There should be more restrictions on what poor people can buy with food stamps.

[Rigby5]

SNAP's is a federal program funded by people who pay federal income tax which is only a little more than half the people in our country. It is not funded through sales taxes, property taxes, or payroll taxes. Therefore they are not funding SNAP's and likely never will.

The government is not telling you how to live or what you must eat. They are only telling you what they are willing to provide. It's just like an insurance company. They may cover doctors visits, surgeries, but no elective surgeries like face lifts or sex changes. They are not telling you how to live. If you want those things, pay for it yourself.

Not sure why you differentiate "income tax" from "payroll tax"?

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

When companies get advantages like roads, and don't pay as much as everyone else does for those roads, then that is welfare.
Agriculture subsidies are corporate welfare.
Selling oil, gas, coal, etc., from public lands, below value, is corporate welfare.

Bullshit. Most companies have in-going and outgoing freight. Transportation companies pay the most in road taxes and we have to include the cost of those taxes in our shipping costs to the companies we deliver to. Without those companies, those roads would be in much worse shape.

 

[Rigby5]

The investments in children should be made by parents--not government. Parents raise their children, parents feed their children, and parents should provide medical care for their children.

I disagree.
Human instincts are not limited by family.
Originally, for millions of years, raising children was tribal.
The whole "nuclear family" thing is only in the last 100 years or so.
Any society that is not involved with the general welfare of its children, will fail.
Children are the future, and are an important investment by the whole society.
All societies that invest in children, like public schools, are better than those that do not.

 

[progressive hunter]

When companies get advantages like roads, and don't pay as much as everyone else does for those roads, then that is welfare.
Agriculture subsidies are corporate welfare.
Selling oil, gas, coal, etc., from public lands, below value, is corporate welfare.

companies pay the majority of the taxs that pay for the roads so thats not welfare,, thats using what you paid for,,

all subsidies by the feds should be ended and if a state wants to support farms in their state they can,,

and what do you mean by "below value"???

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Not sure why you differentiate "income tax" from "payroll tax"?

Because they fund different things, that's why. You don't equate your auto insurance with your house insurance, do you? They are separate insurance policies that cover different things.

Payroll taxes are sort of like government savings accounts. If you live the average lifespan, you get all that back and maybe even more. You get all of the SS contributions you and your employer put into the program. Same with Medicare. FICA as well. None of that money funds our federal welfare programs. Local and state taxes go to fund your emergency services, street lights, garbage pickup, highway construction.

 

[progressive hunter]

I disagree.
Human instincts are not limited by family.
Originally, for millions of years, raising children was tribal.
The whole "nuclear family" thing is only in the last 100 years or so.
Any society that is not involved with the general welfare of its children, will fail.
Children are the future, and are an important investment by the whole society.
All societies that invest in children, like public schools, are better than those that do not.

everything you said but reverse it,,

public schools are a new thing and only about 150 yrs old,, before that the families educated their kids,,

 

[Rigby5]

Bullshit. Most companies have in-going and outgoing freight. Transportation companies pay the most in road taxes and we have to include the cost of those taxes in our shipping costs to the companies we deliver to. Without those companies, those roads would be in much worse shape.

I did not say the US currently is giving companies corporate welfare for roads in the US.
I just said that is a way it could be done.
And it is being done when the US builds roads in Africa, solely for the purpose of Coca Cola being able to produce, ship, and sell their products in Africa.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

I disagree.
Human instincts are not limited by family.
Originally, for millions of years, raising children was tribal.
The whole "nuclear family" thing is only in the last 100 years or so.
Any society that is not involved with the general welfare of its children, will fail.
Children are the future, and are an important investment by the whole society.
All societies that invest in children, like public schools, are better than those that do not.

Schools are funded mostly by local taxpayers that agree to have a public school. But the basic raising of a child is done by parents. Now that government is intruding on that model. We see the results. We have kids getting guns killing other kids, stealing cars at the age of 13, running around all night during the school week instead of getting their homework done at night and getting ample sleep for the next school day.

Everything government touches, it makes worse.

 

[22lcidw]

We have a general welfare clause not any form of general warfare clause.

That is pretty loose and has been used to gouge the taxpayers at ever increasing percentages.

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Nothing at all.
But people were equating EBT that can be used to buy gas, with SNAP, which can't be used to buy gas.

You ate quoting me. I have not said that nor have I seen it said by anyone else.

Seems more like random thoughts just to promote pointless arguing

 

[Rigby5]

Because they fund different things, that's why. You don't equate your auto insurance with your house insurance, do you? They are separate insurance policies that cover different things.

Payroll taxes are sort of like government savings accounts. If you live the average lifespan, you get all that back and maybe even more. You get all of the SS contributions you and your employer put into the program. Same with Medicare. FICA as well. None of that money funds our federal welfare programs. Local and state taxes go to fund your emergency services, street lights, garbage pickup, highway construction.

Oh, I see your point.
Since income tax is also usually deducted from your paycheck, I was mixing them.
But I see you meant SS and FICA.

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Schools are funded mostly by local taxpayers that agree to have a public school. But the basic raising of a child is done by parents. Now that government is intruding on that model. We see the results. We have kids getting guns killing other kids, stealing cars at the age of 13, running around all night during the school week instead of getting their homework done at night and getting ample sleep for the next school day.

Everything government touches, it makes worse.

He seemingly misses the days when the tribal elders would all take turns having their way with the children.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

everything you said but reverse it,,

public schools are a new thing and only about 150 yrs old,, before that the families educated their kids,,

And many are turning to that today. I have tenants where the wife stays home and educates the kids while the husband works all day. The kids are smart, well behaved, and have a bright future which is more than I can say about a lot of public educated children these days.

 

[progressive hunter]

And many are turning to that today. I have tenants where the wife stays home and educates the kids while the husband works all day. The kids are smart, well behaved, and have a bright future which is more than I can say about a lot of public educated children these days.

poor rigby has a habit of saying things exactly opposite of what they are,,

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Oh, I see your point.
Since income tax is also usually deducted from your paycheck, I was mixing them.
But I see you meant SS and FICA.

Well yes because SS, FICA, Medicare, city and state taxes are what's known as payroll taxes. Not one cent of payroll taxes funds our federal welfare programs. Federal income taxes do, just like they fund interstate highways, our military, payroll for all the federal workers including the President and Congress.

 

[danielpalos]

That is pretty loose and has been used to gouge the taxpayers at ever increasing percentages.

Nobody takes right-wingers seriously about economics. They have a Congressional Budget Office to help them create Pareto Optimal plans.

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

poor rigby has a habit of saying things exactly opposite of what they are,,

When public education started, this is what it was.

 

[Rigby5]

everything you said but reverse it,,

public schools are a new thing and only about 150 yrs old,, before that the families educated their kids,,

Not really.
The reason humans started living longer is that the older generation that was no longer directly involved in passing on DNA, started passing on knowledge.
The elderly became valuable to our survival, as a repository of knowledge, they would pass on to the next generation.
This expanded into classrooms eventually.
The best arrow maker in the tribe taught everyone how to make arrows.
It was no longer up to the family.
When monarchies took over, they did not care, so then it was up to religions then to carry that load of public education.

 

[Rigby5]

When public education started, this is what it was.

View attachment 555769

{...
Perhaps the earliest formal school was developed in Egypt's Middle Kingdom under the direction of Kheti, treasurer to Mentuhotep II (2061-2010 BCE).
...
In Mesopotamia, the early logographic system of cuneiform script took many years to master. Thus only a limited number of individuals were hired as scribes to be trained in its reading and writing. Only royal offspring and sons of the rich and professionals such as scribes, physicians, and temple administrators, were schooled.[5] Most boys were taught their father's trade or were apprenticed to learn a trade.[6][page needed] Girls stayed at home with their mothers to learn housekeeping and cooking, and to look after the younger children. Later, when a syllabic script became more widespread, more of the Mesopotamian population became literate. Later still in Babylonian times there were libraries in most towns and temples; an old Sumerian proverb averred "he who would excel in the school of the scribes must rise with the dawn." There arose a whole social class of scribes, mostly employed in agriculture, but some as personal secretaries or lawyers.[7] Women as well as men learned to read and write, and for the Semitic Babylonians, this involved knowledge of the extinct Sumerian language, and a complicated and extensive syllabary. Vocabularies, grammars, and interlinear translations were compiled for the use of students, as well as commentaries on the older texts and explanations of obscure words and phrases. Massive archives of texts were recovered from the archaeological contexts of Old Babylonian scribal schools known as edubas (2000–1600 BCE), through which literacy was disseminated. The Epic of Gilgamesh, an epic poem from Ancient Mesopotamia is among the earliest known works of literary fiction. The earliest Sumerian versions of the epic date from as early as the Third Dynasty of Ur (2150–2000 BC) (Dalley 1989: 41–42).

Ashurbanipal (685 – c. 627 BC), a king of the Neo-Assyrian Empire, was proud of his scribal education. His youthful scholarly pursuits included oil divination, mathematics, reading and writing as well as the usual horsemanship, hunting, chariotry, soldierliness, craftsmanship, and royal decorum. During his reign he collected cuneiform texts from all over Mesopotamia, and especially Babylonia, in the library in Nineveh, the first systematically organized library in the ancient Middle East,[8] which survives in part today.

In ancient Egypt, literacy was concentrated among an educated elite of scribes. Only people from certain backgrounds were allowed to train to become scribes, in the service of temple, pharaonic, and military authorities. The hieroglyph system was always difficult to learn, but in later centuries was purposely made even more so, as this preserved the scribes' status. The rate of literacy in Pharaonic Egypt during most periods from the third to first millennium BC has been estimated at not more than one percent,[9] or between one half of one percent and one percent.[10]

In ancient Israel, the Torah (the fundamental religious text) includes commands to read, learn, teach and write the Torah, thus requiring literacy and study. In 64 AD the high priest caused schools to be opened.[11] Emphasis was placed on developing good memory skills in addition to comprehension oral repetition. For details of the subjects taught, see History of education in ancient Israel and Judah. Although girls were not provided with formal education in the yeshivah, they were required to know a large part of the subject areas to prepare them to maintain the home after marriage, and to educate the children before the age of seven. Despite this schooling system, it would seem that many children did not learn to read and write, because it has been estimated that "at least ninety percent of the Jewish population of Roman Palestine [in the first centuries AD] could merely write their own name or not write and read at all",[12] or that the literacy rate was about 3 percent.[13]

In the Islamic civilization that spread all the way between China and Spain during the time between the 7th and 19th centuries, Muslims started schooling from 622 in Medina, which is now a city in Saudi Arabia, schooling at first was in the mosques (masjid in Arabic) but then schools became separate in schools next to mosques. The first separate school was the Nizamiyah school. It was built in 1066 in Baghdad. Children started school from the age of six with free tuition. The Quran encourages Muslims to be educated. Thus, education and schooling sprang up in the ancient Muslim societies. Moreover, Muslims had one of the first universities in history which is Al-Qarawiyin University in Fez, Morocco. It was originally a mosque that was built in 859
...}

History of education - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[progressive hunter]

Not really.
The reason humans started living longer is that the older generation that was no longer directly involved in passing on DNA, started passing on knowledge.
The elderly became valuable to our survival, as a repository of knowledge, they would pass on to the next generation.
This expanded into classrooms eventually.
The best arrow maker in the tribe taught everyone how to make arrows.
It was no longer up to the family.
When monarchies took over, they did not care, so then it was up to religions then to carry that load of public education.

you crack me up,, making arrows isnt education as we are speaking and nothing to do with public schools that start 150 yrs ago,,,

and we started living longer through medicine not passing DNA,,