Zone1 What has been Lost, What has been Gained?

[forkintheroad7]

Probably at least in part because of my family. You can’t wave a hand in either side of my family without hitting at least two church workers…. Pastors, choir members, church musicians, church school teachers, elders, etc…

That meant growing up spending most as much time in the church building as I did at school. It also meant a major expectation of personal investment of time, money and energy into the church upon becoming an adult. As I grew up my personal beliefs and experiences began to differ from the message the church was offering. That left me questioning things, and therefore not being as accepted in a church body that doesn’t exactly believe in questioning things.

I have some good/bad news for you: This kind of thing happens in EVERY community or certainly every Church (or church) community I have been in. You cannot question certain things AND you cannot be too knowledgeable about certain things. I went to a Sedevacantist Catholic Church once and quoted a scripture (this was in the social hour after Mass). A woman hearing what I said questioned that that was actually in the Bible, but I don't quote the Bible unless something really is there in it. So then she started having a negative attitude toward me, even though she didn't have her Bible handy to dispute what I was saying. She is no longer speaking to me. I don't know if THAT (what I just said) is the reason or not (for her not speaking to or emailing me), but I just shook my head and said to myself "So much for charity... I thought Christianity was supposed to be primarily about charity.. you know.. like it appears to be the primary thing with Jesus?!" Or am I missing something? I mean... you ditch someone completely for THIS kind of thing?! Wow..

So yeh, I'm not happy with any of the 3 branches of Catholicism we have today. We have 2 of them because the Vatican (the alleged 3rd one) went off the rails decades ago-- that one is NOT Catholic anymore... Need proof? One word: Francis... and he's not the only one.. I could go on all day but I won't... See Novus Ordo Watch website for details on the Tragedy of Losing the Vatican

 

[forkintheroad7]

I think of God as an 'absentee landlord' at this time in history. He going to let this kettle boil until just before it boils over.

I've had the same thought. He gives us all the rope we need to hang our dumbass selves

 

[Woodznutz]

I've had the same thought. He gives us all the rope we need to hang our dumbass selves

And it's not all about the hereafter. When God first told man to choose good over evil there was no promise of eternal life, just a good life or a bad life on earth.

 

[forkintheroad7]

Family of murdered woman react to Biden commuting killer's death sentence: ‘So frustrating!’ | Fox News Video

Donna Major’s husband Danny Major and daughter Heather Turner join ‘The Ingraham Angle’ with reaction to President Biden commuting several federal death sentences.

www.foxnews.com

Check out comments about the "pope" so called at Point 6:50 which I TOTALLY agree with. The Catholic Church is not against the death penalty. But thanks to fakers in the Vatican (last several decades), the Catholic Faith does not abide there anymore (to say the least). The Vatican teaching on the death penalty is seen as "Catholic" by people like this hurting family in the sited video above.. But the TRUE Catholic teaching is just the opposite.

 

[forkintheroad7]

And it's not all about the hereafter. When God first told man to choose good over evil there was no promise of eternal life, just a good life or a bad life on earth.

Well, I wasn't there when God told man to choose good from evil. There's abundant evidence, however, of how man chose! That is clear to anyone who is not brain dead. The thing is, it is the most logical thing in the world to believe in an afterlife, mainly because this life, in myriad ways sucks. There is little justice to be found on Planet E. That seems to more than adequately imply that justice is to be found in the Next realm or not at all. The Not at All option does not make sense and would lead to atheism because if God is not just, He is not good and we are told He is good

 

[TNHarley]

I've learned more about the Old Testament by studying commentaries of Jewish scholars and rabbis.

In other words, you follow what other people say and not "gods word"

 

[TNHarley]

What has been lost by being agnostic? Nothing
What has been gained? Freedom, ambition to learn, a bit more objective than most religious people.

 

[Meriweather]

In other words, you follow what other people say and not "gods word"

If you like. I call it studying the word of God, because this way, history, culture, etymology are all brought in.

Are you one who feels reading the Bible on his/her own is the best way to follow God's word?

 

[TNHarley]

If you like. I call it studying the word of God, because this way, history, culture, etymology are all brought in.

Are you one who feels reading the Bible on his/her own is the best way to follow God's word?

Yes, Anyone with a brain would assume going by gods word is better than humans. Unless you dont see the bible as gods word.
Its like the debate over the constitution. Should we go by what it actually says, or what some pundit or pol says?

 

[Meriweather]

Yes, Anyone with a brain would assume going by gods word is better than humans.

My brain isn't human as well?

 

[Seymour Flops]

I have a hard time, figuring out what protestants lost by breaking away from the Catholic Church. I know a lot of them were burned at the stake. I guess they lost their lives if you look at it that way.

 

[forkintheroad7]

I have a hard time, figuring out what protestants lost by breaking away from the Catholic Church. I know a lot of them were burned at the stake. I guess they lost their lives if you look at it that way.

This looks like another twisted version of history taught by Protestants who hate the Catholic Church.. seen plenty of that in my time. That said, What is in the Vatican right now is not Catholic and really should be rejected by both C and P. Real Catholicism cannot be destroyed, however, because Jesus said His Church will withstand the very gates of Hell (mt 16:18). The Protestants lost a lot by separating themselves from the Church Christ founded. But I won't go on and on about that because protestants (they are the majority here) do not listen, and it's a sin to waste time.

 

[Meriweather]

I have a hard time, figuring out what protestants lost by breaking away from the Catholic Church. I know a lot of them were burned at the stake. I guess they lost their lives if you look at it that way.

Sacraments. Saints. Biblical understanding (Catholics read through the Bible every three years). Christ's true presence in the Eucharist.

 

[Seymour Flops]

Sacraments. Saints. Biblical understanding (Catholics read through the Bible every three years). Christ's true presence in the Eucharist.

I'd put a typical Baptist's bible reading efforts against a typical Catholic's, and a devout Baptist againt a devout Catholic. IOW, bible study is certainly not limited to one religion. Nor is "understanding" as each of us understand the Bible in our own way. Even a Catholic who professes to only interpret the Bible as taught by the Church is making a personal decision to do so.

We did the Lord's supper in my Baptist church. Whenever there was a "month of Sundays," i.e. a month with five Sundays, we would do it on the fifth.

We understood it to be symbolic of Jesus sacrifice of his physical blood and body. I don't think any of us thought the grape juice (Baptists don't drink) turned into the actual blood, nor the bread into actual body of Jesus.

Come to think of it, for some protestants, they did lose the drinking of alcohol. That's what put me off of the Baptist religion since the Bible forbids drunkeness, not all consumption of alcohol. I believe that alcohol is a part of God's bounty, but I also believe it is a work product and that productive work is a holy act.

But plenty of protestant churches have a responsible drinking policy, so it wasn't a loss that came about by separating from Rome.

I'll give you saints, though. Five years ago, I had esophogeal cancer, and one of my Catholic friends gave me a St Blaise medal (patron saint of throat ailments). I damn sure wore it every day until my cancer was declared gone, and then I framed it and hung it over my bed.

 

[Seymour Flops]

This looks like another twisted version of history taught by Protestants who hate the Catholic Church.. seen plenty of that in my time. That said, What is in the Vatican right now is not Catholic and really should be rejected by both C and P. Real Catholicism cannot be destroyed, however, because Jesus said His Church will withstand the very gates of Hell (mt 16:18). The Protestants lost a lot by separating themselves from the Church Christ founded. But I won't go on and on about that because protestants (they are the majority here) do not listen, and it's a sin to waste time.

No protestants were burned at the stake? The history of "Bloody Mary" is a lie?

 

[Woodznutz]

What has been lost by being agnostic? Nothing
What has been gained? Freedom, ambition to learn, a bit more objective than most religious people.

You wouldn't ask a plumber to go to college to study the ToE, would you? We actually need more tradespeople than evolutionary scientists, objectively speaking.

 

[Woodznutz]

Yes, Anyone with a brain would assume going by gods word is better than humans. Unless you dont see the bible as gods word.
Its like the debate over the constitution. Should we go by what it actually says, or what some pundit or pol says?

The believer is led by the Spirit.

 

[TNHarley]

My brain isn't human as well?

So you trust humans over gods word?

 

[Meriweather]

So you trust humans over gods word?

Not what I said. First, I do not believe God penned or dictated the Bible. He did not put anyone into a trance. Men wrote the words of the Bible. The accounts, written by man were indeed inspired by God. God's inspiration is not, was not, limited to only those whose scrolls were gathered into what today is thought of as one book, the Bible. The etymology of 'Bible' is a library of books, poems, songs, history, folklore, biographies, letters.

Are you one who takes every word of the Bible literally?

 

[Moonglow]

What has been lost by Protestants leaving the Catholic Church? What has been gained?

What has been lost by Christianity leaving Judaism? What has been gained?

What has been lost by being atheist? What has been gained?


Starting with Christianity leaving Judaism, was has been lost is a true understanding of the Old Testament. I've learned more about the Old Testament by studying commentaries of Jewish scholars and rabbis. In losing this understanding, we also miss some of the beauty of the New Testament.

You left out the Eastern Orthodox Church it left earlier than the Protestants.