The Nuking of Nagasaki: Even More Immoral and Unnecessary than Hiroshima

[RetiredGySgt]

The only way it ended was the way it did. The Japanese Army controlled the Government and absolutely refused to surrender. Even after 2 nukes and the Soviet attack. The Emperor intervened and ordered thre surrender and even THEN the Army staged a Coup to stop that. You are simply being lied to when you are told Japan was going to surrender on their own.

 

[JoeB131]

The war could have ended in any number of ways with a surrender and without the incineration of hundreds of thousands of women, children, and the elderly.

True, but that falls as much on the Japanese for not surrendering in 1943 or 1944 as it does on us for just using a bomb.

 

[P@triot]

True, but that falls as much on the Japanese for not surrendering in 1943 or 1944 as it does on us for just using a bomb.

Jerkoff Joey still bitter that more Americans didn't die.

 

[P@triot]

Always. The unnecessary slaughter of civilians doesn't bother you, does it? Neither one bothered the fucking scumbag fdr, that's for damn sure.

Like Jerkoff Joey, Sensei Snowflake still pissed off more Americans weren't killed. They anti-Americans hate that bombs ended the war instantly.

 

[Unkotare]

....more Americans weren't killed.......

A great many more American servicemen would not have died if the war had ended sooner, as it might have if the scumbag fdr didn't want otherwise.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

....more Americans weren't killed.......

A great many more American servicemen would not have died if the war had ended sooner, as it might have if the scumbag fdr didn't want otherwise.

Again you LYING TOOL, I have the ACTUAL Government documents in the link. All Japanese Government offered was a CEASEFIRE and return to 41 start lines except in China NO concessions there. You claim General Mac Aurther had something else, PROVE IT. I want eitther the offical Government documents showing what he told the Government or an official statement from HIM that says they offered something more than ANY of the official channels. You can not provide them they don't exist because all the Army that Controlled the Japanese Government ever offered was a cease fire as I have proof of. Even after 2 Atomic Bombs and the entry of the Soviets into the war the Army that CONTROLLED the Government refused to surrender and when the Emperor intervened and ordered the surrender the ARMY STAGED A COUP to stop him.

What you have is the attempts by the Navy, a junior member of the Government, to surrender on some other terms. No matter what they wanted they couldn't do it because they were NOT in control of the Government the ARMY was. And that is what your IGNORANT historians that claim they would have surrendered have. IT SIMPLE WASN'T GOING TO HAPPEN.

 

[JoeB131]

Jerkoff Joey still bitter that more Americans didn't die.

Well, funny old thing. We let the Russians do all the heavy lifting, and then whined when they took an unfair share of the rewards.

Like Jerkoff Joey, Sensei Snowflake still pissed off more Americans weren't killed. They anti-Americans hate that bombs ended the war instantly.

Except the bombs had nothing to do with Japan's surrender. We had been bombing them for months. What caused them to surrender was the USSR entering the war, opening a whole new front they weren't ready to fight on.

Remember, the ENTIRE goal of Japan in the war was to hold onto their territories in China and Korea. Once the USSR got into the war, and their armies in Manchuria were being rolled up like a rug, that became a moot point and the only option they had was to surrender unconditionally and hope their country didn't get partitioned like Germany.

A great many more American servicemen would not have died if the war had ended sooner, as it might have if the scumbag fdr didn't want otherwise.

Again, Dripping Poop, here was the problem. The one thing we didn't want was Japan to be able to develop it's own version of the "Stabbed in the Back" myth that the Germans did in World War I. You certainly didn't want to leave all those territories under Japanese dominance.

 

[P@triot]

....more Americans weren't killed.......

A great many more American servicemen would not have died if the war had ended sooner, as it might have if the scumbag fdr didn't want otherwise.

While FDR is absolutely one of the worst in U.S. history, he dropped two fucking nukes, you imbecile. He clearly wanted the war to end. It did. And you’re pissed off because it prevented more Americans from dying.

 

[P@triot]

The Nuking of Hiroshima and Nagasaki: Even better today than it was yesterday!

 

[P@triot]

”Most regular people would say it's hard...And any streetwise son of a bitch knows: Don't fuck with this”

 

[P@triot]

Not only did the bombings immediately end the war - but they proactively prevented any and all attacks on the U.S. Not a single nation has attacked the U.S. since we dropped the atomic bombs on Japan. Not one.

That’s something the simpletons like mikegriffith1 and Sensei Snowflake Unkotare don’t think about. Millions and millions of American lives saved. Our only mistake was not dropping a third.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Jerkoff Joey still bitter that more Americans didn't die.

Well, funny old thing. We let the Russians do all the heavy lifting, and then whined when they took an unfair share of the rewards.

Like Jerkoff Joey, Sensei Snowflake still pissed off more Americans weren't killed. They anti-Americans hate that bombs ended the war instantly.

Except the bombs had nothing to do with Japan's surrender. We had been bombing them for months. What caused them to surrender was the USSR entering the war, opening a whole new front they weren't ready to fight on.

Remember, the ENTIRE goal of Japan in the war was to hold onto their territories in China and Korea. Once the USSR got into the war, and their armies in Manchuria were being rolled up like a rug, that became a moot point and the only option they had was to surrender unconditionally and hope their country didn't get partitioned like Germany.

A great many more American servicemen would not have died if the war had ended sooner, as it might have if the scumbag fdr didn't want otherwise.

Again, Dripping Poop, here was the problem. The one thing we didn't want was Japan to be able to develop it's own version of the "Stabbed in the Back" myth that the Germans did in World War I. You certainly didn't want to leave all those territories under Japanese dominance.

The Army that controlled the Japanese Governent did not surrender because of the Soviets, they did not surrender at all. After Atomic Bombs and the Soviet attack the Army REFUSED to surrender and when the Emperor ordered the surrender that same Army attempted a Coup to stop the surrender. I seriously doubt the Emperor surrendered because of the Soviets.

 

[Unkotare]

....more Americans weren't killed.......

A great many more American servicemen would not have died if the war had ended sooner, as it might have if the scumbag fdr didn't want otherwise.

While FDR is absolutely one of the worst in U.S. history, he dropped two fucking nukes...

Did he? Do you have to work at being this stupid?

 

[Unkotare]

A great many more American servicemen would not have died if the war had ended sooner, as it might have if the scumbag fdr didn't want otherwise.

 

[JoeB131]

While FDR is absolutely one of the worst in U.S. history, he dropped two fucking nukes, you imbecile. He clearly wanted the war to end. It did. And you’re pissed off because it prevented more Americans from dying.

FDR was already dead when the Nukes were dropped.... Truman made the decision to use the bombs.

I find it funny that someone who calls himself a "Patriot" hates our greatest presidents- FDR, Lincoln, Teddy Roosevelt.

Not only did the bombings immediately end the war - but they proactively prevented any and all attacks on the U.S. Not a single nation has attacked the U.S. since we dropped the atomic bombs on Japan. Not one.

Actually, the bombs had little to do with ending the war. Japan realized that they were without allies, and with the USSR entering the war, they had no other options but surrender.

Remember, the Jap Goal was to hold on to some of the territories they had gained in Asia. Once the Russians were in it, that wasn't going to happen, and they best thing they had to hope for was not getting partitioned like Germany and having a bunch of half-Russian mongrels running around.

 

[JoeB131]

The Army that controlled the Japanese Governent did not surrender because of the Soviets, they did not surrender at all. After Atomic Bombs and the Soviet attack the Army REFUSED to surrender and when the Emperor ordered the surrender that same Army attempted a Coup to stop the surrender. I seriously doubt the Emperor surrendered because of the Soviets.

The point was, the coup failed because most of the Army knew that with the USSR in the mix, the Japanese had no other options.

Heck, there was probably some guy on some Island who didn't surrender until the 1970's, but most of them knew they didn't have a chance when the USSR got into it.

The bombs weren't that big of a deal. We were already bombing the snot our of Japan with conventional bombs, leveling most of their major cities. It was the prospect of invading Russian Armies, with the horror stories of what they were doing in Germany, that got Japan to realize that being occupied by the Americans was the best deal.

Then you had the OTHER end of it. The last sticking point was the status of the Emperor. Up until that point, the US wanted to treat him as the war criminal he was. Once the Russians got into it and we realized we might have to share the spoils of war with them, we suddenly decided we were totally cool with letting Hirohito off.

 

[P@triot]

I find it funny that someone who calls himself a "Patriot" hates our greatest presidents- FDR, Lincoln, Teddy Roosevelt.

See, I find it tragic that you're so uneducated, you actually think FDR is one of our "greatest presidents". He pissed all over the U.S. Constitution and then wiped his ass with what was left of it, he ran for more than two terms because he was obsessed with power (typical leftist), and he ran one of the most corrupt administrations of all time.

 

[P@triot]

I find it funny that someone who calls himself a "Patriot" hates our greatest presidents- FDR, Lincoln, Teddy Roosevelt.

What do those three have in common? They took a match to the U.S. Constitution and reveled in it. Which is exactly why Joey likes them. Sad.

 

[JoeB131]

See, I find it tragic that you're so uneducated, you actually think FDR is one of our "greatest presidents". He pissed all over the U.S. Constitution and then wiped his ass with what was left of it, he ran for more than two terms because he was obsessed with power (typical leftist), and he ran one of the most corrupt administrations of all time.

Okay, let's look at that.

Nearly every survey of historians puts FDR in the top three presidents.

Historical rankings of presidents of the United States - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

There was no rule that said he couldn't run for more than two terms.
He got us through the Great Depression and World War II
Unlike nearly every other country that sank into some kind of dictatorship, he did it within the confines of the constitution.

But, of course, he realized you couldn't run a modern state with the thinking of dead slave rapists, so I guess there's that.

I also noticed you avoided that you think FDR dropped the bomb when he had been dead for five months when they were dropped.

What do those three have in common? They took a match to the U.S. Constitution and reveled in it. Which is exactly why Joey likes them. Sad.

Honestly, I don't give a crap about the constitution, we should have written a new one decades ago like any other state.

 

[Mushroom]

Whatever labored, embarrassing arguments one can make for the nuking of Hiroshima cannot be made for the nuking of Nagasaki just three days later. From my article "Did We Really Need to Use the Atomic Bomb Against Japan?":

On August 9, 1945, just three days after we nuked Hiroshima, and before Japan’s leaders had sufficient time to process and respond to our nuclear attack on Hiroshima, we dropped an atomic bomb on the city of Nagasaki, which was home to Japan’s largest Christian population. The atomic bombing of Nagasaki was even more inexcusable than the nuking of Hiroshima. . . .​

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Oh nonsense. They knew exactly what damage it had done, and still resolved to fight on no matter what.

Remember. the month before when the Allies released the Potsdam Declaration, they expressly warned Japan that they would be utterly destroyed if they did not surrender. n The Japanese response? They treated it with utter contempt, the Prime Minister used the phrase "Mokusatsu", which translated to "Kill with silence" (it was not worth responding to).

Then fast forward to August. Prior to the dropping of the first bomb, the entire Privy Council was unanimous in that the war should be continued no matter what. Then on 6 August when the news of Hiroshima arrived, they took another vote. And they voted 7-1 to continue the war.

The Navy assured them that the Americans could have no more than 1 bomb, and they would still sweep them from the seas if they tried to invade. Then on 9 August came both the Soviet Invasion and the second bomb. And the warning that another bomb would be dropped in no more than a week if they did not capitulate.

And after an all night long debate, the Privy Council was ultimately deadlocked at 4-4. At that time we all know Emperor Showa threw in the towel and they decided to accept a modified surrender. Of course, then you had a coup attempt by Army diehards that still wanted to go down swinging.

If anybody thinks that Japan was about to surrender, they do not understand the nation or culture. This was a nation where death before surrender was part of their religion, and they set the pattern for suicide bombers to follow. Except instead of handfuls of fanatics, this was almost an entire nation willing to die if needed.

If the Emperor had voted the other way (after all the Council was deadlocked even after 2 bombs and another invasion), then we likely would have had to drop a 3rd, or 4th bomb. Of course by that time odds are that one of them would have been on Tokyo, and would have destroyed the Council and Emperor. At that point it literally would have been a bloodbath of epic scale.

This was a nation and culture that literally did not know the concept of "surrender".