What specific political goals/policies do you support or object to?

[daveman]

I've never argued that but you just have to lash out.




A free man still pays for what he uses.

So, a man forced to pay for what other men use is not free.

Glad you're on board!

 

[pknopp]

You had your chance to have you say in the way things would be run.

The American people said they were done with business as usual.

They said that in 2016 and we got an additional 7.8 trillion in new debt.

 

[pknopp]

Deadbeats are responsible for the debts they incur.

I don't recall voting for trillions in debt.

And yet you did. You didn't vote for Trump in 2016? Whoever you voted for before that if they won added to the debt also.

 

[pknopp]

So, a man forced to pay for what other men use is not free.

Glad you're on board!

The argument was to not pay for what you use.

 

[g5000]

I will ask everyone to leave issues of character and law breaking out of this discussion whether you are anti-Trump or anti-Biden/Harris or are coming from a different direction. Can we keep the trolling and insults to a minimum and concentrate on why we support what we support as actual or proposed policy?


Let's focus for a bit on actual policy and why we support it.

I'll address some of the items on your checklist.

• Most migrants are good for America and should have a path to citizenship.

It is a fact immigrants, both legal and illegal, are more law-abiding than native-born Americans.

Now some wiseass is going to say illegal immigrants are already breaking the law by being here, but I will ignore that kind of facetiousness.

If you stack up violent crimes between immigrants of any flavor against US citizens, the facts prove US citizens are far more violent.

ETA: The right wing is really missing the boat on immigrants. They are everything the Right claims to be in favor of. Immigrants are extremely hard-working, they are family-oriented, and they are deeply religious.

You would not know that by consuming MAGA media because those outlets are rife with logical fallacies and deliberately feed their viewers' confirmation bias with every story they can find of immigrants behaving badly.

Confirmation bias - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Next, our birth rate is now well below the replacement rate. It needs to be at 2.1 and is currently at 1.7 and dropping.

With a declining birth rate, you end up with an aging population which does not have enough younger people to support the elderly.

Japan is particularly suffering from this problem right now.

Several countries have tried every experiment to get their people to breed, and all of them have failed.

Developed nations are failing at getting their birth rates back up.

So the answer is...increasing immigration.

Bigots do NOT like this. We have had nativist movements off and on all through our history. Anti-Irish, anti-German, anti-Chinese, anti-Catholic, ad infinitum.

But we are a nation of immigrants. We are the proverbial melting pot.

We are a nation of mutts, and we kicked the Aryan assholes asses in WWII.

• Minors should not get surgery or dangerous substances included in 'gender affirming care.'

I am absolutely opposed to any "treatment" of minors, chemically or surgically. Absolutely, unequivocally opposed.

A child can't even get a tattoo and we're going to alter their body chemistry or physicality?

Oh hell no!

Not only am I opposed, I am also opposed to a child being allowed to do so with a parent's consent for a very simple reason.

If an adult has sex with a minor, they go to prison. If a parent gives their consent for their child to have sex with an adult, the parent goes to prison.

We don't allow kids to have sex with adults because they cannot give INFORMED CONSENT. Their brains aren't developed enough.

We don't allow kids to get tattoos for the exact same reason.

I do not know what special twisted fucked up brain a liberal must have to think a child can give informed consent in one case but not another.

• Government should be held accountable for all money spent.

What is this "government" you are talking about? The one we elected to give us everything we demand?

It's not "government's" fault it spends too much.

It's ours.

When is the last time you saw a "conservative" bitching about all the wild spending Republicans do?

Yet they scream and moan over Democrat spending.

Hypocrites.

We NEVER hold our "team' accountable for over-spending.

Never.

"Gimme gimme and make that guy over there pay for it."

We demand all kinds of deductions and credits and exemptions under the lie that "we are getting to keep more of our own money."

That's a total lie. A lying lie fucking lie.

Every deduction, credit, and exemption has to be offset with HIGHER TAX RATES INFLICTED ON EVERYONE.

And so much of this shit has been demanded by us that if we raised tax rates to fully offset all of them, we'd scream bloody murder.

So the government borrows. And borrows. And borrows.

It's us. We are the problem. Government is not the problem.


The next time you bitch about government overspending, look in the mirror. There's your culprit.

Congress has single-digit job approval, and yet we re-elect 98 percent of the House every election, and 80 percent of the Senate.


"Those other congresscritters spend too much on PORK, but my guy brings home the BACON."

We get the politicians we deserve.

 

[daveman]

They said that in 2016 and we got an additional 7.8 trillion in new debt.

Since you're opposed to debt, who did you vote for?

 

[Foxfyre]

California's policies effect the entire nation and now cost you money and degrade the publics safety far beyond California's border.

It doesn't matter. California is constitutionally entitled to screw itself up as it choose to do. People who choose to live there and keep voting in the people who screw it up deserve what they get. If that means we can't get or afford what California produces that's unfortunate but we do without or get those products somewhere else. In fact it might create some pretty lucrative opportunities for others to step up and provide the products that we no longer get from California.

 

[daveman]

And yet you did. You didn't vote for Trump in 2016? Whoever you voted for before that if they won added to the debt also.

Everybody added to the debt, because there are no incentives to spend only what we take in.

 

[daveman]

The argument was to not pay for what you use.

The argument was taxation is theft.

 

[pknopp]

Since you're opposed to debt, who did you vote for?

Last time Vermin Supreme. Before that Jo Jorgenson. Jill Stein and Vermin Supreme before that.

None of those I voted for added to the debt.

Now here is where you argue that if they had they would have. And my reply is that maybe they would which would mean I would not vote to re-elect them.

 

[pknopp]

Everybody added to the debt, because there are no incentives to spend only what we take in.

Especially not a risk to have people not vote for them.

 

[pknopp]

The argument was taxation is theft.

A silly argument. You have to pay for what you use.

Not paying for what you use is theft.

 

[elektra]

It doesn't matter. California is constitutionally entitled to screw itself up as it choose to do. People who choose to live there and keep voting in the people who screw it up deserve what they get. If that means we can't get or afford what California produces that's unfortunate but we do without or get those products somewhere else. In fact it might create some pretty lucrative opportunities for others to step up and provide the products that we no longer get from California.

You and the entire country pay more for energy, food, goods and services because of policies you have no problem with. Hopefully MAGA fixes this country so that your opinion no longer effects the rest of us

 

[elektra]

The federal government is the worst entity in the world to try to micromanage what the private sector and free market does very well.

It is not a private sector nor free market when a state government makes goods for the entire country more expensive

 

[g5000]

Since you're opposed to debt, who did you vote for?

I know you addressed the question to pknopp, but I'd like to answer it for myself.

I stopped voting for federal level offices in 2006 precisely because both parties overspend and stopped making an effort to get it under control.

I voted on local issues and wrote in Snoopy and Pat Paulsen for high offices.

In 2016, however, I wrote in Ted Cruz to honor my mother who had recently passed. She was a Cruz supporter. I'm glad she didn't live to see what a worm-infested weasel he became.

In 2020, I voted for the Libertarian candidate. I think Libertarians are complete whackadoos, but Trump had taken the organization formerly known as the Republican Party so far off the reservation I found myself more in alignment with the LP.

I didn't move. The LP didn't move. The GOP moved. Bigly. So that's how I came to find myself suddenly closer to the LP than my former home, the GOP.

In the 2024 election, I kept my ballot as a souvenir. I didn't vote. None of these jackals have earned my vote. I don't whore myself that cheaply.

 

[g5000]

It is not a private sector nor free market when a state government makes goods for the entire country more expensive

You are going to hate JD Vance.

He's a big believer in government industrial policy.

 

[daveman]

Last time Vermin Supreme. Before that Jo Jorgenson. Jill Stein and Vermin Supreme before that.

None of those I voted for added to the debt.

Now here is where you argue that if they had they would have. And my reply is that maybe they would which would mean I would not vote to re-elect them.

Fair enough.

 

[daveman]

Especially not a risk to have people not vote for them.

Everybody's all for fiscal responsibility...until it means they don't get what they used to.

 

[daveman]

A silly argument. You have to pay for what you use.

Not paying for what you use is theft.

Do you support ending assistance to people who can work, but refuse to?

 

[daveman]

I know you addressed the question to pknopp, but I'd like to answer it for myself.

I stopped voting for federal level offices in 2006 precisely because both parties overspend and stopped making an effort to get it under control.

I voted on local issues and wrote in Snoopy and Pat Paulsen for high offices.

In 2016, however, I wrote in Ted Cruz to honor my mother who had recently passed. She was a Cruz supporter. I'm glad she didn't live to see what a worm-infested weasel he became.

In 2020, I voted for the Libertarian candidate. I think Libertarians are complete whackadoos, but Trump had taken the organization formerly known as the Republican Party so far off the reservation I found myself more in alignment with the LP.

I didn't move. The LP didn't move. The GOP moved. Bigly. So that's how I came to find myself suddenly closer to the LP than my former home, the GOP.

In the 2024 election, I kept my ballot as a souvenir. I didn't vote. None of these jackals have earned my vote. I don't whore myself that cheaply.

Okay, thanks for the input.