The tie that saved Rome. Do Western nations need a State Religion?

[irosie91]

The survival of Western civilization is not in danger.

No it isn't-----there is some danger to PEOPLE because of
Islamic terrorism -----like in France and in Belgium. Long ago---
there was another time when there was danger to people
in France----because of Islamic terrorism. I have no doubt
that there will be some reaction in France regarding that
sorta new danger

 

[irosie91]

...Is creating a State Religion the way to peace?...

No.

However, I see no harm in crafting legislation recognizing a Western Nation to be a Secularized Christian Nation.

Meaning; a nation with its culture and beliefs strongly rooted in Christianity, but committed to a Separation of Church and State, in practical public life.

right----sounds ok to me-----Christmas can be a NATIONAL HOLIDAY----easter too.

 

[occupied]

Nothing about the conversion to Christianity turned out well for Rome or the rest of western culture. Almost the entirety of Greco-Roman learning was suppressed and forgotten for a thousand years as western Europe endured the dark ages under the anti-science catholic church. Progress was rejected for a millennium of holy wars, inquisitions, superstition and stagnation.

Wrong. Many things were invented, many scientists were Christians and the religion did unify the people and create a Eurpean empire that lasted for a thousand years, successfully repelling the Islamic invasion and taking territory back when lost.

Go back to world history class and stay awake this time. They call it the dark ages because nothing worth remembering happened except for all the constant slaughter and plagues. Rather than unify, Christianity set off a constant state of war that is responsible for Europe being made up of hundreds of little city states, principalities and petty kingdoms before the renaissance and the rise the modern nation state.

The plagues happened because of tight cramped unsanitary living conditions, had zip to do with religion. You go back to class. Nothing notable happened? Pick a year and I'll provide an invention. Wars were happening all along, the Huns, Visigoths, Franks, you name it. You are incredibly ignorant of world history.

The history of the dark ages was plagues and wars as I said. I am sure things got invented here and there but science as we know it was all but banned. I never blamed the plagues directly on religion but it can be claimed that the church's declaration that all disease is attributable to God's wrath and could be turned away by fasting and prayer played a part in the high death toll.

 

[irosie91]

BTW---I never endorsed the idea of a "religion for the USA"----- I did for FRANCE. France is in real danger of being
overcome by ISLAM-----too many people there eager for a
MUSLIM FRANCE. You may not know-----lots of muslims do
---with great confidence ----PREDICT A MUSLIM FRANCE.
Consider Lebanon------Lebanon used to be -----sorta --almost--
a Christian country. France has a history of being a NOMINALLY catholic country-------it also has a history-----
which muslims take VERY SERIOUSLY of almost being a
MUSLIM COUNTRY (the southern part of france was virtually
conquered for quite awhile) History of "being muslim" may
mean nothing to you-----but it means LOTS to something like
1/4 of the world's population

I'm pretty sure France isn't going to endorse a state religion anytime soon, and that you are a bit overly hyperbolic about Muslims taking over. I do understand that there has been a big influx of "refugees", that some aren't really refugees but opportunists, and that a limit has to be enforced as France or Europe for that matter can only accept so many.

I am not being hyperbolic------and YOU are trivializing.
I have a sense that you really know nothing about islam --
and its history and its "NOW" as an ideology. I would not
ascribe "CONSPIRACY" to the overwhelming majority of
muslim refugees in France or anywhere else in the world-----
Most people in the world are LOOKING FOR THE BEST DEAL life has to offer--------HOWEVER----muslims do have a RELIGION----that is very specific regarding that which is
RIGHT and that which is WRONG. What is RIGHT for
muslims is establishment of ISLAM AS THE RIGHT RELIGION FOR ALL OF THE WORLD and establishment of that "RIGHT" a prime directive---------it is hard for you to accept that idea. You are probably American born. You just do
not know

I have a work friend who is a Muslim, came from war torn Bosnia. I have had conversations with him about religion and politics. He respects me, I respect him. I've been to his house, met his wife, kids. They aren't trying for a Muslim takeover lol, trust me. I think YOU do not know a Muslim and are full of fear because of the extremist Muslims you see on tv and think they are all like that. My friend hates them too. Did it ever occur to you he wanted no part of the extremists, and that most Muslims aren't extremists?

what makes you think that I do not know muslims? I know lots of muslims and have been to lots of muslim homes-----I read the koran LONG ago----probably before you were born..
What are you calling an "EXTREMIST" muslim? You assume
LOTS. Do you know anything about BOSNIAN MUSLIMS?
Have you ever met a NON-MUSLIM from Bosnia? You know muslims IN THE PARLOR------so do I. ----I also know muslims
NOT IN THE PARLOR.

Oh good grief. Go ahead with your "wisdom" then old one.

you really want to discuss the issue? You claim you have a muslim friend from Bosnia and had DISCUSSIONS with him
about "religion" which included HIS hatred for muslim terrorists. OK---good. How about you tell me ---something----about an opinion which he expressed on
islam IN BOSNIA----and the conflict between Bosnia and
Serbia and religion in general.-----something---anything

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Funny, I distinctly remember Rome falling.....

Hmmm

 

[irosie91]

Funny, I distinctly remember Rome falling.....

Hmmm

that was later on------when they were eating and vomiting and screwing themselves to death

 

[OldLady]

Liberalism is a political religion. The war is on and in full debate. I will resist it as will many others, that's considered division by leftists. If it comes to bloodshed, my side is better prepared.

Is that a THREAT, weasel? Typical for your side. And you wonder why anyone would want to set themselves apart from such attitudes?

What part went over your head? You clearly didn't understand the post.

If it comes to bloodshed, my side is better prepared.
I understood it fine. You're doing your typical wiggling off the hook, but go ahead. We all know the dreams of glory dancing in your head.

You don't know jack shit, you just love to smear people. You had a kneejerk emotional reaction to my words and went full auto. I said my side is better prepared, which is true. Our founders explained why it's a good idea, you should educate yourself instead of living in a sea of emotions.

There is nothing emotional about calling you out for your threatening stance. You call that knee jerk and full auto? LOL.
BTW, try it buddy, and I'll pick up all the itty bitty pieces of you flakes that are left after a drone strike on your underground bunker.

 

[occupied]

Funny, I distinctly remember Rome falling.....

Hmmm

Rome did not really fall as in a sudden collapse, it was more a steady decline that took 100 years or so.

 

[Iceweasel]

Liberalism is a political religion. The war is on and in full debate. I will resist it as will many others, that's considered division by leftists. If it comes to bloodshed, my side is better prepared.

Is that a THREAT, weasel? Typical for your side. And you wonder why anyone would want to set themselves apart from such attitudes?

What part went over your head? You clearly didn't understand the post.

If it comes to bloodshed, my side is better prepared.
I understood it fine. You're doing your typical wiggling off the hook, but go ahead. We all know the dreams of glory dancing in your head.

You don't know jack shit, you just love to smear people. You had a kneejerk emotional reaction to my words and went full auto. I said my side is better prepared, which is true. Our founders explained why it's a good idea, you should educate yourself instead of living in a sea of emotions.

There is nothing emotional about calling you out for your threatening stance. You call that knee jerk and full auto? LOL.
BTW, try it buddy, and I'll pick up all the itty bitty pieces of you flakes that are left after a drone strike on your underground bunker.

Lying asshole. I said my side is better prepared, like the founders said we should be. All you do is lie and smear. The military folks, like law enforcement are conservatives and believe as I do. You stupid, intolerant, tyrannical leftists are the ones that will be turned into greasy spots.

 

[Iceweasel]

Liberalism is a political religion. The war is on and in full debate. I will resist it as will many others, that's considered division by leftists. If it comes to bloodshed, my side is better prepared.

LOL!!! Your side doesn't have an army. Regardless of political views, the army will stand with the duly elected government, not the rebels.

You can't read, you illiterate dipstick. I didn't say we had an army I implied we are better armed. Pop your head out of your ass and focus on then actual words. The founders wrote about tyranny and it's WHY they made arms a right. You and Old Lady need to go back to grade school US history.

Better armed than what? That's the question. You like to shoot off your mouth, but it's just words. The army uses real bullets.

The Army? WTF are you babbling about, Sheila?

 

[WheelieAddict]

I'm pretty sure France isn't going to endorse a state religion anytime soon, and that you are a bit overly hyperbolic about Muslims taking over. I do understand that there has been a big influx of "refugees", that some aren't really refugees but opportunists, and that a limit has to be enforced as France or Europe for that matter can only accept so many.

I am not being hyperbolic------and YOU are trivializing.
I have a sense that you really know nothing about islam --
and its history and its "NOW" as an ideology. I would not
ascribe "CONSPIRACY" to the overwhelming majority of
muslim refugees in France or anywhere else in the world-----
Most people in the world are LOOKING FOR THE BEST DEAL life has to offer--------HOWEVER----muslims do have a RELIGION----that is very specific regarding that which is
RIGHT and that which is WRONG. What is RIGHT for
muslims is establishment of ISLAM AS THE RIGHT RELIGION FOR ALL OF THE WORLD and establishment of that "RIGHT" a prime directive---------it is hard for you to accept that idea. You are probably American born. You just do
not know

I have a work friend who is a Muslim, came from war torn Bosnia. I have had conversations with him about religion and politics. He respects me, I respect him. I've been to his house, met his wife, kids. They aren't trying for a Muslim takeover lol, trust me. I think YOU do not know a Muslim and are full of fear because of the extremist Muslims you see on tv and think they are all like that. My friend hates them too. Did it ever occur to you he wanted no part of the extremists, and that most Muslims aren't extremists?

what makes you think that I do not know muslims? I know lots of muslims and have been to lots of muslim homes-----I read the koran LONG ago----probably before you were born..
What are you calling an "EXTREMIST" muslim? You assume
LOTS. Do you know anything about BOSNIAN MUSLIMS?
Have you ever met a NON-MUSLIM from Bosnia? You know muslims IN THE PARLOR------so do I. ----I also know muslims
NOT IN THE PARLOR.

Oh good grief. Go ahead with your "wisdom" then old one.

you really want to discuss the issue? You claim you have a muslim friend from Bosnia and had DISCUSSIONS with him
about "religion" which included HIS hatred for muslim terrorists. OK---good. How about you tell me ---something----about an opinion which he expressed on
islam IN BOSNIA----and the conflict between Bosnia and
Serbia and religion in general.-----something---anything

He didn't tell me about Muslim terrorists in Bosnia. He says he hates the extremists in general as much as me, and I believe him. I have talked to him plenty about his views on religion, life etc. I don't ask him about the war because I am polite, sometimes he tells me tidbits though. He lost family. He says outsiders (other Muslims) took over his village and they fought constantly with bloodshed. He says Russians fighters were most ruthless above all. I don't ask him for details.

 

[konradv]

Liberalism is a political religion. The war is on and in full debate. I will resist it as will many others, that's considered division by leftists. If it comes to bloodshed, my side is better prepared.

LOL!!! Your side doesn't have an army. Regardless of political views, the army will stand with the duly elected government, not the rebels.

You can't read, you illiterate dipstick. I didn't say we had an army I implied we are better armed. Pop your head out of your ass and focus on then actual words. The founders wrote about tyranny and it's WHY they made arms a right. You and Old Lady need to go back to grade school US history.

Better armed than what? That's the question. You like to shoot off your mouth, but it's just words. The army uses real bullets.

The Army? WTF are you babbling about, Sheila?

I'm talking about your boast about being better prepared. Better prepared for what, shortbus? Suicide?

 

[WheelieAddict]

...Is creating a State Religion the way to peace?...

No.

However, I see no harm in crafting legislation recognizing a Western Nation to be a Secularized Christian Nation.

Meaning; a nation with its culture and beliefs strongly rooted in Christianity, but committed to a Separation of Church and State, in practical public life.

Unconstitutional.

 

[konradv]

Oh good grief. Go ahead with your "wisdom" then old one.

you really want to discuss the issue? You claim you have a muslim friend from Bosnia and had DISCUSSIONS with him about "religion" which included HIS hatred for muslim terrorists. OK---good. How about you tell me ---something----about an opinion which he expressed on islam IN BOSNIA----and the conflict between Bosnia and Serbia and religion in general.-----something---anything

He didn't tell me about Muslim terrorists in Bosnia. He says he hates the extremists in general as much as me, and I believe him. I have talked to him plenty about his views on religion, life etc. I don't ask him about the war because I am polite, sometimes he tells me tidbits though. He lost family. He says outsiders (other Muslims) took over his village and they fought constantly with bloodshed. He says Russians fighters were most ruthless above all. I don't ask him for details.

It's true. People that have been through a war rarely talk about it. It's people that haven't that think they know it all.

 

[Iceweasel]

Liberalism is a political religion. The war is on and in full debate. I will resist it as will many others, that's considered division by leftists. If it comes to bloodshed, my side is better prepared.

LOL!!! Your side doesn't have an army. Regardless of political views, the army will stand with the duly elected government, not the rebels.

You can't read, you illiterate dipstick. I didn't say we had an army I implied we are better armed. Pop your head out of your ass and focus on then actual words. The founders wrote about tyranny and it's WHY they made arms a right. You and Old Lady need to go back to grade school US history.

Better armed than what? That's the question. You like to shoot off your mouth, but it's just words. The army uses real bullets.

The Army? WTF are you babbling about, Sheila?

I'm talking about your boast about being better prepared. Better prepared for what, shortbus? Suicide?

Better prepared than libtards like you that think the Army will turn on their family and friends. Shortbus. An armed population is the ONLY thing that keeps government goons like you in check. It's WHY we have the rights.

 

[Iceweasel]

Oh good grief. Go ahead with your "wisdom" then old one.

you really want to discuss the issue? You claim you have a muslim friend from Bosnia and had DISCUSSIONS with him about "religion" which included HIS hatred for muslim terrorists. OK---good. How about you tell me ---something----about an opinion which he expressed on islam IN BOSNIA----and the conflict between Bosnia and Serbia and religion in general.-----something---anything

He didn't tell me about Muslim terrorists in Bosnia. He says he hates the extremists in general as much as me, and I believe him. I have talked to him plenty about his views on religion, life etc. I don't ask him about the war because I am polite, sometimes he tells me tidbits though. He lost family. He says outsiders (other Muslims) took over his village and they fought constantly with bloodshed. He says Russians fighters were most ruthless above all. I don't ask him for details.

It's true. People that have been through a war rarely talk about it. It's people that haven't that think they know it all.

What war did you go through?

 

[Norman]

The tie that saved Rome. Do Western nations need a State Religion?

The Western nations of today, like Rome in the days of Constantine, are being fractured by the plethora of religious and racial factions the emigration is causing. The Western nations are again being inundated by various religious militias and no go zones set up by religious and racial factions.

All countries and large coalitions of countries need something to unite the populations and have it all move in the same direction when required. Religion is a good tool for uniting a country.

Constantine was looking for stability and peace for Rome and decided that a State Religion was the way to unify Rome and its allies. He chose the least barbaric and belligerent religion in his day, Christianity, to be the tie that would bind the empire and other countries together.

I see the Western religious forces of today doing the same as in Constantine’s day, fracturing the country and being an enemy to unity and peace.

A house divided cannot stand, --- and history is repeating itself.

To insure the survival of the Western ideology, in these times of religious strife and division, should the present Western political powers follow Constantine’s example and choose a State Religion?

I am not suggesting that we send out this new religion to convert by the sword the way Christianity did. I think that we are intelligent enough today to debate the morality of the various religions to determine which is the most moral and the best for nations and the individuals within them.

Constantine chose strength by numbers and not by ideology and I think we are mature enough today to choose by worthy morality and ideology.

Is creating a State Religion the way to peace?

Regards
DL

Plenty of western nations have a state church.

And the nations that do are more atheistic than any... did you honestly think a government program would solve anything? You don't solve problems by forcing people to do shit... at best temporarily...

... And so, Rome fell.

 

[IsaacNewton]

Well Rome fell after about 600 years of no one in Rome ever seeing a foreign army approach the gates. All things end but 600 years is a loooong time.

 

[Kondor3]

...Is creating a State Religion the way to peace?...

No.

However, I see no harm in crafting legislation recognizing a Western Nation to be a Secularized Christian Nation.

Meaning; a nation with its culture and beliefs strongly rooted in Christianity, but committed to a Separation of Church and State, in practical public life.

Unconstitutional.

1. the topic is Western Nations - not just the United States

2. our Mother Country - England - the UK - has a State Religion - a branch of Christianity - the Church of England

3. here, it is only un-constitutional so long as the Constitution is not changed to reflect such a state of affairs

4. you think only in the here-and-now, rather in terms of what-was, and what-might be... a rather myopic perspective, youngling

 

[Onyx]

State religion.

Another way for the state to indoctrinate, conform, and condition the masses.