What has the Devil done that is really that bad?

[rightwinger]

Going by what is in the Bible, what has the Devil done that is so horrible?

God destroyed almost every living creature on earth
God killed the first born children of Egypt

What has the Devil done of that magnitude ?

Good Lord

-Geaux

Can’t name one can you?

 

[Unification]

god made man--yes?
man has murdered/destroyed/hated/raped/robbed/etc

God cannot murder. God can destroy and hate, yes. How can God rob? What do you own that God does not? Who has God raped? If you're talking about Mary, she was the "willing handmaid of the Lord" Luke 1:38

God can and does murder the innocent

Nay, a God can't murder, as murder implies legitimate killing as opposed to illegitimate nor could anyone killed by a God be innocent to begin with.

That would be akin to arguing that nature "murders" people by designing them with infinite mortal lives, which would be silly and oxymoronic.

And what is murdered anyway? When a "child is killed", no matter is destroyed, as this would violate the laws of physics - all that happens when a child dies is a group of material particles rearranging themselves into a different, nonliving form of matter.

So nothing dies or is "destroyed" from a materialistic perspective - "child" is merely a social construct.

 

[JustAnotherNut]

,how come males cannot ''choose'' not to murder

So how many have you murdered?

 

[JustAnotherNut]

Going by what is in the Bible, what has the Devil done that is so horrible?

The Devil in monotheism represents deception, or the source of "adversity" within existence, not a physical or anthropomorphic being.

The Devil is essentially, therefore, the challenge of the godly and of society to overcome in the "game of life" - one paradoxically therefore could view the Devil as "beneficial" - as without a Devil or "adversary" to overcome, there would be no reason de'tre to exist or enact social change and progress.

God destroyed almost every living creature on earth
God killed the first born children of Egypt

What has the Devil done of that magnitude ?

If one is atheist, they cannot logically assert and objection to killing, and for that matter, one could argue that materially speaking, nothing was "killed" anyway - as when one "kills" a human body, no matter or energy is actually "destroyed" - the material particles are merely arranged into a different form.

Or if for example, executing 1,000 homosexuals saved 10,000 from dying of AIDS, there would be no rational reason to object to the execution of homosexuals.

If on the other hand, one was a devout Christian, Buddhist, etc who practiced non-violence, etc they could potentially object to the mass-execution of homosexuals - but not the atheist.

Damn boy.....

You got bizarre views

No, I just express ancient views on subject.

The Devil represents adversity - adversity is 'good' in the sense that it provides meaning to life, since adversity is necessary to create versity. If there was no Devil, there could be no Angels. And if there was no Imperfect, there could be no Perfect.

No....they are bizarre

No......actually they are scientific.

 

[JustAnotherNut]

Kind of an abstract concept.

God destroyed almost every living thing on the planet. Rejecting someone who would do such an evil thing is understandable.

Seems those who wrote the Bible got to pick their side.

You think too small...…..The realm of God, and the spirit world is beyond human understanding.

You and other non-believers keep trying to fit God (category 10 hurricane) into your little box, it doesn't work

About what I expected

As a human, you cannot understand

As a human, I do understand
I understand acts that are petty and vindictive. I understand an act done out of anger, I understand unjust punishments.

If these acts were coming from a Devil, I could understand
Not when they come from a superior being

Do you have kids??? When one of them has ever disobeyed you, didn't you discipline them? To teach them a lesson? And what if the kid kept doing the wrong and each time do it in a more rebellious way? Doesn't your punishments become more strict with each deliberate wrong??? Similar idea

We do not kill our kids for correction! It's mans bible not gods! Man is responsible for his own evil! Man does not want to take responsibiilty for it so they create the devil to blame it on!

Absolutely

To set up a creature like Satan that you can blame for your own poor decisions and shortcomings is a work of man

Ya know, I never claim to know everything so let me put it to you this way...….

If you're right and there is no God, Angels, Heaven or Hell.....then when we die, we just become worm food

But if I'm right and there is...…..then I'll spend eternity laying around on fluffy white clouds with no pain or worries and full of joy and peace praising the Almighty's goodness.....not so for unbelievers who will suffer the fires of hell & damnation for eternity.

 

[Yarddog]

Going by what is in the Bible, what has the Devil done that is so horrible?

God destroyed almost every living creature on earth
God killed the first born children of Egypt

What has the Devil done of that magnitude ?

Well, there was this verse in the book of Mathew:

"And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell."

maybe there are some natural laws in place we do not understand, who knows? All the first born of Egypt and al those animals would be dead today anyway. In their physical being that is. From what i understand, the "Real Death" is having your spirit being separated from god after your physical body dies.
Now perhaps it was not this way in the begining, but maybe the "devil" figured out a way to make this separation happen. Now, if that was the case, all those stories of people being smitten down by God would pale in comparison. They would all be dead today anyway. The real enemy of your physical body is TIME itself. Anyone who thinks otherwise are completely fooling themselves.... as long as the spirit inside resides in a good place after you leave this earth is really the message of the bible I think. Reconciliation towards the next life.

Now maybe the Devil is like that high school friend who talks you into having the party at your house when your parents are out of town. He'll convince you all that matters is having a great time, and making it lively for all your friends, I mean, whats better than being popular and cool to all your buddies,.. he'll make sure to set you up with the booze and meth and whatever else.. even hire some hookers... why not? because enjoying today ..which will never be here again.... that is the most important thing. And that friend? He's the greatest guy in the whole world.... definately way cooler than your uptight old man with all those rules. It only makes sense when your feeling high.
Now, when the next day comes and your dads car is crashed into a tree around the block, your moms china set is broken, the coin collection is missing, there's a 20 sq foot hole cut out of the living room carpet , someone repainted the kitchen with paisley art, shaved the cat, put the goldfish in the freezer and you came down with syphilis from the hookers..... you can bet your friend will be nowhere to be found, and when your dad gets home there will be hell to pay. your friend (aka the devil) may not seem like such a cool guy then.
(theoreticaly speaking )))

 

[Yarddog]

That is quite a stretch

Adam and Eve acted on their own volition, just like the rest of us do.
It is called personal responsibility for our own actions

God destroyed the world
The Devil introduced temptation

Totally false. You really don't know the Bible, do you?

Splain it to me in terms of evilness

Tell you what. You put in the good faith effort. You read Genesis chapters 2 and 3. I recommend the ESV or NIV translation. They are short chapters. Read that and get back with me and then we'll discuss. If you want to debate Christians on their terms, you can expect to read their texts.

I asked what the Devil did that is so bad

You should be able to explain it without homework assignments

I believe the Devil gave mankind their freedom. Showed them how to think. God would have us all puppets worshipping his greatness. God would have us all mindless zombies in awe of his mightiness.

Oh really? and how many people do you know who GOD has forced to worship him like puppets? probably none because its only the teachings of other humans that turn people into puppets. Maybe they misunderstood something about God you think? now if what you say was true, humans would be created like puppets and not have the minds and potentials that they do have. You can look at humans and tell they were never designed to be puppets... so no, the truth is somewhere else.

 

[frigidweirdo]

Going by what is in the Bible, what has the Devil done that is so horrible?

God destroyed almost every living creature on earth
God killed the first born children of Egypt

What has the Devil done of that magnitude ?

Are we talking Trump here?

He said lying was evil. With his lying he becomes the devil based on this theory.

 

[Synthaholic]

The Devil seems to be a scapegoat for all the weaknesses of man

Anger, jealousy, rage, infidelity, lying........all are the responsibility of the human doing it........The Devil is given the blame

Just like the Pharohs son

May God have mercy on your soul

Which god?

 

[sparky]

I has always seemed to me as if God is telling us a so much that we can't understand--yet--and so He couches it in much 'coded' language.

Well that's the catch 22 Sue

Supreme beings communicating celestial doctrine to primitive man before print would seem a tedious affair.

Considering a millenia of reditors , we're looking at some serious coding





~S~

 

[rightwinger]

god made man--yes?
man has murdered/destroyed/hated/raped/robbed/etc

God cannot murder. God can destroy and hate, yes. How can God rob? What do you own that God does not? Who has God raped? If you're talking about Mary, she was the "willing handmaid of the Lord" Luke 1:38

God can and does murder the innocent

Nay, a God can't murder, as murder implies legitimate killing as opposed to illegitimate nor could anyone killed by a God be innocent to begin with.

That would be akin to arguing that nature "murders" people by designing them with infinite mortal lives, which would be silly and oxymoronic.

And what is murdered anyway? When a "child is killed", no matter is destroyed, as this would violate the laws of physics - all that happens when a child dies is a group of material particles rearranging themselves into a different, nonliving form of matter.

So nothing dies or is "destroyed" from a materialistic perspective - "child" is merely a social construct.

So all the babies, puppies and kittens killed in the Great flood were not innicent?

Who wants to worship a God that drowns puppies and kittens?

 

[rightwinger]

Going by what is in the Bible, what has the Devil done that is so horrible?

God destroyed almost every living creature on earth
God killed the first born children of Egypt

What has the Devil done of that magnitude ?

Well, there was this verse in the book of Mathew:

"And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell."

maybe there are some natural laws in place we do not understand, who knows? All the first born of Egypt and al those animals would be dead today anyway. In their physical being that is. From what i understand, the "Real Death" is having your spirit being separated from god after your physical body dies.
Now perhaps it was not this way in the begining, but maybe the "devil" figured out a way to make this separation happen. Now, if that was the case, all those stories of people being smitten down by God would pale in comparison. They would all be dead today anyway. The real enemy of your physical body is TIME itself. Anyone who thinks otherwise are completely fooling themselves.... as long as the spirit inside resides in a good place after you leave this earth is really the message of the bible I think. Reconciliation towards the next life.

Now maybe the Devil is like that high school friend who talks you into having the party at your house when your parents are out of town. He'll convince you all that matters is having a great time, and making it lively for all your friends, I mean, whats better than being popular and cool to all your buddies,.. he'll make sure to set you up with the booze and meth and whatever else.. even hire some hookers... why not? because enjoying today ..which will never be here again.... that is the most important thing. And that friend? He's the greatest guy in the whole world.... definately way cooler than your uptight old man with all those rules. It only makes sense when your feeling high.
Now, when the next day comes and your dads car is crashed into a tree around the block, your moms china set is broken, the coin collection is missing, there's a 20 sq foot hole cut out of the living room carpet , someone repainted the kitchen with paisley art, shaved the cat, put the goldfish in the freezer and you came down with syphilis from the hookers..... you can bet your friend will be nowhere to be found, and when your dad gets home there will be hell to pay. your friend (aka the devil) may not seem like such a cool guy then.
(theoreticaly speaking )))

All the first born of Egypt and al those animals would be dead today anyway.


Isn’t that an excuse for all murders?

 

[Slyhunter]

You think too small...…..The realm of God, and the spirit world is beyond human understanding.

You and other non-believers keep trying to fit God (category 10 hurricane) into your little box, it doesn't work

About what I expected

As a human, you cannot understand

As a human, I do understand
I understand acts that are petty and vindictive. I understand an act done out of anger, I understand unjust punishments.

If these acts were coming from a Devil, I could understand
Not when they come from a superior being

Do you have kids??? When one of them has ever disobeyed you, didn't you discipline them? To teach them a lesson? And what if the kid kept doing the wrong and each time do it in a more rebellious way? Doesn't your punishments become more strict with each deliberate wrong??? Similar idea

We do not kill our kids for correction! It's mans bible not gods! Man is responsible for his own evil! Man does not want to take responsibiilty for it so they create the devil to blame it on!

Absolutely

To set up a creature like Satan that you can blame for your own poor decisions and shortcomings is a work of man

Ya know, I never claim to know everything so let me put it to you this way...….

If you're right and there is no God, Angels, Heaven or Hell.....then when we die, we just become worm food

But if I'm right and there is...…..then I'll spend eternity laying around on fluffy white clouds with no pain or worries and full of joy and peace praising the Almighty's goodness.....not so for unbelievers who will suffer the fires of hell & damnation for eternity.

If Muslims are right they'll be eating plenty and having 72 virgins. While you and I rot.
If Vikings are right, they'll be drinking mead in Valhalla, while we end up in Hades.
If.
I believe in the soul. I believe when this body dies I'll rise up. The real me. And join all the others in space. Whether it's a friendly greeting, one froth with competition, or horror, I don't know yet.

 

[SweetSue92]

I has always seemed to me as if God is telling us a so much that we can't understand--yet--and so He couches it in much 'coded' language.

Well that's the catch 22 Sue

Supreme beings communicating celestial doctrine to primitive man before print would seem a tedious affair.

Considering a millenia of reditors , we're looking at some serious coding





~S~

How many books of antiquity have you read, really? "primitive".

 

[SweetSue92]

About what I expected

As a human, you cannot understand

As a human, I do understand
I understand acts that are petty and vindictive. I understand an act done out of anger, I understand unjust punishments.

If these acts were coming from a Devil, I could understand
Not when they come from a superior being

Do you have kids??? When one of them has ever disobeyed you, didn't you discipline them? To teach them a lesson? And what if the kid kept doing the wrong and each time do it in a more rebellious way? Doesn't your punishments become more strict with each deliberate wrong??? Similar idea

We do not kill our kids for correction! It's mans bible not gods! Man is responsible for his own evil! Man does not want to take responsibiilty for it so they create the devil to blame it on!

Absolutely

To set up a creature like Satan that you can blame for your own poor decisions and shortcomings is a work of man

Ya know, I never claim to know everything so let me put it to you this way...….

If you're right and there is no God, Angels, Heaven or Hell.....then when we die, we just become worm food

But if I'm right and there is...…..then I'll spend eternity laying around on fluffy white clouds with no pain or worries and full of joy and peace praising the Almighty's goodness.....not so for unbelievers who will suffer the fires of hell & damnation for eternity.

If Muslims are right they'll be eating plenty and having 72 virgins. While you and I rot.
If Vikings are right, they'll be drinking mead in Valhalla, while we end up in Hades.
If.
I believe in the soul. I believe when this body dies I'll rise up. The real me. And join all the others in space. Whether it's a friendly greeting, one froth with competition, or horror, I don't know yet.

Okay, you've dismissed Christianity and Islam. You're write to base the Viking myths but that's another story.

On what basis do you believe your own story? What are the facts in evidence for your belief?

 

[Slyhunter]

Do you have kids??? When one of them has ever disobeyed you, didn't you discipline them? To teach them a lesson? And what if the kid kept doing the wrong and each time do it in a more rebellious way? Doesn't your punishments become more strict with each deliberate wrong??? Similar idea

We do not kill our kids for correction! It's mans bible not gods! Man is responsible for his own evil! Man does not want to take responsibiilty for it so they create the devil to blame it on!

Absolutely

To set up a creature like Satan that you can blame for your own poor decisions and shortcomings is a work of man

Ya know, I never claim to know everything so let me put it to you this way...….

If you're right and there is no God, Angels, Heaven or Hell.....then when we die, we just become worm food

But if I'm right and there is...…..then I'll spend eternity laying around on fluffy white clouds with no pain or worries and full of joy and peace praising the Almighty's goodness.....not so for unbelievers who will suffer the fires of hell & damnation for eternity.

If Muslims are right they'll be eating plenty and having 72 virgins. While you and I rot.
If Vikings are right, they'll be drinking mead in Valhalla, while we end up in Hades.
If.
I believe in the soul. I believe when this body dies I'll rise up. The real me. And join all the others in space. Whether it's a friendly greeting, one froth with competition, or horror, I don't know yet.

Okay, you've dismissed Christianity and Islam. You're write to base the Viking myths but that's another story.

On what basis do you believe your own story? What are the facts in evidence for your belief?

Anecdotal. Nothing that would convince you I'm right so I won't bother trying.

 

[SweetSue92]

We do not kill our kids for correction! It's mans bible not gods! Man is responsible for his own evil! Man does not want to take responsibiilty for it so they create the devil to blame it on!

Absolutely

To set up a creature like Satan that you can blame for your own poor decisions and shortcomings is a work of man

Ya know, I never claim to know everything so let me put it to you this way...….

If you're right and there is no God, Angels, Heaven or Hell.....then when we die, we just become worm food

But if I'm right and there is...…..then I'll spend eternity laying around on fluffy white clouds with no pain or worries and full of joy and peace praising the Almighty's goodness.....not so for unbelievers who will suffer the fires of hell & damnation for eternity.

If Muslims are right they'll be eating plenty and having 72 virgins. While you and I rot.
If Vikings are right, they'll be drinking mead in Valhalla, while we end up in Hades.
If.
I believe in the soul. I believe when this body dies I'll rise up. The real me. And join all the others in space. Whether it's a friendly greeting, one froth with competition, or horror, I don't know yet.

Okay, you've dismissed Christianity and Islam. You're write to base the Viking myths but that's another story.

On what basis do you believe your own story? What are the facts in evidence for your belief?

Anecdotal. Nothing that would convince you I'm right so I won't bother trying.

So there are no facts and evidence in support of your worldview other than maybe some "personal experiences". You just believe it, and that's enough.

Listen, you do you--I mean that. You have every right to believe what you want as long as you're not hurting anyone. But your assertion here would have been entirely ignored, not offensive to anyone, while when Christians make assertions backed up by PLENTY of facts and evidence, it's scoffed at and mocked.

Just pointing out that difference.

 

[dave p]

Going by what is in the Bible, what has the Devil done that is so horrible?

God destroyed almost every living creature on earth
God killed the first born children of Egypt

What has the Devil done of that magnitude ?

Religion is a scam. More death and destruction has been done in the name of religion than anything else.

 

[Yarddog]

Going by what is in the Bible, what has the Devil done that is so horrible?

God destroyed almost every living creature on earth
God killed the first born children of Egypt

What has the Devil done of that magnitude ?

Well, there was this verse in the book of Mathew:

"And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell."

maybe there are some natural laws in place we do not understand, who knows? All the first born of Egypt and al those animals would be dead today anyway. In their physical being that is. From what i understand, the "Real Death" is having your spirit being separated from god after your physical body dies.
Now perhaps it was not this way in the begining, but maybe the "devil" figured out a way to make this separation happen. Now, if that was the case, all those stories of people being smitten down by God would pale in comparison. They would all be dead today anyway. The real enemy of your physical body is TIME itself. Anyone who thinks otherwise are completely fooling themselves.... as long as the spirit inside resides in a good place after you leave this earth is really the message of the bible I think. Reconciliation towards the next life.

Now maybe the Devil is like that high school friend who talks you into having the party at your house when your parents are out of town. He'll convince you all that matters is having a great time, and making it lively for all your friends, I mean, whats better than being popular and cool to all your buddies,.. he'll make sure to set you up with the booze and meth and whatever else.. even hire some hookers... why not? because enjoying today ..which will never be here again.... that is the most important thing. And that friend? He's the greatest guy in the whole world.... definately way cooler than your uptight old man with all those rules. It only makes sense when your feeling high.
Now, when the next day comes and your dads car is crashed into a tree around the block, your moms china set is broken, the coin collection is missing, there's a 20 sq foot hole cut out of the living room carpet , someone repainted the kitchen with paisley art, shaved the cat, put the goldfish in the freezer and you came down with syphilis from the hookers..... you can bet your friend will be nowhere to be found, and when your dad gets home there will be hell to pay. your friend (aka the devil) may not seem like such a cool guy then.
(theoreticaly speaking )))

All the first born of Egypt and al those animals would be dead today anyway.


Isn’t that an excuse for all murders?

Well, there is something to be said about that especialy looking at it from the human perspective. But what if God is an eternal being who can actually see beyond what we can see, and then from god's perspective if he can see that life on this earth is only a passing phase into something else ... it may not be murder at all. Theoretically speaking, this life could be some sort of training ground.
Of course if it WAS true that the devil somehow played a part in separating humans from god in the next life, then yes he may be the one jumping up and down, pointing a finger at god and saying "Yeah see.... That god is much worse than me, I only want you to have a good time, but he's the real monster here, he's the murderer"
Basicaly as described in the bible... the Devil is somewhat of a deceiver and pretty much uses a lot of your arguments.

 

[rightwinger]

Going by what is in the Bible, what has the Devil done that is so horrible?

God destroyed almost every living creature on earth
God killed the first born children of Egypt

What has the Devil done of that magnitude ?

Well, there was this verse in the book of Mathew:

"And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell."

maybe there are some natural laws in place we do not understand, who knows? All the first born of Egypt and al those animals would be dead today anyway. In their physical being that is. From what i understand, the "Real Death" is having your spirit being separated from god after your physical body dies.
Now perhaps it was not this way in the begining, but maybe the "devil" figured out a way to make this separation happen. Now, if that was the case, all those stories of people being smitten down by God would pale in comparison. They would all be dead today anyway. The real enemy of your physical body is TIME itself. Anyone who thinks otherwise are completely fooling themselves.... as long as the spirit inside resides in a good place after you leave this earth is really the message of the bible I think. Reconciliation towards the next life.

Now maybe the Devil is like that high school friend who talks you into having the party at your house when your parents are out of town. He'll convince you all that matters is having a great time, and making it lively for all your friends, I mean, whats better than being popular and cool to all your buddies,.. he'll make sure to set you up with the booze and meth and whatever else.. even hire some hookers... why not? because enjoying today ..which will never be here again.... that is the most important thing. And that friend? He's the greatest guy in the whole world.... definately way cooler than your uptight old man with all those rules. It only makes sense when your feeling high.
Now, when the next day comes and your dads car is crashed into a tree around the block, your moms china set is broken, the coin collection is missing, there's a 20 sq foot hole cut out of the living room carpet , someone repainted the kitchen with paisley art, shaved the cat, put the goldfish in the freezer and you came down with syphilis from the hookers..... you can bet your friend will be nowhere to be found, and when your dad gets home there will be hell to pay. your friend (aka the devil) may not seem like such a cool guy then.
(theoreticaly speaking )))

All the first born of Egypt and al those animals would be dead today anyway.


Isn’t that an excuse for all murders?

Well, there is something to be said about that especialy looking at it from the human perspective. But what if God is an eternal being who can actually see beyond what we can see, and then from god's perspective if he can see that life on this earth is only a passing phase into something else ... it may not be murder at all. Theoretically speaking, this life could be some sort of training ground.
Of course if it WAS true that the devil somehow played a part in separating humans from god in the next life, then yes he may be the one jumping up and down, pointing a finger at god and saying "Yeah see.... That god is much worse than me, I only want you to have a good time, but he's the real monster here, he's the murderer"
Basicaly as described in the bible... the Devil is somewhat of a deceiver and pretty much uses a lot of your arguments.

If we can excuse the excesses of God as.....humans just can’t understand

Why can’t we do the same for the Devil......we are incapable of understanding

I still do t see what he did that was so horrible in the Bible