Were the Confederates traitors

[IM2]

Really? You mean lower Gas Prices? Closing the Border? Fighting Crime? Less inflation? Better Trade deals? Bombing Irans Nukes? Making NATO pay up? --As to the Lefties--Burning things down--Killing Cops-- Protecting Criminals-- And Bitching ,Bitching BITCHING!

Gas prices aren't lower. The borders are not closed. You can't fight crime with a convicted felon as president. We haven't had better trade deals. NATO countries have always paid, not all of them have been able to afford the 2 percent, and it doesn't look like we got rid of Iran's nuclear program. The left had done none of what you said. Cops wre killing citizens, which caused the protests. The burning was also done by right-wingers. The right has done the bitching and you are protecting a criminal in the white house.

 

[Seymour Flops]

You can’t separate the Nazis from the Holocaust. You can’t say I oppose the Holocaust but support the Nazis

Same goes for the Confederacy. You can’t say you oppose slavery and wave the Rebel flag

Apples and Oranges.

It was not a freedom-loving abolitionist nation that invaded the Confederate States of America. It was the United States of America that invaded them.

Yes, the same United States that enshrined slavery in its Constitution and made each "African" born in America legally 3/5 of a person. The same United States who still had legal slavery among its remaining states, and who deliberately left those states who kept slaves but fought for the Union out of the much ballyhoo'd Emancipation Proclaimation.

The Union won, and Texas and the Southern states agreed to be a loyal and equal part of the United States, honoring the post-Civil War amendment. They proved that loyalty over and over in the nearly 150 years since. Trying to revive regional strife is a divisive and fruitless effort, as shown by the fact that the monument destroyers lost so soundly in 2024. They didn't want their own slave states to lose the enslaved labor when they were also sending their young men to the battlefields.

But . . . if getting rid of history is so important to you, you might pause your endless rambling on message boards and try to help Your Party (or "not my party") to figure out how to get back to winning elections again.

 

[rightwinger]

Yes, the same United States that enshrined slavery in its Constitution and made each "African" born in America legally 3/5 of a person. The same United States who still had legal slavery among its remaining states, and who deliberately left those states who kept slaves but fought for the Union out of the much ballyhoo'd Emancipation Proclaimation.

You guys keep trying to pull that shit to justify the Confederacy

Yes, our Constitution allowed slavery.
But it was the same wretched states who formed the Confederacy that insisted it be allowed in the Constitution.

Confederacy= Nazi Germany

 

[rightwinger]

made each "African" born in America legally 3/5 of a person.

No, they were not legally 3/5 a person
They did not have 3/5 the rights of other persons
They were property

States were able to count them 3/5 in terms of assigning representatives in Congress

Those 3/5 additional congressmen did not represent the slaves, they represented those who enslaved them

 

[Unkotare]

But what if it were a state? What then—...

But what if you were a flying pig? What then--

 

[Unkotare]

...

Also, what if the Hispanic population in the Southwest grew so large that they decided they wanted to secede from the United States and join Mexico? ...

That would be illegal and traitors would be dealt with as traitors are. Just like last time.

 

[Seymour Flops]

You guys keep trying to pull that shit to justify the Confederacy

It is true or not?

Yes, our Constitution allowed slavery.
But it was the same wretched states who formed the Confederacy that insisted it be allowed in the Constitution.

Right, and the same states that invaded the Confederate States that agreed to put it in.

Confederacy= Nazi Germany

The Confederacy was Nazis, Trump is a Nazi, both Bushes were Nazis, Ann Coulter is a Nazi, Mike Pence was a Nazi, until he opposed Trump over Jan 6th, at which time your media de-Nazified him and he became a hero.

You guys seriously need some new material.

No, they were not legally 3/5 a person
They did not have 3/5 the rights of other persons
They were property

States were able to count them 3/5 in terms of assigning representatives in Congress

Those 3/5 additional congressmen did not represent the slaves, they represented those who enslaved them

Yes, fair point. They were 0/5 of a person, according to the United States and that had not changed in the slightest when the U.S. of A invaded the C.S. of A.

That invasion was not about slavery, no matter how much you now wish it had been.

 

[Robert W]

Yes, fair point. They were 0/5 of a person, according to the United States and that had not changed in the slightest when the U.S. of A invaded the C.S. of A.

That invasion was not about slavery, no matter how much you now wish it had been.

There is historical proof Abe invaded VA. National monuments show it not far from Manassas, VA There is proof said by Abe he did not invade due to slavery.

 

[toobfreak]

Were the Confederates traitors?​

To what? The North? The country was founded on self-governance and autonomy, so technically, the North violated their rights when they refused to allow them to secede from the union and forced them to join.

When they drafted the DOI and Constitution, they made many concessions in order to get all 13 colonies to sign aboard.

Technically, what the North did to keep the South was essentially the very thing our Founders fought England over and chose to break away from them to get away from.

 

[Unkotare]

...

It was not a freedom-loving abolitionist nation that invaded the Confederate States of America. ...

No one invaded the so-called "confederate states." The "confederacy" never existed. The traitors started their insurrection by attacking a US federal installation.

 

[rightwinger]

The Confederacy was Nazis, Trump is a Nazi, both Bushes were Nazis, Ann Coulter is a Nazi, Mike Pence was a Nazi, until he opposed Trump over Jan 6th, at which time your media de-Nazified him and he became a hero.

The Confederacy is part of a rogues gallery of nations that existed by exploiting the human rights of its citizens. 4 million of their 9 million population were slaves

Nazi Germany is also one of those nations

 

[Seymour Flops]

No one invaded the so-called "confederate states." The "confederacy" never existed. The traitors started their insurrection by attacking a US federal installation.

That the confederacy did not exist is a silly and counter-factual argument.

 

[rightwinger]

That invasion was not about slavery, no matter how much you now wish it had been

Any way you try to spin it
The Civil War was fought over slavery

The south seceded because of slavery.
Everything that followed was because of that decision

 

[Seymour Flops]

The Confederacy is part of a rogues gallery of nations that existed by exploiting the human rights of its citizens. 4 million of their 9 million population were slaves

Nazi Germany is also one of those nations

Is the United States, who had slavery enshrined in their Constitution for almost 80 years?

 

[Unkotare]

That the confederacy did not exist is a silly and counter-factual argument.

Name one country in the world that ever recognized it as an independent nation. You can go in your closet, close the door and declare it "a nation," but that won't make it one and if you have to be dragged out of there and beaten like a dog you have nothing to complain about.

 

[Unkotare]

The Confederacy is part of a rogues gallery of nations that existed by exploiting the human rights of its citizens. ...

No it's not, because it was never a real nation.

 

[Seymour Flops]

Name one country in the world that ever recognized it as an independent nation. You can go in your closet, close the door and declare it "a nation," but that won't make it one and if you have to be dragged out of there and beaten like a dog you have nothing to complain about.

Recognized or not, it was still a nation. Captured Confederates were not given criminal trials, they were put in prisoner of war camps.

But you didn't say that it wasn't a nation, you said that it did not exist, which is silly.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

I agree. And the 10th Amendment gives every state the right to secede.

Jeff Davis was arrested and sent to prison where he stayed for two years awaiting his trial for treason. His trial was well known and publicized that the North would show the world what they do to traitors. It would be a trial to prove that secession was treason and they would hang Jeff Davis from a sour apple tree.

Then a problem arose. The prosecution started looking into the case instead of just going on their biased northern feelings of revenge. And then they backed off. This occurred several times as the North kept getting other prosecutors. They told the prisident, Johnson at that time, that you have your military victory. Don't take a chance on this trial and stain that victory with a not guilty verdict for Davis.

Now they were in a dilemma. What to do with Jeff Davis. Through a dog and pony show they figured out how 'legaly' to set Jeff Davis free and it not appear they were responisble.

Thus, the most hated man in the North went free after all those boasts of trying him and secession in a real court of law.

In other words, When they set Jeff Davis free, this was an admission that he and the South was right. Neither he or the South were traitors.

But somebody was. The North.

Quantrill

I am curious as how you settled on your username, especially since we are discussing the Civil War. Care to share? Where are you from?

 

[Robert W]

The Confederacy is part of a rogues gallery of nations that existed by exploiting the human rights of its citizens. 4 million of their 9 million population were slaves

Nazi Germany is also one of those nations

That is what happens when Democrats take things over.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

The entire territory of the American Civil War was The UNITED States of America. The so-called "confederacy" was NEVER a separate nation.

Great Britain did, but never formally.