THIS is why I say Israel is fascist

[amity1844]

"BEWARE MY HUNGER AND MY ANGER"
Mahmoud Darwish

Sabra and Shatila differs from what the Nazis did to Jews only in scope, and we are apparently getting there slowly.

 

[irosie91]

LOOK, I provided you with one good source for the one fact that has been questioned. It is your responsibility to follow up. You're pretending I should go down to the library, get this book, scan those pages, upload to the internet and post a link, and then come to your place and hold your effing eyelids open so you can read. It ain't happening.

Now look folks, I have done everything expected of a quality researcher, but ...

I CAN'T FIX COGNITIVE DISSONANCE.

it called itself a "quality researcher" because it can quote Wikki -----and other random
printed crap. I read all kinds of stuff as a child which----I actually do remember with
the clarity of ------a kid reading anything a kid reads----quality stuff----some of it written
by such brilliant writers as ARIBERT HEIM------that is how I learned how such quality
researchers function

 

[toastman]

"BEWARE MY HUNGER AND MY ANGER"
Mahmoud Darwish

Sabra and Shatila differs from what the Nazis did to Jews only in scope, and we are apparently getting there slowly.

You're comparing Sabra and Shatilla to What Nazis did to Jews??

Now do you wonder why no one takes you seriously here??

 

[Coyote]

"BEWARE MY HUNGER AND MY ANGER"
Mahmoud Darwish

Sabra and Shatila differs from what the Nazis did to Jews only in scope, and we are apparently getting there slowly.

Get serious.

Come back when they start stuffing families into ovens, conducting inhuman and painful experiments on kids, and kill two thirds of the population in the process of creating a pure super race....

 

[irosie91]

"BEWARE MY HUNGER AND MY ANGER"
Mahmoud Darwish

Sabra and Shatila differs from what the Nazis did to Jews only in scope, and we are apparently getting there slowly.

You're comparing Sabra and Shatilla to What Nazis did to Jews??

Now do you wonder why no one takes you seriously here??

It is not unreasonable to make comparisons. I would compare Sabra and Shatilla to that which took
place at THE ALAMO A fair comparison ----sorta. As for Nazi action---there is no question that
that which the Nigerian muslims did to the Biafrans compares to the actions of the Nazis-----and that which the turks did to the Armenians also compares to the Nazis Historically---
the Iranians did a NAZI on the Zoroastrians West Pakistan did a Nazi on east Pakistan

 

[aris2chat]

460 (35 women and children) dead in two days of fighting by 200 men vs 10,000-20,000 a day over 12 years in many of the 20,000 camps, wiping out two thirds of the jews.

You really think there is a comparison?

What happened in Lebanon was ordered by Syria, not Israel and carried out by a select group of Lebanese. Political gamesmanship not genocide.

 

[irosie91]

460 (35 women and children) dead in two days of fighting by 200 men vs 10,000-20,000 a day over 12 years in many of the 20,000 camps, wiping out two thirds of the jews.

You really think there is a comparison?

What happened in Lebanon was ordered by Syria, not Israel and carried out by a select group of Lebanese. Political gamesmanship not genocide.

compare and contrast ------is always an option----nothing exists entirely on its own ----
velocity cannot exist without two points of comparison and----time. All of science DEPENDS
on comparisons. Compared to one month ago---I am now two pounds less in mass----
weight can describe mass------sorta-----related to "g" (gravity)

 

[aris2chat]

"BEWARE MY HUNGER AND MY ANGER"
Mahmoud Darwish

Sabra and Shatila differs from what the Nazis did to Jews only in scope, and we are apparently getting there slowly.

You're comparing Sabra and Shatilla to What Nazis did to Jews??

Now do you wonder why no one takes you seriously here??

It is not unreasonable to make comparisons. I would compare Sabra and Shatilla to that which took
place at THE ALAMO A fair compa/rison ----sorta. As for Nazi action---there is no question that
that which the Nigerian muslims did to the Biafrans compares to the actions of the Nazis-----and that which the turks did to the Armenians also compares to the Nazis Historically---
the Iranians did a NAZI on the Zoroastrians West Pakistan did a Nazi on east Pakistan

Comparison to holocaust would be the massacre of 1.7 million persians in the 13 C.

Why is so much attention focused on 460 (mostly fighters) that died in the '82 incident and not the thousands killed by syrian and amal after '85? Or the 1500 killed at tel zatar, many killed by fellow palestinians? What of the palestinian massacre in Damour of 684? The bus massacre? Zahle?
Then there are the Avivim school bus, Kiryat Shmona, Ma'alot, Savoy and the Coastal Road massacres carried out by the palestinians

 

[Phoenall]

And I guess that is the first time I ever agreed with irosie.

As far as genocide, if anyone has an interest in undertaking genocide, they can usually find someone to collaborate on it with them. Like Israel did in Lebanon.

So you are now saying that the Palestinians collaborated with the Isrealis to wipe out the Lebanese Christians. Until the Lebanese Christians retaliated and gave the Palestinians a taste of their own medicine. Remind you of the Jordanian army tactics to sort out the Palestinians attempted take over of Jordan, fire on the Palestinians locked up in the concentration camps and mass murder 50,000.

 

[Phoenall]

There is no evidence of this.. The BOMB that assasinated the Prez was planted by Syrian militants. That was KNOWN the day after it went off when the assassin was IN CUSTODY. And there is no evidence of statements to the Phlangists by Israel that the PLO or Palestinians were involved in the assassination..

That's a lot of work on your part --- JUST TO INVENT A REAL BLOOD LIBEL.. Without a shred of evidence... Dontchathink??
Still waiting on the proof that Israel is a Fascist nation.. Or was that just to draw attention to your hefty cut n' paste ???

It was attested to by various witnesses that the Israeli commaqnder told the Phalange that they had intelligence that Palestinians had killed Germayel. The source is in the wikipedia article I linked to unless someone has removed them within the last day or two.

From your link we see this

The militarization of the Palestinian refugee population, with the arrival of the PLO forces after their expulsion from Jordan during Black September, sparked an arms race amongst the different Lebanese political factions[citation needed] and provided a foundation for the long-term involvement of Lebanon in regional conflicts. Fighting between Maronite and Palestinian forces began in 1975, and Left Wing, pan-Arabist and Muslim Lebanese groups later allied themselves with the Palestinians

So it was the Palestinians that were behind the 120,000 mass murders through their illegal land grabs..


cant find your claim that " It was attested to by various witnesses that the Israeli commaqnder told the Phalange that they had intelligence that Palestinians had killed Germayel. The source is in the wikipedia article I linked to unless someone has removed them within the last day or two "

 

[Phoenall]

1) Go to Wikipedia.
2) Enter search term "Sabra and Shatila."
3) Scroll down.
4) Find place where this fact is discussed.
5) Every statement in Wikipedia has to have one good source. Click on the little number after the statement to see source that supports it. You can probably get this info from navigating the original post if you want.

From your link we see this

Sabra and Shatila massacre[edit]

The Kahan Commission was set up by the Israeli government to investigate the circumstances of the Sabra and Shatila massacre, in which up to 3,500 Muslim civilians were killed by the Lebanese Maronite forces.[42] "for ignoring the danger of bloodshed and revenge" and "not taking appropriate measures to prevent bloodshed." The Commission recommended that Sharon resign his post as Defense Minister, which he did, though he remained in the government as a minister without Portfolio

 

[Phoenall]

Even the assassin was not executed (IIRC), but merely imprisoned.. This massacre occurred because Israel should never have trusted a blood thirsty foreign militia to have discipline and restraint. It was a miscalculation and Sharon pretty much admitted so... That is no PROOF of a innate Fascist govt being a feature of the state of Israel..

I'd say this was pretty fascist, and if anything Israel's genocidal intent is even clearer today. And I think fascism is a judgment call. Looks like a democracy to Israeli Jews, but Israel's war machinery presents a fascist face to the Palestinians, invariably.

I don't think Israel trusted the Kataeb, they USED the Kataeb. Israel was in charge in this event. Israel hatched the plan, gave the orders, and coordinated the events from a nearby tower. If things WEREN'T happening according to plan then Israel had 1-1/2 days' worth of opportunity to stop it.

The only thing I have never been able to figure out is WHY.

Going on your past misunderstandings of terms like NAZI and ZIONIST would you care to explain what you believe fascists to mean.

 

[Phoenall]

puhleeeeeze you missed it------Aenmity has already told you that the
Palestinians in Lebanon never did anything bad

Well, I certainly never said THAT.

But truthfully they were about the best of the lot.

And anyway, I think we're veering toward that collective punishment kneejerk mentality again. The people who participated in Damour were thousands of miles away. What was left in Sabra and Shatila were the non-combatants, families, old people. No fedayeen left at all.

They were doing exactly what you blame Israel for, and they were the best of the lot. They had just been put firmly in their place by Jordan when they tried to take over there by force and this resulted in 50,000 Palestinian deaths in the camps. Then they decided that Lebanon would be an easier option and tried an armed take over there as well. By this time the world knew the way to stop Arafat and the PLO in their tracks was to kill as many of his supporters as possible. He saw the writing on the wall and escaped Lebanon leaving behind many of his followers to face the music for their atrocities in Lebanon. That is why they were killed and it had absolutely nothing to do with Israel, it was all down to the illegal armed take over attempt by the Palestinians and the atrocities and genocides by their hands. They deserved all they got, and the world should have ran them all down until not a one was left free for the war crimes and crimes against humanity committed in the name of Palestine.

 

[Phoenall]

Will get more later.

If "the rest" of your proof that Israel is a fascist nation, relies on an uncited quotation from the ACTUAL butcher of those camps, I am not interested. Thats the problem with exaggerated conspiracy theories. They all lead down the rabbit hole...

No, now I've got two sources. I'll grant you Hobeika was trying to get his butt out of a tight spot. It is also very suspicious for Israeli involvement in HIS assassination, coming as it did immediately before his testimony at the war crimes trial where he promised to "out" Eitan and Sharon.

So now do we have everything sourced? Have I proven insofar as is possible that Israel lied to Hobeika to get him and his men fired up for the slaughter?
Yes, you said you agreed with everything else. And everything else is pretty uncontestable.

I just HATE conspiracy theories. Utterly ridiculous most of them.

Let me say a word about the "fascist" issue. Coyote read us the dictionary definition. If as you learn more about Israel you think the shoe fits...

As I said, Israelis see a very benign face of the Israeli military, so they can't accept the "fascist" label.
I have seen Israel's other face, the face it presents to the Palestinians, and I say Israel IS fascist ... according to the definition provided.

And all the concrete evidence calls you a LIAR, just as the findings of the ICJ also calls you a LIAR

 

[Phoenall]

Too late, you already said you agreed with everything else.
And really, people, this has been a matter of public record for 30+ years. None of this is new or uncontested by history at this point.

If you want to read my Jerusalem Fund lady's testimony, you will have to buy that book. Its copyrighted, so its not online. I hope you're not one of the people on here who refuse to read books?
I have well justified my title: I say its fascist because it meets the dictionary definition of fascism. You can say whatever you want. You see the fun side of Israel. The Palestinians don't.

And my conclusions follow logically from proven premises. No demurral will be forthcoming.

So you don't understand copyright laws then, and how you can cite a passage from a book as long as you give credence to the author for having written the work. You must have something to hide if you cant bring any evidence to support your claim

 

[Phoenall]

Ńo you just got caught again for fraudulent citing. LOL

Check the book, dingleball. It seems like a sound citation to me.

And when was the FIRST TIME I allegedly "got caught for fraudulently citing." I don't remember that ever happening.

I'll bet I can find other sources as well.

Now remember the point is that these were unarmed civilians who had not participated in anything. And they were massacred at Israel's instigation.

Source other than an ISLAMONAZI one please that shows the Palestinian terrorists were unarmed. As all the valid sources state they were well armed.

 

[Phoenall]

I've just admitted there was Israeli culpability on this matter. But not the story that you have concocted..

The fighters were to be handed over to the Israelis at the stadium.

I just saw this ... things get buried so quickly. What fighters did you mean, Aris?

The ones left behind in the camps after Arafat the coward had ran away.

 

[Phoenall]

This is worthless to prove your premise that Israel lied about anything to the militias. Does not mention even what the "revelations" might have been. And why are you not CITING where in the Wiki you got this?

This quote

According to Linda Malone of the Jerusalem Fund, Ariel Sharon and Chief of Staff Rafael Eitan[28] met with Phalangist militia units and invited them to enter Sabra and Shatila, claiming that the PLO was responsible for Gemayel's assassination.[29] The meeting concluded at 3:00 pm 16 September.[26]

is in the Wikipedia article cited in the original post, January 11, revision.

Did you bother to read what it said at the top

This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Peleio Aquiles (talk | contribs) at 19:43, 11 January 2014 (→*U.N. condemnation: Removing unbalanced paragraphs quoting only critics of the resolution.). It may differ significantly from the current revision.


Making your source far from valid and current

You are clutching at straws now and your attempts at demonising Israel are failing as fast as the Palestinian economy.

 

[Phoenall]

Check the book, dingleball. It seems like a sound citation to me.

And when was the FIRST TIME I allegedly "got caught for fraudulently citing." I don't remember that ever happening.

I'll bet I can find other sources as well.

Now remember the point is that these were unarmed civilians who had not participated in anything. And they were massacred at Israel's instigation.

ROFLMAO -----"Israel's instigation" gee again-----arabs decide that they are SOOOOO
stupid that all a jew has to do is say "hey guys -----go and kill each other" and they do it

I must tell the Knesset----- "boys---you are playing a dangerous game---
what happens if some arabs tell some jews ----'hey jews from tel aviv---
go kill the jews over in Beersheba' " that might work---because of the
Ashkenazi , Sephardi schism------tell all your friends, Aenmity

of course right now------the jews did tell the Shiites and sunnis in Iran ---"go
kill each other" so they are doing it. Zionist world control is so much fun

I think there is more truth to this than you even intend, Roudy. Israel might well one day be proven to be at the bottom of most of the upheaval in the Arab world. They have been doing it since at least the Lavon Affair.

Lavon Affair - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Palestinians are pretty savvy about Israel's lies and manipulation and treachery. Others have to learn the hard way like the Palestinians did.

Off topic deflection because your arguments are being destroyed by the truth. As for this link check the source and come back and apologise for using ISLAMONAZI PROPAGANDA

 

[Phoenall]

The Goebbels rationale "I wrote it 47 times----therefore it is written---therefore it must be
true"

more than 600 years ago----Maimonides wrote "be very careful of that which you write---
that it is correct and true---because once something is written----people tend to believe
it"

Well, there is also the not-so-small matter of it being the truth. Like I said, this is pretty much the consensus on what happens. Israel doesn't even officially deny very much of this.

You see ya'll whine on and on about how the "animals" kill your babies without even considering that there might be very good reasons for their anger. And so far, not a one of you has even said "oops" let alone "I'm sorry."

It is only the truth in your ISLAMONAZI FANTASY WORLD, as for the animals killing the babies they have been doing that since Medina 632 C.E. when the Jewish tribe refused to worship Mohamed as a god