Zone1 Trinity and Prayer

[crossbody]

I would not have a problem with this. Father is a title, Son is a title and Holy Spirit is a title. Beliefs and understandings will differ to their names. I go with the Father's name as Elohim. The Son's name as Jesus or Jehovah. And, the Holy Spirit's name as The Holy Ghost.
And, God is a title for all three in the Godhead.

ok so...

How come you do not baptize in the name of Elohim, and in the name of Jesus, of the Holy Ghost? ...since that's what you believe

 

[Cougarbear]

ok so...

How come you do not baptize in the name of Elohim, and in the name of Jesus, of the Holy Ghost? ...since that's what you believe

Because that is pretty much what Jesus said to do. Maybe it's to not use the actual names too much. Actually, I'm sure the Holy Ghost has a name other than Holy Ghost. But, because of His duties in the Godhead, it isn't a requirement for us to know. So, we just leave it as the Holy Ghost at this point.

 

[crossbody]

Because that is pretty much what Jesus said to do. Maybe it's to not use the actual names too much. Actually, I'm sure the Holy Ghost has a name other than Holy Ghost. But, because of His duties in the Godhead, it isn't a requirement for us to know. So, we just leave it as the Holy Ghost at this point.

Then why did the baptism change?

Why did it change after the Pentecost experience; to people getting baptized in Jesus actual "name?"

Acts 2:38 38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

 

[kjw47]

The doctrine of the Trinity is encapsulated in Matthew 28:19, where Jesus instructs the apostles: “Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.”

Well, can we end your nonsense and what you find on Google. Now, if you want to debate what the trinity actually is, we can do that. But, there is a Godhead. Colossians 2:9. It's there. There is a lot more but these two versus put to rest your denial of the Godhead or Trinity. The Nicene Creed does give a first attempt on who the Father, Son and Holy Ghost are. But, the apostasy was well into it's 200th year since the death (or in my reading and understanding his transliteration). So, I really don't care what the Catholic Church teaches.

Stop in the name of the law is the same concept as at Matt 28:19--Each law has its own name and are not the same as another law.
Jesus does EVERYTHING in his Fathers name, He lives 24/7-365 to do his Fathers will over self.

 

[Cougarbear]

Then why did the baptism change?

Why did it change after the Pentecost experience; to people getting baptized in Jesus actual "name?"

Acts 2:38 38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Peter just saying repent and be baptized is not the ordinance being performed. Do the apostles always have to be precise? No. Again, Peter is just saying repent and be baptized. When the ordinance is performed, it will be done correct based on their direction from the Lord in their times.

 

[Cougarbear]

Stop in the name of the law is the same concept as at Matt 28:19--Each law has its own name and are not the same as another law.
Jesus does EVERYTHING in his Fathers name, He lives 24/7-365 to do his Fathers will over self.

You didn't address the topic. Of course he addresses everything in his Father's name. Duh... But, the question is about is there a trinity or Godhead of three personages. This is typical JW bible bashing technique. Stray from the topic and you think you will win. NOT!!!

 

[crossbody]

Peter just saying repent and be baptized is not the ordinance being performed. Do the apostles always have to be precise? No. Again, Peter is just saying repent and be baptized. When the ordinance is performed, it will be done correct based on their direction from the Lord in their times.

You're a bit lost for an answer, so you have chosen to focus on the ordinance. When the focus I'm bringing up is on the baptizing in the name of Jesus.

 

[Meriweather]

That's impossible!

God was not on the cross with Jesus.

Whose will/plan was Jesus obeying when he accepted the cross? In love and prayers, the Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father and the Son.

Was there obedience? Was there prayer? If so, the three were united.

 

[ding]

That's impossible!

God was not on the cross with Jesus.

People unfairly put God on trial daily and unfairly convict God daily. He most certainly was on the cross that day. He put himself there. We are without excuse for blaming him for our material suffering. He has suffered with us.

 

[crossbody]

People unfairly put God on trial daily and unfairly convict God daily. He most certainly was on the cross that day. He put himself there. We are without excuse.

fallback

you do not have Bible for what you are saying. Jesus was the only one on the cross asking God to remove the cup of the sins of the cross from him.

 

[Cougarbear]

You're a bit lost for an answer, so you have chosen to focus on the ordinance. When the focus I'm bringing up is on the baptizing in the name of Jesus.

Not lost about anything. Just stating the fact that when we baptize, it’s done as stated in the Bible, in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Ghost (Spirit). Peter was telling the people to repent and be baptized. Taking out of context seems to be real easy with you JWs.

 

[crossbody]

Not lost about anything. Just stating the fact that when we baptize, it’s done as stated in the Bible, in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Ghost (Spirit). Peter was telling the people to repent and be baptized. Taking out of context seems to be real easy with you JWs.

You just have to lie don't you? I'm not a JW, and never have been, but I love them.

You tell only a half truth. Peter did not simply tell them to repent and be baptized... he told them to do so in the name of Jesus. Why do you continuously and purposely leave that part out? Never mind, don't even answer it, I'm done.

 

[Cougarbear]

You just have to lie don't you? I'm not a JW, and never have been, but I love them.

You tell only a half truth. Peter did not simply tell them to repent and be baptized... he told them to do so in the name of Jesus. Why do you continuously and purposely leave that part out? Never mind, don't even answer it, I'm done.

Well, when you say I baptize you in the name of the father, and of the son and of the Holy Ghost then you are doing so. In other verses it says during the ordinance to say all three names as I just did. So, you are the liar. Why do you feel the need to lie?

 

[kjw47]

You didn't address the topic. Of course he addresses everything in his Father's name. Duh... But, the question is about is there a trinity or Godhead of three personages. This is typical JW bible bashing technique. Stray from the topic and you think you will win. NOT!!!

Jesus answers you--you won't believe him=John 20:17, Rev 3:12--

 

[Cougarbear]

Jesus answers you--you won't believe him=John 20:17, Rev 3:12--

Why won’t you believe me?

 

[The Irish Ram]

What an insane teaching that paradise is in Hades(grave). Eden translates-paradise--It will be the new earth=paradise. The whole earth transformed into a garden of Eden( paradise). There is no spirit prison mentioned any spot in Gods bible.

When Christ rose from the dead, He told Mary not to touch Him as He had not yet risen.
The day Jesus died, He told the thief hanging next to Him that He would be with Jesus in Paradise that day. So, you know He wasn't referring to Heaven.
They went to Abraham's Bosom, also called Paradise. It is where those who belonged to God, but had not yet had their sins removed by Christ were congregated.
God's solution was to create “Abraham's Bosom” (Luke 16:22), a special place that was set apart from the rest of hell by a great gap or gulf. This arrangement was temporary, because after Jesus died, he went to Abraham's Bosom, and He emptied it. They came back with Him.
Where they were waiting for Him:
^
Luke 16:19-31
The Rich Man and Lazarus
“There was a rich man who was dressed in purple and fine linen and lived in luxury every day. At his gate was laid a beggar named Lazarus, covered with sores and longing to eat what fell from the rich man’s table. Even the dogs came and licked his sores.
“The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham’s side. The rich man also died and was buried. In Hades, where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side. So he called to him, ‘Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.’ “But Abraham replied, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad things, but now he is comforted here and you are in agony. And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been set in place, so that those who want to go from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us.’ "He answered, ‘Then I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my family, for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.’ “Abraham replied, ‘They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to them.’ “‘No, father Abraham,’ he said, ‘but if someone from the dead goes to them, they will repent.’ “He said to him, ‘If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.

Where Jesus said He was going:
^
Matthew 12:40 For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of a huge fish, so the Son of Man will be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth. < which gives us the location of Hell.

 

[Cougarbear]

When Christ rose from the dead, He told Mary not to touch Him as He had not yet risen.
The day Jesus died, He told the thief hanging next to Him that He would be with Jesus in Paradise that day. So, you know He wasn't referring to Heaven.
They went to Abraham's Bosom, also called Paradise. It is where those who belonged to God, but had not yet had their sins removed by Christ were congregated.
God's solution was to create “Abraham's Bosom” (Luke 16:22), a special place that was set apart from the rest of hell by a great gap or gulf. This arrangement was temporary, because after Jesus died, he went to Abraham's Bosom, and He emptied it. They came back with Him.
Where they were waiting for Him:
^
Luke 16:19-31
The Rich Man and Lazarus
“There was a rich man who was dressed in purple and fine linen and lived in luxury every day. At his gate was laid a beggar named Lazarus, covered with sores and longing to eat what fell from the rich man’s table. Even the dogs came and licked his sores.
“The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham’s side. The rich man also died and was buried. In Hades, where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side. So he called to him, ‘Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.’ “But Abraham replied, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad things, but now he is comforted here and you are in agony. And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been set in place, so that those who want to go from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us.’ "He answered, ‘Then I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my family, for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.’ “Abraham replied, ‘They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to them.’ “‘No, father Abraham,’ he said, ‘but if someone from the dead goes to them, they will repent.’ “He said to him, ‘If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.

Where Jesus said He was going:
^
Matthew 12:40 For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of a huge fish, so the Son of Man will be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth. < which gives us the location of Hell.

JW's have attacked the Bible to where they are very confused. So, she will continue to answer you but she will spin the debate to something else. She always does it.

 

[ding]

fallback

you do not have Bible for what you are saying. Jesus was the only one on the cross asking God to remove the cup of the sins of the cross from him.

The Trinity is not a mystery to be solved. It’s a relationship to be entered into.

 

[crossbody]

The Trinity is not a mystery to be solved. It’s a relationship to be entered into.

I dont care anything for the Catholic trinity. Neither to do I adhere to the false Catholic trinity

I would NEVER enter into any kind of a relationship with a Catholic trinity - nor a trinity period. They created this trinity thread under the false pretenses of prayer.

 

[ding]

I dont care anything for the Catholic trinity. Neither to do I adhere to the false Catholic trinity

I would NEVER enter into any kind of a relationship with a Catholic trinity - nor a trinity period. They created this trinity thread under the false pretenses of prayer.

Good for you. Go be happy.