Unsealed Trump Search Warrant - Trump had classified Documents

[AntonToo]

Doesn't matter.
It means the docs being there was legal.

No it doesn't. Presidential records do not belong to ex-presidents, they belong to National Archives, who have been trying to get them back since 2021.

Trump violated the Presidential Records Act by refusing to turn them over, even without much more serious classification issues.

 

[Rigby5]

Of course it's meaningless.

Warrant does not somehow disapear retroactively if after raid Trump suddenly claims that he declassified everything in his head.

Everything given to any president is automatically declassified to that president, forever.
He can make copies, move them, allow access by subordinates, etc., as he wants.
As soon as the docs were given to him, they were declassified to him and whatever subordinates he chooses.
He does not have to do anything to officially declassify them to him or his appointed subordinates.
He CAN officially declassify them, but that is only if he wants them to become open to the public.

 

[Rigby5]

No it doesn't. Presidential records do not belong to ex-presidents, they belong to National Archives, who have been trying to get them back since 2021.

Trump violated the Presidential Records Act by refusing to turn them over, even without much more serious classification issues.

Wrong.
The docs a president decides to turn over to NARA are up to him and there is no deadline.
The docs given to a president are totally up the president if he wants to copy, destroy, classify, declassify, or whatever.
The only legal basis for NARA to insist is the FOIA, and that would only imply criminal offenses if a president were to try to hide evidence of wrong doing.
It is not at all illegal for a president to destroy personal documents, redundant junk, something too classified for NARA, etc.
The president retains his individual right to privacy if he so wishes.

 

[AntonToo]

Wrong.
The docs a president decides to turn over to NARA are up to him and there is no deadline.
The docs given to a president are totally up the president if he wants to copy, destroy, classify, declassify, or whatever.

...and in your expert opinion, what would you say is the purpose of the Presidential Records Act?


What do you THINK, this means:

PRA changed the legal ownership of the President's official records from private to public, and established a new statutory structure under which Presidents must manage their records.

The PRA requires the President to ensure preservation of records documenting the performance of his official duties (44 U.S.C. § 2203(a)), provides for the National Archives and Records Administration (NARA) to take custody and control of the records (44 U.S.C. § 2203(g))

 

[Flopper]

That's not what's going on here.
These fuckers are trying to make what other presidents did in the past a crime if Trump does it. Mkay?
They criminalize everything that he does.

There are policies, procedures, and laws to be followed by the president. Trump of course does what he always does, whatever he wants to do. He knew that the presidential documents were not his too keep. The Director of the National Achieves meets with each new president to explain this and the procedures to be followed in record keeping so presidential transitions are orderly and in accordance with the law.

In the months following Trump's departure from office, the Director's staff contacted Mar A Lago many times asking for the documents. In May the Director send a letter to Trump demanding the documents be returned. Trump does nothing. In the fall of 2021, the Director sends another letter and nothing happens. When it becomes clear to Trump that the DOJ is going get involved, he sends 30 boxes to the National Achieves but retains at least a dozen.

I believe the DOJ involvement, the search and all of this could have been avoided had the Director made an appointment with Trump in Feb 2021 and explained to him how badly they needed those records and how important they will be to his presidentially library. In others words plead with Trump and ask him nicely to return the records. Judging from his past, I think Trump would have told his staff to box up everything and return it and we would not be having this discussion today. Trump does not respond well to demands and threats.

 

[Flopper]

Wrong.
The docs a president decides to turn over to NARA are up to him and there is no deadline.
The docs given to a president are totally up the president if he wants to copy, destroy, classify, declassify, or whatever.
The only legal basis for NARA to insist is the FOIA, and that would only imply criminal offenses if a president were to try to hide evidence of wrong doing.
It is not at all illegal for a president to destroy personal documents, redundant junk, something too classified for NARA, etc.
The president retains his individual right to privacy if he so wishes.

Prior to the Presidential Records of 1978, presidential records belong to the president. That changed beginning with the Reagan administration.

The PRA changed the legal ownership of the official records of the President from private to public, and established a new statutory structure under which Presidents, and subsequently NARA, must manage the records of their Administrations. Also the PRA required that personal records be stored separately from presidential records. An the Classification Act required that classified documents be stored and secured separately for other records.

So it should have been very clear in the presidential transition, as to what is to sent to Mar A Lago, the NARA storage facility in Chicago, and the NARA classified document storage in Maryland.

Presidential Records Act (PRA) of 1978

The Presidential Records Act (PRA) of 1978, 44 U.S.C. ß2201-2209, governs the official records of Presidents and Vice Presidents that were created or received after January 20, 1981 (i.e., beginning with the Reagan Administration). The PRA changed the legal ownership of the official records of...

www.archives.gov

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Well looks like we have another nutter that hasn't actually read the link.

READ IT. Reconcile it with your claims, then post.

Crazy idea, I know.

the server was wiped AFTER the subpoena dumbass as to the phones there is a dispute when they got smashed.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

No it doesn't. Presidential records do not belong to ex-presidents, they belong to National Archives, who have been trying to get them back since 2021.

Trump violated the Presidential Records Act by refusing to turn them over, even without much more serious classification issues.

again for the slow and stupid there is no punishment for that in the law. no crime was committed to warrant an FBI raid

 

[AntonToo]

the server was wiped AFTER the subpoena dumbass as to the phones there is a dispute when they got smashed.

Emails were erased (not "server wiped"). Not by Clinton, but by her IT management, who failed to follow Clinton's 60 day retention policy she set forth well before subpoena was issued.

So what did Clinton refuse to provide? Nothing is the correct answer.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Emails were erased (not "server wiped"). Not by Clinton, but by her IT management, who failed to follow Clinton's 60 day retention policy she set forth well before subpoena was issued.

So what did Clinton refuse to provide? Nothing is the correct answer.

she illegally wiped the server AFTER ordered to turn it over retard. And she lied about emails being unclassified and having turned in all work related ones as well.

 

[Flopper]

Prior to the Presidential Records of 1978, presidential records belong to the president. That changed beginning with the Reagan administration.

The PRA changed the legal ownership of the official records of the President from private to public, and established a new statutory structure under which Presidents, and subsequently NARA, must manage the records of their Administrations The current president is made responsible for turning over records that the new president will need. Also the PRA required that personal records be stored separately from presidential records. And the Classification Act required that classified documents be stored and secured separately for other records.

So it should have been very clear in the presidential transition, as to what is to sent to Mar A Lago, the NARA storage facility in Chicago, and the NARA classified document storage in Maryland.

Presidential Records Act (PRA) of 1978

The Presidential Records Act (PRA) of 1978, 44 U.S.C. ß2201-2209, governs the official records of Presidents and Vice Presidents that were created or received after January 20, 1981 (i.e., beginning with the Reagan Administration). The PRA changed the legal ownership of the official records of...

www.archives.gov

 

[AntonToo]

she illegally wiped the server AFTER ordered to turn it over retard.

Can you quote that in the link provided?

There is nothing supporting what you've just said. It's just a fantasy in your head.

 

[BWK]

It seems every Trump transgression becomes more serious. It's like he's playing catch me if you can. This time he may have gone just one step too far for his lawyers to save him.

He knows he's gone to far, so let me turn my dogs out.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Can you quote that in the link provided?

There is nothing supporting what you've just said. It's just a fantasy in your head.

the dates have already been provided retard.

 

[AntonToo]

the dates have already been provided retard.

Well then go ahead and QUOTE IT.

If what you've just said is supported by linked material, then you should be able to quote it. Right? Whats the problem?

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Well then go ahead and QUOTE IT.

Or maybe you don't know how to do basic copy and paste?

I am not going to do your work for you the post is in this thread and available on line look it up IF your are so stupid you did not actually read the thread

 

[BWK]

Most restrictions, laws, etc., are for worst case scenarios, and are not supposed to be enforced blindly, to the letter.
For example, Hillary deliberately violated the State Department email and cellphone rules.
But it turns out, most people did.
So the letter of the law and restrictions are usually not applicable.

Really? So some laws are ignored? For who? Certainly not me. Dude, you make some of the stupidest arguments imaginable.

Should law enforcement ignore all traffic violations?

Your idiotic Hillary argument is prime example of your stupidity.

By the way, just so you know, what Trump did comes under "worst case scenario."

 

[AntonToo]

I am not going to

Well then ok, get lost, you have nothing.

I can't quote that which DOES NOT ******* EXIST.

 

[BWK]

Well then go ahead and QUOTE IT.

If what you've just said is supported by linked material, then you should be able to quote it. Right? Whats the problem?

He can't.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Really? So some laws are ignored? For who? Certainly not me. Dude, you make some of the stupidest arguments imaginable.

Should law enforcement ignore all traffic violations?

Your idiotic Hillary argument is prime example of your stupidity.

By the way, just so you know, what Trump did comes under "worst case scenario."

again STUPID there is no punishment for not turning over records and material no criminal act was done,