Why we have to redistribute income through taxes

[Dad2three]

Anyone notice that when someone says that the wealthy need to "pay their fair share" of taxes, it is usually being said by someone who does not pay any income taxes?

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The answer to your question in "no". Neither have you. You've absolutely concocted everything you have to say.

High icome people pay a disproportionate share of taxes. The lower middle class is undertaxed. This is not even in dispute.

LIE

Total U.S. taxes are barely progressive, as shown in this table and chart from Citizens for Tax Justice. The bottom 99 percent pays a 27.5 percent total tax rate on average, while the top 1 percent pays an average 29 percent tax rate, according to 2011 data from Citizens for Tax Justice.

The share of total taxes paid by each income group is similar to that group’s share of total income.


Who Pays Taxes in America? | CTJReports

 

[Contumacious]

Oh, I see. You don't know what 'central control' means and how the US economy, especially the banking system, functions.

Oh, by the way, LARGE FONT AND ALL CAPS DOESN'T MAKE YOU ANY LESS WRONG.

Problem is that you say so little that even comes close to the appearance of intellegence that there really isn't anything to respond to.

Here we go dingle berry, for your edification , from their own website:


What is the purpose of the Federal Reserve System?

The Federal Reserve System, often referred to as the Federal Reserve or simply "the Fed," is the central bank of the United States. It was created by the Congress to provide the nation with a safer, more flexible, and more stable monetary and financial system. The Federal Reserve was created on December 23, 1913, when President Woodrow Wilson signed the Federal Reserve Act into law. Today, the Federal Reserve's responsibilities fall into four general areas.

Conducting the nation's monetary policy by influencing money and credit conditions in the economy in pursuit of full employment and stable prices.

Got it, so you don't know the history of the US financial crashes, recessions and depression pre fed reserve

Got it you are a low life socialist son of a ***** who hasn't study the causes of crashes before 1913.

The GOVERNMENT WAS ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS INVOLVED.....ALWAYS

.

 

[Dad2three]

High icome people pay a disproportionate share of taxes. The lower middle class is undertaxed. This is not even in dispute.

Which has absolutely nothing with what you claimed. The only relationship is both use the word " tax".

And it is a total duh that people who earn more money pay more income taxes. It does not follow that they pay disproportionally more taxes. Someone making minimum wage should be paying less in taxes, even none at all.

But, everyone pay the same sales tax. Property taxes are worked into rent, so propery taxes don't support your claim. Capital gains taxes are lower than income taxes so that doesn't support your hypothesis. On inspection, nothing appearsmto support your fabricated position.

And, I can guarantee that you are not basing your concept on actual research and math.

So, yes, your statement entirely disputed, entirely fabricated, and completely false on its face.

You're right it does not follow.
What does follow is that the top 20% of earners pay over 90% of income taxes. That is disproportionate in any sense of the term. ANd it is higher than it ever was, even when the top tax rate was 90%
Sales taxes are irrelevant here. It is a red herring argument.
I can guarantee you know nothing about this and are deflecting and your next post will contain a logical fallacy.

 

[MrZartok]

The answer to your question in "no". Neither have you. You've absolutely concocted everything you have to say.

High icome people pay a disproportionate share of taxes. The lower middle class is undertaxed. This is not even in dispute.

LIE



Total U.S. taxes are barely progressive, as shown in this table and chart from Citizens for Tax Justice. The bottom 99 percent pays a 27.5 percent total tax rate on average, while the top 1 percent pays an average 29 percent tax rate, according to 2011 data from Citizens for Tax Justice.

The share of total taxes paid by each income group is similar to that group’s share of total income.





Who Pays Taxes in America? | CTJReports

Good boy! You have learned to copy and paste! Woo hoo! You deserve a treat, honey. At this rate you will be going potty in no time. Hooray!


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

 

[Dad2three]

Here we go dingle berry, for your edification , from their own website:


What is the purpose of the Federal Reserve System?

The Federal Reserve System, often referred to as the Federal Reserve or simply "the Fed," is the central bank of the United States. It was created by the Congress to provide the nation with a safer, more flexible, and more stable monetary and financial system. The Federal Reserve was created on December 23, 1913, when President Woodrow Wilson signed the Federal Reserve Act into law. Today, the Federal Reserve's responsibilities fall into four general areas.

Conducting the nation's monetary policy by influencing money and credit conditions in the economy in pursuit of full employment and stable prices.

Got it, so you don't know the history of the US financial crashes, recessions and depression pre fed reserve

Got it you are a low life socialist son of a ***** who hasn't study the causes of crashes before 1913.

The GOVERNMENT WAS ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS INVOLVED.....ALWAYS

.

Got it, you'll stick with myths and fairy tales. You do know Ayn Rand wrote fiction right?

 

[Dad2three]

High icome people pay a disproportionate share of taxes. The lower middle class is undertaxed. This is not even in dispute.

LIE



Total U.S. taxes are barely progressive, as shown in this table and chart from Citizens for Tax Justice. The bottom 99 percent pays a 27.5 percent total tax rate on average, while the top 1 percent pays an average 29 percent tax rate, according to 2011 data from Citizens for Tax Justice.

The share of total taxes paid by each income group is similar to that group’s share of total income.





Who Pays Taxes in America? | CTJReports

Good boy! You have learned to copy and paste! Woo hoo! You deserve a treat, honey. At this rate you will be going potty in no time. Hooray!


Sent from my iPhone using USMessageBoard.com

Good, you don't disagree, Rabbi lied AGAIN....

 

[Dad2three]

Redistribute income?

You take away the food from my family's table and I will **** you up but good.

Specifically -- how do you suppose a redistribution program would "take away the food" from your family?

Money buys food. Take money, take food. Carter did it, Obama wants to do it. Naomi Jakobsson wants to do it. Screw Liberals, Progressives, and Socialists.

WHY DO YOU SUPPORT REDISTRIBUTION UPWARDS THE PAST 33 YEARS THEN?


Non-Partisan Congressional Tax Report Debunks Core Conservative Economic Theory

The conclusion?

Lowering the tax rates on the wealthy and top earners in America do not appear to have any impact on the nation’s economic growth.

This paragraph from the report says it all—

“The reduction in the top tax rates appears to be uncorrelated with saving, investment and productivity growth. The top tax rates appear to have little or no relation to the size of the economic pie. However, the top tax rate reductions appear to be associated with the increasing concentration of income at the top of the income distribution.”

These three sentences do nothing less than blow apart the central tenet of modern conservative economic theory, confirming that lowering tax rates on the wealthy does nothing to grow the economy while doing a great deal to concentrate more wealth in the pockets of those at the very top of the income chain.

Non-Partisan Congressional Tax Report Debunks Core Conservative Economic Theory-GOP Suppresses Study - Forbes


No one likes paying higher taxes. But do lower taxes actually spur economic growth? Bruce Bartlett, an economist in the Reagan administration, has compared tax rates in various rich countries in 1979 to each country's growth rate since then. His conclusion? There's virtually no correlation. Recent US history backs this up too.

Charts: 6 Big Economic Myths, Debunked | Mother Jones


“The Democrats are the party of government activism, the party that says government can make you richer, smarter, taller, and get the chickweed out of your lawn. Republicans are the party that says government doesn't work, and then get elected and prove it." - P.J. O’rourke

 

[Dad2three]

But I have no problem with Beyonce or Oprah being taxed at a higher rate, they don't seem to be against it either....

There is nothing preventing them from sending extra money to the Treasury voluntarily.

Rich liberals always talk about wanting to get taxed more...but simply can't grasp that they don't have to wait for the government to take it away from them.

Or they understand, but refuse to do it. Hey, makes for some good sound bites, don't it?

Weird, you don't know taxes aren't voluntary?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Specifically -- how do you suppose a redistribution program would "take away the food" from your family?

Money buys food. Take money, take food. Carter did it, Obama wants to do it. Naomi Jakobsson wants to do it. Screw Liberals, Progressives, and Socialists.

Who has convinced you that a redistribution program would take food off the tables of ordinary working class taxpayers? Let me assure you it wouldn't. In fact, if you are an ordinary citizen a redistribution will ultimately benefit you.

Read this: Tax Dodging Companies Hoarding Nearly One Trillion Overseas | Common Dreams

That will be just one target of a redistribution program. If corporate tax levels are substantially increased they will be more inclined to increase wage levels as a "write-off." And when the revenue is applied to a federal make-work program the combined effect will be increased consumption of goods, which will increase demand, which will increase production -- which is the way the Great American Middle Class was created during the 40s to the 80s. It's called Demand Side economics. Ronald Reagan's Supply Side, "trickle down" economics, which in fact is "siphon up" economics, is what caused the problems we are seeing today.

So don't believe what Rush Limbaugh and Glenn Beck tells you about redistribution. They are multi-millionaire propagandists in service to the corporatocracy. Unless you are rich redistribution will serve your interests.

We need Bernie Sanders in the White House. Please keep that name in mind.

If corporate tax levels are substantially increased they will be more inclined to increase wage levels as a "write-off."

If my tax levels are substantially increased I will be more inclined to increase my mortgage balance as a "write-off."

Wait, no I won't.

 

[The Rabbi]

Thanks. And that is generally in line with labor economics. Contrary to popular belief, beyond a certain level, incentive to work decreases with increases wage. Taxing higj income earners creates an incentive to work more, not less.

Why are the two of you deflecting from the question? If CEO salaries are a problem then why anre't Oprah's?
And what difference does it make whether CEOs perform well or badly? You're not paying them.

Harpo Productions, Inc.

Type Private
Industry Media
Founded 1986 (Chicago, Illinois)
Founder(s) Oprah Winfrey


Harpo Productions - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


WOW your lack of critical thinking is scary!

Was there a point you were attempting to make? I mentioned that both Oprah and Beyonce are also CEOs in a previous message. I guess you're just....stooopid

 

[Erand7899]

Does Oprah not pay her employees well enough to not be on the gvt assistance programs that we have to pay for? Does Beyonce?

Jailed? what are you rambling about????? Taxing someone at a higher rate is now jailing someone? NOTE! I am reading this thread from the end going backwards so maybe I will understand what your saying when I continue to read....???

Why are you deflecting from answering his question?
If huge incomes are obscene for CEOs then why not for Oprah and Beyonce, who are of course also CEOs?

It can be argued that Huge salaries for the CEO takes AWAY higher wages for the worker bees, who perform the actual work, for the same corporation....

it also takes away from the actual owners, the stock holder's, earnings/value.

But I have no problem with Beyonce or Oprah being taxed at a higher rate, they don't seem to be against it either....

And for the record, I'd rather see corporations and CEO's CHOOSE not to take 200-400 times the average worker's salary, and give this money in raises to their loyal and performing, worker bee employees....than some kind of tax redistribution....

It can be argued that satan sheets cause pregnancy, but that would not be valid either. And, for the record, I would like to see some CEO come along and offer me more than my house is worth, but that is not going to happen either. Every thing has a market price and labor is no exception.

You don't offer your grocer more than the market price of food, however you expect the grocer to offer more than the market value of labor, for no other reason that you expect to be on the receiving end of the deal.

If a CEO is making $millions in salary, then he is already paying the higherst tax rate on the bulk of his income. However, most of their compensation is paid in stock options and they pay the capital gains rate for the bulk of that compensation. However, none of it is any business of yours. You don't pay the salary, or the stock options, and you have no financial interest in the business. The CEO is just as much an employee as any other employee, and is just as loyal, and just as industrious as any other employee. He/she is just as worthy of their pay as any other employee.

Your obvious envy and jealousy aside, what any CEO makes has absolutely no financial effect on you, me, or any other non related individual. Tend to your own damn business and leave others to tend to theirs.

 

[The Rabbi]

The answer to your question in "no". Neither have you. You've absolutely concocted everything you have to say.

High icome people pay a disproportionate share of taxes. The lower middle class is undertaxed. This is not even in dispute.

LIE

Total U.S. taxes are barely progressive, as shown in this table and chart from Citizens for Tax Justice. The bottom 99 percent pays a 27.5 percent total tax rate on average, while the top 1 percent pays an average 29 percent tax rate, according to 2011 data from Citizens for Tax Justice.

The share of total taxes paid by each income group is similar to that group’s share of total income.


Who Pays Taxes in America? | CTJReports

You're a ******* dishonest liar. Just look at the chart, which doubtless you cannot read.
Federal income taxes are disproportiantely paid by high income earners. That remains a fact, despite your idiotic attempts to deflect and dissimulate.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Why are you deflecting from answering his question?
If huge incomes are obscene for CEOs then why not for Oprah and Beyonce, who are of course also CEOs?

It can be argued that Huge salaries for the CEO takes AWAY higher wages for the worker bees, who perform the actual work, for the same corporation....

it also takes away from the actual owners, the stock holder's, earnings/value.

But I have no problem with Beyonce or Oprah being taxed at a higher rate, they don't seem to be against it either....

And for the record, I'd rather see corporations and CEO's CHOOSE not to take 200-400 times the average worker's salary, and give this money in raises to their loyal and performing, worker bee employees....than some kind of tax redistribution....

It can be argued that satan sheets cause pregnancy, but that would not be valid either. And, for the record, I would like to see some CEO come along and offer me more than my house is worth, but that is not going to happen either. Every thing has a market price and labor is no exception.

You don't offer your grocer more than the market price of food, however you expect the grocer to offer more than the market value of labor, for no other reason that you expect to be on the receiving end of the deal.

If a CEO is making $millions in salary, then he is already paying the higherst tax rate on the bulk of his income. However, most of their compensation is paid in stock options and they pay the capital gains rate for the bulk of that compensation. However, none of it is any business of yours. You don't pay the salary, or the stock options, and you have no financial interest in the business. The CEO is just as much an employee as any other employee, and is just as loyal, and just as industrious as any other employee. He/she is just as worthy of their pay as any other employee.

Your obvious envy and jealousy aside, what any CEO makes has absolutely no financial effect on you, me, or any other non related individual. Tend to your own damn business and leave others to tend to theirs.

It can be argued that satan sheets cause pregnancy,

Satan sheets lead to evil kids.

 

[Mathbud1]

You mean the people doing the work who are making more stuff? Those guys?

You mean the people who are doing EASIER work making more stuff? Those guys? The ones who are working jobs that have been made much much easier and safer by technology and investment by the companies that they work for?

The Highest-Paid CEOs Are The Worst Performers, New Study Says

Across the board, the more CEOs get paid, the worse their companies do over the next three years, according to extensive new research. This is true whether they’re CEOs at the highest end of the pay spectrum or the lowest. “The more CEOs are paid, the worse the firm does over the next three years, as far as stock performance and even accounting performance,” says one of the authors of the study, Michael Cooper of the University of Utah’s David Eccles School of Business.


The Highest-Paid CEOs Are The Worst Performers, New Study Says - Forbes

Spam it up friend. If you don't actually address what people say in their posts, you are no better than a spam bot.

 

[MikeK]

[...]

If a CEO is making $millions in salary, then he is already paying the higherst tax rate on the bulk of his income. However, most of their compensation is paid in stock options and they pay the capital gains rate for the bulk of that compensation. However, none of it is any business of yours. You don't pay the salary, or the stock options, and you have no financial interest in the business. The CEO is just as much an employee as any other employee, and is just as loyal, and just as industrious as any other employee. He/she is just as worthy of their pay as any other employee.

Your obvious envy and jealousy aside, what any CEO makes has absolutely no financial effect on you, me, or any other non related individual. Tend to your own damn business and leave others to tend to theirs.

First, that "envy and jealousy" routine is old, tired, cliched and worn-out nonsense right from the playbook of such multi-millionaire corporatist propagandists as Limbaugh, Hannity, Beck, et al. So you do yourself no service by using it. A more accurate designation for the average Progressive's disposition toward today's grossly overpaid CEOs is resentment, and justifiably so.

The mindset you've been fed by corporate propagandists asserting the exaggerated CEO salaries and bonuses have no effect on the mainstream is patently wrong. Those excessive outlays occur in proportion to reduced and stagnant wages of these CEO's employees. The net effect of that disgraceful example of Reaganomics is a marked reduction in consumer activity, which directly affects the circulation of money in the national economy -- which is analogous to the circulation of blood through a living organism.

And that sums up the economic problem America is experiencing today -- the hoarding of vast amounts of money by a small group of inordinately greedy super-rich who have more money than they could ever spend no matter how hard they try. This hoarding impedes the critically necessary effect of monetary circulation, which is what gave rise to the American Middle Class and enabled the most productive and prosperous decades in our history, the 40s to the 80s.

Bottom line: There is nothing wrong with wealth. It is the hoarding of excessive wealth which is ruining America. And because of the obvious level of corruption in Washington correcting this problem will require the implementation of radical measures. I.e., redistribution of the Nation's wealth resources via confiscatory taxation.

 

[williepete]

Bottom line: There is nothing wrong with wealth. It is the hoarding of excessive wealth which is ruining America. And because of the obvious level of corruption in Washington, correcting this problem will require the implementation of radical measures. I.e., redistribution of the Nation's wealth resources via confiscatory taxation.

Honest question:

Are you saying what I earn through hard work and investment isn't my private property? It's part of or belongs to the "Nation's wealth"?

I was paying very close attention and I could swear my wealth wasn't "distributed" to me. I distinctly recall earning it and risking a great deal of it investing.

Just curious.

 

[Dad2three]

Why are the two of you deflecting from the question? If CEO salaries are a problem then why anre't Oprah's?
And what difference does it make whether CEOs perform well or badly? You're not paying them.

Harpo Productions, Inc.

Type Private
Industry Media
Founded 1986 (Chicago, Illinois)
Founder(s) Oprah Winfrey


Harpo Productions - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


WOW your lack of critical thinking is scary!

Was there a point you were attempting to make? I mentioned that both Oprah and Beyonce are also CEOs in a previous message. I guess you're just....stooopid

You mean both in private Corps? AND? What does that have to do with public CEO pay or the FACT that BOTH of those support Dem policy like higher taxes on the 'job creators'? Now they are just selfish? Oh wait, no that would be CEO's who support GOP policies!

 

[Dad2three]

Bottom line: There is nothing wrong with wealth. It is the hoarding of excessive wealth which is ruining America. And because of the obvious level of corruption in Washington, correcting this problem will require the implementation of radical measures. I.e., redistribution of the Nation's wealth resources via confiscatory taxation.

Honest question:

Are you saying what I earn through hard work and investment isn't my private property? It's part of or belongs to the "Nation's wealth"?

I was paying very close attention and I could swear my wealth wasn't "distributed" to me. I distinctly recall earning it and risking a great deal of it investing.

Just curious.

Yep, you did that all in the bubble, without ANY help from the US society past or present *shaking head*

 

[The Rabbi]

Bottom line: There is nothing wrong with wealth. It is the hoarding of excessive wealth which is ruining America. And because of the obvious level of corruption in Washington, correcting this problem will require the implementation of radical measures. I.e., redistribution of the Nation's wealth resources via confiscatory taxation.

Honest question:

Are you saying what I earn through hard work and investment isn't my private property? It's part of or belongs to the "Nation's wealth"?

I was paying very close attention and I could swear my wealth wasn't "distributed" to me. I distinctly recall earning it and risking a great deal of it investing.

Just curious.

I missed the definition of "excessive wealth" somewhere. Is it right near "fairness" in the dictionariy of liberal cliches?

 

[Dad2three]

You mean the people who are doing EASIER work making more stuff? Those guys? The ones who are working jobs that have been made much much easier and safer by technology and investment by the companies that they work for?

The Highest-Paid CEOs Are The Worst Performers, New Study Says

Across the board, the more CEOs get paid, the worse their companies do over the next three years, according to extensive new research. This is true whether they’re CEOs at the highest end of the pay spectrum or the lowest. “The more CEOs are paid, the worse the firm does over the next three years, as far as stock performance and even accounting performance,” says one of the authors of the study, Michael Cooper of the University of Utah’s David Eccles School of Business.


The Highest-Paid CEOs Are The Worst Performers, New Study Says - Forbes

Spam it up friend. If you don't actually address what people say in their posts, you are no better than a spam bot.

THIS image addressed it, along with the others Bubba