Zone1 Where does atheist morality come from?

[Mashmont]

So, the opposite of maga culture.

The MAGA culture is the very essence of freedom and allowing people to be the best they can be without shackles and graft of leftwing government. That's why the Pope almost certainly voted for Trump.
The leftwing atheist culture is the opposite of that.

 

[ding]

Please submit your evidence that your Gid created the universe.

The universe popped into existence, not being created from existing matter, in an improbable manner, and inexplicably fine tuned to produce intelligence according to the laws of nature which existed before space and time itself.

 

[Ace Nova]

Perhaps I stated it too strongly.

Genesis 8:21 "The inclination of the human heart is evil from youth,"

Misunderstood and misinterpreted.

"The INCLINATION of the human heart is evil from youth." Key word is Inclination - meaning humans have THE ABILITY to do evil from youth - AKA - FREE WILL.

What does this mean? If humans are left unattended from youth, some will choose to do evil, others will not. Those that defy temptation AKA "The INCLINATION" of their heart from youth - could be considered those chosen by God, to do God's will - whether by grace, chance or other.

The people who defied the INCLINATION of their hearts to do evil, will go on to raise their children accordingly - helping their children to also defy the INCLINATION of their hearts - to the best of their ability.

Eventually - through many generations - the INCLINATION becomes little more than a hidden desire within the hearts of the chosen. The initial generations overcame their inclination by grace or other - every generation since, overcame their inclination with the help of their parents, grandparents and ancestors.

When the Prophets spoke about punishment of those who disobeyed God - that they would be "cursed" for generations to come - this is exactly what they were speaking of. If people stray from God's path - they cannot help their children and grandchildren defy "their inclination" - so by defying God (or his ways) parents leave their "children unattended" as they were in the first generations, allowing them to fall victim to the "evil inclination" of their hearts at a much higher rate, than the parents who helped guide their children.

The Prophets were simply explaining the consequences of peoples actions - in a way a primitive people could understand.

Yet those passages led scholars, "brilliant minds", and all sorts of supposedly enlightened people to judge the God of the Bible as some sort of tyrannical monster - who cursed people for generations - when in realty, the people "cursed" themselves as a consequence of their actions - God (or his messengers) were simply telling them what would happen.

The "enlightened" in their most ignorant moment - killed the messenger - overlooking the actual message - and were ignorant of the truth - despite thinking themselves, "enlightened".

 

[Paradoxical#1]

The universe popped into existence, not being created from existing matter, in an improbable manner, and inexplicably fine tuned to produce intelligence according to the laws of nature which existed before space and time itself.

Goddidit, amirite?

 

[Captain Caveman]

How can an atheist claim to have morals, other than by stealing morals from other sources such as the Bible, or the law of the state or nation in which they live?

For that matter, there is no way to know what every individual's morals are or where they come from, so how do we know that an atheist has morals to begin with just because they say they do?

You have innate instincts (natural behaviours) and nurture (parental influences).

 

[cnm]

Philosophically, this goes on until one finds that what is not contingent on anything--it simply is (or, I am who I am). This leads to the problem of describing this--and one cannot, because anything that can be described falls back into the contingency category. Therefore, we are stuck with describing what it is not.

The Gawd of Gaps is a perfectly adequate description of what it is.

 

[cnm]

Amazing, isn't it, how humanity has grown from beating people who work for them into never laying a hand on them.

I don't think the Bronze Age tribes to whom this narrative refers have yet managed to stop beating people.

 

[cnm]

It's unbelievable (to me) that it was Pope Francis who first called this well known verse to your own mind.

Which other Popes have said it in regard to sexual diversity?

 

[cnm]

Even then it was noted in her (admittedly small) hometown, it is well to keep in mind, "Who am I to judge."

American Catholic bishops are famously willing to judge.

 

[cnm]

Therefore, atheism proceeds in almost all its manifestations on the assumption that the basic principles guiding the life of an individual and of mankind in general do not go beyond the satisfaction of material needs or primitive instincts.

Be that as it may, cooperation and generosity help satisfy material needs.

 

[cnm]

My point was that with respect to all of your complaints concerning God, if you don't believe the narrative then provide the narrative that you believe that explains the texts. Then you will discover your error.

Tribal self justification in their story telling of genocide.

Funny that.

 

[cnm]

My morality comes from my LOVE of God as God is love among other "things."

Like sacrifice?

 

[Meriweather]

The Gawd of Gaps is a perfectly adequate description of what it is.

It's not. That was used to explain what was not yet scientifically known about the physical world. And, as the physical world is a creation of God, in a way, true.

 

[Meriweather]

Which other Popes have said it in regard to sexual diversity?

Which other known Popes were asked? It was how the issue was already being handled (for the most part) in Catholicism.

 

[Meriweather]

American Catholic bishops are famously willing to judge.

Which ones, on which issue? What as their judgment?

 

[ding]

Goddidit, amirite?

The only thing that can be eternal into the past is no thing. God is no thing. This is a life breeding, intelligence creating universe because the constant presence of mind made it so. Rather than mind being a late outgrowth of the evolution of space and time, mind has always existed as the source or matrix of the physical world. The physical world is made up of mind stuff.

 

[ding]

Be that as it may, cooperation and generosity help satisfy material needs.

Yes, they do. It seems that nature does have a preference for an outcome. And that preference is goodness.

 

[ding]

Tribal self justification in their story telling of genocide.

Funny that.

There it is. So is it your argument that God didn't really do all that stuff and that Jews just made it up to justify their actions?

 

[ding]

Like sacrifice?

View attachment 1110357

I guess that all depends on how you see sacrifice and if you think sacrifice is an extant attribute of reality. I suspect you have a very narrow view of what a sacrifice is despite you yourself making many sacrifices throughout your life.

 

[rightwinger]

There it is. So is it your argument that God didn't really do all that stuff and that Jews just made it up to justify their actions?

Pretty much so

Invent an almighty force that you had better obey or else
Easier to control people. God is watching