind of movies explicit or otherwise are made, that's the freedom we have, and with that artistic freedom comes consequences, that is quantifiable...........Truly there have been movies that had a PG rating that I took small children to thinking the content was okay for them to see only to be horribly shocked, so there is a huge disconnect between Hollywood and what the rest of America thinks is okay for kids to see. So yes the rating system needs to be revamped, trouble is everytime the conversation turns on that subject the screams of censorship start, simply not the case.
As far as adults are concerned yes they can make their own decisions as to what they find entertaining, however many adults can't handle the sex and violence either and it does have a detrimental effect on society as a whole, so maybe Hollywood should take a more responsible attitude as to what lines as an industry it crosses?????????????

 

[KarlMarx]

Actually Andy I don't give a shit what kind of movies explicit or otherwise are made, that's the freedom we have, and with that artistic freedom comes consequences, that is quantifiable...........Truly there have been movies that had a PG rating that I took small children to thinking the content was okay for them to see only to be horribly shocked, so there is a huge disconnect between Hollywood and what the rest of America thinks is okay for kids to see. So yes the rating system needs to be revamped, trouble is everytime the conversation turns on that subject the screams of censorship start, simply not the case.
As far as adults are concerned yes they can make their own decisions as to what they find entertaining, however many adults can't handle the sex and violence either and it does have a detrimental effect on society as a whole, so maybe Hollywood should take a more responsible attitude as to what lines as an industry it crosses?????????????

Didja know that the movie ratings system is entirely voluntary? It replaced the "Hayes code" that was used to regulate the content of movies during the first part of the 20th century.

Considering that during the Hayes code period we had such trashy movies like "Citizen Kane", "Casablanca", "Gone with the Wind" and "The Wizard of Oz" one can see why they did away with it!

 

[Bonnie]

Didja know that the movie ratings system is entirely voluntary? It replaced the "Hayes code" that was used to regulate the content of movies during the first part of the 20th century.

Considering that during the Hayes code period we had such trashy movies like "Citizen Kane", "Casablanca", "Gone with the Wind" and "The Wizard of Oz" one can see why they did away with it!

What is it Rush says about using absurdity to show absurdity.

Frankly I like the kind of erotic movies that leave something to the imagination. There are many movie scenes like that, one in particular was in Last Of The Mohekians when there is that romantic kissing scene between Cora and Lewis, while explsions are going off in the distance and passionate music is playing....Takes your breath away, makes your heart pound, and is uplifting!!

 

[KarlMarx]

What is it Rush says about using absurdity to show absurdity.

Frankly I like the kind of erotic movies that leave something to the imagination. There are many movie scenes like that, one in particular was in Last Of The Mohekians when there is that romantic kissing scene between Cora and Lewis, while explsions are going off in the distance and passionate music is playing....Takes your breath away, makes your heart pound, and is uplifting!!

True.... if you watch older movies as much as I do (I'm a silent film, "classic" movie buff).... you see a lot of suggestions like that.... for example in Casablanca... you never actually see anyone in bed or taking off their clothes.... but you KNOW what is going on!!! Alfred Hitchcock used this a lot in his movies..... he had a lot of sexual overtones in his movies... he used a lot of break away shots that are suggestive... e.g. a trains going into tunnels... and fireworks.... and a lot of wisecracks (e.g. In "North By Northwest" .."don't order dessert"... "Oh yes... I get you meaning!"... "That ISN'T what I meant, the train is slowing down and I just saw FBI agents getting on board"....)

The neat thing about using innuendo in the movies is that you can watch it with your kids

 

[UsaPride]

"North By Northwest"

I love that movie!! I'm a huge Cary Grant fan. I always thought he was so sexy, and not once have I seen him naked!

 

[Bonnie]

True.... if you watch older movies as much as I do (I'm a silent film, "classic" movie buff).... you see a lot of suggestions like that.... for example in Casablanca... you never actually see anyone in bed or taking off their clothes.... but you KNOW what is going on!!! Alfred Hitchcock used this a lot in his movies..... he had a lot of sexual overtones in his movies... he used a lot of break away shots that are suggestive... e.g. a trains going into tunnels... and fireworks.... and a lot of wisecracks (e.g. In "North By Northwest" .."don't order dessert"... "Oh yes... I get you meaning!"... "That ISN'T what I meant, the train is slowing down and I just saw FBI agents getting on board"....)

The neat thing about using innuendo in the movies is that you can watch it with your kids

Great movie I also love the, after all they are classics for a reason, they are for the most part timeless.
I also really like Michael Mann, his work although sophisticated, stylish, and intense is also filled with subtle romance and nuances about life, good evil. He has a respect for women that comes across in his character portrayals from Heat, to Manhunter, without any overt sexuality etc. Same thing with Ridley Scott and the movie Bladerunner.

 

[CivilLiberty]

Wish that were true, but its total BS. If Hollywood only cared about the Bottom line the only movies they would make are G and PG movies because those are the ones that sell the most. But instead they do garbage like this. There is a clear agenda in Hollywood.

Nope.

G rated films are among the LOWEST grossing films out there.

PG is a bit higher

PG-13 is Highest

R is is next behind PG-13


This is not to say that there aren't PG films that gross more than some Rs, and there are plenty of Rs that gross more than PG-13.


If you are referring to the Dove Foundations bogus report that G movies "make more money than others" - that report fails to acknowledge market demographics, and product penetration. There is a very limited audience for G rated fare ( films like Monster's Inc. not withstanding). It's only true that G rated films "have a higher return on investment" because they are made for VERY low budgets. they are made for very low budgets because they are among the lowest grossing films out there.

But it is NOT true that "G movies sell more".

When it comes to box office gross, G kills. Even ET has a line added ("smegma breath") specifically to bump it up from a G to PG, because of the stigma attached with G rated films.

Pixar has managed to push past this with their high quality animated G features, but they are an exception.

You cannot apply the Dove Foundation's highly spun numbers to the real world of film exhibition. The very big grossing films also cost the most to make, and while the percentage return may be a little less than the low budget G genre, the total returns are astronomical.

Out of the top 25 all-time highest grossing films, only 2 are G: Pixar's finding Nemo, and Disney's The Lion King.

The rest are PG, PG-13 and R, with the vast majority being PG-13 (a category that was once R, but was split from R some years ago).

It's interesting to note that of the the R films that is in the top 25 is "The Passion of the Christ".


Regards,


Andy

 

[CivilLiberty]

Truly there have been movies that had a PG rating that I took small children to thinking the content was okay for them to see only to be horribly shocked,

PG can be read as "Not intended for small children"

PG-13 is "definitely not intended for small children, " and guidance suggested for children over 13.

R is restricted for children under 17

There's not a problem with the ratings, though there may be a problem with the public understanding the meaning of the ratings.

In an attempt to combat this, ratings now also include a description of WHY the film received a particular rating.


If you don't want to be shocked with small kids, take them to G rated films.


On another subject, the MPAA is a board of NON-film industry individuals - parents, actually - that vote on what rating a film should receive. If you've had parental experience, you can apply to be on the board.



Regards


Andy

 

[CivilLiberty]

What is it Rush says about using absurdity to show absurdity.

Frankly I like the kind of erotic movies that leave something to the imagination. There are many movie scenes like that, one in particular was in Last Of The Mohekians when there is that romantic kissing scene between Cora and Lewis, while explsions are going off in the distance and passionate music is playing....Takes your breath away, makes your heart pound, and is uplifting!!

As a side note, "Last Of The Mohicans" was rated R.


Regards


Andy

 

[CivilLiberty]

Great movie I also love the, after all they are classics for a reason, they are for the most part timeless.
I also really like Michael Mann, his work although sophisticated, stylish, and intense is also filled with subtle romance and nuances about life, good evil. He has a respect for women that comes across in his character portrayals from Heat, to Manhunter, without any overt sexuality etc. Same thing with Ridley Scott and the movie Bladerunner.

ANd yet all of these films are rated R
.

"Sex Lies and Videotape" has absolutely NO nudity in. Not one bit.

But it is rated R, and despite the total lack of nudity it is one of the steamiest, hottest films I've ever seen.


So then, where are all these "grotesquely nude" films that this thread was started about? Name one or two, someone. Or is this just another up-in-arms conspiracy theory as to how "we in Hollywood are warping the minds of young Christians everywhere".




Regards,

Andy

 

[5stringJeff]

Nope.

G rated films are among the LOWEST grossing films out there.

PG is a bit higher

PG-13 is Highest

R is is next behind PG-13

...

Out of the top 25 all-time highest grossing films, only 2 are G: Pixar's finding Nemo, and Disney's The Lion King.

The rest are PG, PG-13 and R, with the vast majority being PG-13 (a category that was once R, but was split from R some years ago).

It's interesting to note that of the the R films that is in the top 25 is "The Passion of the Christ".


Regards,


Andy

According to this site, 12 of the top 25 grossing movies of all time were PG-13. 9 were PG, 2 were G, and 2 were R - the Passion and Matrix Reloaed. The 12 PG-13 movies include the LOTR trilogy (fantasy violence) and both Spider-Man movies (comic book-type violence), along with ET. Take ET and put it into the PG column and you come up with 11 PG-13, 10 PG, 2 G, and 2 R. So the highest grossing films still seems to be the ones where you can take the whole family - even if the family is a little older.

 

[Bonnie]

As a side note, "Last Of The Mohicans" was rated R.


Regards


Andy

Yes and your point? My point is there was no nudity in that movie but rather a classy love scene which left a lot to the imagination, and would have been perfectly suitable for children to watch, not the violence in the film though.

 

[Bonnie]

ANd yet all of these films are rated R
.

"Sex Lies and Videotape" has absolutely NO nudity in. Not one bit.

But it is rated R, and despite the total lack of nudity it is one of the steamiest, hottest films I've ever seen.


So then, where are all these "grotesquely nude" films that this thread was started about? Name one or two, someone. Or is this just another up-in-arms conspiracy theory as to how "we in Hollywood are warping the minds of young Christians everywhere".




Regards,

Andy

In this post I was referring to the fact that a movie can be sophisticated, and grown up and also not be degrading to women or sex or feature nudity to get make it's point...Very simple

 

[Bonnie]

ANd yet all of these films are rated R
.

"Sex Lies and Videotape" has absolutely NO nudity in. Not one bit.

But it is rated R, and despite the total lack of nudity it is one of the steamiest, hottest films I've ever seen.


So then, where are all these "grotesquely nude" films that this thread was started about? Name one or two, someone. Or is this just another up-in-arms conspiracy theory as to how "we in Hollywood are warping the minds of young Christians everywhere".




Regards,

Andy

Again you miss the boat here Andy, Sex Lies, and Video Tape was free of nudity, however it also contained a bunch of screwed up people one of which was a husband who was fucking his wife's sister....Not exactly the example I want to set for any kids. Additonally movies like that glorify and normalize flakey dysfunctional behavior.

Oh and by the way.......All you have to do is look at almost any ridiculous teen coming of age movie and all you get to see is one big giant teen orgy complete with nudity, obscenity, and the notion that women are to be used by men, and discarded like old wash rags.

 

[Mr. P]

There's not a problem with the ratings, though there may be a problem with the public understanding the meaning of the ratings.

In an attempt to combat this, ratings now also include a description of WHY the film received a particular rating.


If you don't want to be shocked with small kids, take them to G rated films.



Regards


Andy

Ahhhhh....BULLSHIT...Ya know what the problem is, CL? Hollywood. It's not the public understanding of ratings,
it's Holy-woods understanding of the public.

The public says, we don't like this.....(Forced), Holy-wood responded with a rating.
The public says again, we don't like this....Holy-wood responded with a revised rating system.
Now the public says, we still don't like this! And CL Holy-wood says...The PUBLIC doesn't understand the meaning of the ratings.

Please!

 

[CivilLiberty]

Who is the "we in Hollywood"? Are you supposed to be somebody?

My credits are viewable on IMDB

THe internet movie database is here:

http://www.imdb.com

And my name is Andrew Somers, which you can search for. I am not providing a direct link as I do not want to break rule 5.


A

 

[CivilLiberty]

Again you miss the boat here Andy, Sex Lies, and Video Tape was free of nudity, however it also contained a bunch of screwed up people one of which was a husband who was fucking his wife's sister....Not exactly the example I want to set for any kids. Additonally movies like that glorify and normalize flakey dysfunctional behavior.

And it's rated R. Kids prohibited without an adult.

Oh and by the way.......All you have to do is look at almost any ridiculous teen coming of age movie and all you get to see is one big giant teen orgy complete with nudity, obscenity, and the notion that women are to be used by men, and discarded like old wash rags.

And those films are rated R.

The point I'm trying to make Bonnie, is that the rating system is not the problem - Films with adult content, for which there is a sizeable market, are appropriately rated.

Regards

Andy

 

[CivilLiberty]

Ahhhhh....BULLSHIT...Ya know what the problem is, CL? Hollywood. It's not the public understanding of ratings,
it's Holy-woods understanding of the public.

The public says, we don't like this....Please!

Bull. If people don't want to watch it, they wouldn't pay 10 bux to see it.

They DO pay 10 bux to see it, and the FOCUS groups of randomly selected average movie going Americans says "bring it on".

The rating system is pretty clear. if you want to see happy fluffy bunnies in a wholesome meadow of puritanical splendor, stay with G rated films. Otherwise:

PG means not appropriate for young children.

PG - 13 means not appropriate for pre-teens.

R means under 17 not admitted without parent.

NC-17 means under 17 not admitted, period.

These should be perfectly clear.

http://mpaa.org/movieratings/about/index.htm

In addition, the reason for the ratings is given. If you don't want to see sexual activity, then don't see films rated for sexual activity. It's as simple as that.


A

 

[dilloduck]

Bull. If people don't want to watch it, they wouldn't pay 10 bux to see it.

They DO pay 10 bux to see it, and the FOCUS groups of randomly selected average movie going Americans says "bring it on".

The rating system is pretty clear. if you want to see happy fluffy bunnies in a wholesome meadow of puritanical splendor, stay with G rated films. Otherwise:

PG means not appropriate for young children.

PG - 13 means not appropriate for pre-teens.

R means under 17 not admitted without parent.

NC-17 means under 17 not admitted, period.

These should be perfectly clear.

http://mpaa.org/movieratings/about/index.htm

In addition, the reason for the ratings is given. If you don't want to see sexual activity, then don't see films rated for sexual activity. It's as simple as that.


A

And lets let people screw in public parks and restaurants--what the hell to kids need to go there for anyway !