The Official Discussion Thread for who is considered indiginous to Palestine?

[Sixties Fan]

Why is ancient terminology such a big deal?

Because it is deliberately used to erase Jewish history and create a FALSE history for the Arab Palestinians.

In this case it is not false. Palestine is a term for the area that has been in use for several thousand years.

But the ARAB Palestinians of today have NO History in it at all.
They are not part of the ancient history.
They were not there during the Greek or Roman invasions, or even the Byzantine invasion.

 

[Shusha]

Why is ancient terminology such a big deal?

Because it is deliberately used to erase Jewish history and create a FALSE history for the Arab Palestinians.

In this case it is not false. Palestine is a term for the area that has been in use for several thousand years.

As have MANY other names. Why choose that one? When it is one which was deliberately chosen, and is still being deliberately chosen, to ERASE Jewish history?

 

[Sixties Fan]

The Public Relations Hype versus Genealogy

Such is the ethos. When one looks into what the Palestinians say about themselves, how each family describes its lineage, there is no trace of a “Canaanite” ancestry. Most of the families find their origins in Arab tribes, some of them with Kurdish or Egyptian background, and there are even – by word of mouth – widespread stories of Jewish or Samaritan ancestry. Although one might have expected some effort to adduce a Philistine ancestry, there is almost no such phenomenon.21

In Nablus, there is a family named Kanaan – that is, Canaan. We asked members of the family about its lineage, and they affirmed that they had been Canaanites for 3,000 years. However, a look at the family’s website gave a different picture.22 It is indeed an ancient family – part of it Christian, indicating its pre-Islamic origin; but coming from Aleppo in Syria. From Aleppo, the family branched out to Damascus, Cyprus, and other places, including Nablus. Although the name may indicate Canaanite ancestry, the Canaanite forebears were in Syria, not in the land of Canaan.

According to another source within the family, the clan originated in Homs,23 Syria and became widely dispersed in the Middle East, apparently including Nablus, about 300 years ago. Despite the fact that the name suggests a Canaanite lineage, this source says the family’s origins lie in the ancient Arab Tamim24 tribe.

Thus, apart from the Kanaan family with its possible Canaanite ancestry coming from Syria, not Palestine, and its possible Arab origins, there is no direct or indirect evidence of the Palestinians having descended from the Canaanite people as they claim.

On February 1, 2014, Saeb Erekat locked horns with his negotiating partner, Tzipi Livni, before a European audience in Germany. He pronounced:25 “I am a son of Jericho. My age—10,000 years. I am a proud son of the Canaanites, and I was [here] 5,000 years ago, and 500 years before the coming of Joshua bin Nun, who burned my city, Jericho, and I will not trade in my history [because of a demand to recognize Israel as a Jewish state].”

In other words, Erekat’s claimed Canaanite roots entail that he cannot recognize Jewish history; and in any case, Joshua bin Nun, Erekat intimates, was a war criminal.

Is the Erekat family “Canaanite,” as he angrily insisted to Tzipi Livni before a European audience that did not bat an eyelash?

To find out how the family views its lineage, we looked at his family’s genealogical sites.

It turns out that the Erekat family originates in the large Huweitat tribe, and they belong to the Ashraf (families that trace their lineage to the family of the Prophet). They are related to the descendants of Hussein, grandson of the Prophet, who migrated from Medina to the Syrian Desert and settled in the Aqaba area.

The Erekat family itself settled in Abu Dis, Jericho, Amman, and Ajloun (in Jordan). The sheikh of the family was Kamal Erekat, commander of the jihad against the nascent Jewish state in 1948 after Abd al-Kader al-Husseini was killed in the Battle of Kastel during Israel’s War of Independence. Kamal Erekat himself was wounded in the war and later became the first speaker of the Jordanian parliament.

In general, the list of heads of the Erekat family includes many Jordanian cabinet ministers. Why is the family so prominent in Jordan? Because the Huweitat tribe was among the main tribes that backed the Great Arab Revolt of the Hashemites in Mecca, and it moved north along with Laurence of Arabia —that is, at the same time as the Zionists were establishing themselves in Palestine.

The Hejaz-based Huweitat tribe linked up with the branch of the tribe that had already settled in Jordan, and together they conquered Aqaba.


Who Are the Palestinians?

 

[Coyote]

The Palestinians aren’t just Arabs.

If they are not just Arabs what else are they? What other culture do they possess? What other cultural markers do they possess? What other identity do they have? What languages do they speak? What religions do they follow? What cultural life events? Holidays? Laws? Customs? Clothing?

They are Arabs. Only Arabs.

They are Palestinians.

Meaningless. Unless you can make it distinct from all other peoples. What makes one distinctively Palestinian? At what point in time did that distinction come to be?

It isn’t meaningless. Is there some specific date needed? How about self identification.

I think this argument illustrates something and that is how important it is for some people here to insist that the Palestinians are a “fake” people with a “fake” history. Why is that so important? What is the agenda behind it?

 

[Coyote]

The Public Relations Hype versus Genealogy

Such is the ethos. When one looks into what the Palestinians say about themselves, how each family describes its lineage, there is no trace of a “Canaanite” ancestry. Most of the families find their origins in Arab tribes, some of them with Kurdish or Egyptian background, and there are even – by word of mouth – widespread stories of Jewish or Samaritan ancestry. Although one might have expected some effort to adduce a Philistine ancestry, there is almost no such phenomenon.21

In Nablus, there is a family named Kanaan – that is, Canaan. We asked members of the family about its lineage, and they affirmed that they had been Canaanites for 3,000 years. However, a look at the family’s website gave a different picture.22 It is indeed an ancient family – part of it Christian, indicating its pre-Islamic origin; but coming from Aleppo in Syria. From Aleppo, the family branched out to Damascus, Cyprus, and other places, including Nablus. Although the name may indicate Canaanite ancestry, the Canaanite forebears were in Syria, not in the land of Canaan.

According to another source within the family, the clan originated in Homs,23 Syria and became widely dispersed in the Middle East, apparently including Nablus, about 300 years ago. Despite the fact that the name suggests a Canaanite lineage, this source says the family’s origins lie in the ancient Arab Tamim24 tribe.

Thus, apart from the Kanaan family with its possible Canaanite ancestry coming from Syria, not Palestine, and its possible Arab origins, there is no direct or indirect evidence of the Palestinians having descended from the Canaanite people as they claim.

On February 1, 2014, Saeb Erekat locked horns with his negotiating partner, Tzipi Livni, before a European audience in Germany. He pronounced:25 “I am a son of Jericho. My age—10,000 years. I am a proud son of the Canaanites, and I was [here] 5,000 years ago, and 500 years before the coming of Joshua bin Nun, who burned my city, Jericho, and I will not trade in my history [because of a demand to recognize Israel as a Jewish state].”

In other words, Erekat’s claimed Canaanite roots entail that he cannot recognize Jewish history; and in any case, Joshua bin Nun, Erekat intimates, was a war criminal.

Is the Erekat family “Canaanite,” as he angrily insisted to Tzipi Livni before a European audience that did not bat an eyelash?

To find out how the family views its lineage, we looked at his family’s genealogical sites.

It turns out that the Erekat family originates in the large Huweitat tribe, and they belong to the Ashraf (families that trace their lineage to the family of the Prophet). They are related to the descendants of Hussein, grandson of the Prophet, who migrated from Medina to the Syrian Desert and settled in the Aqaba area.

The Erekat family itself settled in Abu Dis, Jericho, Amman, and Ajloun (in Jordan). The sheikh of the family was Kamal Erekat, commander of the jihad against the nascent Jewish state in 1948 after Abd al-Kader al-Husseini was killed in the Battle of Kastel during Israel’s War of Independence. Kamal Erekat himself was wounded in the war and later became the first speaker of the Jordanian parliament.

In general, the list of heads of the Erekat family includes many Jordanian cabinet ministers. Why is the family so prominent in Jordan? Because the Huweitat tribe was among the main tribes that backed the Great Arab Revolt of the Hashemites in Mecca, and it moved north along with Laurence of Arabia —that is, at the same time as the Zionists were establishing themselves in Palestine.

The Hejaz-based Huweitat tribe linked up with the branch of the tribe that had already settled in Jordan, and together they conquered Aqaba.


Who Are the Palestinians?

Don’t you think that source might be a bit biased?

 

[Coyote]

Because Palestine is a long standing historic term for the region.

So is Israel.

Not really.

Israel disappeared around 700BC. Almost 3000 years ago. Roman maps referenced Palestine and Judea as separate regions. I think historically Palestine Has long been used,

From the article you posted a few pages ago:

Rome involved itself in the region’s affairs in 63 BCE and, after Augustus became emperor, Palestine became a province known as Roman Judea in c. 31 BCE.

Palestine


Why are you assuming that there were TWO separate regions, when Judea is the one which the Romans eventually changed its name into Syria Palestina in135 CE?

I am not assuming anything. I looked at a map. Why is ancient terminology such a big deal?

View attachment 250490

Yes, and this map is from circa 100 CE and not 2000 BCE or 1000 BCE.

Here is a 9th Centure BCE map:

Approximate map of the Iron Age kingdom of Israel (blue) and kingdom of Judah(yellow), with their neighbors (tan) (9th century BCE)

History of ancient Israel and Judah - Wikipedia

And...what exactly is your point?

 

[Sixties Fan]

The Public Relations Hype versus Genealogy

Such is the ethos. When one looks into what the Palestinians say about themselves, how each family describes its lineage, there is no trace of a “Canaanite” ancestry. Most of the families find their origins in Arab tribes, some of them with Kurdish or Egyptian background, and there are even – by word of mouth – widespread stories of Jewish or Samaritan ancestry. Although one might have expected some effort to adduce a Philistine ancestry, there is almost no such phenomenon.21

In Nablus, there is a family named Kanaan – that is, Canaan. We asked members of the family about its lineage, and they affirmed that they had been Canaanites for 3,000 years. However, a look at the family’s website gave a different picture.22 It is indeed an ancient family – part of it Christian, indicating its pre-Islamic origin; but coming from Aleppo in Syria. From Aleppo, the family branched out to Damascus, Cyprus, and other places, including Nablus. Although the name may indicate Canaanite ancestry, the Canaanite forebears were in Syria, not in the land of Canaan.

According to another source within the family, the clan originated in Homs,23 Syria and became widely dispersed in the Middle East, apparently including Nablus, about 300 years ago. Despite the fact that the name suggests a Canaanite lineage, this source says the family’s origins lie in the ancient Arab Tamim24 tribe.

Thus, apart from the Kanaan family with its possible Canaanite ancestry coming from Syria, not Palestine, and its possible Arab origins, there is no direct or indirect evidence of the Palestinians having descended from the Canaanite people as they claim.

On February 1, 2014, Saeb Erekat locked horns with his negotiating partner, Tzipi Livni, before a European audience in Germany. He pronounced:25 “I am a son of Jericho. My age—10,000 years. I am a proud son of the Canaanites, and I was [here] 5,000 years ago, and 500 years before the coming of Joshua bin Nun, who burned my city, Jericho, and I will not trade in my history [because of a demand to recognize Israel as a Jewish state].”

In other words, Erekat’s claimed Canaanite roots entail that he cannot recognize Jewish history; and in any case, Joshua bin Nun, Erekat intimates, was a war criminal.

Is the Erekat family “Canaanite,” as he angrily insisted to Tzipi Livni before a European audience that did not bat an eyelash?

To find out how the family views its lineage, we looked at his family’s genealogical sites.

It turns out that the Erekat family originates in the large Huweitat tribe, and they belong to the Ashraf (families that trace their lineage to the family of the Prophet). They are related to the descendants of Hussein, grandson of the Prophet, who migrated from Medina to the Syrian Desert and settled in the Aqaba area.

The Erekat family itself settled in Abu Dis, Jericho, Amman, and Ajloun (in Jordan). The sheikh of the family was Kamal Erekat, commander of the jihad against the nascent Jewish state in 1948 after Abd al-Kader al-Husseini was killed in the Battle of Kastel during Israel’s War of Independence. Kamal Erekat himself was wounded in the war and later became the first speaker of the Jordanian parliament.

In general, the list of heads of the Erekat family includes many Jordanian cabinet ministers. Why is the family so prominent in Jordan? Because the Huweitat tribe was among the main tribes that backed the Great Arab Revolt of the Hashemites in Mecca, and it moved north along with Laurence of Arabia —that is, at the same time as the Zionists were establishing themselves in Palestine.

The Hejaz-based Huweitat tribe linked up with the branch of the tribe that had already settled in Jordan, and together they conquered Aqaba.


Who Are the Palestinians?

Don’t you think that source might be a bit biased?

Not if the research done is based on factual Arab websites and interviews conducted on other Arabs.

Would you care to do a research on Arab Leader Erekart's family just to check it out?

 

[Coyote]

The Palestinians have been subject to multiple DNA studies so I don’t know what you are talking about. Either you believe it or you don’t. You don’t get to pick and choose just the bits you agree with.

But , that is exactly what you have been doing.

Exactly how? What DNA studies am I picking bits from?

And since your knowledge of the issue is usually nil......and you won't even comment on how come the Palestinians cannot identify with any of the Canaanite tribes, but have been able to identify with the ones from Arabia .........

Since I find your knowledge to be little more than pro-Israeli propaganda you will have to excuse me for not taking what you say seriously. What genetic studies support your claim?

You already posted a study saying that Palestinians were close in DNA to Jews.

The point is that the study you pointed out to cannot be confirmed by any other study.

Was Israel allowed to look at the samples, know who the Palestinians were and conduct the same test on them to get the same result?

The answer is no.

There is no conclusive study, outside those who are pro Palestinians, who will say that most Palestinians have DNA closer to the Jews than to the Arabs.

And that is a fact.

The scientists were not pro (or anti) Palestinian. Why are you trying to politicize the science? Is it so threatening to identity to find the Palestinians are not as distantly related as you hoped? This is the weirdest argument. What the studies tend to show is fairly close relationships among many of the peoples in the region. Not some sharp division between Jews and “Arabs” in the area.

There are actually multiple studies looking at various aspects of genetics.

And that is a fact.

Multiple studies.

Please, post the link to each one of them.

This article references several.

Blood brothers: Palestinians and Jews share genetic roots


Now you show me studies indicating they are not related. Disprove those studies.

 

[Coyote]

The Public Relations Hype versus Genealogy

Such is the ethos. When one looks into what the Palestinians say about themselves, how each family describes its lineage, there is no trace of a “Canaanite” ancestry. Most of the families find their origins in Arab tribes, some of them with Kurdish or Egyptian background, and there are even – by word of mouth – widespread stories of Jewish or Samaritan ancestry. Although one might have expected some effort to adduce a Philistine ancestry, there is almost no such phenomenon.21

In Nablus, there is a family named Kanaan – that is, Canaan. We asked members of the family about its lineage, and they affirmed that they had been Canaanites for 3,000 years. However, a look at the family’s website gave a different picture.22 It is indeed an ancient family – part of it Christian, indicating its pre-Islamic origin; but coming from Aleppo in Syria. From Aleppo, the family branched out to Damascus, Cyprus, and other places, including Nablus. Although the name may indicate Canaanite ancestry, the Canaanite forebears were in Syria, not in the land of Canaan.

According to another source within the family, the clan originated in Homs,23 Syria and became widely dispersed in the Middle East, apparently including Nablus, about 300 years ago. Despite the fact that the name suggests a Canaanite lineage, this source says the family’s origins lie in the ancient Arab Tamim24 tribe.

Thus, apart from the Kanaan family with its possible Canaanite ancestry coming from Syria, not Palestine, and its possible Arab origins, there is no direct or indirect evidence of the Palestinians having descended from the Canaanite people as they claim.

On February 1, 2014, Saeb Erekat locked horns with his negotiating partner, Tzipi Livni, before a European audience in Germany. He pronounced:25 “I am a son of Jericho. My age—10,000 years. I am a proud son of the Canaanites, and I was [here] 5,000 years ago, and 500 years before the coming of Joshua bin Nun, who burned my city, Jericho, and I will not trade in my history [because of a demand to recognize Israel as a Jewish state].”

In other words, Erekat’s claimed Canaanite roots entail that he cannot recognize Jewish history; and in any case, Joshua bin Nun, Erekat intimates, was a war criminal.

Is the Erekat family “Canaanite,” as he angrily insisted to Tzipi Livni before a European audience that did not bat an eyelash?

To find out how the family views its lineage, we looked at his family’s genealogical sites.

It turns out that the Erekat family originates in the large Huweitat tribe, and they belong to the Ashraf (families that trace their lineage to the family of the Prophet). They are related to the descendants of Hussein, grandson of the Prophet, who migrated from Medina to the Syrian Desert and settled in the Aqaba area.

The Erekat family itself settled in Abu Dis, Jericho, Amman, and Ajloun (in Jordan). The sheikh of the family was Kamal Erekat, commander of the jihad against the nascent Jewish state in 1948 after Abd al-Kader al-Husseini was killed in the Battle of Kastel during Israel’s War of Independence. Kamal Erekat himself was wounded in the war and later became the first speaker of the Jordanian parliament.

In general, the list of heads of the Erekat family includes many Jordanian cabinet ministers. Why is the family so prominent in Jordan? Because the Huweitat tribe was among the main tribes that backed the Great Arab Revolt of the Hashemites in Mecca, and it moved north along with Laurence of Arabia —that is, at the same time as the Zionists were establishing themselves in Palestine.

The Hejaz-based Huweitat tribe linked up with the branch of the tribe that had already settled in Jordan, and together they conquered Aqaba.


Who Are the Palestinians?

Don’t you think that source might be a bit biased?

Not if the research done is based on factual Arab websites and interviews conducted on other Arabs.

Would you care to do a research on Arab Leader Erekart's family just to check it out?

Oh come on. Yes it can still be biased in what it chooses to include, leave out, the words it chooses to use. You know that.

 

[Sixties Fan]

So is Israel.

Not really.

Israel disappeared around 700BC. Almost 3000 years ago. Roman maps referenced Palestine and Judea as separate regions. I think historically Palestine Has long been used,

From the article you posted a few pages ago:

Rome involved itself in the region’s affairs in 63 BCE and, after Augustus became emperor, Palestine became a province known as Roman Judea in c. 31 BCE.

Palestine


Why are you assuming that there were TWO separate regions, when Judea is the one which the Romans eventually changed its name into Syria Palestina in135 CE?

I am not assuming anything. I looked at a map. Why is ancient terminology such a big deal?

View attachment 250490

Yes, and this map is from circa 100 CE and not 2000 BCE or 1000 BCE.

Here is a 9th Centure BCE map:

Approximate map of the Iron Age kingdom of Israel (blue) and kingdom of Judah(yellow), with their neighbors (tan) (9th century BCE)

History of ancient Israel and Judah - Wikipedia

And...what exactly is your point?

The point continues to be:

Before Israel's time, the area was known as Canaan.
During Israel's time, it was known as Israel, or Israel and Judea, or later Judea.

We are talking just about Canaan.

And let us remember that the Philistines mainly occupied the area of Gaza, plus Ashkelon, etc.

The point is, that by 100 CE, Ptolomeu may have chosen to use the term Palestine for the area in his map. Who knows.

But where in history books did any invaders like the Assyrians, Babylonians, Greeks or even the Romans invaded "Palestine" and took the "Palestinians" into captivity to Babylon, or the Assyrians conquered Palestine, or the Greeks conquered Palestine.

I cannot find your Palestine anywhere in their history books.

 

[Coyote]

Why is ancient terminology such a big deal?

Because it is deliberately used to erase Jewish history and create a FALSE history for the Arab Palestinians.

In this case it is not false. Palestine is a term for the area that has been in use for several thousand years.

But the ARAB Palestinians of today have NO History in it at all.
They are not part of the ancient history.
They were not there during the Greek or Roman invasions, or even the Byzantine invasion.

Sure they were. If they are a composite of all those peoples then they were.

 

[Coyote]

Not really.

Israel disappeared around 700BC. Almost 3000 years ago. Roman maps referenced Palestine and Judea as separate regions. I think historically Palestine Has long been used,

From the article you posted a few pages ago:

Rome involved itself in the region’s affairs in 63 BCE and, after Augustus became emperor, Palestine became a province known as Roman Judea in c. 31 BCE.

Palestine


Why are you assuming that there were TWO separate regions, when Judea is the one which the Romans eventually changed its name into Syria Palestina in135 CE?

I am not assuming anything. I looked at a map. Why is ancient terminology such a big deal?

View attachment 250490

Yes, and this map is from circa 100 CE and not 2000 BCE or 1000 BCE.

Here is a 9th Centure BCE map:

Approximate map of the Iron Age kingdom of Israel (blue) and kingdom of Judah(yellow), with their neighbors (tan) (9th century BCE)

History of ancient Israel and Judah - Wikipedia

And...what exactly is your point?

The point continues to be:

Before Israel's time, the area was known as Canaan.
During Israel's time, it was known as Israel, or Israel and Judea, or later Judea.

We are talking just about Canaan.

And let us remember that the Philistines mainly occupied the area of Gaza, plus Ashkelon, etc.

The point is, that by 100 CE, Ptolomeu may have chosen to use the term Palestine for the area in his map. Who knows.

But where in history books did any invaders like the Assyrians, Babylonians, Greeks or even the Romans invaded "Palestine" and took the "Palestinians" into captivity to Babylon, or the Assyrians conquered Palestine, or the Greeks conquered Palestine.

I cannot find your Palestine anywhere in their history books.

Well if you can’t find Palestine in history books then your books are clearly deficient since it exists on maps and histories. You are making a silly argument.

 

[Sixties Fan]

Why is ancient terminology such a big deal?

Because it is deliberately used to erase Jewish history and create a FALSE history for the Arab Palestinians.

In this case it is not false. Palestine is a term for the area that has been in use for several thousand years.

But the ARAB Palestinians of today have NO History in it at all.
They are not part of the ancient history.
They were not there during the Greek or Roman invasions, or even the Byzantine invasion.

Sure they were. If they are a composite of all those peoples then they were.

I asked you to show me where the Palestinians can prove, via oral or written ways, that they are descendants of any of the Canaanite tribes I posted in my previous post.

The Erekart clan. Which Canaanite tribe are they from?
The Abbas clan. Which Canaanite tribe are they from?
The Al Husseini clan. Which Canaanite tribe are they from?

Any of these tribes below have Canaanite roots?
Qurei
Dahlan. ...
Rajoub. ...
Yusuf. ...
Shaath.
Meshal
Al Hindi
Barghouti
Nusseibeh
Abed Rabbo
Nasrallah


They do say that they come from Canaan for thousands and thousands of years before.

True or false?

 

[Sixties Fan]

From the article you posted a few pages ago:

Rome involved itself in the region’s affairs in 63 BCE and, after Augustus became emperor, Palestine became a province known as Roman Judea in c. 31 BCE.

Palestine


Why are you assuming that there were TWO separate regions, when Judea is the one which the Romans eventually changed its name into Syria Palestina in135 CE?

I am not assuming anything. I looked at a map. Why is ancient terminology such a big deal?

View attachment 250490

Yes, and this map is from circa 100 CE and not 2000 BCE or 1000 BCE.

Here is a 9th Centure BCE map:

Approximate map of the Iron Age kingdom of Israel (blue) and kingdom of Judah(yellow), with their neighbors (tan) (9th century BCE)

History of ancient Israel and Judah - Wikipedia

And...what exactly is your point?

The point continues to be:

Before Israel's time, the area was known as Canaan.
During Israel's time, it was known as Israel, or Israel and Judea, or later Judea.

We are talking just about Canaan.

And let us remember that the Philistines mainly occupied the area of Gaza, plus Ashkelon, etc.

The point is, that by 100 CE, Ptolomeu may have chosen to use the term Palestine for the area in his map. Who knows.

But where in history books did any invaders like the Assyrians, Babylonians, Greeks or even the Romans invaded "Palestine" and took the "Palestinians" into captivity to Babylon, or the Assyrians conquered Palestine, or the Greeks conquered Palestine.

I cannot find your Palestine anywhere in their history books.

Well if you can’t find Palestine in history books then your books are clearly deficient since it exists on maps and histories. You are making a silly argument.

What I continue not to be able to find, as I showed in a post above, is a reference to Canaan as being Palestine, at the time Canaan was Canaan.

What I did find, was Palestine being first used by Herodotus after 5th Century BCE, long after Canaan stopped being used, because the area became known as Israel around 1000 BCE.

 

[Shusha]

Of all the POSSIBLE names to call the geographical area

The Palestinians aren’t just Arabs.

If they are not just Arabs what else are they? What other culture do they possess? What other cultural markers do they possess? What other identity do they have? What languages do they speak? What religions do they follow? What cultural life events? Holidays? Laws? Customs? Clothing?

They are Arabs. Only Arabs.

They are Palestinians.

Meaningless. Unless you can make it distinct from all other peoples. What makes one distinctively Palestinian? At what point in time did that distinction come to be?

It isn’t meaningless. Is there some specific date needed? How about self identification.

I think this argument illustrates something and that is how important it is for some people here to insist that the Palestinians are a “fake” people with a “fake” history. Why is that so important? What is the agenda behind it?

The agenda is the protection and preservation of the Jewish people; their history; their culture; their monuments; their religious faith; their homeland.

No one is removing the rights of Arab Palestinians to self-identify as Arab Palestinians.

We are rejecting their desire to rewrite history in an effort to deny and replace the Jewish people.

There is nothing curlturally about Arab Palestinians which is distinctly a culture other than Arab. There is no connection culturally between Arab Palestinians and any people from ancient times in that homeland.

Self-identification alone is not the criteria for indigeneity. I can "identify" all I want with ancient Canaanite culture. It doesn't make me Canaanite. I can identify all I want to Coast Salish culture. It doesn't make me Coast Salish.

The Arab Palestinians are deliberately creating a false cultural connection to ancient tribes where there is NO cultural connection in order to usurp and replace the Jewish people.

Indigeneity has a meaning. By saying that anyone of any culture can "self-identify" with any ancient culture you are making the term "indigenous" completely meaningless.

There is NO connection and NO cultural identification between the Arab peoples and the ancient cultures which existed in this particular homeland.

Again, that doesn't mean they have no rights. Just that they can't build those rights on a fake history.

 

[Sixties Fan]

Please, let us not discuss what name Ancient Canaan had, at any time, anymore. It truly does not matter.

The issue of this thread is Who Is Indigenous to Ancient Canaan/Palestine who can trace the roots of their people there.

The Jewish People, clearly have traced their roots and founding of Judaism in Ancient Canaan.

The argument is that most most of today's Palestinians also trace their roots to that area.

I have posted a list of Arab leaders above, as all claim ancestral lineage to ancient Canaanite tribes, and would like to know to which tribes in Ancient Canaan do they trace ancestral lineage.

Here is a map of Ancient Canaan giving the ancient tribes in existence about 3500 years ago.

The map may not show, here are the tribes:

The Canaanites

The Amorites

The Hittites

The Jebusites

The Hivites

The Perizzites

The Girgashites

https://www.bible-history.com/map-israel-joshua/



Is there an actual Arab Palestinian archeological history on the land for the past 10,000 years which would prove this statement:

PA deputy district governor accuses Israel of stealing Palestinian heritage; "The antiquities in all of Palestine prove that the land of Palestine is an Arab-Canaanite land”
Source: Official PA daily, Al-Hayat Al-Jadida, Sept. 25, 2018



Who found this clearly Arab Palestinian culture and history the PA Deputy refers to and in which Museums is it being kept?

 

[Sixties Fan]

Here is my puzzlement, and hope someone can clarify it for me.

I posted above the 7 Nations in existence in Canaan at the time of Abraham or King David.

As some have noticed, Abbas and others like Rehmani and his Indian Muslim preacher, are stating that all of those Nations, tribes were Arabs.

By making Canaan Arab, one would also have to make Mesopotamia, Syria and Phoenicia Arab. Or would one?

By making Canaan Arab, one would have to make the Hebrews who created the Nation of Israel, Arabs.

My puzzlement stands from the fact that not once Abbas's clan, Husayni, or any other clan has actually confirmed which one of the 7 Nations they come from.

By stating that all of Canaan was Arab, they are also stating that the language spoken in Canaan was Arabic.


I am not refuting that the Arabs have, since the 7th Century CE, added a mixture of some of the peoples they conquered via intermarriage with others. But I do not believe that it comes to a high percentage to the point where it overtakes the indigenous Arabs themselves.
As we know, clans tend to stay very tight within and marry usually amongst themselves.

There is definitely no proof that the population of Canaan was
Arab, or that any of the Nations spoke Arabic.

There is no proof that the Arabs, since their invasion outside of Arabia, have actually mixed to the point of making some of the other peoples disappear, lose their identity as a Nation.
The Kurds, the Yazidis, the Assyrians and others continue to be proof of that.
Some Palestinians even have European looks, due to some Europeans converting to Islam, and are now calling themselves Palestinians, even Arabs.


So, back to my question.

Which Canaanite Nations do the Arabs claim to come from, as they continue to claim that they are Palestinians, and that their ancestors are indeed any one of the 7 Nations which existed at the time?

They are claiming to be Palestinians.... Arabs. That is how they identify themselves. But there was no Arab Nation in Canaan at the time.


Full descent from Canaanite Nations or Full descent from Arab tribes of the Peninsula until the 7th Century CE?


And why are so many Arabs and non Arabs starting to spread the idea that Canaan was Arab in ancient times?

 

[rylah]

The Origins of Arab Settlers in the Land of Israel

Yes, basically there were 4 waves of Arab invasion and settlement, one for each Caliphate.
Besides importing populations, virtually no rule managed to hold the borders from constant infiltration.

One only has too look at the first aerial photographed and detailed maps, to see how small and underdeveloped remained the Arab settlement, right up until the Jewish return.

 

[rylah]

This thread is being set up to prevent our second most common thread derailment (after the Mandate) - please discuss the ancient history of the peoples in the Palestine area here.

Both the Jews and Philistines (i.e. Palestinians) have lived in Israel for thousands years according to the Bible.

Also, according to the Bible, the Jewish People were deeded the Holy Land as "God's Chosen People." The Torah predates Muhammad and Islam by several thousand years. If Muslims want their religion and their beliefs respected then they must respect the Jewish and Christian faiths. You cannot have it both ways.


Israel is Jewish land according to the Torah. The question for Muslims: Will you respect Jewish faith and beliefs?

Please, the Philistines were invaders from Greece who created an Empire in the area of Gaza.

The Palestinians are Arabs, from Arabia.

Pro or Con, let us please get the identity of the players correct.

Because the Arabs would love for everyone to believe that they have been in Ancient Canaan for "thousands of years" when it wasn't even their ancestors but the Kurdish Muslims who were the first to invade the Land of Israel/region of Palestine in the 7th Century.

Islam does not allow for Muslims to "respect" the Jews. Especially as free people. The Jews must never be sovereign over any Muslims.

Which is why so many Muslims will lie, and lie, and destroy and destroy any and all Jewish history and archeology they can find, and call themselves the natives of the land.

The Palestinians were not Arabs from Arabia. I dont know why that lie keeps getting repeated.

Palestinians were not Arabs., this name merely jumps on whoever is the invader in the land.
It's the funniest thing when Bedouins all of a sudden start pretending to be these ancient "sea people",
who's name they cannot even pronounce.

 

[ForeverYoung436]

Here is my puzzlement, and hope someone can clarify it for me.

I posted above the 7 Nations in existence in Canaan at the time of Abraham or King David.

As some have noticed, Abbas and others like Rehmani and his Indian Muslim preacher, are stating that all of those Nations, tribes were Arabs.

By making Canaan Arab, one would also have to make Mesopotamia, Syria and Phoenicia Arab. Or would one?

By making Canaan Arab, one would have to make the Hebrews who created the Nation of Israel, Arabs.

My puzzlement stands from the fact that not once Abbas's clan, Husayni, or any other clan has actually confirmed which one of the 7 Nations they come from.

By stating that all of Canaan was Arab, they are also stating that the language spoken in Canaan was Arabic.


I am not refuting that the Arabs have, since the 7th Century CE, added a mixture of some of the peoples they conquered via intermarriage with others. But I do not believe that it comes to a high percentage to the point where it overtakes the indigenous Arabs themselves.
As we know, clans tend to stay very tight within and marry usually amongst themselves.

There is definitely no proof that the population of Canaan was
Arab, or that any of the Nations spoke Arabic.

There is no proof that the Arabs, since their invasion outside of Arabia, have actually mixed to the point of making some of the other peoples disappear, lose their identity as a Nation.
The Kurds, the Yazidis, the Assyrians and others continue to be proof of that.
Some Palestinians even have European looks, due to some Europeans converting to Islam, and are now calling themselves Palestinians, even Arabs.


So, back to my question.

Which Canaanite Nations do the Arabs claim to come from, as they continue to claim that they are Palestinians, and that their ancestors are indeed any one of the 7 Nations which existed at the time?

They are claiming to be Palestinians.... Arabs. That is how they identify themselves. But there was no Arab Nation in Canaan at the time.


Full descent from Canaanite Nations or Full descent from Arab tribes of the Peninsula until the 7th Century CE?


And why are so many Arabs and non Arabs starting to spread the idea that Canaan was Arab in ancient times?

At various different times, the "Palestinians" have claimed to be Canaanites, Philistines and even the ancient Israelites. Don't try to make sense of it. Their ancestry changes, depending on what is the most convenient claim at any given moment.