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That is incorrect, as usual. What secures them, do they own a tiny piece of the factory? No, they own a piece of paper, not much better than owning a stock certificate, another piece of paper. Bonds become worthless at times, just like the stocks. Look it up.I would tend to agree however it appears they were creditors, and creditors are before bondholders who are before stockholders.Unions are not "secured" creditors.Yep, as they were being treated like a creditor I suspect but I haven't looked into that closely. Your turn...They were higher up the chain. Look it up.
So the union was a secured creditor? Really? That's the only way they could be higher according to your links.
Wrong. Bondholders are secured creditors. Union thugs aren't secured creditors.
While as making as much money as possible off of the backs of the poor sucker.
No, we don't need this shit near power! Bernie sanders is what we need.
Maybe the dimbulbs actually think rich liberals DON'T pay as little as they can get away with. Maybe they actually think rich libs overpay taxes out of the goodness of their hearts. They must, since they only get mad when non-hypocrites fight to keep what they earn. Hypocrites get a pass as long as they put on really stern faces and bloviate that they, and other rich people, need to pay more in taxes.While as making as much money as possible off of the backs of the poor sucker.
No, we don't need this shit near power! Bernie sanders is what we need.
are you that fricken stupid? Don't you realize that the Clintons do exactly what Trump said he does? Does your hero Sanders pay more than he absolutely has to pay?
You really are a dim bulb, matt.
I would tend to agree however it appears they were creditors, and creditors are before bondholders who are before stockholders.Unions are not "secured" creditors.Yep, as they were being treated like a creditor I suspect but I haven't looked into that closely. Your turn...They were higher up the chain. Look it up.So how does that square with the dear leader giving 40% of the new company to the union and not the bond holders?
So the union was a secured creditor? Really? That's the only way they could be higher according to your links.
We look forward to Trump making his tax returns public.
Why?
Why? Don't you follow politics? Among other things, it would show that he has nothing to be ashamed of.
Don't you following the US Constitution, there is a presumption of innocence. There's no reason for him to make his tax returns public to prove he's innocent. Being rich is not a crime and Trump has his taxes prepared by an army of CPA's.
I would tend to agree however it appears they were creditors, and creditors are before bondholders who are before stockholders.Unions are not "secured" creditors.Yep, as they were being treated like a creditor I suspect but I haven't looked into that closely. Your turn...They were higher up the chain. Look it up.
So the union was a secured creditor? Really? That's the only way they could be higher according to your links.
Now I know you don't know jack. A bondholder *IS* a creditor.
Who Gets Paid First When a Company Goes Bankrupt Chron.com
If the bankrupt company still has money left over, it starts paying its unsecured creditors. These debts not based on a physical piece of property. Unsecured debts could be credit card bills, unpaid insurance premiums and bank loans that weren't backed up by property. It also includes payments to bondholders.
I knew as soon as I read that, that you were farting on the forum.... again...
I don't get why you people make up crap, and think we won't find out.
Bottom line is this...
The Unions can only apply to be on the bankruptcy, if they can make a claim that they were owed unpaid union dues, or related contractual payments.
So clearly they had a case to be made against GM.
However, they would have been listed as unsecured creditor, just like all bondholders. They were not a superior position according to bankruptcy law.
That is exactly why Obama intervened illegal, oh behalf of the Unions.
While the Unions had some about of money to submit a claim on, the bond holders had far more.
GM filed a total debt of $172 Billion dollars. The unions had an unsecured creditor claim of $20 Billion.
The total remaining unsecured creditor claims, was $30 Billion.
Point being, no matter how you cut it, or check it, or what perspective you take on it.... by law, the Unions should have received the smallest portion out of the bankruptcy, just above the stock holders, which got zero.
Unfortunately, the Unions which caused the bankruptcy to begin with, were rewarded for destroying the company, and wiping out tens of billions of tax payer money..... by getting the second largest stake in the company. The exact opposite message we want to send.
More so, you people on the left, are the most irrational people on the planet... you actually support something that harmed jobs, harmed the economy, and drove up taxes on yourself. How dumb can you be.
We look forward to Trump making his tax returns public.
Why?
Why? Don't you follow politics? Among other things, it would show that he has nothing to be ashamed of.
Don't you following the US Constitution, there is a presumption of innocence. There's no reason for him to make his tax returns public to prove he's innocent. Being rich is not a crime and Trump has his taxes prepared by an army of CPA's.
Romney also had his taxes prepared by an army of CPA's.
We look forward to Trump making his tax returns public.
Why?
Why? Don't you follow politics? Among other things, it would show that he has nothing to be ashamed of.
Don't you following the US Constitution, there is a presumption of innocence. There's no reason for him to make his tax returns public to prove he's innocent. Being rich is not a crime and Trump has his taxes prepared by an army of CPA's.
Romney also had his taxes prepared by an army of CPA's.
And Obama was still born in Kenya
Bondholders are unsecured creditors, you are correct. The question was why was the union ahead of the bondholders?I would tend to agree however it appears they were creditors, and creditors are before bondholders who are before stockholders.Unions are not "secured" creditors.Yep, as they were being treated like a creditor I suspect but I haven't looked into that closely. Your turn...They were higher up the chain. Look it up.
So the union was a secured creditor? Really? That's the only way they could be higher according to your links.
Now I know you don't know jack. A bondholder *IS* a creditor.
Who Gets Paid First When a Company Goes Bankrupt Chron.com
If the bankrupt company still has money left over, it starts paying its unsecured creditors. These debts not based on a physical piece of property. Unsecured debts could be credit card bills, unpaid insurance premiums and bank loans that weren't backed up by property. It also includes payments to bondholders.
I knew as soon as I read that, that you were farting on the forum.... again...
I don't get why you people make up crap, and think we won't find out.
Bottom line is this...
The Unions can only apply to be on the bankruptcy, if they can make a claim that they were owed unpaid union dues, or related contractual payments.
So clearly they had a case to be made against GM.
However, they would have been listed as unsecured creditor, just like all bondholders. They were not a superior position according to bankruptcy law.
That is exactly why Obama intervened illegal, oh behalf of the Unions.
While the Unions had some about of money to submit a claim on, the bond holders had far more.
GM filed a total debt of $172 Billion dollars. The unions had an unsecured creditor claim of $20 Billion.
The total remaining unsecured creditor claims, was $30 Billion.
Point being, no matter how you cut it, or check it, or what perspective you take on it.... by law, the Unions should have received the smallest portion out of the bankruptcy, just above the stock holders, which got zero.
Unfortunately, the Unions which caused the bankruptcy to begin with, were rewarded for destroying the company, and wiping out tens of billions of tax payer money..... by getting the second largest stake in the company. The exact opposite message we want to send.
More so, you people on the left, are the most irrational people on the planet... you actually support something that harmed jobs, harmed the economy, and drove up taxes on yourself. How dumb can you be.
Bondholders are unsecured creditors, you are correct. The question was why was the union ahead of the bondholders?I would tend to agree however it appears they were creditors, and creditors are before bondholders who are before stockholders.Unions are not "secured" creditors.Yep, as they were being treated like a creditor I suspect but I haven't looked into that closely. Your turn...So the union was a secured creditor? Really? That's the only way they could be higher according to your links.
Now I know you don't know jack. A bondholder *IS* a creditor.
Who Gets Paid First When a Company Goes Bankrupt Chron.com
If the bankrupt company still has money left over, it starts paying its unsecured creditors. These debts not based on a physical piece of property. Unsecured debts could be credit card bills, unpaid insurance premiums and bank loans that weren't backed up by property. It also includes payments to bondholders.
I knew as soon as I read that, that you were farting on the forum.... again...
I don't get why you people make up crap, and think we won't find out.
Bottom line is this...
The Unions can only apply to be on the bankruptcy, if they can make a claim that they were owed unpaid union dues, or related contractual payments.
So clearly they had a case to be made against GM.
However, they would have been listed as unsecured creditor, just like all bondholders. They were not a superior position according to bankruptcy law.
That is exactly why Obama intervened illegal, oh behalf of the Unions.
While the Unions had some about of money to submit a claim on, the bond holders had far more.
GM filed a total debt of $172 Billion dollars. The unions had an unsecured creditor claim of $20 Billion.
The total remaining unsecured creditor claims, was $30 Billion.
Point being, no matter how you cut it, or check it, or what perspective you take on it.... by law, the Unions should have received the smallest portion out of the bankruptcy, just above the stock holders, which got zero.
Unfortunately, the Unions which caused the bankruptcy to begin with, were rewarded for destroying the company, and wiping out tens of billions of tax payer money..... by getting the second largest stake in the company. The exact opposite message we want to send.
More so, you people on the left, are the most irrational people on the planet... you actually support something that harmed jobs, harmed the economy, and drove up taxes on yourself. How dumb can you be.
"The plan for General Motors' bankruptcy is to auction off the company's assets in a section 363 sale.[2][3][4][45][47] Because the price that these assets are expected to sell for is very high, there is expected to be only one bidder in the auction, a new company NGMCO Inc.[1] This company is formed by the United States government with a 60.8% stake, the federal government of Canada and provincial government of Ontario with an 11.7% stake, the United and Canadian Auto Workers unions VEBA fund[2] with a 17.5% stake, and the unsecured bondholders of General Motors with a 10% stake.[45] The selling company is called Motors Liquidation Company (see below).[48]"
General Motors Chapter 11 reorganization - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia
So, what is VEBA?
In general, yes, in this case, no, it would seem. Bonds, like stocks, are risky, You can only lose your investment, not your house, but that's the price of entering the game.Bondholders are unsecured creditors, you are correct. The question was why was the union ahead of the bondholders?I would tend to agree however it appears they were creditors, and creditors are before bondholders who are before stockholders.Unions are not "secured" creditors.Yep, as they were being treated like a creditor I suspect but I haven't looked into that closely. Your turn...
Now I know you don't know jack. A bondholder *IS* a creditor.
Who Gets Paid First When a Company Goes Bankrupt Chron.com
If the bankrupt company still has money left over, it starts paying its unsecured creditors. These debts not based on a physical piece of property. Unsecured debts could be credit card bills, unpaid insurance premiums and bank loans that weren't backed up by property. It also includes payments to bondholders.
I knew as soon as I read that, that you were farting on the forum.... again...
I don't get why you people make up crap, and think we won't find out.
Bottom line is this...
The Unions can only apply to be on the bankruptcy, if they can make a claim that they were owed unpaid union dues, or related contractual payments.
So clearly they had a case to be made against GM.
However, they would have been listed as unsecured creditor, just like all bondholders. They were not a superior position according to bankruptcy law.
That is exactly why Obama intervened illegal, oh behalf of the Unions.
While the Unions had some about of money to submit a claim on, the bond holders had far more.
GM filed a total debt of $172 Billion dollars. The unions had an unsecured creditor claim of $20 Billion.
The total remaining unsecured creditor claims, was $30 Billion.
Point being, no matter how you cut it, or check it, or what perspective you take on it.... by law, the Unions should have received the smallest portion out of the bankruptcy, just above the stock holders, which got zero.
Unfortunately, the Unions which caused the bankruptcy to begin with, were rewarded for destroying the company, and wiping out tens of billions of tax payer money..... by getting the second largest stake in the company. The exact opposite message we want to send.
More so, you people on the left, are the most irrational people on the planet... you actually support something that harmed jobs, harmed the economy, and drove up taxes on yourself. How dumb can you be.
"The plan for General Motors' bankruptcy is to auction off the company's assets in a section 363 sale.[2][3][4][45][47] Because the price that these assets are expected to sell for is very high, there is expected to be only one bidder in the auction, a new company NGMCO Inc.[1] This company is formed by the United States government with a 60.8% stake, the federal government of Canada and provincial government of Ontario with an 11.7% stake, the United and Canadian Auto Workers unions VEBA fund[2] with a 17.5% stake, and the unsecured bondholders of General Motors with a 10% stake.[45] The selling company is called Motors Liquidation Company (see below).[48]"
General Motors Chapter 11 reorganization - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia
So, what is VEBA?
In other words, a rigged game.
In general, yes, in this case, no, it would seem. Bonds, like stocks, are risky, You can only lose your investment, not your house, but that's the price of entering the game.Bondholders are unsecured creditors, you are correct. The question was why was the union ahead of the bondholders?I would tend to agree however it appears they were creditors, and creditors are before bondholders who are before stockholders.Unions are not "secured" creditors.
Now I know you don't know jack. A bondholder *IS* a creditor.
Who Gets Paid First When a Company Goes Bankrupt Chron.com
If the bankrupt company still has money left over, it starts paying its unsecured creditors. These debts not based on a physical piece of property. Unsecured debts could be credit card bills, unpaid insurance premiums and bank loans that weren't backed up by property. It also includes payments to bondholders.
I knew as soon as I read that, that you were farting on the forum.... again...
I don't get why you people make up crap, and think we won't find out.
Bottom line is this...
The Unions can only apply to be on the bankruptcy, if they can make a claim that they were owed unpaid union dues, or related contractual payments.
So clearly they had a case to be made against GM.
However, they would have been listed as unsecured creditor, just like all bondholders. They were not a superior position according to bankruptcy law.
That is exactly why Obama intervened illegal, oh behalf of the Unions.
While the Unions had some about of money to submit a claim on, the bond holders had far more.
GM filed a total debt of $172 Billion dollars. The unions had an unsecured creditor claim of $20 Billion.
The total remaining unsecured creditor claims, was $30 Billion.
Point being, no matter how you cut it, or check it, or what perspective you take on it.... by law, the Unions should have received the smallest portion out of the bankruptcy, just above the stock holders, which got zero.
Unfortunately, the Unions which caused the bankruptcy to begin with, were rewarded for destroying the company, and wiping out tens of billions of tax payer money..... by getting the second largest stake in the company. The exact opposite message we want to send.
More so, you people on the left, are the most irrational people on the planet... you actually support something that harmed jobs, harmed the economy, and drove up taxes on yourself. How dumb can you be.
"The plan for General Motors' bankruptcy is to auction off the company's assets in a section 363 sale.[2][3][4][45][47] Because the price that these assets are expected to sell for is very high, there is expected to be only one bidder in the auction, a new company NGMCO Inc.[1] This company is formed by the United States government with a 60.8% stake, the federal government of Canada and provincial government of Ontario with an 11.7% stake, the United and Canadian Auto Workers unions VEBA fund[2] with a 17.5% stake, and the unsecured bondholders of General Motors with a 10% stake.[45] The selling company is called Motors Liquidation Company (see below).[48]"
General Motors Chapter 11 reorganization - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia
So, what is VEBA?
In other words, a rigged game.
We look forward to Trump making his tax returns public.
Why?
Why? Don't you follow politics? Among other things, it would show that he has nothing to be ashamed of.
I dare Trump NOT to release his tax returns.
Presidential candidates have long history of releasing tax returns - CNN Political Ticker
I dare Trump NOT to release his tax returns.
Presidential candidates have long history of releasing tax returns - CNN Political Ticker
We look forward to Trump making his tax returns public.
Why?
Why? Don't you follow politics? Among other things, it would show that he has nothing to be ashamed of.
The real reason is so turds like you can go over it with a fine-toothed comb looking for anything you can excoriate him for even though it might be perfectly innocent, like Romney's overseas bank accounts.
Liberals know there's a vast mass of numskulls out there who will swallow this kind of bullshit.
