Zone1 Why does a good God allow evil?

[TNHarley]

God gave you free will so you could choose good or evil. By having free will, you are responsible for your choice. That's just fair, so no one can blame God for going to hell. Everyone is responsible for their choices.

You skipped addressing my point.

 

[ding]

Ok, we cant go by the bible. Thanks.

Not the way you read it, no.

 

[TNHarley]

This life is your TEST. Do you follow GOD'S definition of good and evil, or your own definition?

In other words, DID YOU CHOOSE THE TREE OF LIFE, or the tree that tells God you'll go it YOUR way

Why does he need to test if he is omniscient?

 

[ding]

Why does he need to test if he is omniscient?

Do you believe that life prunes you? You know... like a gardener prunes a shrub?

 

[Meriweather]

Because he didn't give us free will. We are self existent in the same way God is. There are parts of us God did not create. Our intelligence is one of them.

Consider that God is continually creating and shaping us, and yet in this portion of his creation we also contribute.

Ok, we cant go by the bible. Thanks.

Start with the concept that everything God created is good. Think of a choice/sin that resulted in a cavity forming in that goodness. (Warning: Analogy coming up!) When a cavity develops in a tooth that is good, we fill the cavity, make the tooth good again. This is where grace comes in. Scripture assures us that no need to fear sin (those holes in our goodness) because where there is sin, there is grace abounds to fill/rectify that cavity that sin caused.

Always good to return to Bible basics!

Why does he need to test if he is omniscient?

We are a creation in progress. Isn't it possible that we wrote/planned/chose many of the tests we face? Others present themselves due to we are physical beings which comes with its own difficulties and limitations. Doesn't overcoming these limitations strengthens us, both physically and spiritually?

 

[Cougarbear]

Ok, we cant go by the bible. Thanks.

Well, some of us can go by our intelligence to read the Bible and fill in the blanks. The volumes of books Jesus said he taught his Apostles that were not written down. It’s you that isn’t going by the Bible. And the Bible isn’t all God can speak to us by. You are as bad as the Sadducees and Pharisees were attempting to limit Jesus Christ to what had been written in their scripture to that point.

 

[Cougarbear]

Consider that God is continually creating and shaping us, and yet in this portion of his creation we also contribute.

Start with the concept that everything God created is good. Think of a choice/sin that resulted in a cavity forming in that goodness. (Warning: Analogy coming up!) When a cavity develops in a tooth that is good, we fill the cavity, make the tooth good again. This is where grace comes in. Scripture assures us that no need to fear sin (those holes in our goodness) because where there is sin, there is grace abounds to fill/rectify that cavity that sin caused.

Always good to return to Bible basics!

We are a creation in progress. Isn't it possible that we wrote/planned/chose many of the tests we face? Others present themselves due to we are physical beings which comes with its own difficulties and limitations. Doesn't overcoming these limitations strengthens us, both physically and spiritually?

I would still throw out a question. Why? Why are we here? What’s the purpose of our existence on earth? If we don’t know where we came from or where exactly we are going, that question cannot be answered.

 

[Cougarbear]

Ok, we cant go by the bible. Thanks.

By the way, the Bible does in many places tell us that we existed in some form before we were conceived in the womb. How did God know Jeremiah before his body was formed in his mother’s womb? Who were all the personages who fought the war in Heaven before the universe was formed?

If we haven’t always had free will, then God indeed would be the author or creator of evil.
Jesus gave some of the devil hosts that were banished from heaven bodies of pigs. Obviously Jesus could see them meaning they had form or spirit bodies for him to talk with. Meaning you and I also were in spirit physical shape form before being in our bodies. Think and reason McFly, think!

 

[TNHarley]

Consider that God is continually creating and shaping us, and yet in this portion of his creation we also contribute.

Start with the concept that everything God created is good. Think of a choice/sin that resulted in a cavity forming in that goodness. (Warning: Analogy coming up!) When a cavity develops in a tooth that is good, we fill the cavity, make the tooth good again. This is where grace comes in. Scripture assures us that no need to fear sin (those holes in our goodness) because where there is sin, there is grace abounds to fill/rectify that cavity that sin caused.

Always good to return to Bible basics!

We are a creation in progress. Isn't it possible that we wrote/planned/chose many of the tests we face? Others present themselves due to we are physical beings which comes with its own difficulties and limitations. Doesn't overcoming these limitations strengthens us, both physically and spiritually?

So he isnt omniscient.

 

[TNHarley]

Well, some of us can go by our intelligence to read the Bible and fill in the blanks. The volumes of books Jesus said he taught his Apostles that were not written down. It’s you that isn’t going by the Bible. And the Bible isn’t all God can speak to us by. You are as bad as the Sadducees and Pharisees were attempting to limit Jesus Christ to what had been written in their scripture to that point.

Well, the bible says he created free will, and you say it doesnt say that, so im confused. Its quit clear in genesis chapter 2.

 

[TNHarley]

By the way, the Bible does in many places tell us that we existed in some form before we were conceived in the womb. How did God know Jeremiah before his body was formed in his mother’s womb? Who were all the personages who fought the war in Heaven before the universe was formed?

If we haven’t always had free will, then God indeed would be the author or creator of evil.
Jesus gave some of the devil hosts that were banished from heaven bodies of pigs. Obviously Jesus could see them meaning they had form or spirit bodies for him to talk with. Meaning you and I also were in spirit physical shape form before being in our bodies. Think and reason McFly, think!

"thinking" creates agnostics and atheists.

 

[Meriweather]

I would still throw out a question. Why? Why are we here? What’s the purpose of our existence on earth? If we don’t know where we came from or where exactly we are going, that question cannot be answered.

Baltimore Catechism: Q: Why did God make me?
A: God made me to know him, love him, serve him and to be happy with him

 

[Cougarbear]

Well, the bible says he created free will, and you say it doesnt say that, so im confused. Its quit clear in genesis chapter 2.

Free will and knowledge are not the same thing. Knowledge of good and evil simply means now you have a choice to choose from. Only when you can understand your choice can you sin. Until then, it’s merely a transgression. Sin and transgression are not the same either.
To the tree of knowledge, read carefully, God made or instructed Lord God to plant the two choices good and evil without Adam or Eve understanding at that point. Two things: The tree existed before being planted like an acorn that grows into a tree. Second, there again are multiple Gods, God and Lord God. Elohim and Jehovah. The word “us” now proves there is a Godhead or at least two personages. Father and Son.

 

[Meriweather]

So he isnt omniscient.

Are you saying God does not know his own plan and/or is incapable of bringing it to fruition? If so, why are you saying that?

 

[Cougarbear]

So he isnt omniscient.

Baltimore Catechism: Q: Why did God make me?
A: God made me to know him, love him, serve him and to be happy with him

Well, he gave us this life to prove through faith that we are capable of loving him and serving him. Did he just make puppets out of nothing? Again, he knew us before we were conceived in our mother’s womb. Where and in what state did we exist before that we knew each other? And, where are we going afterwards?

 

[MarathonMike]

How about this? Let's drop the religious constructs for the sake of argument and say that "God" is an infinite, all-knowing, all-powerful entity who has always existed. If we start there, then it is not difficult to imagine our universe is just one of his grand experiments.

The life within it, he created for his amusement. He does not intervene, makes no judgements he just sets the initial conditions. imparts consciousness to the life forms and observes how they behave, learn, adapt and evolve.

 

[BS Filter]

You skipped addressing my point.

What's your point?

 

[Meriweather]

Well, he gave us this life to prove through faith that we are capable of loving him and serving him. Did he just make puppets out of nothing? Again, he knew us before we were conceived in our mother’s womb. Where and in what state did we exist before that we knew each other? And, where are we going afterwards?

I doubt that we existed in any state, but don't worry--I know you cannot be talked out of it.

Every so often I dabble in water colors. The finished work did not exist anywhere before I put it on paper. I conceived, in my own mind, how the finished creation would look. The same seems true of Jeremiah. Before Jeremiah was conceived, the idea of who he would be/ become, existed in the mind of God, nowhere else.

Where and in what state did the Earth exist before it came to being here? It existed in the mind of God, nowhere else, and he had plans for it. We, his people, are here because God cannot imagine his creation without us in it.

I know you imagine yourself as "moving on" and becoming a god, pretty much like a dog imagining itself moving on and becoming a giraffe. I see it as quite the opposite. I was created to be a human being, and a human being is who I am and what I'll continue to be. I keep in mind God's word in Isaiah....I am God, there is no other, none beside me.

 

[Ace Nova]

judgement for admission to the heavens ... they know.

the spoken religion of antiquity - heavenly goal granted a&e per their request for self determination - the triumph of good vs evil - is for those who accomplish the goal and are judged for admission to the heavens. told which in fact they accomplished. very doubtful a desert dweller need apply.

I live in eternal harmony in an infinite world among infinite worlds.

 

[Cougarbear]

I doubt that we existed in any state, but don't worry--I know you cannot be talked out of it.

Every so often I dabble in water colors. The finished work did not exist anywhere before I put it on paper. I conceived, in my own mind, how the finished creation would look. The same seems true of Jeremiah. Before Jeremiah was conceived, the idea of who he would be/ become, existed in the mind of God, nowhere else.

Where and in what state did the Earth exist before it came to being here? It existed in the mind of God, nowhere else, and he had plans for it. We, his people, are here because God cannot imagine his creation without us in it.

I know you imagine yourself as "moving on" and becoming a god, pretty much like a dog imagining itself moving on and becoming a giraffe. I see it as quite the opposite. I was created to be a human being, and a human being is who I am and what I'll continue to be. I keep in mind God's word in Isaiah....I am God, there is no other, none beside me.

We agree based on Genesis that God created everything spiritually before the physical universe, earth and people. So, what does spirituality for God look like? It’s not like a painting although a nice example. Energy cannot be created nor destroyed. Only changed. With the event of AI, you should be able to understand that intelligence is a form of energy. So, for us to say we’ve always existed in the form of intelligence shouldn’t be a stretch at all. This means we will always have free will and free moral agency. God has never tried to control this. We have always had a choice to pick good or evil that never was given by God. He leads by light and good. He never had or could create evil. That’s our choice. The fact we have always existed with God is the only way to answer the atheists attacks “why did God create evil?” LDS are correct logically and spiritually.