White Fragility: White Folks Are Shy that their whiteness gave them a big leg up in life & crashed black people's dreams

[there4eyeM]

Did anyone notice that in Japan, the Japanese are the most successful.
In China, the Chinese are the most successful.
In Slavic countries, the Slaves are the most successful.
See a pattern?

 

[JoeB131]

Did anyone notice that in Japan, the Japanese are the most successful.
In China, the Chinese are the most successful.
In Slavic countries, the Slaves are the most successful.
See a pattern?

In America, the Americans are most successful. yes, we see a pattern.

 

[IM2]

This is not about wealth. A poor white can be just as racist as a rich one. And poor whites still do not face the things a black person or any other person of color faces. From my experience poor whites are more likely to exhibit white fragility than one who aren't.

quite right. Blaming them for the state of things when they got no benefit from it should piss them off.

The thing that should have happened is we should have raised minorities up to the level of the white working class, not pushed the white working class down.

True, but poor whites have got the benefit of things like not being harrassed by police or assumed to be on welfare, not wanting to work etc. They see the positive image of themselves to the extent that they default person they see as a true American is white. This is what spoken about when we talk about white privilege, not financial stuff or wealth. The simple fact they can vote for a president without questioning where he was born, or demanding to see his birth certificate is a privilege poor whites have that we have not.

Poor whites can get a job and there is no discussion of whether they were qualified to get that job or were they hired because of affirmative action. Poor whites can work in a crew of poor whites and never consider that the fact everyone is white is based on race and not qualifications, but if 2-3 blacks are working with them those same poor whites start talking about quotas.

These are the things that are referred to when people talk about white privilege. So poor whites are not immune from such privilege and it is white race baiters who have conflated the meaning of white privilege to mean wealth or income.

I'm not saying that's what you are doing joe, I am just explaining how white privilege is seen by those like me.

 

[IM2]

Did anyone notice that in Japan, the Japanese are the most successful.
In China, the Chinese are the most successful.
In Slavic countries, the Slaves are the most successful.
See a pattern?

In America, the Native Americans should be the most sucessful. Why didn't that happen?

 

[JoeB131]

This is not about wealth. A poor white can be just as racist as a rich one. And poor whites still do not face the things a black person or any other person of color faces. From my experience poor whites are more likely to exhibit white fragility than one who aren't.

quite right. Blaming them for the state of things when they got no benefit from it should piss them off.

The thing that should have happened is we should have raised minorities up to the level of the white working class, not pushed the white working class down.

True, but poor whites have got the benefit of things like not being harrassed by police or assumed to be on welfare, not wanting to work etc. They see the positive image of themselves to the extent that they default person they see as a true American is white. This is what spoken about when we talk about white privilege, not financial stuff or wealth. The simple fact they can vote for a president without questioning where he was born, or demanding to see his birth certificate is a privilege poor whites have that we have not.

Poor whites can get a job and there is no discussion of whether they were qualified to get that job or were they hired because of affirmative action. Poor whites can work in a crew of poor whites and never consider that the fact everyone is white is based on race and not qualifications, but if 2-3 blacks are working with them those same poor whites start talking about quotas.

These are the things that are referred to when people talk about white privilege. So poor whites are not immune from such privilege and it is white race baiters who have conflated the meaning of white privilege to mean wealth or income.

I'm not saying that's what you are doing joe, I am just explaining how white privilege is seen by those like me.

I'm just pointing out how these things are seen by working class whites who have little job security, and they are being accused of having a privilege they probably aren't seeing tangible results of.

Yes, they are less likely to be pulled over by the cops... but how often does that happen to anyone?

 

[IM2]

their whiteness is the clearest example of the very identity politics that is harmful to america

their whiteness has shielded them from growing up as quickly as they would have had they not so heavily leaned on it to make it through life

their whiteness is the cause of hurt feelings, shattered egos, fraught spirits, vexed bodies, and bloodshot eyes.

white folks just don't wanna face that!

FACE IT, WHITES!

Life's too short to watch some Academic Cow shriek for an hour about White Privilege. When she's done a hard day of labor in her life, she can get back to me.

Okay, here's kind of the problem with that. It's the notion of "collective guilt" that comes with this kind of thinking.

My ancestors didn't own slaves. My paternal ancestors were working class folks from Germany, my maternal ancestors were poor dirt farmers from Missouri. I didn't directly benefit from slavery. Did my forebears get some advantage from being white? Yes. They also encounter some prejudice. (you think anyone was too keen on Germans between 1918 to 1945?)

Now, I'm the first one to call out the Trump supporters on their racism. But at it's root, there's a genuine complaint. The white working class has on one side, seen it's status chipped away at by Corporate Greed, and on the other hand, seen it's being blamed for all the past sins against people of color.

I often say that Trump supporters are just smart enough to know they are being screwed, but too dumb to realize who is screwing them.

Books such as “Color of Law”, “White Rage”, “American Apartheid”, “The New Jim Crow”, “We Charge Genocide,” or “Racism without Racists” to name a few, provide example after example of the great pains the America government took to establish and maintain a system based on white racial supremacy. They detail the toll such policies have inflicted upon blacks as well as all other people of color in America. Countless studies have been done detailing the negative effects that purposefully designed racially exclusionary American public policy has had upon black communities.

I am talking about racist policies made by whites in the last century that have impacted our lives right now. I don't see the same valid complaint because what you say has been chipped away was something we never have gotten as of yet. Working class whites were complicit in the apartheid system of the 20th century, participated in the refusal to follow laws that were made for equal opportunity in the latter part of the 20th, and some still do so today as you point out when you talk about the racism of trump supporters..

 

[IM2]

This is not about wealth. A poor white can be just as racist as a rich one. And poor whites still do not face the things a black person or any other person of color faces. From my experience poor whites are more likely to exhibit white fragility than one who aren't.

quite right. Blaming them for the state of things when they got no benefit from it should piss them off.

The thing that should have happened is we should have raised minorities up to the level of the white working class, not pushed the white working class down.

True, but poor whites have got the benefit of things like not being harrassed by police or assumed to be on welfare, not wanting to work etc. They see the positive image of themselves to the extent that they default person they see as a true American is white. This is what spoken about when we talk about white privilege, not financial stuff or wealth. The simple fact they can vote for a president without questioning where he was born, or demanding to see his birth certificate is a privilege poor whites have that we have not.

Poor whites can get a job and there is no discussion of whether they were qualified to get that job or were they hired because of affirmative action. Poor whites can work in a crew of poor whites and never consider that the fact everyone is white is based on race and not qualifications, but if 2-3 blacks are working with them those same poor whites start talking about quotas.

These are the things that are referred to when people talk about white privilege. So poor whites are not immune from such privilege and it is white race baiters who have conflated the meaning of white privilege to mean wealth or income.

I'm not saying that's what you are doing joe, I am just explaining how white privilege is seen by those like me.

I'm just pointing out how these things are seen by working class whites who have little job security, and they are being accused of having a privilege they probably aren't seeing tangible results of.

Yes, they are less likely to be pulled over by the cops... but how often does that happen to anyone?

I understand that, but those same working class whites are in here making racist comments about how blacks have failed. So they must see some tangible benefit in being white.

You talk about how these whites have little job security but they have more job security than blacks in the same position relative to being in the working class. The fact that blacks have consistently had double the unemployment in this country shows this.

 

[AveryJarhman]

their whiteness is the clearest example of the very identity politics that is harmful to america

their whiteness has shielded them from growing up as quickly as they would have had they not so heavily leaned on it to make it through life

their whiteness is the cause of hurt feelings, shattered egos, fraught spirits, vexed bodies, and bloodshot eyes.

white folks just don't wanna face that!

FACE IT, WHITES!

Hello. Frankly, I sincerely believe evidence demonstrates that for-$PROFIT$ author and world renown "white fragility" lecturer Dr. Robin DiAngelo, Ph.D joins millions of American citizens WILLFULLY IGNORING America's *CHILD CARE* PUBLIC HEALTH CRISIS, aka America's potentially life scarring SYSTEMIC & GENERATIONAL Culture of African American Child Abuse, Emotional Neglect and Maltreatment that evolved from America's multi-generational, ignorant, once legal Culture of Racism!

I am referring to a Culture of Child Abuse, Emotional Neglect, Abandonment and Maltreatment responsible for popular American urban story-TRUTH-tellers and 'Childhood Trauma' (ACEs) victims the late Tupac Shakur (born 1971) and Mr. Barack "My Brother's Keeper" Obama White House guest and friend Kendrick Lamar (born 1987) vividly describing in their American art and interviews the "T.H.U.G.L.I.F.E." and "Good Kid, m.A.A.d. City" Child Abuse Cultures prevalent in far too many American communities.

I am referring to a Culture of Systemic and Generational CHILD ABUSE that THROUGH NO FAULT OF THEIR OWN, deprived Tupac and Kendrick, their childhood friends, as well as many of their elementary and JHS classmates from experiencing a SAFE, fairly or wonderfully happy American kid childhood.

Sadly, the traumatic, potentially life-scarring Criminal Child Abuse and Emotional Abandonment each of these men speaks about experiencing during a critical period of human/childhood development, resulted with them maturing into emotionally ill adults revealing in public they’ve been experiencing acute depression as well as Suic*dal Thoughts for most of their lives.

The same Culture of African American Child Abuse, Neglect and Maltreatment that for near 40 years has been inspiring significant numbers of popular urban story-TRUTH-tellers to compose and promote American music art HATEFULLY informing our world that American girls, women and MOTHERS of African descent should be viewed as less than human *itches, *hores, 'hoes' or "THOTS" unworthy of being treated with basic human respect. (THOT = "That Hoe Over There")

Unfortunately, it's plainly evident Kendrick, Tupac as well as untold numbers of American children are being raised, nurtured and socialized by moms experiencing some type of illness preventing and impeding them from embracing and following their innate, natural maternal instinct to protect their child or children from harm.

Perhaps I'm wrong but *something* is preventing significant numbers of American moms of African descent from recognizing that placing ABOVE ALL ELSE the emotional well being of our Nation's most precious and cherished assets, will most likely result with a fairly or wonderfully happy child maturing into a reasonably responsible teen and adult citizen caring about their own well being (*May 18, 2015 - Rise in Suic!de by Black Children Surprises Researchers - The New York Times*), as well as embracing compassion, empathy and respect for their peaceful or less fortunate neighbors.

It appears Dr. Robin DiAngelo, Ph.D., is more concerned with gaining CASH and notoriety than she is with correctly identifying and EDUCATING a population of SELFISH, immature, apathetic American moms who medical doctors Dr. Nadine Burke Harris, MD, and Dr. Bruce D. Perry, MD, Ph.D, believe are causing far too many American kids and teens to experience a potentially life scarring medical disease known as 'Childhood Trauma' or 'Adverse Childhood Experiences' (ACEs).

Respectfully, the American MOTHERS I am referring to are a specific population of American girls and women of African descent who most all of President Barack "My Brother's Keeper" and Mrs. Michelle "Girl Power" Obama's American urban story-TRUTH-teller friends and WH guests HATEFULLY denigrate as less than human *itches and *hores, 'hoes' thots or 'RATCHET' females undeserving of being treated with basic human respect.

Bottom-line: In my opinion FOR PROFIT author Robin DiAngelo is no different from FOR PROFIT author Tim Wise, both are educated, WILLFULLY IGNORANT citizens exploiting race issues to line their pockets with cash offered by clueless Americans experiencing WHITE GUILT.

Attending a Dr. Robin DiAngelo opinion-based event will cost you $135 – $175.

Public Events | Robin DiAngelo, PhD

 

[basquebromance]

aha

my feet are cold

 

[there4eyeM]

Did anyone notice that in Japan, the Japanese are the most successful.
In China, the Chinese are the most successful.
In Slavic countries, the Slaves are the most successful.
See a pattern?

In America, the Native Americans should be the most sucessful. Why didn't that happen?

How do you reason that a minority would be the most successful (not that "successful" is really defined or a proper standard)?
What you are arguing is that "whites" (and that has not been defined, either) were and are 'racist' (though much of your verbiage is identical to what you say is 'racist' in others). What you do not deny is that everyone was and is racist, so, humans have been and some continue to be 'racist' (despite science displaying that old ideas of race are unsubstantiated). No one disagrees that, yes, ignorant or purposefully stupid individuals do express what can be called racist attitudes. Bigots roam among us. Would convincing some group to feel guilty because of this disgusting minority help? Would it make this minority disappear?

 

[Ghost of a Rider]

when being accused of racism, white people get angry. i find that strange. you would think that getting informed of their mistake would prevent them from doing it again. they should feel relief, not anger, my friends!

This is based on the false premise that every white person is racist. Those who are called racist but are not racist are justifiably angry.

Has this not occurred to you?

 

[JoeB131]

I am talking about racist policies made by whites in the last century that have impacted our lives right now. I don't see the same valid complaint because what you say has been chipped away was something we never have gotten as of yet. Working class whites were complicit in the apartheid system of the 20th century, participated in the refusal to follow laws that were made for equal opportunity in the latter part of the 20th, and some still do so today as you point out when you talk about the racism of trump supporters..

Here's the thing about it... Irish, German, Polish immigrants also suffered their own share of prejudice and discrimination. My grandparents suffered so much discrimination they seriously considered going back to Germany. So laying a guilt trip on me because some other white people put in a system 100 years ago...

Life isn't fair. There are always going to be people who aren't going to like you because of your skin color, your weight, the way you talk, whatever.

Yes, I call racism when I see it, but a lot of self-inflicted wounds are holding people of color back. I am currently not on speaking terms with some family members because I thought a certain CPD officer should have been held accountable for a police shooting. (They happen to be friends with him). But in Chicago, we have 500+ shootings of blacks not by the cops, but by other blacks, and most of them go unpunished because no one reports it or testifies. Only 17% of homicides in Chicago are solved. We could also talk about the 65% out of wedlock birth rate in the African American community as being a real problem.

Now, here's the reality. People will only take care of themselves. Trump support is where a lot of white folks see it as self-protection. So maybe you need to ratchet down the rage just a bit...

yes, I've seen racist bosses... and I've seen employees who got hired on a quota who were absolutely useless. I'm old. I've seen it all, I've done it all, I just can't remember it all.

 

[JoeB131]

I understand that, but those same working class whites are in here making racist comments about how blacks have failed. So they must see some tangible benefit in being white.

You talk about how these whites have little job security but they have more job security than blacks in the same position relative to being in the working class. The fact that blacks have consistently had double the unemployment in this country shows this.

I don't deny racism exists. And frankly, I suspect half the racists who engage you are just trying to get a rise out of you.

 

[harmonica]

their whiteness is the clearest example of the very identity politics that is harmful to america

their whiteness has shielded them from growing up as quickly as they would have had they not so heavily leaned on it to make it through life

their whiteness is the cause of hurt feelings, shattered egos, fraught spirits, vexed bodies, and bloodshot eyes.

white folks just don't wanna face that!

FACE IT, WHITES!

more HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAH
FACE IT......haahahahahahahha
now THIS is a good post to laugh at....not like the anti-Trump thread I just posted in
..very good Bman--keep the laughs coming..it's been boring since the C19 crap--it's all we talk about...but you bring laughs and something different
thanks

 

[basquebromance]

their whiteness is the clearest example of the very identity politics that is harmful to america

their whiteness has shielded them from growing up as quickly as they would have had they not so heavily leaned on it to make it through life

their whiteness is the cause of hurt feelings, shattered egos, fraught spirits, vexed bodies, and bloodshot eyes.

white folks just don't wanna face that!

FACE IT, WHITES!

more HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAH
FACE IT......haahahahahahahha
now THIS is a good post to laugh at....not like the anti-Trump thread I just posted in
..very good Bman--keep the laughs coming..it's been boring since the C19 crap--it's all we talk about...but you bring laughs and something different
thanks

the truth hurts!

 

[MizMolly]

when being accused of racism, white people get angry. i find that strange. you would think that getting informed of their mistake would prevent them from doing it again. they should feel relief, not anger, my friends!

The only whites getting angry are the ones who are FALSELY accused of racism. People of all races can be racist, but some blacks are in denial.

 

[MizMolly]

This is not about wealth. A poor white can be just as racist as a rich one. And poor whites still do not face the things a black person or any other person of color faces. From my experience poor whites are more likely to exhibit white fragility than one who aren't.

quite right. Blaming them for the state of things when they got no benefit from it should piss them off.

The thing that should have happened is we should have raised minorities up to the level of the white working class, not pushed the white working class down.

True, but poor whites have got the benefit of things like not being harrassed by police or assumed to be on welfare, not wanting to work etc. They see the positive image of themselves to the extent that they default person they see as a true American is white. This is what spoken about when we talk about white privilege, not financial stuff or wealth. The simple fact they can vote for a president without questioning where he was born, or demanding to see his birth certificate is a privilege poor whites have that we have not.

Poor whites can get a job and there is no discussion of whether they were qualified to get that job or were they hired because of affirmative action. Poor whites can work in a crew of poor whites and never consider that the fact everyone is white is based on race and not qualifications, but if 2-3 blacks are working with them those same poor whites start talking about quotas.

These are the things that are referred to when people talk about white privilege. So poor whites are not immune from such privilege and it is white race baiters who have conflated the meaning of white privilege to mean wealth or income.

I'm not saying that's what you are doing joe, I am just explaining how white privilege is seen by those like me.

You are ASSuming things about poor whites. Since you are not a poor white person, you are not qualified to comment on them. (Just throwing out your excuse as to why whites can't comment on blacks).

 

[22lcidw]

This is not about wealth. A poor white can be just as racist as a rich one. And poor whites still do not face the things a black person or any other person of color faces. From my experience poor whites are more likely to exhibit white fragility than one who aren't.

quite right. Blaming them for the state of things when they got no benefit from it should piss them off.

The thing that should have happened is we should have raised minorities up to the level of the white working class, not pushed the white working class down.

True, but poor whites have got the benefit of things like not being harrassed by police or assumed to be on welfare, not wanting to work etc. They see the positive image of themselves to the extent that they default person they see as a true American is white. This is what spoken about when we talk about white privilege, not financial stuff or wealth. The simple fact they can vote for a president without questioning where he was born, or demanding to see his birth certificate is a privilege poor whites have that we have not.

Poor whites can get a job and there is no discussion of whether they were qualified to get that job or were they hired because of affirmative action. Poor whites can work in a crew of poor whites and never consider that the fact everyone is white is based on race and not qualifications, but if 2-3 blacks are working with them those same poor whites start talking about quotas.

These are the things that are referred to when people talk about white privilege. So poor whites are not immune from such privilege and it is white race baiters who have conflated the meaning of white privilege to mean wealth or income.

I'm not saying that's what you are doing joe, I am just explaining how white privilege is seen by those like me.

Not true about white poverty. But one thing will happen if there is a collapse. A disconnect on this never ending racial accusations. Whether it continues or not will not matter. People will pay no attention to it as survival will be paramount for many more of them.

 

[MarcATL]

Did anyone notice that in Japan, the Japanese are the most successful.
In China, the Chinese are the most successful.
In Slavic countries, the Slaves are the most successful.
See a pattern?

So America is for white people?

 

[IM2]

Did anyone notice that in Japan, the Japanese are the most successful.
In China, the Chinese are the most successful.
In Slavic countries, the Slaves are the most successful.
See a pattern?

In America, the Native Americans should be the most sucessful. Why didn't that happen?

How do you reason that a minority would be the most successful (not that "successful" is really defined or a proper standard)?
What you are arguing is that "whites" (and that has not been defined, either) were and are 'racist' (though much of your verbiage is identical to what you say is 'racist' in others). What you do not deny is that everyone was and is racist, so, humans have been and some continue to be 'racist' (despite science displaying that old ideas of race are unsubstantiated). No one disagrees that, yes, ignorant or purposefully stupid individuals do express what can be called racist attitudes. Bigots roam among us. Would convincing some group to feel guilty because of this disgusting minority help? Would it make this minority disappear?

Drop the everyone is racist bs. That's part of the problem. Certain whites not wanting to own responsibility for what whites have done and keep doing.

The Native Americans were a majority before the attempted genocide of their nations. I like how whites try telling me how what I say is identical to racists. I am talking about a behavior that has occurred practiced by whites for 400 years. I am not stereotyping whites just because I believe they are inherently racist. This is the problem with talking about race with some white people. We do not come from the same racial experience. Blacks and other non white races have been the people bullied by the racists and our opinion mainly will be responses to that racism which gets called racism by some whites who now imagine some symmetry exists between the experiences of non whites and whites in America.

I can't slap you then press charges for battery when you slap me back.. Nor can I complain about how wrong it was for you to hit me. But it seems like there are whites who believe they have the right to call us racists for being angry or opposing the continuing racism we see today. Somehow on matters of race for us to express our opinion with how we have been and continue to be treated by whites in this country, we get called racists.

You don't seem to understand and buy into this ignorance about making people feel guilty. Whites don't need to feel guilt, whites need to get in their communities, roll up their sleeves and start working to end the racism that exists in your communities. Stop pointing fingers at non whites talking about how they can be racists too, because no non white group has implemented supreme court decisions or public policy purposefully designed to harm whites in any manner. And until attitudes are gone that exist in this country among whites who lie and twist math to create an illusion of violent blacks so they can craft laws to stand their ground and shoot to kill people they believe are violent, the fight will continue.

The problem we have today was created by whites in the past and maintained throughout our history up to this very second. Whites made this bed and hollering about everybody else isn't going to end anything. If whites created the white supremacist belief and subsequent system in this country, whites must end it. It's just that simple.