A revolt is growing as more people refuse to pay back student loans

[thereisnospoon]

Whatever... you're not listening. Like I said, I had to forgo the "college experience" and be a commuter, part-time student in order to get my education. I couldn't afford to go off to college, live in a dorm, etc.

But, I got my education... which was the goal.

It can, and is being done all over this country. You're being childish and close-minded.

wow. I really though he may have been an adult.

However, I can not recall an adult EVER using the term "good grades" while discussing requirements for college. GPA and community involvement....never "good grades"...unless they are telling a child "get good grades and you can become anything you want".

Wow.

He must be one of the "participation trophy" kids Adam Carolla warned about...

That's "SHE." Obviously you could use a better education and a class in reading comprehension. Unless of course, you are calling me a "he" to try to insult me because you have no argument and no statistics or links to back up any of your assertions . . . Typical of the loons around here.

Unless a poster informs the board members of details on their identity, each of us anonymous.
So spare us your faux outrage.

Since 1978, college tuition on average has increased 1120%.

Back to the infusion of federal money....That alone is the main driver of the cost of higher education.

 

[Ame®icano]

There should be no student loans at all. Maybe if enough people refuse to pay the whole program will be scrapped.

Then the idiots can demand new car loan forgiveness.

Didn't you hear? Obama gunna gib evey won a free ejukashun. 4 year community college that extends childhood to 30, and makes a bachelors as worthless as a high school diploma is now.

 

[Ame®icano]

A revolt is growing as more people refuse to pay back student loans - The Washington Post

Awesome!

First, the government has no obligation to protect people from bad decisions.

Second, the IRS will collect outstanding federally insured loans, count on it.

IRS seems very good at confiscating people's bank accounts. Not so good at answering calls.

IRS ignoring 60% of calls

 

[Ame®icano]

A revolt is growing as more people refuse to pay back student loans - The Washington Post

Awesome!

First, the government has no obligation to protect people from bad decisions.

But it does have an obligation to protect people from crooks. And it failed.

Forgetting that most of crooks are in government.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Whatever... you're not listening. Like I said, I had to forgo the "college experience" and be a commuter, part-time student in order to get my education. I couldn't afford to go off to college, live in a dorm, etc.

But, I got my education... which was the goal.

It can, and is being done all over this country. You're being childish and close-minded.

wow. I really though he may have been an adult.

However, I can not recall an adult EVER using the term "good grades" while discussing requirements for college. GPA and community involvement....never "good grades"...unless they are telling a child "get good grades and you can become anything you want".

Wow.

He must be one of the "participation trophy" kids Adam Carolla warned about...

That's "SHE." Obviously you could use a better education and a class in reading comprehension. Unless of course, you are calling me a "he" to try to insult me because you have no argument and no statistics or links to back up any of your assertions . . . Typical of the loons around here.

Unless a poster informs the board members of details on their identity, each of us anonymous.
So spare us your faux outrage.

So tell me . . . since you people want to use "how it was when you went to college," what decade were you attending college? I notice you are ALL hesitant to provide that data.

80's...When most people could afford higher education with far less in the way of accumulating debt.
I do not have a degree. I attended college but work got in the way.
What difference does it make?
No matter how much you whine scream howl or carry on like an idiot, college will never be free of charge.

 

[bendog]

Bullshit... it can be done... you just want the easy way out.

Good luck with that you childish brat.

The average minimum-wage paying job only pays around $15,000 a year, fool.

And? Most min wage earners are teens and retirees working for small business and working part time. And they make up less than 1% of all wage earners.
Non factor.
Your inability to stay on point indicates your argument has run out of gas....Stand down

That is wrong.



The overwhelming majority of low-wage earners who would receive a raise by restoring the minimum wage to its historic value are adults who spend their careers in frontline low-wage industries that make our economy run. Fast-growing low-wage jobs like home care are disproportionately held by female and older workers.

Contrary to stereotypes and the repeated claims of minimum wage opponents, the overwhelming majority of low-wage workers are adults, not teens, and they contribute a substantial portion of their households’ incomes. According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, three quarters of minimum wage earners are 20 or older.

According to the Economic Policy Institute’s State of Working America, a stunning 35 million Americans – 26 percent of our workforce – earn less than $10.55 an hour.

That means 75% of workers earn above $10.55 per hour.
Once again, you people think money grows on trees. The fact is of the min wage earners are kids and seniors.
And make up less than 1% of the workforce.
Your injection of min wage into this is a merely thread derailment.....Shut it.
None of it is untrue....
BTW, you were referring to min wage. You conveniently injected those making up to over $10 per hour.
What does any of this have to do with college tuition?

That is just not true. Many people are suffering, and you cannot get a good paying job without a college education nowadays. A kid who is trying to go to college and takes a job to pay for it is not going to make much more than minimum wage, and more than likely will ONLY make minimum wage.

In fact, a lot of jobs out there are only offering part time work and many are only temporary jobs. You see, poor people do not have a lot of options to better themselves.

I don't have a link, but there's no doubt that my summer jobs back in the mid 70s involved construction labor and working as furniture mover. I could take home $600 a month after taxes with overtime. Living at home, that covered a good part of my housing and food during the school year, and I could work a part-time min wage service job at $2 an hour. Tuition was around $500 a year.

I just don't see how the math adds up today. Laborers get less than $15 an hour Back in the 70s, my dad would get me on with one of his customers, but even if today a kid would get a job, he's still only gonna be taking home around $1700 a month during the summer. Tuition alone in my home state is $9500 a year.

 

[Ame®icano]

Free pre-school, free child care, free public school, free university, free food, free healthcare, state jobs, subsidized housing, and retirement.

For the people comrades !!!!!

Don't forget free birth control. Free clean sheets and lavender candles are just a bonus.

 

[kaz]

Everyone can attend school now with loans. You aren't solving a problem that exists

7 countries where Americans can study at universities in English for free or almost free - The Washington Post

Now, if other countries can provide this, there is no reason why we couldn't too.

That's an argument why we should do it?

 

[kaz]

The average minimum-wage paying job only pays around $15,000 a year, fool.

And? Most min wage earners are teens and retirees working for small business and working part time. And they make up less than 1% of all wage earners.
Non factor.
Your inability to stay on point indicates your argument has run out of gas....Stand down

That is wrong.



The overwhelming majority of low-wage earners who would receive a raise by restoring the minimum wage to its historic value are adults who spend their careers in frontline low-wage industries that make our economy run. Fast-growing low-wage jobs like home care are disproportionately held by female and older workers.

Contrary to stereotypes and the repeated claims of minimum wage opponents, the overwhelming majority of low-wage workers are adults, not teens, and they contribute a substantial portion of their households’ incomes. According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, three quarters of minimum wage earners are 20 or older.

According to the Economic Policy Institute’s State of Working America, a stunning 35 million Americans – 26 percent of our workforce – earn less than $10.55 an hour.

That means 75% of workers earn above $10.55 per hour.
Once again, you people think money grows on trees. The fact is of the min wage earners are kids and seniors.
And make up less than 1% of the workforce.
Your injection of min wage into this is a merely thread derailment.....Shut it.
None of it is untrue....
BTW, you were referring to min wage. You conveniently injected those making up to over $10 per hour.
What does any of this have to do with college tuition?

That is just not true. Many people are suffering, and you cannot get a good paying job without a college education nowadays. A kid who is trying to go to college and takes a job to pay for it is not going to make much more than minimum wage, and more than likely will ONLY make minimum wage.

In fact, a lot of jobs out there are only offering part time work and many are only temporary jobs. You see, poor people do not have a lot of options to better themselves.

I don't have a link, but there's no doubt that my summer jobs back in the mid 70s involved construction labor and working as furniture mover. I could take home $600 a month after taxes with overtime. Living at home, that covered a good part of my housing and food during the school year, and I could work a part-time min wage service job at $2 an hour. Tuition was around $500 a year.

I just don't see how the math adds up today. Laborers get less than $15 an hour Back in the 70s, my dad would get me on with one of his customers, but even if today a kid would get a job, he's still only gonna be taking home around $1700 a month during the summer. Tuition alone in my home state is $9500 a year.

You can't address half the equation. The other half is that limitless government money is driving up the cost of education and unlimited access to it is letting people make poor choices. You borrow $80K and get a degree in sociology and you can't pay it back? No shit.

As a taxpayer, why is that on me now?

 

[kaz]

That is a great argument that what you propose doesn't work. Endless low interest government money is a bad idea. You want the cost of school to go down, eliminate government subsidized loans. Then students will pick schools based on the value they get and make better choices. Schools aren't accountable for creating economic value and the cost is skyrocketing. You want to double down on that over and over by flooding in even more government money to unaccountable administratoins.

Throw money at a problem and hope some of it helps. What a great plan. As a management consultant, I never tried suggesting that strategy to CEOs. I'll try that next time, thanks for the tip. Hey, I know it's a problem bro, throw money at it, maybe that will help. You know, like liberals do in government. Yeah, I'd be on the street by tonight. You people do know how to waste money, and wasting your own isn't enough for you

AS you've been told, those getting grants and student loans HAVE TO MAINTAIN A CERTAIN GRADE POINT AVERAGE. Derp.

Oh, now I get it. So if you get a B in underwater basket weaving, you will be able to get a good job. Got it.

You don't listen very well, do you? I'm talking about kids who have GREAT potential but cannot attend college because of monetary reasons.

How do you determine if one has great potential?

Earning a 3.0 in high school? The student simply saying "I have great potential"?

What do you think academic scholarships are based on? Duh. Why don't you just admit that you don't want to give poor people the opportunity or any options.

You obviously don't have college age kids or recent college experience. Almost all money is now distributed on "need"

 

[kaz]

Oh, now I get it. So if you get a B in underwater basket weaving, you will be able to get a good job. Got it.

You don't listen very well, do you? I'm talking about kids who have GREAT potential but cannot attend college because of monetary reasons.

Everyone can attend school now with loans. You aren't solving a problem that exists

7 countries where Americans can study at universities in English for free or almost free - The Washington Post

Now, if other countries can provide this, there is no reason why we couldn't too.

Gee, I wonder if such is true, then why do so many foreign students leave their homes, families, friends...spend all kinds of money to come here to the US to pay 50K a year......

Most of our doctors are educated in OTHER countries. They obtain degrees from other countries where college is MUCH cheaper or even free.

30% is "most?"

 

[kaz]

And a LOT of those are minimum wage paying jobs. And what of the kids who are smart enough and motivated enough to be doctor? They don't have any option except to accept going to a trade school?

And everyone doesn't have the drive or brains to be a doctor, you want to leave them with no option but medical school or the street?

No kidding. Trade schools are STILL an option for those who wish to do a trade. Your arguments are SO stupid.

That's what he said, try to keep up.

And personal responsibility, wow, what an idiot I am...

And my point is, that some students would like to do something more. The only thing stopping them, is costs.

Oh, I know. By God, helping people better themselves and contribute to the economy instead of having to rely on public assistance is SOCIALISM!

Gotcha, sugar, once again you are begging the question. You keep repeating this strawman and ignoring the points made against it.

The irony, if you take a crowbar to your cheap ass and squeeze out any of your own money, that doesn't count. If you advocate government use guns to redistribute other people's money, then you are helping people.

To each according to their need, from each according to their ability. And you ask why you are being called a socialist. I'll go with the obvious...

 

[bendog]

I certainly didn't say "free." In fact, imo that's a horrible idea. But, there's simply no question that a kid's chances for graduating college with a four year degree, correlate to family income. And it is much more so today than it was in 1970. See the final graph on page 33.
http://www.pellinstitute.org/downlo...ion_Equity_in_the_US_45_Year_Trend_Report.pdf

 

[kaz]

And everyone doesn't have the drive or brains to be a doctor, you want to leave them with no option but medical school or the street?

No kidding. Trade schools are STILL an option for those who wish to do a trade. Your arguments are SO stupid.

That's what he said, try to keep up.

And personal responsibility, wow, what an idiot I am...

And my point is, that some students would like to do something more. The only thing stopping them, is costs.

That is what Stafford loans are for.

Let me fill you ion on something. Here in NY, the state decided to offer those that apply and qualify, an education for free in medical coding. It was not only for free....but they were paid a salary (or allowed to stay on unemployment during the term of the course, even though they were not actively seeking a job)...all they had to do was register for the course and attend the classes.

To qualify, you had to meet certain basic requirements....a HS diploma (or GED) and unemployed.

I supported the program as I was one that helped locate medical coding opportunities for those that graduated.

The problem?

Every class was booked...a good thing....by the last class and practical exam, less that 25% were still attending.....more than 75% stopped showing up. Of those that graduated, less that 50% accepted interviews....and of those that accepted interviews......about 67% showed up on the interviews......a little less than 1/3 just did not show up on the interview.

Bet if they paid at least something for the course...be it 25%.......a heck of a lot more would have capitalized on the opportunity.

Post a link.

Yeah, for you? Pass. Don't ask for what you never give

 

[bendog]

And? Most min wage earners are teens and retirees working for small business and working part time. And they make up less than 1% of all wage earners.
Non factor.
Your inability to stay on point indicates your argument has run out of gas....Stand down

That is wrong.



The overwhelming majority of low-wage earners who would receive a raise by restoring the minimum wage to its historic value are adults who spend their careers in frontline low-wage industries that make our economy run. Fast-growing low-wage jobs like home care are disproportionately held by female and older workers.

Contrary to stereotypes and the repeated claims of minimum wage opponents, the overwhelming majority of low-wage workers are adults, not teens, and they contribute a substantial portion of their households’ incomes. According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, three quarters of minimum wage earners are 20 or older.

According to the Economic Policy Institute’s State of Working America, a stunning 35 million Americans – 26 percent of our workforce – earn less than $10.55 an hour.

That means 75% of workers earn above $10.55 per hour.
Once again, you people think money grows on trees. The fact is of the min wage earners are kids and seniors.
And make up less than 1% of the workforce.
Your injection of min wage into this is a merely thread derailment.....Shut it.
None of it is untrue....
BTW, you were referring to min wage. You conveniently injected those making up to over $10 per hour.
What does any of this have to do with college tuition?

That is just not true. Many people are suffering, and you cannot get a good paying job without a college education nowadays. A kid who is trying to go to college and takes a job to pay for it is not going to make much more than minimum wage, and more than likely will ONLY make minimum wage.

In fact, a lot of jobs out there are only offering part time work and many are only temporary jobs. You see, poor people do not have a lot of options to better themselves.

I don't have a link, but there's no doubt that my summer jobs back in the mid 70s involved construction labor and working as furniture mover. I could take home $600 a month after taxes with overtime. Living at home, that covered a good part of my housing and food during the school year, and I could work a part-time min wage service job at $2 an hour. Tuition was around $500 a year.

I just don't see how the math adds up today. Laborers get less than $15 an hour Back in the 70s, my dad would get me on with one of his customers, but even if today a kid would get a job, he's still only gonna be taking home around $1700 a month during the summer. Tuition alone in my home state is $9500 a year.

You can't address half the equation. The other half is that limitless government money is driving up the cost of education and unlimited access to it is letting people make poor choices. You borrow $80K and get a degree in sociology and you can't pay it back? No shit.

As a taxpayer, why is that on me now?

I have no idea what in my post you are responding to. I never borrowed a dime to get my BA. If anything, your post underscores the issue that our system of financing a college degree is focked up.

 

[kaz]

That's what he said, try to keep up.

And personal responsibility, wow, what an idiot I am...

And my point is, that some students would like to do something more. The only thing stopping them, is costs.

That is what Stafford loans are for.

Let me fill you ion on something. Here in NY, the state decided to offer those that apply and qualify, an education for free in medical coding. It was not only for free....but they were paid a salary (or allowed to stay on unemployment during the term of the course, even though they were not actively seeking a job)...all they had to do was register for the course and attend the classes.

To qualify, you had to meet certain basic requirements....a HS diploma (or GED) and unemployed.

I supported the program as I was one that helped locate medical coding opportunities for those that graduated.

The problem?

Every class was booked...a good thing....by the last class and practical exam, less that 25% were still attending.....more than 75% stopped showing up. Of those that graduated, less that 50% accepted interviews....and of those that accepted interviews......about 67% showed up on the interviews......a little less than 1/3 just did not show up on the interview.

Bet if they paid at least something for the course...be it 25%.......a heck of a lot more would have capitalized on the opportunity.

Post a link.

post a link?

This was MY personal experience I related to you. I was the one who had to keep the stats and submit it to the state. I believe they discontinued the program.

The fact that you doubt it is not my problem. I know it as fact. I offered it up to you for consideration.

Your personal experiences are irrelevant. If you can't post a link, your claims are pointless and might even be made up. I am posting the FACTS.

Facts? If you give people degrees instead of making them earn it and they know they don't have to pay anything back, then they will get motivated and contribute to society and we'll make money on tax savings as other than that they'd end up on welfare. These are socialist delusions, not facts

 

[kaz]

That is wrong.



The overwhelming majority of low-wage earners who would receive a raise by restoring the minimum wage to its historic value are adults who spend their careers in frontline low-wage industries that make our economy run. Fast-growing low-wage jobs like home care are disproportionately held by female and older workers.

Contrary to stereotypes and the repeated claims of minimum wage opponents, the overwhelming majority of low-wage workers are adults, not teens, and they contribute a substantial portion of their households’ incomes. According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, three quarters of minimum wage earners are 20 or older.

According to the Economic Policy Institute’s State of Working America, a stunning 35 million Americans – 26 percent of our workforce – earn less than $10.55 an hour.

That means 75% of workers earn above $10.55 per hour.
Once again, you people think money grows on trees. The fact is of the min wage earners are kids and seniors.
And make up less than 1% of the workforce.
Your injection of min wage into this is a merely thread derailment.....Shut it.
None of it is untrue....
BTW, you were referring to min wage. You conveniently injected those making up to over $10 per hour.
What does any of this have to do with college tuition?

That is just not true. Many people are suffering, and you cannot get a good paying job without a college education nowadays. A kid who is trying to go to college and takes a job to pay for it is not going to make much more than minimum wage, and more than likely will ONLY make minimum wage.

In fact, a lot of jobs out there are only offering part time work and many are only temporary jobs. You see, poor people do not have a lot of options to better themselves.

I don't have a link, but there's no doubt that my summer jobs back in the mid 70s involved construction labor and working as furniture mover. I could take home $600 a month after taxes with overtime. Living at home, that covered a good part of my housing and food during the school year, and I could work a part-time min wage service job at $2 an hour. Tuition was around $500 a year.

I just don't see how the math adds up today. Laborers get less than $15 an hour Back in the 70s, my dad would get me on with one of his customers, but even if today a kid would get a job, he's still only gonna be taking home around $1700 a month during the summer. Tuition alone in my home state is $9500 a year.

You can't address half the equation. The other half is that limitless government money is driving up the cost of education and unlimited access to it is letting people make poor choices. You borrow $80K and get a degree in sociology and you can't pay it back? No shit.

As a taxpayer, why is that on me now?

I have no idea what in my post you are responding to. I never borrowed a dime to get my BA. If anything, your post underscores the issue that our system of financing a college degree is focked up.

Seriously? You don't know what I am talking about? Seriously? You don't understand when you make the point that you used to be able to earn comparatively more money to pay for more of your degree part time, and I said government pumping cheap money into the system is driving up the cost of education, you don't know what that has to do with your point. Seriously? Geez, I can't help you. I'd sue for your money back though

 

[bendog]

That means 75% of workers earn above $10.55 per hour.
Once again, you people think money grows on trees. The fact is of the min wage earners are kids and seniors.
And make up less than 1% of the workforce.
Your injection of min wage into this is a merely thread derailment.....Shut it.
None of it is untrue....
BTW, you were referring to min wage. You conveniently injected those making up to over $10 per hour.
What does any of this have to do with college tuition?

That is just not true. Many people are suffering, and you cannot get a good paying job without a college education nowadays. A kid who is trying to go to college and takes a job to pay for it is not going to make much more than minimum wage, and more than likely will ONLY make minimum wage.

In fact, a lot of jobs out there are only offering part time work and many are only temporary jobs. You see, poor people do not have a lot of options to better themselves.

I don't have a link, but there's no doubt that my summer jobs back in the mid 70s involved construction labor and working as furniture mover. I could take home $600 a month after taxes with overtime. Living at home, that covered a good part of my housing and food during the school year, and I could work a part-time min wage service job at $2 an hour. Tuition was around $500 a year.

I just don't see how the math adds up today. Laborers get less than $15 an hour Back in the 70s, my dad would get me on with one of his customers, but even if today a kid would get a job, he's still only gonna be taking home around $1700 a month during the summer. Tuition alone in my home state is $9500 a year.

You can't address half the equation. The other half is that limitless government money is driving up the cost of education and unlimited access to it is letting people make poor choices. You borrow $80K and get a degree in sociology and you can't pay it back? No shit.

As a taxpayer, why is that on me now?

I have no idea what in my post you are responding to. I never borrowed a dime to get my BA. If anything, your post underscores the issue that our system of financing a college degree is focked up.

Seriously? You don't know what I am talking about? Seriously? You don't understand when you make the point that you used to be able to earn comparatively more money to pay for more of your degree part time, and I said government pumping cheap money into the system is driving up the cost of education, you don't know what that has to do with your point. Seriously? Geez, I can't help you. I'd sue for your money back though

I'm happy for you having this discussion with yourself. But Chris's posts were comparing education access in decades past to today. I'm happy that you agree with us that today's fcoked up. Carry on ... with whatever the hell you're ranting about.

 

[kaz]

That is just not true. Many people are suffering, and you cannot get a good paying job without a college education nowadays. A kid who is trying to go to college and takes a job to pay for it is not going to make much more than minimum wage, and more than likely will ONLY make minimum wage.

In fact, a lot of jobs out there are only offering part time work and many are only temporary jobs. You see, poor people do not have a lot of options to better themselves.

I don't have a link, but there's no doubt that my summer jobs back in the mid 70s involved construction labor and working as furniture mover. I could take home $600 a month after taxes with overtime. Living at home, that covered a good part of my housing and food during the school year, and I could work a part-time min wage service job at $2 an hour. Tuition was around $500 a year.

I just don't see how the math adds up today. Laborers get less than $15 an hour Back in the 70s, my dad would get me on with one of his customers, but even if today a kid would get a job, he's still only gonna be taking home around $1700 a month during the summer. Tuition alone in my home state is $9500 a year.

You can't address half the equation. The other half is that limitless government money is driving up the cost of education and unlimited access to it is letting people make poor choices. You borrow $80K and get a degree in sociology and you can't pay it back? No shit.

As a taxpayer, why is that on me now?

I have no idea what in my post you are responding to. I never borrowed a dime to get my BA. If anything, your post underscores the issue that our system of financing a college degree is focked up.

Seriously? You don't know what I am talking about? Seriously? You don't understand when you make the point that you used to be able to earn comparatively more money to pay for more of your degree part time, and I said government pumping cheap money into the system is driving up the cost of education, you don't know what that has to do with your point. Seriously? Geez, I can't help you. I'd sue for your money back though

I'm happy for you having this discussion with yourself. But Chris's posts were comparing education access in decades past to today. I'm happy that you agree with us that today's fcoked up. Carry on ... with whatever the hell you're ranting about.

You have a BA? Again, I'd get your money back. Let's walk through this slower. Let's see if you can get a simple point, it's becoming a challenge now.

Yes, decades ago, relative to wages college was cheaper. I worked part time and paid for most of my degree, and I went to the University of Maryland, which is right on the border of DC, not exactly Podunk college, and I did it by working summers, nights, winter break, spring break, etc.

Since then, government took over funding educations and pumps subsidized loans into the system. You apply, you get it. There is no determination of where you are going and what you are studying and if you are likely to even be able to pay it back if you want to. People owe $100K and have a degree in sociology which pays maybe $30K a year, less than my first job in ... 1988.

The cost of education has while government pumped in endless subsidized loans all that time continued to spiral up far out pacing inflation. Those decades the government kept pumping in cheap money people kept spending and spending.

Now it's a lot harder to pay significant portions of your degree only working part time because relative to income college costs more, you can earn a lower percent.

Seriously, you aren't seeing the relation between government cheap money and the difference between the 80s and today? A BA can't follow simple numerical reasoning?

 

[kaz]

I'm happy that you agree with us that today's fcoked up

On this point, yes, it's fucked up. The problem is that Chris wants to do more of what is fucking it up and I want to do LESS of what is fucking it up. Government is fucking it up. And it's devaluing the worth of an educations as it eliminates market incentives to control costs and teach relevant skills