Zone1 Which came first, Christianity or Judaism?

[Woodznutz]

Of course it’s true. What type of Gd do you think we have? He would send good, kind, decent people to hell because they don’t believe Jesus was his son? That’s the majority of people.

True that most people go to hell*, not because they don't believe in Jesus, but because they die.

Hell: the grave (look it up).

 

[Woodznutz]

Also, it doesn’t say in Isiah that he will be born of a virgin. That was the translation. The actual word just means a young woman of child-bearing age.

Mary was a young woman, and a virgin.

 

[onefour1]

So when Isaiah was giving a sign unto all Israel, that sign was simply that a young woman would have a child? I think the meaning of "hā·‘al·māh" can mean both a young woman or maiden and virgin. I don't think Israel would be looking for a young woman to have a child as being a miraculous sign from the Lord. I think the translation, in this instance, is correct. It doesn't make much sense otherwise. The miraculous thing about the sign was the virgin birth, and that the birth would be the son of God. The meaning of Immanuel is "God is with us". The great sign is that the son of God would be born of a virgin.

Mary, Young Woman or Virgin?​

 

[theHawk]

Of course it’s true. What type of Gd do you think we have? He would send good, kind, decent people to hell because they don’t believe Jesus was his son? That’s the majority of people.

Difficult to say. Basically it means that if you truly believe in God you will listen to Jesus’s message and obey his commandments: Love God, and Love thy neighbor. If you follow this you will “know God”. Ultimately Jesus will judge. But even to Catholics being a Christian doesn’t mean you go straight to heaven, you may need to be purified in purgatory before. Maybe nonbelievers will just have to spend a really long time there, and then be allowed into heaven.

If you believe the Messiah has not come yet, then do you still believe the gates of heaven are closed? The Old Testament tells us that when people die they go down into the Earth, to “Abraham’s boson” (As Abraham is there to embrace them). As Sheol is described as being one side where believers go, the other side is the “place of torment” where sinners go. Dead “good” people could not enter heaven because no one had yet paid for their sins, because no one is without sin, but they were not being tormented like the non-believers and ones with bad sins. Sheol is also described as being barred and with gates that cannot be breached. These are the gates to heaven.

Christians believe when Jesus died and descended into Sheol, he opened those gates, and the dead in Abraham’s bosom were finally able to get into heaven, as Jesus had paid for their sins with his blood.

If you claim to be a Jew, then who has paid for people’s sins in order to go to heaven as you claim?

 

[Meriweather]

So when Isaiah was giving a sign unto all Israel, that sign was simply that a young woman would have a child?

It has been a long time since I studied it, but this is what I recall if memory serves. Isaiah had a daughter who was married to King Hezekiah. The sign of hope was the young woman (the king's wife) would be with child. This was a sign/prophecy the people of the time could watch unfold. It was not intended as a prophecy for future generations. Mary was a young woman with child during another difficult time period. It could be considered a reminder of an earlier time and the good that came out of it, and an expectation that blessings would again come to the people of God.

 

[BackAgain]

Unless Jesus was the Great I AM, and Jehovah of the Old Testament. Then all that was received from the God of the Old Testament was from Christ and was all Christianity from the beginning even though it wasn't called Christianity in those days. If it's from Christ, then the revelations are of Christ and it is all Christianity.

Or — and stay with me here for a moment — maybe time is really just a construct in which nothing ever comes “before” anything else.

 

[Lisa558]

Difficult to say. Basically it means that if you truly believe in God you will listen to Jesus’s message and obey his commandments: Love God, and Love thy neighbor. If you follow this you will “know God”. Ultimately Jesus will judge. But even to Catholics being a Christian doesn’t mean you go straight to heaven, you may need to be purified in purgatory before. Maybe nonbelievers will just have to spend a really long time there, and then be allowed into heaven.

If you believe the Messiah has not come yet, then do you still believe the gates of heaven are closed? The Old Testament tells us that when people die they go down into the Earth, to “Abraham’s boson” (As Abraham is there to embrace them). As Sheol is described as being one side where believers go, the other side is the “place of torment” where sinners go. Dead “good” people could not enter heaven because no one had yet paid for their sins, because no one is without sin, but they were not being tormented like the non-believers and ones with bad sins. Sheol is also described as being barred and with gates that cannot be breached. These are the gates to heaven.

Christians believe when Jesus died and descended into Sheol, he opened those gates, and the dead in Abraham’s bosom were finally able to get into heaven, as Jesus had paid for their sins with his blood.

If you claim to be a Jew, then who has paid for people’s sins in order to go to heaven as you claim?

What makes you think someone else has to “pay” for people’s sins? That’s an entirely Christian concept. How can you not understand that?

In Judaism, one does the best he can to observe the mitzvot Gd has commanded us, atone for our OWN sins by asking forgiveness when we fail and making amends for them, and vowing not to repeat them.

Also, not sure what you mean by I “claim” to be a Jew.

 

[surada]

So when Isaiah was giving a sign unto all Israel, that sign was simply that a young woman would have a child? I think the meaning of "hā·‘al·māh" can mean both a young woman or maiden and virgin. I don't think Israel would be looking for a young woman to have a child as being a miraculous sign from the Lord. I think the translation, in this instance, is correct. It doesn't make much sense otherwise. The miraculous thing about the sign was the virgin birth, and that the birth would be the son of God. The meaning of Immanuel is "God is with us". The great sign is that the son of God would be born of a virgin.

Mary, Young Woman or Virgin?​

Chapter 19 WHO IS THE CHILD?

(Isaiah 9:5-6) Who is the child? Isaiah presents many of his messages through the use of prophetic names (Isaiah 7:3, 14; 8:3). In one such passage he declares: For a child has been born to us, a son has been given to us; and the government is upon his shoulder

jewsforjudaism.org

 

[surada]

What makes you think someone else has to “pay” for people’s sins? That’s an entirely Christian concept. How can you not understand that?

In Judaism, one does the best he can to observe the mitzvot Gd has commanded us, atone for our OWN sins by asking forgiveness when we fail and making amends for them, and vowing not to repeat them.

Also, not sure what you mean by I “claim” to be a Jew.

What of temple sacrifice?

 

[BackAgain]

neither is there a hereditary link nor known articles of religious bearing from the heavens related to any of the madeup desert religions - life itself is the reflection of the heavenly prescribed, spoken religion of antiquity jesus gave their life for ... and was never a jew.

liberation theology, self determination is what those you speak of feared and knew without intervention their hold on the religious tethers used to persecute and victimize the innocent would soon be taken from them.

- at least a new beginning and return to the pursuit granted humanity at the time of noah and the path set by their intervention.

Yawn.

 

[irosie91]

What of temple sacrifice?

what of it? For those who wish to know and are confused by the idiot
insinuations of jerks------in reference to animals the ENGLISH word for
killing them for food (or experimentation or husbandry) is "sacrifice".
Persons interested in reality regarding the HUMAN HUSBANDRY of meat,
read some decent literature in the field of ANTHROPOLOGY.

 

[BreezeWood]

What makes you think someone else has to “pay” for people’s sins? That’s an entirely Christian concept. How can you not understand that?

In Judaism, one does the best he can to observe the mitzvah Gd has commanded us, atone for our OWN sins by asking forgiveness when we fail and making amends for them, and vowing not to repeat them.

Also, not sure what you mean by I “claim” to be a Jew.

lisa - he can ... jews are transvestites, seems fitting. or is it tom.

asking forgiveness - does about as much for a spirit as polishing an apple.

 

[Woodznutz]

what of it? For those who wish to know and are confused by the idiot
insinuations of jerks------in reference to animals the ENGLISH word for
killing them for food (or experimentation or husbandry) is "sacrifice".
Persons interested in reality regarding the HUMAN HUSBANDRY of meat,
read some decent literature in the field of ANTHROPOLOGY.

He was referring to sacrifices in Biblical times, up to and including Jesus' day.

 

[theHawk]

What makes you think someone else has to “pay” for people’s sins? That’s an entirely Christian concept. How can you not understand that

Because Jewish scripture says so.

Are you denying what Sheol is described as in Jewish scripture?

 

[BreezeWood]

Because Jewish scripture says so.

their claim is a&e were sinners - and the reason to crucify jesus who claimed otherwise.

 

[BS Filter]

Jesus is Jehovah. Jesus is the God of Israel and always has been. Jesus is the God of the Old Testament who talked with Moses and Abraham, etc. That's my belief.

 

[theHawk]

What makes you think someone else has to “pay” for people’s sins? That’s an entirely Christian concept. How can you not understand that?

In Judaism, one does the best he can to observe the mitzvot Gd has commanded us, atone for our OWN sins by asking forgiveness when we fail and making amends for them, and vowing not to repeat them.

Also, not sure what you mean by I “claim” to be a Jew.

Say, do Jews still sacrifice lambs?

 

[BreezeWood]

Say, do Jews still sacrifice lambs?

just ask ir-91 ... it's all in a days work, and they care so much for all that's around them not jewish.

 

[surada]

What makes you think someone else has to “pay” for people’s sins? That’s an entirely Christian concept. How can you not understand that?

In Judaism, one does the best he can to observe the mitzvot Gd has commanded us, atone for our OWN sins by asking forgiveness when we fail and making amends for them, and vowing not to repeat them.

Also, not sure what you mean by I “claim” to be a Jew.

It dates back to Azazel.

SIN-OFFERING - JewishEncyclopedia.com

Complete contents the 1906 Jewish Encyclopedia.

www.jewishencyclopedia.com

 

[irosie91]

He was referring to sacrifices in Biblical times, up to and including Jesus' day.

what about "sacrifices" at the time you call "biblical" ?