The Universe: Eternal or no?

[FistyTheBadger]

What the ... ? Ooookay ... drinking too much does kill brain cells. How can a lesson that does not exist "come through." Even the Ancient Egyptians traveled around the globe.

The lesson that one man can be right while the establishment is wrong comes through.

 

[KittenKoder]

The lesson that one man can be right while the establishment is wrong comes through.

Um ... no. The only lesson is that religious zealots can successfully supress science when they rid the are of literacy and logic.

 

[Dante]

Um ... no. The only lesson is that religious zealots can successfully supress science when they rid the are of literacy and logic.

you left out critical thinking skills. teach to the test so we have a conforming populace ready to be led by their crosses.

 

[FistyTheBadger]

Um ... no. The only lesson is that religious zealots can successfully supress science when they rid the are of literacy and logic.

No other group can oppress any other person?

 

[KittenKoder]

No other group can oppress any other person?

What you say is true, any group can oppress another, but the Columbus story still does not support TruthUknown's assertions, even by a stretch.

 

[Truthspeaker]

One that us-es rea-son and log-ic! Durrr...


This is retarded bullshit that an elementary pupil would spout who just came from a class with a dumbass elementary teacher with an even dumber textbook. No, Christopher Columbus did not suggest to the people of the world that the Earth was round. It was in fact a widely accepted notion among all intellectuals of the day. Even the ancient Greeks knew that the world was round and were able to accurately estimate the Earth's diameter.

Yes indeed, nonetheless, since you can't comprehend that I knew that already I will have to state that I did. But there were still many who didn't believe the "intellectuals". Many ancient civilizations knew that the earth was round, but that doesn't eliminate the fact that societies can take a step back in knowledge. the common process of the day had columbus as a fool.

 

[Truthspeaker]

One that us-es rea-son and log-ic! Durrr...


This is retarded bullshit that an elementary pupil would spout who just came from a class with a dumbass elementary teacher with an even dumber textbook. No, Christopher Columbus did not suggest to the people of the world that the Earth was round. It was in fact a widely accepted notion among all intellectuals of the day. Even the ancient Greeks knew that the world was round and were able to accurately estimate the Earth's diameter.

Reason and logic as YOU see it. reason and logic to me is something entirely different to you. You say that everyone religious is a loon, including your family. You are a bitter, confused young person and you are jealous of the religious knowledge that people have because you just can't figure it out for yourself.

Or maybe you have got all the eons of the cosmos figured out in your 18 years of existence. I guess you learned that while playing final fantasy 48 according to your avatar.

 

[Truthspeaker]

Columbus was doubted by the religious people not the scientists, he got his theory from other scientists, it wasn't even his own he was just the one brave enough to go against the church.

Not all religious people felt that way. King Ferdinand did not.

 

[Truthspeaker]

you left out critical thinking skills. teach to the test so we have a conforming populace ready to be led by their crosses.

How insulting and bigoted of you to say that religious people are incapable of critical thinking. Don't you think that you WOULD have to think critically before believing in something you haven't seen. You don't get that so you condemn it.

 

[XVZ]

How insulting and bigoted of you to say that religious people are incapable of critical thinking. Don't you think that you WOULD have to think critically before believing in something you haven't seen. You don't get that so you condemn it.

That is precisely what is being said. Belief in something you cannot demonstrate a reason for believing doesn't require critical thinking. Visit a loon asylum to get a grasp of the stupidity involved in baseless beliefs.

Those lunatics will swear to you that they and only they know the truth. They can't demonstrate how or why they know what they know, just tell you that they know and you do not. And we all know why they can't demonstrate their beliefs, because they in fact know absolutely nothing. They are mentally deranged. They believe they know, but they don't know; it is an the highest order of irrationality and insanity.

Yes indeed, nonetheless, since you can't comprehend that I knew that already I will have to state that I did.

I am quite capable of comprehending that fact that you made a completely idiotic statement and now that you have been called on it, you are backpeddling and attempting to save face by implying you meant something completely opposite of what you said

But there were still many who didn't believe the "intellectuals".

Just as you do not believe the intellectuals, yes - there were a lot of fools then and there are a lot of fools like you now.

Many ancient civilizations knew that the earth was round, but that doesn't eliminate the fact that societies can take a step back in knowledge. the common process of the day had columbus as a fool.

Yes, the rise of Christianity and fall of Rome certainly was a huge step back in knowledge.

Reason and logic as YOU see it. reason and logic to me is something entirely different to you.

You have not demonstrated any use of reason or logic. Belief in something that was indoctrinated into your brain but you cannot demonstrate is using neither reason nor logic. You must be able to demonstrate the facts whether those facts be repeatable experiments that produce the same results, or mountains of archival data, or observation of recurrent phenomenon, etc, that support your argument and clearly articulate the logic that results from said facts. You have no facts to work with so any insistence that you are using reason or logic is a nonstarter.

I will demonstrate to you an example of a loony argument. Someone puts forward to the scientific community that they have solved the mechanism behind gravity. This someone says that they have been revealed the truth and you must trust that they know what they are talking about. They explain that it is in fact a force driven by invisible undetectable strings manipulated by countless undetectable gremlins that in fact rule the universe. They go on to further explain that they know this because one of the gremlins revealed himself only to his mind.

Are you going to take this loon with any ounce of seriousness?

You say that everyone religious is a loon, including your family. You are a bitter, confused young person and you are jealous of the religious knowledge that people have because you just can't figure it out for yourself.

Thanks for your opinion, but I am not bitter nor confused. I in fact get along quite well with religious people, including my family.

Or maybe you have got all the eons of the cosmos figured out in your 18 years of existence. I guess you learned that while playing final fantasy 48 according to your avatar.

I am not sure why you think my avatar has anything to do with final fantasy. But you are the only one that is trying to pass off knowledge that you clearly do not have. You no doubt believe you have such knowledge, but that is only because you are insane. See the top of this post.

 

[KittenKoder]

I am not sure why you think my avatar has anything to do with final fantasy. But you are the only one that is trying to pass off knowledge that you clearly do not have. You no doubt believe you have such knowledge, but that is only because you are insane. See the top of this post.

Actually, that's probably the first time I have seen TS use any logic.

The eyes look like a Final Fantasy poster, but he was trying to be smart, there are only 13 of them so far.

 

[Dante]

How insulting and bigoted of you to say that religious people are incapable of critical thinking. Don't you think that you WOULD have to think critically before believing in something you haven't seen. You don't get that so you condemn it.

how insulting for you to purposefully misrepresent what I wrote.

your god will punish you for this one.

 

[Dante]

How insulting and bigoted of you to say that religious people are incapable of critical thinking. Don't you think that you WOULD have to think critically before believing in something you haven't seen. You don't get that so you condemn it.

the saddest part is you probably believe the image you project in your mind is what I or others see. Oh contraire! Your faith based honesty and morality? How could you do what you just did and live with yourself?

here:

Originally Posted by KittenKoder:
Um ... no. The only lesson is that religious zealots can successfully supress science when they rid the are of literacy and logic.

Originally Posted by DevNell:
you left out critical thinking skills. teach to the test so we have a conforming populace ready to be led by their cross

you do see where you got bagged don't you?

clue: religious zealots are not viewed by me as average religious people, but by you?

you make no distinction between zealots and the average religious person because you are blinded by your own zealotry.

for shame!!!

 

[XVZ]

Actually, that's probably the first time I have seen TS use any logic.

The eyes look like a Final Fantasy poster, but he was trying to be smart, there are only 13 of them so far.

Well it should be noted that his first use of logic resulted in a faulty conclusion

Link please to said poster so I can judge the resemblance for myself.

 

[edthecynic]

Secondly, don't confuse matter with energy.

Matter and energy are interrelated according to the equation, E=mc2
Think of matter as highly concentrated energy.

 

[ABikerSailor]

The Big Bang occurred, and the Universe was formed. The Universe had a beginning, and something that has a beginning is not eternal.

However......it IS forever.

 

[Amanda]

clue: religious zealots are not viewed by me as average religious people, but by you?

you make no distinction between zealots and the average religious person because you are blinded by your own zealotry.

In general, and on message boards especially, we (religious people) seem to get lumped together a lot. So, when someone starts slamming religion it's not that much of a leap to think that you (as a religious person) is being targeted.

 

[sky dancer]

On forums and message boards there is an equality opportunity to get targeted or slammed for your views.

I don't think 'religious' people get particularly singled out. Some boards, it's the atheists get smashed to smithereens.

What's fun for me as a non-theist, is that I get heat from the atheists and I get it from the Christians and other theists.

Back to the topic. How can the Universe be permanent? If it was created, then it had a beginning and will have an end.

 

[Amanda]

On forums and message boards there is an equality opportunity to get targeted or slammed for your views.

I don't think 'religious' people get particularly singled out. Some boards, it's the atheists get smashed to smithereens.

What's fun for me as a non-theist, is that I get heat from the atheists and I get it from the Christians and other theists.

Back to the topic. How can the Universe be permanent? If it was created, then it had a beginning and will have an end.

My point was that someone using the term "religious zealots" doesn't necessarily mean they aren't talking about all religious people. Some people seem to think that if you believe in God you're a zealot by definition.

I believe the universe can have an end.

 

[ABikerSailor]

On forums and message boards there is an equality opportunity to get targeted or slammed for your views.

I don't think 'religious' people get particularly singled out. Some boards, it's the atheists get smashed to smithereens.

What's fun for me as a non-theist, is that I get heat from the atheists and I get it from the Christians and other theists.

Back to the topic. How can the Universe be permanent? If it was created, then it had a beginning and will have an end.

Well, what's fun for me (as a Christian Taoist with Jewish understanding), as well as have a decent grounding in science, is that I can talk to ANYONE about ANYTHING. But.....that's only because I'm open to hearing new things.

And.....what says anything that has a beginning has to have an end? If you're a Christian, then, according to John 3:16......"For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, and whosoever believeth in Him, shall not perish, but have everlasting life."

Which means, that you live forever, but, because you have a beginning (birth) you cannot be eternal like God.

Same thing with the Universe. Now, if you were to look into things like exploding stars at the end of their life cycle, you would see that some of them form into nebulae and end up creating new stars all over again, which, means they also will last forever.

Entropy is a myth.