Would you be better off under Socialism, if so how?

[Resnic]

I'm curious as to the thought process involved in embracing Socialism so I ask, Would you be better off under Socialism, if so how?

I promise I won't flame

I'd be better off if we could go back to late 90s, everything pretty good then. Even if we could make things how they were 2 years ago things were pretty good then.

But no, no socialism. What we have works, we have seen it work. The problem is no one wants to let our system be what it's designed to do. The system works but when you keep fucking with it, and letting people try to modify it to suit their personal desires then the shit breaks down.

 

[pknopp]

~~~~~~
Wrong!!

Socialism, Not Sanctions, Is to Blame for Venezuela's Misery

Economic sanctions aren't helpful and shouldn't be defended. But Venezuela’s crisis is entirely of its own making and is a direct result of the failed policies of Hugo Chavez and Nicolás Maduro.

fee.org

**********​

How Socialism Destroyed Venezuela

Nationalizations under Chavez and Maduro that should have given “power” to workers only left them unemployed and hungry.

economics21.org

**********​

Socialism, not sanctions, is to blame for Venezuela's collapse

The Venezuelan economy was in freefall long before the imposition of limited US sanctions

capx.co

**********​

Venezuela: Hugo Chavez's Daughter Enjoys Wealth While Nation Starves | KPRC AM 950 | Kenny Webster's Pursuit of Happiness

Here's your daily reminder that socialism is theft.

kprcradio.iheart.com

Let's argue for a second that those reports are correct. We had NO business placing sanctions on Venezuela.

 

[ESay]

..they had mucho troubles in the 30s....[and before that ] ..they were far behind the US/etc in farming/farming equipment/human rights/governmental/etc ..then the war came and a double whammy--the Germans went in, and then the Germans went out..so they had had it very rough for decades ....but, obviously, the system was a failure

Yeah, that system got started thanks to millions of rightless and 'free' slaves working in agriculture, industry, construction, mining etc. As people began demanding more decent life, the system got broken.

 

[harmonica]

I'd be better off if we could go back to late 90s, everything pretty good then. Even if we could make things how they were 2 years ago things were pretty good then.

But no, no socialism. What we have works, we have seen it work. The problem is no one wants to let our system be what it's designed to do. The system works but when you keep fucking with it, and letting people try to modify it to suit their personal desires then the shit breaks down.

good call......the USA system has worked---now they want to change it!!
..a wise old saying: if it works, don't fix it

 

[harmonica]

Yeah, that system got started thanks to millions of rightless and 'free' slaves working in agriculture, industry, construction, mining etc. As people began demanding more decent life, the system got broken.

hahahhahahahahaha
..the USA is one of the greatest countries ever....it was the WHITE people that built America--without the brains, you would have a shithole like Africa is STILL today
.....whites were making very complicated windmills for farming etc while the blacks were still hunting-gathering inefficiently
...the white people had the brains to design and build STEAM engines, railroads, schools, ships, etc etc etc ..the blacks did not even have a written language , which is needed for advancement
etc etc etc

 

[harmonica]

Yeah, that system got started thanks to millions of rightless and 'free' slaves working in agriculture, industry, construction, mining etc. As people began demanding more decent life, the system got broken.

.....black Africa can't even feed itself--in the 21st Century !!!!

The Netherlands Can Feed the World. Here’s Why It Shouldn’t - EcoWatch

Recently, National Geographic published an article called This Tiny Country Feeds the World, where the author extolled the innovations of a small European...

www.ecowatch.com

 

[iamwhatiseem]

As far as communism or socialism is concerned... communism is probably the best system there is if you can find angels to organize it for you. (borrowing the words of Milton Friedman)
There always was, and always will be corruption no matter what system a society employs.
The problem with socialism/communism is that it concentrates power into an extraordinary small number of people. And gives those people power over all aspects of society. And if there is anything we should have learned from the entirety of human history - is the greater power you give to someone - the greater the corruption and greed will be. There is not one single example of where this is not true.

 

[ESay]

hahahhahahahahaha
..the USA is one of the greatest countries ever....it was the WHITE people that built America--without the brains, you would have a shithole like Africa is STILL today
.....whites were making very complicated windmills for farming etc while the blacks were still hunting-gathering inefficiently
...the white people had the brains to design and build STEAM engines, railroads, schools, ships, etc etc etc ..the blacks did not even have a written language , which is needed for advancement
etc etc etc

You got something wrong. I was talking about the Soviet Union.

 

[harmonica]

Yeah, that system got started thanks to millions of rightless and 'free' slaves working in agriculture, industry, construction, mining etc. As people began demanding more decent life, the system got broken.

..you fkd up--most of the industry was in the North, not the South

Difference Between Southern and Northern States before the Civil War

Southern vs Northern States before the Civil War Prior to the Civil War there were several significant differences between Northern and Southern states in terms of demographics, occupational opportunities, income–potential, economic classes, production choices, development,

www.differencebetween.net

 

[harmonica]

You got something wrong. I was talking about the Soviet Union.

my mistake--you said slaves, and I thought you meant the US ..I haven't seen the word ''slaves'' used for Russia pre-WW2

 

[ESay]

my mistake--you said slaves, and I thought you meant the US ..I haven't seen the word ''slaves'' used for Russia pre-WW2

No, I meant the Soviets. Of course they weren't called slaves. Call them peasants, workers, proletariat and so on. That doesn't matter. They were 'slaves' for the state machine.

 

[Mac1958]

Your angle is trolling.
Why?
What good does it to, besides giving yourself a false sense of superiority?
Have you ever noticed you answer every post with a non answer that attempts to make you look smarter?
We should call you "Mr. Superior"

So you don't have the balls to define the word either.

In Normal World, definitions matter for honest, interesting conversation.

That's okay. I know what I'm dealing with.

 

[LordBrownTrout]

They don't understand the concept of government's size, scope and cost existing along a spectrum, a continuum. Nuance/complexity scares and intimidates them, so they attack it. You must be either a commie or you're a great MAGA patriot. That's it. That's all they can grasp, because that's how they're conditioned to think.

That's not even close, mac. Come on, man.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

So you don't have the balls to define the word either.

In Normal World, definitions matter for honest, interesting conversation.

That's okay. I know what I'm dealing with.

Haha.... and there it is.
Yet again.
You have just once again looked for an angle to troll and attempt to make yourself look smart.
Without actually saying anything substantive or defining of your own opinion.
"Aha - see you didn't do this thing I want you to do... therefore I am smarter than you"
That is about 70% of all you do here.

 

[Mac1958]

Haha.... and there it is.
Yet again.
You have just once again looked for an angle to troll and attempt to make yourself look smart.
Without actually saying anything substantive or defining of your own opinion.
"Aha - see you didn't do this thing a want you to do... therefore I am smarter than you"
That is about 70% of all you do here.

Good thing I wasn't holding my breath.

Your opinion of me means nothing. Sorry.

 

[Batcat]

Wrong.
Capitalism can only be profit motivated and based.
Under pure capitalism it would be illegal to tax people for use for social programs that help the poor, disabled, or have public schools.
Those are all socialism.
It is only socialism that is universal and can allow anything, because all socialism demands of any capitalist venture is regulations to prevent abuse.
Like laws against child labor or unsafe work conditions.
Socialism allows capitalism, but capitalism can not allow socialism.
Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, etc. are proof the US is not capitalist.

Some experts disagree with you.

Capitalist Countries 2024

According to the 2020 Economic Freedom of the World Index, the top 10 capitalist countries (ranked from highest score to lowest):

1. Hong Kong
2. Singapore
3. New Zealand
4. Switzerland
5. Australia
6. United States
7. Mauritius
8. Georgia
9. Canada
10. Ireland

Is America capitalist? The United States is referred to as a mixed market economy, meaning that it has characteristics of capitalism and socialism. The United States is a capitalist society where means of production are based on private ownership and operation for profit. The United States is not a totally capitalist society, however, because the economy has regulations, taxation, and some subsidization. The U.S. government has always had some role in the economy, but the economy was closer to a truly free market during some periods. The government has at least some partial control over education, roads, health care, and postal deliveries and provides subsidies to oil companies, financial companies, and agricultural producers. Additionally, private businesses must register with government agencies, and certain types of companies need government-approved licenses.

The U.S. is Still a Capitalist Country | Brookings

As the New Deal took shape, President Franklin Roosevelt was accused of undermining capitalism. His response was that he was saving capitalism, not least from itself. Today, in the midst of another economic crisis, cries of "socialism" once again abound. These are old debates, writes Brookings...

www.brookings.edu

 

[Nova78]

SOCIALISM =Democrat lazy worthless leeches
FREEDOM = Republican hardworking taxpayer.

 

[Missouri_Mike]

They confuse socialism, which can be government regulation of production and distribution, with communism, where the state actually owns the means of production (no private ownership)

Nobody is confused by that. A government that can regulate production and distribution is the owner of that business. Not on paper, but in reality they run it. Now you start adding minimum wage requirements, benefit requirements and even racial quotas, who actually owns that business? The government does.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

They don't understand the concept of government's size, scope and cost existing along a spectrum, a continuum. Nuance/complexity scares and intimidates them, so they attack it. You must be either a commie or you're a great MAGA patriot. That's it. That's all they can grasp, because that's how they're conditioned to think.

Still haven't answered have you?

Answer so you can teach us something

 

[Missouri_Mike]

public sector utility is just state capitalism, which retains the same employer-employee relationship from the private sector.

The appropriate path to socialism is shown here, which only involves the government in giving workers the opportunity to own the place they work at, perhaps with a loan if needed.

Oh that’s such a nice video. You do know Derik has 3 million bucks and a plan to either pull equipment and the best workers to his own site or change production lines to address his shortage on products he is selling. We all get that right?

Now Laura is just over here thinking she’s pretty much had enough of dealing with these employees and wants 3 million to get out no matter who buys it for whatever reason.

Now you have the employees. Who are going to do what? Collect three million? Probably not. You mentioned a loan, from who? At what rate? To do what? Keep going with what they had? You now have multiple owners with no game plan and expecting they will all just keep doing that line work.

This company is dead in a year. The new owners get to experience bankruptcy, god I hope they used their homes as collateral. Otherwise this failed loan is on who? Tax payers?

Fuck off.