Banned for Reading Bible BEFORE Class

[irosie91]

This story has dropped off the charts....Nothing in the last week
You would think with all the bad press, the University would say something
Normally, students would be posting their accounts of the incident on facebook or twitter

The University can claim the incident is still under investigation even if it isn't. Agreed it's odd the other students haven't come out to affirm or deny what happened.

Off hand, I'd say it happened as reported, but there's more to the story. Sure, Broom Hilda may be a biased, tyrannical queen bitch in her classroom, but Duddly Fuddpucker may be a king-sized asshole doing his best to start trouble. In that case, it's a lose-lose for a 9th out of 10 rated University since it reflects poorly on both it's teaching staff and it's student body.

Typically, in these situations - the school is not allowed to say much about it or in their defense until it's resolved. There is no such inhibition on the student so we likely are hearing very much one side of the story.

Agreed, but why haven't the other students spoken up? Nothing on Martel as a teacher, good or bad, nor about Holden as a student, good or bad. It's as if a bunch of fucking lawyers are involved and all were slapped with a gag order by a judge.

Maybe because it happened BEFORE class, and there were few, to none, other students around to witness it?

Possible, but since it happened a few minutes before class, I'm certain there were other students around to witness it.

If Holden is as smart as he thinks he is, he'd have made sure a friend or two in class was there to both witness and video the incident.

he was supposed to PREDICT?

 

[Divine Wind]

The University can claim the incident is still under investigation even if it isn't. Agreed it's odd the other students haven't come out to affirm or deny what happened.

Off hand, I'd say it happened as reported, but there's more to the story. Sure, Broom Hilda may be a biased, tyrannical queen bitch in her classroom, but Duddly Fuddpucker may be a king-sized asshole doing his best to start trouble. In that case, it's a lose-lose for a 9th out of 10 rated University since it reflects poorly on both it's teaching staff and it's student body.

Typically, in these situations - the school is not allowed to say much about it or in their defense until it's resolved. There is no such inhibition on the student so we likely are hearing very much one side of the story.

Agreed, but why haven't the other students spoken up? Nothing on Martel as a teacher, good or bad, nor about Holden as a student, good or bad. It's as if a bunch of fucking lawyers are involved and all were slapped with a gag order by a judge.

Maybe because it happened BEFORE class, and there were few, to none, other students around to witness it?

Possible, but since it happened a few minutes before class, I'm certain there were other students around to witness it.

If Holden is as smart as he thinks he is, he'd have made sure a friend or two in class was there to both witness and video the incident.

he was supposed to PREDICT?

Yes. In my business it's called operational planning or "The 6 Ps"; Prior Planning Prevents Piss Poor Performance.

Assholes, be they professors or students, are fairly predictable. Once you know which buttons aggravate them, then it's a simply matter to arrange to push those buttons at a certain time in order to "predict" the results. It's important that the "buttons" be legal and justifiable in order to achieve optimal results.

In this case, I'm guessing Holden knew Martel was a straight-white-male-and-religion hating bitch. All he had to do was quietly read his Bible before class for her to become a raging **** to him. Predictable.

 

[irosie91]

Typically, in these situations - the school is not allowed to say much about it or in their defense until it's resolved. There is no such inhibition on the student so we likely are hearing very much one side of the story.

Agreed, but why haven't the other students spoken up? Nothing on Martel as a teacher, good or bad, nor about Holden as a student, good or bad. It's as if a bunch of fucking lawyers are involved and all were slapped with a gag order by a judge.

Maybe because it happened BEFORE class, and there were few, to none, other students around to witness it?

Possible, but since it happened a few minutes before class, I'm certain there were other students around to witness it.

If Holden is as smart as he thinks he is, he'd have made sure a friend or two in class was there to both witness and video the incident.

he was supposed to PREDICT?

Yes. In my business it's called operational planning or "The 6 Ps"; Prior Planning Prevents Piss Poor Performance.

Assholes, be they professors or students, are fairly predictable. Once you know which buttons aggravate them, then it's a simply matter to arrange to push those buttons at a certain time in order to "predict" the results. It's important that the "buttons" be legal and justifiable in order to achieve optimal results.

In this case, I'm guessing Holden knew Martel was a straight-white-male-and-religion hating bitch. All he had to do was quietly read his Bible before class for her to become a raging **** to him. Predictable.

Maybe he knew something. MAYBE HE had been harassing her with the bible.
Maybe he had been PROVING points by quotations from the bible----presenting
the bible as DIVINE KNOWLEGE. I do not doubt that buttons were being
pushed, but I do not claim to know who was doing the pushing. From the available information----neither do you.

 

[Divine Wind]

Agreed, but why haven't the other students spoken up? Nothing on Martel as a teacher, good or bad, nor about Holden as a student, good or bad. It's as if a bunch of fucking lawyers are involved and all were slapped with a gag order by a judge.

Maybe because it happened BEFORE class, and there were few, to none, other students around to witness it?

Possible, but since it happened a few minutes before class, I'm certain there were other students around to witness it.

If Holden is as smart as he thinks he is, he'd have made sure a friend or two in class was there to both witness and video the incident.

he was supposed to PREDICT?

Yes. In my business it's called operational planning or "The 6 Ps"; Prior Planning Prevents Piss Poor Performance.

Assholes, be they professors or students, are fairly predictable. Once you know which buttons aggravate them, then it's a simply matter to arrange to push those buttons at a certain time in order to "predict" the results. It's important that the "buttons" be legal and justifiable in order to achieve optimal results.

In this case, I'm guessing Holden knew Martel was a straight-white-male-and-religion hating bitch. All he had to do was quietly read his Bible before class for her to become a raging **** to him. Predictable.

Maybe he knew something. MAYBE HE had been harassing her with the bible.
Maybe he had been PROVING points by quotations from the bible----presenting
the bible as DIVINE KNOWLEGE. I do not doubt that buttons were being
pushed, but I do not claim to know who was doing the pushing. From the available information----neither do you.

Maybe he's a MARTIAN and she's a VENUSIAN. You KNOW those fucking assholes have hated each other for 10,000 years!

Yes, we only know what we know; she got pissed at him for reading his Bible in class and now she's whining about how she's being attacked. Awesome. I'm happy to await more evidence.

 

[Coyote]

This article has an interesting take on it: NAU President denounces harassment, but is it enough?

It also notes:

In an email to Holden, included in the April 27 Campus Reform article, Martel provided another reason for the student’s removal.


According to the article, Martel said the student was being disruptive in class and using hate speech prior to the incident. Martel, however, declined to comment when The Lumberjack asked about the incident.​

So, if they were harassed, their reaction is to harass students???

If that was what was happening and that is by no means clear...

 

[Divine Wind]

This article has an interesting take on it: NAU President denounces harassment, but is it enough?

It also notes:

In an email to Holden, included in the April 27 Campus Reform article, Martel provided another reason for the student’s removal.


According to the article, Martel said the student was being disruptive in class and using hate speech prior to the incident. Martel, however, declined to comment when The Lumberjack asked about the incident.​

So, if they were harassed, their reaction is to harass students???

If that was what was happening and that is by no means clear...

Agreed. While the University may be still investigating, the complete silence on this tempest-in-a-teapot is interesting and causes me to suspect a clampdown. Where are the other students? Why has Martel gone into seclusion? Where are her defenders?

 

[irosie91]

Maybe because it happened BEFORE class, and there were few, to none, other students around to witness it?

Possible, but since it happened a few minutes before class, I'm certain there were other students around to witness it.

If Holden is as smart as he thinks he is, he'd have made sure a friend or two in class was there to both witness and video the incident.

he was supposed to PREDICT?

Yes. In my business it's called operational planning or "The 6 Ps"; Prior Planning Prevents Piss Poor Performance.

Assholes, be they professors or students, are fairly predictable. Once you know which buttons aggravate them, then it's a simply matter to arrange to push those buttons at a certain time in order to "predict" the results. It's important that the "buttons" be legal and justifiable in order to achieve optimal results.

In this case, I'm guessing Holden knew Martel was a straight-white-male-and-religion hating bitch. All he had to do was quietly read his Bible before class for her to become a raging **** to him. Predictable.

Maybe he knew something. MAYBE HE had been harassing her with the bible.
Maybe he had been PROVING points by quotations from the bible----presenting
the bible as DIVINE KNOWLEGE. I do not doubt that buttons were being
pushed, but I do not claim to know who was doing the pushing. From the available information----neither do you.

Maybe he's a MARTIAN and she's a VENUSIAN. You KNOW those fucking assholes have hated each other for 10,000 years!

Yes, we only know what we know; she got pissed at him for reading his Bible in class and now she's whining about how she's being attacked. Awesome. I'm happy to await more evidence.

not quite-----we only know that HE SAID she got pissed at him for reading
the bible before class ------he said it but did not say WHY. You decided ---
she HATES CHRISTIANITY

 

[mgh80]

Is this a private university (I really have no clue)?

 

[irosie91]

Is this a private university (I really have no clue)?

University of Arizona seems like a state U. to me------why? What difference does
it make?

 

[mgh80]

Is this a private university (I really have no clue)?

University of Arizona seems like a state U. to me------why? What difference does
it make?

Private schools can do whatever they like with "banning" the bible.

 

[irosie91]

Is this a private university (I really have no clue)?

University of Arizona seems like a state U. to me------why? What difference does
it make?

Private schools can do whatever they like with "banning" the bible.

really? It was not THE SCHOOL-----it was a specific teacher who----according
to the complaining student DID NOT WANT HER STUDENT TO BE IN
POSSESSION OF A BIBLE. As to policy----I have no idea if a requirement of
the course was "NO BIBLE IN CLASS"

 

[mgh80]

Is this a private university (I really have no clue)?

University of Arizona seems like a state U. to me------why? What difference does
it make?

Private schools can do whatever they like with "banning" the bible.

really? It was not THE SCHOOL-----it was a specific teacher who----according
to the complaining student DID NOT WANT HER STUDENT TO BE IN
POSSESSION OF A BIBLE. As to policy----I have no idea if a requirement of
the course was "NO BIBLE IN CLASS"

If it's a private school the students don't have the right to have whatever books they wish and a professor can absolutely tell them to put it away. I think it's dumb and probably a power trip for the professor to do, but it's still allowed.

 

[irosie91]

Is this a private university (I really have no clue)?

University of Arizona seems like a state U. to me------why? What difference does
it make?

Private schools can do whatever they like with "banning" the bible.

really? It was not THE SCHOOL-----it was a specific teacher who----according
to the complaining student DID NOT WANT HER STUDENT TO BE IN
POSSESSION OF A BIBLE. As to policy----I have no idea if a requirement of
the course was "NO BIBLE IN CLASS"

If it's a private school the students don't have the right to have whatever books they wish and a professor can absolutely tell them to put it away. I think it's dumb and probably a power trip for the professor to do, but it's still allowed.

even in a Public school (I attended state schools my WHOLE education)
a teacher can tell a student to "get that book outta here" Teachers
often do complain about stuff in the room-----like "GET THAT CIGGY outta
here" (even before the general ban on cigs) I doubt the story as told by
the student-----there was something not stated going on

 

[rightwinger]

Is this a private university (I really have no clue)?

University of Arizona seems like a state U. to me------why? What difference does
it make?

Private schools can do whatever they like with "banning" the bible.

really? It was not THE SCHOOL-----it was a specific teacher who----according
to the complaining student DID NOT WANT HER STUDENT TO BE IN
POSSESSION OF A BIBLE. As to policy----I have no idea if a requirement of
the course was "NO BIBLE IN CLASS"

The teacher says he is lying

The student went to rightwing media with his complaint. There is no evidence

 

[irosie91]

Is this a private university (I really have no clue)?

University of Arizona seems like a state U. to me------why? What difference does
it make?

Private schools can do whatever they like with "banning" the bible.

really? It was not THE SCHOOL-----it was a specific teacher who----according
to the complaining student DID NOT WANT HER STUDENT TO BE IN
POSSESSION OF A BIBLE. As to policy----I have no idea if a requirement of
the course was "NO BIBLE IN CLASS"

The teacher says he is lying

The student went to rightwing media with his complaint. There is no evidence

oh---goody----you got a link?

 

[rightwinger]

Is this a private university (I really have no clue)?

University of Arizona seems like a state U. to me------why? What difference does
it make?

Private schools can do whatever they like with "banning" the bible.

really? It was not THE SCHOOL-----it was a specific teacher who----according
to the complaining student DID NOT WANT HER STUDENT TO BE IN
POSSESSION OF A BIBLE. As to policy----I have no idea if a requirement of
the course was "NO BIBLE IN CLASS"

The teacher says he is lying

The student went to rightwing media with his complaint. There is no evidence

oh---goody----you got a link?

Post 260

 

[irosie91]

University of Arizona seems like a state U. to me------why? What difference does
it make?

Private schools can do whatever they like with "banning" the bible.

really? It was not THE SCHOOL-----it was a specific teacher who----according
to the complaining student DID NOT WANT HER STUDENT TO BE IN
POSSESSION OF A BIBLE. As to policy----I have no idea if a requirement of
the course was "NO BIBLE IN CLASS"

The teacher says he is lying

The student went to rightwing media with his complaint. There is no evidence

oh---goody----you got a link?

Post 260

thanks. those kids at U. Arizona must be DAMNED BORED

 

[rightwinger]

If the professor prohibited a student from reading the bible before class.......she should be fired
If the student made it up....he should be expelled from school

 

[irosie91]

If the professor prohibited a student from reading the bible before class.......she should be fired
If the student made it up....he should be expelled from school

I, very strongly, believe that ---it ain't so simple. I believe that something
had been going on between this student and this teacher before she spied
<gasp> a copy of the bible on his desk. I am intrigued that the incident has
EXCITED so much interest------and very ANNOYED that they do not release
the juicy tidbits

 

[rightwinger]

If the professor prohibited a student from reading the bible before class.......she should be fired
If the student made it up....he should be expelled from school

I, very strongly, believe that ---it ain't so simple. I believe that something
had been going on between this student and this teacher before she spied
<gasp> a copy of the bible on his desk. I am intrigued that the incident has
EXCITED so much interest------and very ANNOYED that they do not release
the juicy tidbits

The student had been reprimanded in the past for disruptive and disrespectful classroom behavior. As a result, he had been told where to sit. So he shows up at class early and takes a seat front and center and pulls out his bible
When the Professor confronts him about sitting in the wrong place, he makes a scene and claims it is about his bible reading