Keystone Pipeline Benefits?

[tinydancer]

Bullshit. I've put up the other routes. Do you want more? How bad do you want to look today?

I'm aware that there are lots of pipelines in existence. We're talking about this one. Just because there are other lines doesn't mean this one should be done. The right started this discussion about this specific line with a long list of false claims that have all been proven to be lies. Why can't the any right winger stay on subject about anything?

I've been on point with all my arguments and have backed up every claim that I have put out there.

The false claims are coming from eco weenies on the left.

Look. You need Canuck crude. You don't produce enough on your own therefore you must import crude.

You have been doing so for many years and in the last decade Canada has become your number one supplier of crude.

What the fuck is the problem? All the other pipelines have been built.

What the hell is fucking wrong with the Northern leg of the Keystone that would pick up oil from your Bakken fields?

Seriously. The Keystone is complete. The XL is just a minor expansion.

This is bullshit.

You have been doing so for many years and in the last decade Canada has become your number one supplier of crude.

You're a liar. I posted the number of barrels this country imports. Mexico and South America sell the USA more oil than Canada.

and your comments vary so far from the truth nobody affords you any credibility bases on your track record. Go find another thread and lie.

A country and a continent combined. Hey why not throw in Nigeria and the Middle East?

Of course if you start switching up one country vs a continent and another country they would supply more.

Fucking idiot.



My track record is impeccable. No lies and everything backed up.

Just because you can't handle the truth doesn't mean that it's not the truth.

you were saying?

And? You still to import.

 

[Siete]

Keystone has already cut our gas prices even though the last leg isn't complete.

Keystone is needed so the shale production OUR OWN western states will increase.

es

 

[Wry Catcher]

From my understanding is that the keystone pipeline is solely about helping Canada get to the gulf and ship oil out the US and has nothing to do with: 1. Getting the US more oil (like many like myself were led to believe) and 2. Not about producing and sending any of our oil anywhere.

Please correct me if I am wrong, but other than the over inflated (yes the right lies about the number of jobs that are created, just like the left does) temporary jobs, what is the big benefit to the US that we continue fight back and forth over.

If it truly was about getting more Canadian oil to the stated, then I am for it. It should more forward, but if it's solely about getting Canadian oil to the gulf, then I have no idea why (other then generous kickbacks), whey the Republicans are pushing for this so hard!

Keystone XL pipeline

Wow, thank you.

Sadly the willfully ignorant and those whose brains have already been washed by Big Oil, and the few others Keystone XL will benefit, will continue to make Keystone XL a mission; a mission no different than those who scream Benghazi, Solyndra, Death Panels and the dozens of hysterical outrages posted since Obama was nominated and later elected President of the United States.

 

[tinydancer]

There's not much in it for the U.S.

TransCanada already said the refined products will not be sold in the U.S.

It's not the end of the world - if the folks on the route are satisfied with their lease/sale agreement, spill clean-up plans, and plans to put things back after the pipeline is no longer needed, then who am I to tell them no?

Folks along the rout are not satisfied. This is the first time a foreign based company has been given imminent domain rights in the US.

Bullshit. I've put up the other routes. Do you want more? How bad do you want to look today?

I'm aware that there are lots of pipelines in existence. We're talking about this one. Just because there are other lines doesn't mean this one should be done. The right started this discussion about this specific line with a long list of false claims that have all been proven to be lies. Why can't the any right winger stay on subject about anything?

I've been on point with all my arguments and have backed up every claim that I have put out there.

The false claims are coming from eco weenies on the left.

Look. You need Canuck crude. You don't produce enough on your own therefore you must import crude.

You have been doing so for many years and in the last decade Canada has become your number one supplier of crude.

What the fuck is the problem? All the other pipelines have been built.

What the hell is fucking wrong with the Northern leg of the Keystone that would pick up oil from your Bakken fields?

Seriously. The Keystone is complete. The XL is just a minor expansion.

This is bullshit.

Well, no. You have been continually trying to change the subject. We are talking about this particular pipeline, and whether there is justification to build it. Not other lines that have already been built. You have presented a lot of information, however, that information is nor pertinent to this subject. I know you want it to be, but it's just not. Do you have anything concerning reasons to build this particular line?

You really don't get it do you. Check your timelines. While you left wing whackos have been freaking out over the XL, Keystone Cushing to the Gulf was being built. In present time. The lateral part of Keystone is being built. To be finished this year.

While you were flipping out and protesting the Alberta Clipper and Southern Lights were being built.

In the here and now. But nothing not a peep. No protests raging on the southern leg.

None. Zip. Nada.

 

[Siete]

I'm aware that there are lots of pipelines in existence. We're talking about this one. Just because there are other lines doesn't mean this one should be done. The right started this discussion about this specific line with a long list of false claims that have all been proven to be lies. Why can't the any right winger stay on subject about anything?

I've been on point with all my arguments and have backed up every claim that I have put out there.

The false claims are coming from eco weenies on the left.

Look. You need Canuck crude. You don't produce enough on your own therefore you must import crude.

You have been doing so for many years and in the last decade Canada has become your number one supplier of crude.

What the fuck is the problem? All the other pipelines have been built.

What the hell is fucking wrong with the Northern leg of the Keystone that would pick up oil from your Bakken fields?

Seriously. The Keystone is complete. The XL is just a minor expansion.

This is bullshit.

You have been doing so for many years and in the last decade Canada has become your number one supplier of crude.

You're a liar. I posted the number of barrels this country imports. Mexico and South America sell the USA more oil than Canada.

and your comments vary so far from the truth nobody affords you any credibility bases on your track record. Go find another thread and lie.

A country and a continent combined. Hey why not throw in Nigeria and the Middle East?

Of course if you start switching up one country vs a continent and another country they would supply more.

Fucking idiot.



My track record is impeccable. No lies and everything backed up.

Just because you can't handle the truth doesn't mean that it's not the truth.

you were saying?

And? You still to import.

and export ..

The United States imported approximately 9.9 million barrels per day (MMbbl/d) of petroleum in 2013 from about 80 countries. Petroleum includes crude oil and refined petroleum products such as gasoline and diesel fuel, and biofuels including ethanol and biodiesel. In 2013, about 78% of gross petroleum imports were crude oil, and about 51% of the crude oil that was processed in U.S. refineries was imported.

The United States exported 3.6 MMbbl/d of crude oil and petroleum products in 2013, resulting in net imports (imports minus exports) of 6.2 MMbbl/d in 2013. Net imports accounted for 33% of the petroleum consumed in the United States, the lowest annual average since 1985.

The top five source countries providing U.S. petroleum imports in 2013 were Canada, Mexico, Russia, Saudi Arabia, and Venezuela. Their respective rankings vary based on gross petroleum imports or net petroleum imports (gross imports minus exports).

we USE Canada, we don't NEED Canada .... deal with it.

 

[tinydancer]

From my understanding is that the keystone pipeline is solely about helping Canada get to the gulf and ship oil out the US and has nothing to do with: 1. Getting the US more oil (like many like myself were led to believe) and 2. Not about producing and sending any of our oil anywhere.

Please correct me if I am wrong, but other than the over inflated (yes the right lies about the number of jobs that are created, just like the left does) temporary jobs, what is the big benefit to the US that we continue fight back and forth over.

If it truly was about getting more Canadian oil to the stated, then I am for it. It should more forward, but if it's solely about getting Canadian oil to the gulf, then I have no idea why (other then generous kickbacks), whey the Republicans are pushing for this so hard!

Keystone XL pipeline

Wow, thank you.

Sadly the willfully ignorant and those whose brains have already been washed by Big Oil, and the few others Keystone XL will benefit, will continue to make Keystone XL a mission; a mission no different than those who scream Benghazi, Solyndra, Death Panels and the dozens of hysterical outrages posted since Obama was nominated and later elected President of the United States.

Oh piss off. You need to get up to speed. The Keystone is complete. Crude is flowing.

XL is just the northern leg that would also pick up crude from the Bakkens in Montana and North Dakota.

This is complete and utter bullshit that Canada needs to ship oil to the Gulf to ship to other countries.

Seriously how geographically retarded are you left wingers? We have both east and west big blue things called FUCKING OCEANS on either coast.

You know. Called the Pacific and the Atlantic.

 

[tinydancer]

I've been on point with all my arguments and have backed up every claim that I have put out there.

The false claims are coming from eco weenies on the left.

Look. You need Canuck crude. You don't produce enough on your own therefore you must import crude.

You have been doing so for many years and in the last decade Canada has become your number one supplier of crude.

What the fuck is the problem? All the other pipelines have been built.

What the hell is fucking wrong with the Northern leg of the Keystone that would pick up oil from your Bakken fields?

Seriously. The Keystone is complete. The XL is just a minor expansion.

This is bullshit.

You have been doing so for many years and in the last decade Canada has become your number one supplier of crude.

You're a liar. I posted the number of barrels this country imports. Mexico and South America sell the USA more oil than Canada.

and your comments vary so far from the truth nobody affords you any credibility bases on your track record. Go find another thread and lie.

A country and a continent combined. Hey why not throw in Nigeria and the Middle East?

Of course if you start switching up one country vs a continent and another country they would supply more.

Fucking idiot.



My track record is impeccable. No lies and everything backed up.

Just because you can't handle the truth doesn't mean that it's not the truth.

you were saying?

And? You still to import.

and export ..

The United States imported approximately 9.9 million barrels per day (MMbbl/d) of petroleum in 2013 from about 80 countries. Petroleum includes crude oil and refined petroleum products such as gasoline and diesel fuel, and biofuels including ethanol and biodiesel. In 2013, about 78% of gross petroleum imports were crude oil, and about 51% of the crude oil that was processed in U.S. refineries was imported.

The United States exported 3.6 MMbbl/d of crude oil and petroleum products in 2013, resulting in net imports (imports minus exports) of 6.2 MMbbl/d in 2013. Net imports accounted for 33% of the petroleum consumed in the United States, the lowest annual average since 1985.

The top five source countries providing U.S. petroleum imports in 2013 were Canada, Mexico, Russia, Saudi Arabia, and Venezuela. Their respective rankings vary based on gross petroleum imports or net petroleum imports (gross imports minus exports).

we USE Canada, we don't NEED Canada .... deal with it.

Then Siete you just get your ass on over to your American companies and direct them not to purchase Canadian crude anymore.

Yeah, yeah that's the ticket. You just tell them not to buy from Canada.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

From my understanding is that the keystone pipeline is solely about helping Canada get to the gulf and ship oil out the US and has nothing to do with: 1. Getting the US more oil (like many like myself were led to believe) and 2. Not about producing and sending any of our oil anywhere.

Please correct me if I am wrong, but other than the over inflated (yes the right lies about the number of jobs that are created, just like the left does) temporary jobs, what is the big benefit to the US that we continue fight back and forth over.

If it truly was about getting more Canadian oil to the stated, then I am for it. It should more forward, but if it's solely about getting Canadian oil to the gulf, then I have no idea why (other then generous kickbacks), whey the Republicans are pushing for this so hard!

Adding to our pipeline network will also help our fracked oil get to market, without using more dangerous train cars or trucks.

It will cost thousands of jobs from truck drivers to the supporting industries. And the mess from burst pipelines will devastate drinking water and farmlands. And all for a measly 35 permanent jobs.

It will cost thousands of jobs from truck drivers to the supporting industries.

We should move oil in 5 gallon containers, one per truck. Think of all the jobs that would create!
Oh, yeah, we should also shut down the thousands of miles of existing pipelines.
We could add 20 million jobs, overnight! /liberal idiocy off

 

[BULLDOG]

From my understanding is that the keystone pipeline is solely about helping Canada get to the gulf and ship oil out the US and has nothing to do with: 1. Getting the US more oil (like many like myself were led to believe) and 2. Not about producing and sending any of our oil anywhere.

Please correct me if I am wrong, but other than the over inflated (yes the right lies about the number of jobs that are created, just like the left does) temporary jobs, what is the big benefit to the US that we continue fight back and forth over.

If it truly was about getting more Canadian oil to the stated, then I am for it. It should more forward, but if it's solely about getting Canadian oil to the gulf, then I have no idea why (other then generous kickbacks), whey the Republicans are pushing for this so hard!

Adding to our pipeline network will also help our fracked oil get to market, without using more dangerous train cars or trucks.

It will cost thousands of jobs from truck drivers to the supporting industries. And the mess from burst pipelines will devastate drinking water and farmlands. And all for a measly 35 permanent jobs.

It will cost thousands of jobs from truck drivers to the supporting industries.

We should move oil in 5 gallon containers, one per truck. Think of all the jobs that would create!
Oh, yeah, we should also shut down the thousands of miles of existing pipelines.
We could add 20 million jobs, overnight! /liberal idiocy off

If I wanted to demonstrate ridiculous right wing logic, I could do no better than to quote your post.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

From my understanding is that the keystone pipeline is solely about helping Canada get to the gulf and ship oil out the US and has nothing to do with: 1. Getting the US more oil (like many like myself were led to believe) and 2. Not about producing and sending any of our oil anywhere.

Please correct me if I am wrong, but other than the over inflated (yes the right lies about the number of jobs that are created, just like the left does) temporary jobs, what is the big benefit to the US that we continue fight back and forth over.

If it truly was about getting more Canadian oil to the stated, then I am for it. It should more forward, but if it's solely about getting Canadian oil to the gulf, then I have no idea why (other then generous kickbacks), whey the Republicans are pushing for this so hard!

Adding to our pipeline network will also help our fracked oil get to market, without using more dangerous train cars or trucks.

It will cost thousands of jobs from truck drivers to the supporting industries. And the mess from burst pipelines will devastate drinking water and farmlands. And all for a measly 35 permanent jobs.

It will cost thousands of jobs from truck drivers to the supporting industries.

We should move oil in 5 gallon containers, one per truck. Think of all the jobs that would create!
Oh, yeah, we should also shut down the thousands of miles of existing pipelines.
We could add 20 million jobs, overnight! /liberal idiocy off

If I wanted to demonstrate ridiculous right wing logic, I could do no better than to quote your post.

If I wanted to demonstrate ridiculous right wing logic, I could do no better than to quote your post.

That's funny, because my post was demonstrating Rdean's idiotic left wing "logic".

 

[nodoginnafight]

MHO: If the backers hadn't lied so much overselling this - it would have already been passed.

There's nothing dangerous in this - but they exaggerated the benefit so much, it was just too easy for opponents to pick apart their lies.

This is nothing more than a partisan pissing match over a largely inconsequential project.

 

[Siete]

You have been doing so for many years and in the last decade Canada has become your number one supplier of crude.

You're a liar. I posted the number of barrels this country imports. Mexico and South America sell the USA more oil than Canada.

and your comments vary so far from the truth nobody affords you any credibility bases on your track record. Go find another thread and lie.

A country and a continent combined. Hey why not throw in Nigeria and the Middle East?

Of course if you start switching up one country vs a continent and another country they would supply more.

Fucking idiot.



My track record is impeccable. No lies and everything backed up.

Just because you can't handle the truth doesn't mean that it's not the truth.

you were saying?

And? You still to import.

and export ..

The United States imported approximately 9.9 million barrels per day (MMbbl/d) of petroleum in 2013 from about 80 countries. Petroleum includes crude oil and refined petroleum products such as gasoline and diesel fuel, and biofuels including ethanol and biodiesel. In 2013, about 78% of gross petroleum imports were crude oil, and about 51% of the crude oil that was processed in U.S. refineries was imported.

The United States exported 3.6 MMbbl/d of crude oil and petroleum products in 2013, resulting in net imports (imports minus exports) of 6.2 MMbbl/d in 2013. Net imports accounted for 33% of the petroleum consumed in the United States, the lowest annual average since 1985.

The top five source countries providing U.S. petroleum imports in 2013 were Canada, Mexico, Russia, Saudi Arabia, and Venezuela. Their respective rankings vary based on gross petroleum imports or net petroleum imports (gross imports minus exports).

we USE Canada, we don't NEED Canada .... deal with it.

Then Siete you just get your ass on over to your American companies and direct them not to purchase Canadian crude anymore.

Yeah, yeah that's the ticket. You just tell them not to buy from Canada.

importing oil from Canada is political, and completely out of my reach. You being the Canadian IDIOT you are is also out of my reach.

 

[Paperman299]

There's not much in it for the U.S.

TransCanada already said the refined products will not be sold in the U.S.

It's not the end of the world - if the folks on the route are satisfied with their lease/sale agreement, spill clean-up plans, and plans to put things back after the pipeline is no longer needed, then who am I to tell them no?

I'm just pissed about the $1B U.S. taxpayers gave the refineries to help them re-tool so they could handle this stuff.

Nodog, though I generally agree with your mostly-neutral position, I've got to correct you on something here and I've pointed out this error to you before: TransCanada has not stated that "all" the refined product will be exported. In fact, the refineries which receive the crude will likely export about half.

According to the U.S. Energy Information Administration, refineries in PADD 3 (called the Gulf Coast refineries district) produced 6.8 million bpd of refined product in August – the latest month data is available. However, some of these refineries are located in West Texas,New Mexico,Northern Louisiana and Arkansas, places too far inland to have access to the water for loading tankers. Coastal refineries in Texas and Louisiana produced about 6 million bpd of refined product, of which they exported 3.1 million bpd last month – over half of their production.

Fact Checking on Keystone XL and Exports - Oil Change InternationalOil Change International

 

[tinydancer]

MHO: If the backers hadn't lied so much overselling this - it would have already been passed.

There's nothing dangerous in this - but they exaggerated the benefit so much, it was just too easy for opponents to pick apart their lies.

This is nothing more than a partisan pissing match over a largely inconsequential project.

Oh it wouldn't have already been passed because so many Democrats have been bought by Steyer. They would choose death before they would back the Keystone. Too much campaign money at stake.

Steyer spent 80 million on the mid terms. Now 2016 is coming up and Democrats will get their payday again from Steyer. $$$$ talks.

Only good blue dog Democrats like Heidi Heitkamp fighting for her state have the balls to go against the big money Steyer has put up.

And this is just the northern leg of Keystone. The direct line was being completed while this dog and pony show of the XL was going on.

So were the Alberta Clipper and the Southern Lights pipelines that OMG no one protested.

What a pathetic joke.

 

[Siete]

MHO: If the backers hadn't lied so much overselling this - it would have already been passed.

There's nothing dangerous in this - but they exaggerated the benefit so much, it was just too easy for opponents to pick apart their lies.

This is nothing more than a partisan pissing match over a largely inconsequential project.

Oh it wouldn't have already been passed because so many Democrats have been bought by Steyer. They would choose death before they would back the Keystone. Too much campaign money at stake.

Steyer spent 80 million on the mid terms. Now 2016 is coming up and Democrats will get their payday again from Steyer. $$$$ talks.

Only good blue dog Democrats like Heidi Heitkamp fighting for her state have the balls to go against the big money Steyer has put up.

And this is just the northern leg of Keystone. The direct line was being completed while this dog and pony show of the XL was going on.

So were the Alberta Clipper and the Southern Lights pipelines that OMG no one protested.

What a pathetic joke.

the Alberta Clipper and the Southern Lights pipelines don't cut the US in half either ... you're the joke TD.

 

[tinydancer]

MHO: If the backers hadn't lied so much overselling this - it would have already been passed.

There's nothing dangerous in this - but they exaggerated the benefit so much, it was just too easy for opponents to pick apart their lies.

This is nothing more than a partisan pissing match over a largely inconsequential project.

Oh it wouldn't have already been passed because so many Democrats have been bought by Steyer. They would choose death before they would back the Keystone. Too much campaign money at stake.

Steyer spent 80 million on the mid terms. Now 2016 is coming up and Democrats will get their payday again from Steyer. $$$$ talks.

Only good blue dog Democrats like Heidi Heitkamp fighting for her state have the balls to go against the big money Steyer has put up.

And this is just the northern leg of Keystone. The direct line was being completed while this dog and pony show of the XL was going on.

So were the Alberta Clipper and the Southern Lights pipelines that OMG no one protested.

What a pathetic joke.

the Alberta Clipper and the Southern Lights pipelines don't cut the US in half either ... you're the joke TD.

This is an argument I've yet to debate. Do tell. Why is it of any concern that the Keystone takes the most direct route to the Gulf and "cuts America in half"?

I can't wait. Do explain how this is bad?

 

[tinydancer]

"The anti-Keystone rhetoric appears to be objecting to the rise in exports of refined product — mostly gasoline and diesel fuel. Last year, for the first time in six decades, the U.S. exported more gasoline and diesel than it imported. The Keystone opposition wants to argue that this is an elaborate ploy to prop up profits for Gulf Coast refiners: The crude is sent down from Canada and the finished product is sold elsewhere, so there’s no benefit to the U.S.

But again, this argument fails on simple economics. While refined exports did rise, it was a response to weaker domestic demand as the U.S. struggled to pull its way out of recession. In a down economy, people don’t drive as much, and companies don’t ship as many goods by truck. Refiners chose to boost exports rather than curtail output, which would have triggered more layoffs in a weak economy.

The bulk of the exports went to Mexico, Canada and Brazil. Mexico and Canada, even without Keystone, are two of our biggest suppliers of crude (Canada is No. 1; Mexico is No. 4 behind Saudi Arabia and Venezuela). Gasoline, of course, is more expensive than crude, so we are in effect importing raw materials, adding value, and selling it back at a higher price – and maintaining U.S. jobs in the process. It also helps reduce the trade deficit.

What’s more, the exports of refined products have fallen as the domestic demand has recovered, according to the latest data from the U.S. Energy Information Administration."

Energy Reality Check Keystone Crude Won t Be Exported - Forbes

 

[Wry Catcher]

From my understanding is that the keystone pipeline is solely about helping Canada get to the gulf and ship oil out the US and has nothing to do with: 1. Getting the US more oil (like many like myself were led to believe) and 2. Not about producing and sending any of our oil anywhere.

Please correct me if I am wrong, but other than the over inflated (yes the right lies about the number of jobs that are created, just like the left does) temporary jobs, what is the big benefit to the US that we continue fight back and forth over.

If it truly was about getting more Canadian oil to the stated, then I am for it. It should more forward, but if it's solely about getting Canadian oil to the gulf, then I have no idea why (other then generous kickbacks), whey the Republicans are pushing for this so hard!

Keystone XL pipeline

Wow, thank you.

Sadly the willfully ignorant and those whose brains have already been washed by Big Oil, and the few others Keystone XL will benefit, will continue to make Keystone XL a mission; a mission no different than those who scream Benghazi, Solyndra, Death Panels and the dozens of hysterical outrages posted since Obama was nominated and later elected President of the United States.

Oh piss off. You need to get up to speed. The Keystone is complete. Crude is flowing.

XL is just the northern leg that would also pick up crude from the Bakkens in Montana and North Dakota.

This is complete and utter bullshit that Canada needs to ship oil to the Gulf to ship to other countries.

Seriously how geographically retarded are you left wingers? We have both east and west big blue things called FUCKING OCEANS on either coast.

You know. Called the Pacific and the Atlantic.

Is the fuel produced from tar sands a pollutant? Does it do more or less harm to the environment then other forms of crude oil. Are the battery's in hybrid cars a greater pollutant today than the refinement of tar sands? Are solar, wind and hydroelectric cleaner sources of energy than tar sands. And, why are you so cock sure that tar sands are better than renewable and green sources of energy? Do you have a personal stake in the building of the pipeline? Do the people whose water source is at risk have any say in the matter, or do you want them to piss off too?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

There's not much in it for the U.S.

TransCanada already said the refined products will not be sold in the U.S.

It's not the end of the world - if the folks on the route are satisfied with their lease/sale agreement, spill clean-up plans, and plans to put things back after the pipeline is no longer needed, then who am I to tell them no?

I'm just pissed about the $1B U.S. taxpayers gave the refineries to help them re-tool so they could handle this stuff.

I'm just pissed about the $1B U.S. taxpayers gave the refineries to help them re-tool so they could handle this stuff.

When did taxpayers do that? Link?

 

[tinydancer]

From my understanding is that the keystone pipeline is solely about helping Canada get to the gulf and ship oil out the US and has nothing to do with: 1. Getting the US more oil (like many like myself were led to believe) and 2. Not about producing and sending any of our oil anywhere.

Please correct me if I am wrong, but other than the over inflated (yes the right lies about the number of jobs that are created, just like the left does) temporary jobs, what is the big benefit to the US that we continue fight back and forth over.

If it truly was about getting more Canadian oil to the stated, then I am for it. It should more forward, but if it's solely about getting Canadian oil to the gulf, then I have no idea why (other then generous kickbacks), whey the Republicans are pushing for this so hard!

Keystone XL pipeline

Wow, thank you.

Sadly the willfully ignorant and those whose brains have already been washed by Big Oil, and the few others Keystone XL will benefit, will continue to make Keystone XL a mission; a mission no different than those who scream Benghazi, Solyndra, Death Panels and the dozens of hysterical outrages posted since Obama was nominated and later elected President of the United States.

Oh piss off. You need to get up to speed. The Keystone is complete. Crude is flowing.

XL is just the northern leg that would also pick up crude from the Bakkens in Montana and North Dakota.

This is complete and utter bullshit that Canada needs to ship oil to the Gulf to ship to other countries.

Seriously how geographically retarded are you left wingers? We have both east and west big blue things called FUCKING OCEANS on either coast.

You know. Called the Pacific and the Atlantic.

Is the fuel produced from tar sands a pollutant? Does it do more or less harm to the environment then other forms of crude oil. Are the battery's in hybrid cars a greater pollutant today than the refinement of tar sands? Are solar, wind and hydroelectric cleaner sources of energy than tar sands. And, why are you so cock sure that tar sands are better than renewable and green sources of energy? Do you have a personal stake in the building of the pipeline? Do the people whose water source is at risk have any say in the matter, or do you want them to piss off too?

None of your post means jack shit because whether you or anyone else likes it or not this crude is being purchased and refined by refineries in Canada and the US. And that will not stop with the blockade of XL.

More than happy one day to discuss the broader issues of renewables, solar and wind. But that's not for the here and now.

Being a mega conservationist since Grassy Narrows I personally believe that a pipeline is the safest method of transfer of crude to refineries. The technology has come up to speed.

I trust pipelines far more than rail or transport truck. The Keystone is built. This is just strictly a dog and pony show. The XL is just the northern leg which would transport Bakken crude to refineries as well.

It's just a fucking pipeline.

Now on to water. That has been my passion for 40 years now. From mercury poisoning to leading a fight in Southern Ontario to protect an aquifer I lived on from intensive hog farming to battling for pure water for First Nations who are consistently under boil water advisories. Oh and still battling intensive hog farming out here too.

Before I started peeping off and supporting the XL I researched. I don't buy into spin. I believe it is truly the safest way to transport the crude.

It's pick your poison on how you want it delivered. I made my choice.