Giuliani Says ‘Truth Isn’t Truth’ in Defense of Trump’s Legal Strategy

[Hutch Starskey]

Rudy lied on MTP. Straight up lied.
No one in the Trump camp can
"misremember" what we all know.

On Jun 3, 2016, at 10:36 AM, Rob Goldstone wrote:

Good morning

Emin just called and asked me to contact you with something very interesting.

The Crown prosecutor of Russia met with his father Aras this morning and in their meeting offered to provide the Trump campaign with some official documents and information that would incriminate Hillary and her dealings with Russia and would be very useful to your father.

This is obviously very high level and sensitive information but is part of Russia and its government's support for Mr. Trump - helped along by Aras and Emin.

What do you think is the best way to handle this information and would you be able to speak to Emin about it directly?

I can also send this info to your father via Rhona, but it is ultra sensitive so wanted to send to you first.

Best

Rob Goldstone

---------------------------

On Jun 3, 2016, at 10:53, Donald Trump Jr. wrote:

Thanks Rob I appreciate that. I am on the road at the moment but perhaps I just speak to Emin first. Seems we have some time and if it's what you say I love it especially later in the summer. Could we do a call first thing next week when I am back?

Best,

Don




We all know now that Trump knew about this meeting before it occurred. We also know he wrote the bogus response.

"We all know"????????????????

Prove it. LMAO

.

I just gave you the emails, dope.

And then you proceeded to make assumptions you can't prove.

.

Did you read my post, dope?

No one can "misremember" details about that meeting as Rudy suggested.

RUDY GIULIANI: That was the original intention of the meeting. It turned out to be a meeting about another subject and it was not pursued at all. And, of course, any meeting with regard to getting information on your opponent is something any candidate's staff would take. If someone said, I have information about your opponent, you would take that meeting. If it happens to be a person with a Russian --
CHUCK TODD: From the Russian government?
RUDY GIULIANI: She didn't represent the Russian government, she's a private citizen. I don't even know if they knew she was Russian at the time. All they had was her name.



We know that's simply not true.

we do how? the comment said talk not meet with. so again, what is it you think you got? see how the truth isn't the truth?

The only thing I see is how dumb you're willing to appear in defense of ole Rudy.

 

[OKTexas]

The fact is two people often have different interpretations of the same events. The more people involved the more stories you'll get, and everyone of them will swear they are telling the truth. Of course you folks know this, but it doesn't fit well with your propaganda. Eye witnesses very often get it wrong.

.

The fact is two people often have different interpretations of the same events. The more people involved the more stories you'll get, and everyone of them will swear they are telling the truth. Of course you folks know this, but it doesn't fit well with your propaganda. Eye witnesses very often get it wrong.

Rudy lied on MTP. Straight up lied.
No one in the Trump camp can
"misremember" what we all know.

On Jun 3, 2016, at 10:36 AM, Rob Goldstone wrote:

Good morning

Emin just called and asked me to contact you with something very interesting.

The Crown prosecutor of Russia met with his father Aras this morning and in their meeting offered to provide the Trump campaign with some official documents and information that would incriminate Hillary and her dealings with Russia and would be very useful to your father.

This is obviously very high level and sensitive information but is part of Russia and its government's support for Mr. Trump - helped along by Aras and Emin.

What do you think is the best way to handle this information and would you be able to speak to Emin about it directly?

I can also send this info to your father via Rhona, but it is ultra sensitive so wanted to send to you first.

Best

Rob Goldstone

---------------------------

On Jun 3, 2016, at 10:53, Donald Trump Jr. wrote:

Thanks Rob I appreciate that. I am on the road at the moment but perhaps I just speak to Emin first. Seems we have some time and if it's what you say I love it especially later in the summer. Could we do a call first thing next week when I am back?

Best,

Don




We all know now that Trump knew about this meeting before it occurred. We also know he wrote the bogus response.

"We all know"????????????????

Prove it. LMAO

.

I just gave you the emails, dope.

And then you proceeded to make assumptions you can't prove.

.

Did you read my post, dope?

No one can "misremember" details about that meeting as Rudy suggested.

RUDY GIULIANI: That was the original intention of the meeting. It turned out to be a meeting about another subject and it was not pursued at all. And, of course, any meeting with regard to getting information on your opponent is something any candidate's staff would take. If someone said, I have information about your opponent, you would take that meeting. If it happens to be a person with a Russian --
CHUCK TODD: From the Russian government?
RUDY GIULIANI: She didn't represent the Russian government, she's a private citizen. I don't even know if they knew she was Russian at the time. All they had was her name.



We know that's simply not true.

Which part?

.

 

[jc456]

"We all know"????????????????

Prove it. LMAO

.

I just gave you the emails, dope.

And then you proceeded to make assumptions you can't prove.

.

Did you read my post, dope?

No one can "misremember" details about that meeting as Rudy suggested.

RUDY GIULIANI: That was the original intention of the meeting. It turned out to be a meeting about another subject and it was not pursued at all. And, of course, any meeting with regard to getting information on your opponent is something any candidate's staff would take. If someone said, I have information about your opponent, you would take that meeting. If it happens to be a person with a Russian --
CHUCK TODD: From the Russian government?
RUDY GIULIANI: She didn't represent the Russian government, she's a private citizen. I don't even know if they knew she was Russian at the time. All they had was her name.



We know that's simply not true.

we do how? the comment said talk not meet with. so again, what is it you think you got? see how the truth isn't the truth?

The only thing I see is how dumb you're willing to appear in defense of ole Rudy.

well stupid fk, you're using an email that doesn't mention anything about a meeting. Nothing, nadda, zip. So how is it proof trump knew about it? the meeting? Please explain, I asked and you never answered.

 

[easyt65]

The only thing I see is how dumb you're willing to appear in defense of ole Rudy.

Because you are a butt-hurt snowflake who WANTS to see only that and who shuts his eyes to all the times 'liberal / Snowflake TRUTH' has been exposed as Fake News / Lies!

 

[rightwinger]

I also thought it was funny when Rudy said that they didn't know if the lawyer chick was Russian or not, because all they had was her name. Yeah...........sure.............nobody knew she was Russian until the meeting was held.

Rudy Giuliani's Sunday show appearance was a total disaster - CNNPolitics

RUDY GIULIANI: That was the original intention of the meeting. It turned out to be a meeting about another subject and it was not pursued at all. And, of course, any meeting with regard to getting information on your opponent is something any candidate's staff would take. If someone said, I have information about your opponent, you would take that meeting. If it happens to be a person with a Russian --
CHUCK TODD: From the Russian government?
RUDY GIULIANI: She didn't represent the Russian government, she's a private citizen. I don't even know if they knew she was Russian at the time. All they had was her name.

How stupid is Trump and his top people that they don’t verify who they are taking a meeting with?

What if they turned out to be Russian spy’s?

Or lobbyist?

.

You are trying to become the POTUS and that is the best judgement you can show?

You take a meeting with someone with obvious Russian ties and you don’t know what those ties are?
You don’t record or take notes of the meeting to be sure?

 

[Hutch Starskey]

The only thing I see is how dumb you're willing to appear in defense of ole Rudy.

Because you are a butt-hurt snowflake who WANTS to see only that and who shuts his eyes to all the times 'liberal / Snowflake TRUTH' has been exposed as Fake News / Lies!

Butthurt?

It's you triggered dopes that feel compelled to try and derail this thread with spam nonsense.

 

[rightwinger]

I just gave you the emails, dope.

And then you proceeded to make assumptions you can't prove.

.

Did you read my post, dope?

No one can "misremember" details about that meeting as Rudy suggested.

RUDY GIULIANI: That was the original intention of the meeting. It turned out to be a meeting about another subject and it was not pursued at all. And, of course, any meeting with regard to getting information on your opponent is something any candidate's staff would take. If someone said, I have information about your opponent, you would take that meeting. If it happens to be a person with a Russian --
CHUCK TODD: From the Russian government?
RUDY GIULIANI: She didn't represent the Russian government, she's a private citizen. I don't even know if they knew she was Russian at the time. All they had was her name.



We know that's simply not true.

we do how? the comment said talk not meet with. so again, what is it you think you got? see how the truth isn't the truth?

The only thing I see is how dumb you're willing to appear in defense of ole Rudy.

well stupid fk, you're using an email that doesn't mention anything about a meeting. Nothing, nadda, zip. So how is it proof trump knew about it? the meeting? Please explain, I asked and you never answered.

Trump didn’t know his son and top people were meeting with Russian agents about the Clintons when he was in the building at the time?

Then why did he tease that he had something big to report on the Clintons and would tell by Monday?

He couldn’t wait for the actual meeting before he bragged about it’s results

 

[OKTexas]

I also thought it was funny when Rudy said that they didn't know if the lawyer chick was Russian or not, because all they had was her name. Yeah...........sure.............nobody knew she was Russian until the meeting was held.

Rudy Giuliani's Sunday show appearance was a total disaster - CNNPolitics

RUDY GIULIANI: That was the original intention of the meeting. It turned out to be a meeting about another subject and it was not pursued at all. And, of course, any meeting with regard to getting information on your opponent is something any candidate's staff would take. If someone said, I have information about your opponent, you would take that meeting. If it happens to be a person with a Russian --
CHUCK TODD: From the Russian government?
RUDY GIULIANI: She didn't represent the Russian government, she's a private citizen. I don't even know if they knew she was Russian at the time. All they had was her name.

How stupid is Trump and his top people that they don’t verify who they are taking a meeting with?

What if they turned out to be Russian spy’s?

Or lobbyist?

.

You are trying to become the POTUS and that is the best judgement you can show?

You take a meeting with someone with obvious Russian ties and you don’t know what those ties are?
You don’t record or take notes of the meeting to be sure?

A rookie mistake by Jr, yep. A crime, not so much.

.

 

[easyt65]

A rookie mistake by Jr, yep. A crime, not so much.
.

If accepting a meeting with a Russian lawyer who says she has opposition research to offer on Hillary (but none was ever passed) is considered a 'Rookie Mistake', what do you call 'seasoned veteran' Hillary Clinton colluding with and PAYING foreign spies and Russians to help her try to win the Presidency?

 

[Dana7360]

I will be the first person to admit that people who refuse to confront & deal with reality baffle me. Trump and his people have thus far succeeded by crafting their own version of reality and I guess that works as long as you have enough money & power to isolate yourself and your facade from anything that threatens it. Trump is surrounded by individuals who apparently are paid to co-sign his lies.

I know attorneys are required to behave ethically but is it ethical to knowingly and willfully lie on behalf of your client - to investigators, to the court, etc?

Getting back to Gulliani's question if his client says he didn't do it and the investigator says he was there when he did, then it becomes a matter of who has more credibility and why, one would imagine, correct? You don't get "trapped" into committing perjury. Perjury requires knowingly making a false statement regarding a material issue.

A perjury trap definition is below. What Mueller is doing isn't a perjury trap. He will be asking trump questions that are directly involved with the investigation. Mueller already has enough proof of obstruction of justice and probable conspiracy with russia in the 2016 election. He doesn't need to use perjury to prosecute trump later. I will add, all trump has to do is not lie. If he tells the truth he has nothing to worry about.

I will point out that what is described below sounds a lot like what ken starr did in the Clinton investigation. Clinton fell into it by lying. He could have avoided the whole thing if he had just told the truth. Or if he had pointed out that what he did with lewinsky had nothing to do with the paula jones lawsuit. Clinton lied on a deposition for a civil lawsuit with paula jones.

Perjury-Trap Doctrine Law and Legal Definition | USLegal, Inc.

Perjury trap doctrine refers to a principle that a perjury indictment against a person must be dismissed if the prosecution secures it by calling that person as a grand-jury witness in an effort to obtain evidence for a perjury charge especially when the person’s testimony does not relate to issues material to the ongoing grand-jury investigation. The perjury trap is a form of entrapment defense, and so must be affirmatively proven by the defendant.

A perjury trap is created when the government calls a witness before the grand jury for the primary purpose of obtaining testimony from him in order to prosecute him later for perjury. When testimony is elicited before a grand jury that is attempting to obtain useful information in furtherance of its investigation, or conducting a legitimate investigation into crimes which had in fact taken place within its jurisdiction, the perjury trap doctrine is, by definition, inapplicable. [United States v. Chen, 933 F.2d 793 (9th Cir. Guam 1991)]

 

[OKTexas]

A rookie mistake by Jr, yep. A crime, not so much.
.

If accepting a meeting with a Russian lawyer who says she has opposition research to offer on Hillary (but none was ever passed) is considered a 'Rookie Mistake', what do you call 'seasoned veteran' Hillary Clinton colluding with and PAYING foreign spies and Russians to help her try to win the Presidency?

The bitch isn't the topic here.

.

 

[easyt65]

A rookie mistake by Jr, yep. A crime, not so much.
.

If accepting a meeting with a Russian lawyer who says she has opposition research to offer on Hillary (but none was ever passed) is considered a 'Rookie Mistake', what do you call 'seasoned veteran' Hillary Clinton colluding with and PAYING foreign spies and Russians to help her try to win the Presidency?

The bitch isn't the topic here.

.

The 'TRUTH' is the topic of this thread, my little triggered snowflake friend.

Why are you so afraid of the question? I am just trying to get to the 'TRUTH'....

If accepting a meeting with a Russian lawyer who says she has opposition research to offer on Hillary (but none was ever passed) is considered a 'Rookie Mistake', what do you call 'seasoned veteran' Hillary Clinton colluding with and PAYING foreign spies and Russians to help her try to win the Presidency?

 

[rightwinger]

I also thought it was funny when Rudy said that they didn't know if the lawyer chick was Russian or not, because all they had was her name. Yeah...........sure.............nobody knew she was Russian until the meeting was held.

Rudy Giuliani's Sunday show appearance was a total disaster - CNNPolitics

RUDY GIULIANI: That was the original intention of the meeting. It turned out to be a meeting about another subject and it was not pursued at all. And, of course, any meeting with regard to getting information on your opponent is something any candidate's staff would take. If someone said, I have information about your opponent, you would take that meeting. If it happens to be a person with a Russian --
CHUCK TODD: From the Russian government?
RUDY GIULIANI: She didn't represent the Russian government, she's a private citizen. I don't even know if they knew she was Russian at the time. All they had was her name.

How stupid is Trump and his top people that they don’t verify who they are taking a meeting with?

What if they turned out to be Russian spy’s?

Or lobbyist?

.

You are trying to become the POTUS and that is the best judgement you can show?

You take a meeting with someone with obvious Russian ties and you don’t know what those ties are?
You don’t record or take notes of the meeting to be sure?

A rookie mistake by Jr, yep. A crime, not so much.

.

Did Junior take a meeting that could bring down the Clinton campIgn with Russian agents and Crooked Donnie a few doors away in Trump Tower....and Crooked Donnie knew nothing about it?

How gullible are you?

 

[rightwinger]

I will be the first person to admit that people who refuse to confront & deal with reality baffle me. Trump and his people have thus far succeeded by crafting their own version of reality and I guess that works as long as you have enough money & power to isolate yourself and your facade from anything that threatens it. Trump is surrounded by individuals who apparently are paid to co-sign his lies.

I know attorneys are required to behave ethically but is it ethical to knowingly and willfully lie on behalf of your client - to investigators, to the court, etc?

Getting back to Gulliani's question if his client says he didn't do it and the investigator says he was there when he did, then it becomes a matter of who has more credibility and why, one would imagine, correct? You don't get "trapped" into committing perjury. Perjury requires knowingly making a false statement regarding a material issue.

A perjury trap definition is below. What Mueller is doing isn't a perjury trap. He will be asking trump questions that are directly involved with the investigation. Mueller already has enough proof of obstruction of justice and probable conspiracy with russia in the 2016 election. He doesn't need to use perjury to prosecute trump later. I will add, all trump has to do is not lie. If he tells the truth he has nothing to worry about.

I will point out that what is described below sounds a lot like what ken starr did in the Clinton investigation. Clinton fell into it by lying. He could have avoided the whole thing if he had just told the truth. Or if he had pointed out that what he did with lewinsky had nothing to do with the paula jones lawsuit. Clinton lied on a deposition for a civil lawsuit with paula jones.

Perjury-Trap Doctrine Law and Legal Definition | USLegal, Inc.

Perjury trap doctrine refers to a principle that a perjury indictment against a person must be dismissed if the prosecution secures it by calling that person as a grand-jury witness in an effort to obtain evidence for a perjury charge especially when the person’s testimony does not relate to issues material to the ongoing grand-jury investigation. The perjury trap is a form of entrapment defense, and so must be affirmatively proven by the defendant.

A perjury trap is created when the government calls a witness before the grand jury for the primary purpose of obtaining testimony from him in order to prosecute him later for perjury. When testimony is elicited before a grand jury that is attempting to obtain useful information in furtherance of its investigation, or conducting a legitimate investigation into crimes which had in fact taken place within its jurisdiction, the perjury trap doctrine is, by definition, inapplicable. [United States v. Chen, 933 F.2d 793 (9th Cir. Guam 1991)]

For Trump
When given the choice of telling the truth or covering with a lie
He will take the lie every time

 

[Wuwei]

You implied that I committed copyright infringement, I disagree because I simply forgot to include the link. Since I "usually" include a link when I post threads and this can be verified by a quick perusal of my posting history I would expect that to allow others to draw the "correct" conclusion that I "probably" just forgot to include it "this" time instead of willfully committing copyright infringement.

No, you moron. It's copyright infringement because you reproduced somebody's work without permission from the copyright owner. Whether you also include a link does not cure the fact that you violated federal law. I told you to post a link next time in lieu of reproducing protected works in the future.

It is not copyright infringement since you are allowed to use others writings in the case of "fair use".

More Information on Fair Use | U.S. Copyright Office

Fair use is a legal doctrine that promotes freedom of expression by permitting the unlicensed use of copyright-protected works in certain circumstances. Section 107 of the Copyright Act provides the statutory framework for determining whether something is a fair use and identifies certain types of uses—such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, and research—as examples of activities that may qualify as fair use.​

Furthermore the OP did give credit to the author:

By Melissa Gomez
Aug. 19, 2018​

 

[OKTexas]

I also thought it was funny when Rudy said that they didn't know if the lawyer chick was Russian or not, because all they had was her name. Yeah...........sure.............nobody knew she was Russian until the meeting was held.

Rudy Giuliani's Sunday show appearance was a total disaster - CNNPolitics

RUDY GIULIANI: That was the original intention of the meeting. It turned out to be a meeting about another subject and it was not pursued at all. And, of course, any meeting with regard to getting information on your opponent is something any candidate's staff would take. If someone said, I have information about your opponent, you would take that meeting. If it happens to be a person with a Russian --
CHUCK TODD: From the Russian government?
RUDY GIULIANI: She didn't represent the Russian government, she's a private citizen. I don't even know if they knew she was Russian at the time. All they had was her name.

How stupid is Trump and his top people that they don’t verify who they are taking a meeting with?

What if they turned out to be Russian spy’s?

Or lobbyist?

.

You are trying to become the POTUS and that is the best judgement you can show?

You take a meeting with someone with obvious Russian ties and you don’t know what those ties are?
You don’t record or take notes of the meeting to be sure?

A rookie mistake by Jr, yep. A crime, not so much.

.

Did Junior take a meeting that could bring down the Clinton campIgn with Russian agents and Crooked Donnie a few doors away in Trump Tower....and Crooked Donnie knew nothing about it?

How gullible are you?

How stupid will you appear if you're wrong? I'm just being prudent, waiting on facts.

.

 

[Dana7360]

The fact is the truth is objective.

That is a Trump fan talking. Now they are even questioning truth and reality.

They know their hero is going down. Mueller will probably be submitting his report within a few months.

Truth isn't subjective and the person you're replying to knows it.

Truth is backed up with facts. When there's official documents that's truth.

The post you replied to is nothing but a lie. There's nothing factual about that post.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

How stupid is Trump and his top people that they don’t verify who they are taking a meeting with?

What if they turned out to be Russian spy’s?

Or lobbyist?

.

You are trying to become the POTUS and that is the best judgement you can show?

You take a meeting with someone with obvious Russian ties and you don’t know what those ties are?
You don’t record or take notes of the meeting to be sure?

A rookie mistake by Jr, yep. A crime, not so much.

.

Did Junior take a meeting that could bring down the Clinton campIgn with Russian agents and Crooked Donnie a few doors away in Trump Tower....and Crooked Donnie knew nothing about it?

How gullible are you?

How stupid will you appear if you're wrong? I'm just being prudent, waiting on facts.

.

No collusion! No collusion!

 

[Dana7360]

By Melissa Gomez
Aug. 19, 2018

First, the facts were alternative, Kellyanne Conway, a counselor to President Trump, suggested last year.

And now, Rudolph W. Giuliani, the president’s personal lawyer, said “Truth isn’t truth,” adding his own phrase to memorable — and sometimes head-scratching — comments made by those close to the president.

During an interview on Sunday on NBC’s “Meet the Press,” the show’s host, Chuck Todd, asked Mr. Giuliani about Donald F. McGahn II, the White House counsel, who The New York Times reported was cooperating extensively in the special counsel investigation.

Mr. Todd asked how Mr. Giuliani had responded to requests by the special counsel, Robert S. Mueller III, to interview Mr. Trump and whether Mr. Giuliani had delayed the investigation.

Mr. Giuliani replied he would not be rushed into having Mr. Trump testify “so that he gets trapped into perjury.”

“And when you tell me that, ‘You know, he should testify because he’s going to tell the truth and he shouldn’t worry,’ well, that’s so silly because it’s somebody’s version of the truth. Not the truth,” Mr. Giuliani said.

“Truth is truth,” Mr. Todd insisted.

“No, it isn’t truth. Truth isn’t truth,” Mr. Giuliani said as Mr. Todd leaned his head onto his hand.

“Truth isn’t truth?” Mr. Todd asked, appearing stunned and at one point looking up. “This is going to become a bad meme.”

“Don’t do this to me,” Mr. Giuliani replied, his hand to his head, mimicking Mr. Todd. “Donald Trump says, ‘I didn’t talk about Flynn with Comey.’ Comey says, ‘You did talk about it.’ So tell me what the truth is.”
​

Translation: Liars gonna lie

The fact is the truth is objective. Go to court and tell your truth! It is amazing how fking ignorant the genius left truly are!. Hey stupid

Trump gave you absolution. Nothing is your fault. All your problems can be blamed on the 'other'. The media, the corrupt Deep State, Muslims, Blacks, immigrants, China.

All you had to do in return is sell out every bit of ethical comportment you had. Alternative facts, truth isn't truth and hey presto! An Orange colored savior is calling the shots.

Now that you've laid aside what you know is right and wrong, after Trump, can you remember where you put it?

That person already did that in the bush boy years.

The only difference now is it's all on steroids.

 

[OKTexas]

Or lobbyist?

.

You are trying to become the POTUS and that is the best judgement you can show?

You take a meeting with someone with obvious Russian ties and you don’t know what those ties are?
You don’t record or take notes of the meeting to be sure?

A rookie mistake by Jr, yep. A crime, not so much.

.

Did Junior take a meeting that could bring down the Clinton campIgn with Russian agents and Crooked Donnie a few doors away in Trump Tower....and Crooked Donnie knew nothing about it?

How gullible are you?

How stupid will you appear if you're wrong? I'm just being prudent, waiting on facts.

.

No collusion! No collusion!

View attachment 211698

Cute meme. Irrelevant, but cute.

.