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The Malta Exchange

Gdjjr

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I'm reading a book, The Malta Exchange by Steve Berry. Granted, it's fiction with a lot of imagination likely- yet, it looks at the inner workings of the catholic church and reveals the corruption and lies within its own hierarchy -
Is it true? IDK, but, I've not been shown any reason to not believe it.

I've been called anti semite- LOL, as though that hurts me, but, I respond I'm anti religion in general. In fact, I'm anti anything that groups people into lesser thans and lays out rules for the lesser thans to abide by and the rule writers refuse to obey the rules themselves.

Anyway, the story is intriguing and informative and, for me at least, validating my opinion on religion. I mean, come on, religion has too much power over people and the catholic church has been too influential for way too long and corruption abated by lies is inevitable- people are just people regardless of their title (or stature). This particular story corroborates similar stories I've read, (about the church corruption), by different authors, so, there must be some truth to the 'tales' being told since good authors do a lot of preliminary investigation into the subject they write about- good authors do that to add plausibility to their story- if nothing else they are at least entertaining and offer cause to stop and think-
 

Porter Rockwell

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I'm reading a book, The Malta Exchange by Steve Berry. Granted, it's fiction with a lot of imagination likely- yet, it looks at the inner workings of the catholic church and reveals the corruption and lies within its own hierarchy -
Is it true? IDK, but, I've not been shown any reason to not believe it.

I've been called anti semite- LOL, as though that hurts me, but, I respond I'm anti religion in general. In fact, I'm anti anything that groups people into lesser thans and lays out rules for the lesser thans to abide by and the rule writers refuse to obey the rules themselves.

Anyway, the story is intriguing and informative and, for me at least, validating my opinion on religion. I mean, come on, religion has too much power over people and the catholic church has been too influential for way too long and corruption abated by lies is inevitable- people are just people regardless of their title (or stature). This particular story corroborates similar stories I've read, (about the church corruption), by different authors, so, there must be some truth to the 'tales' being told since good authors do a lot of preliminary investigation into the subject they write about- good authors do that to add plausibility to their story- if nothing else they are at least entertaining and offer cause to stop and think-
I came from a very non-religious upbringing. Let me put it into perspective for you:

When my father passed away, I was sitting on a couch in the mortuary with an uncle that lives thousands of miles away and we had little contact over the years. In recent years my uncle and father had made contact with each other. Anyway, a lady approaches us and says "well at least he's in a better place now." My uncle stood up so fast you'd think the bell just rang for him to begin round one of a world's boxing championship. He said "like Hell he is."

My father had been a mercenary, killing for profit. I never went to a church until about the age of 14, and then because some Baptists came to the house asking parents if their children might want to go. The old man didn't want people to think he was a bad guy so he agreed. I only went to get away from him. But, I found the whole experience less than uplifting. Organized religion was and is phony.

By the age of 17 I was writing letters to the editor of our local newspaper (I was probably agnostic) due to the things I saw wrong with major religions. Catholics protected pedophile priests; they called mortal men "father" in spite of the Bible command not to. Catholics "christianized" pagan rituals like Saturnalia and called it Christmas. I saw so many things wrong with it.

At 17 I met someone not connected to mainstream thinking and that changed me forever. I graduated Bible college at 19, but only used my education marginally for a few years before taking up the study of law. In 2018 I graduated from another Bible college and still think that these major religions have taken a wrong turn. So, you don't need a fiction book to find fault with what Catholics are doing. Just remember: organized churchianity is not the sum total of what all Christians believe.
 

DGS49

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Yeah, the Catholic Church has way too much power. That's why they have schools, hospitals, homeless shelters, soup kitchens, homes for unwed mothers, substance abuse clinics, daycare centers, and a thousand different varieties of "outreach" to the poor and needy, both here and abroad.

Bastards.
 
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Gdjjr

Gdjjr

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Yeah, the Catholic Church has way too much power. That's why they have schools, hospitals, homeless shelters, soup kitchens, homes for unwed mothers, substance abuse clinics, daycare centers, and a thousand different varieties of "outreach" to the poor and needy, both here and abroad.
LOL- so, having charitable organizations allows, or encourages?, corruption? Or does it negate the pedophilia? Or does it negate the rule writers not following their own rules? Inquiring minds want to know.
 

Porter Rockwell

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Yeah, the Catholic Church has way too much power. That's why they have schools, hospitals, homeless shelters, soup kitchens, homes for unwed mothers, substance abuse clinics, daycare centers, and a thousand different varieties of "outreach" to the poor and needy, both here and abroad.

Bastards.
ALL of what you say is true. On the surface, these big institutions are appearing to "help" people, but what proof do you have that their version really helps? What percentage of the people that they support actually go on to better their lives? How many remain dependent on the church the rest of their lives?
 
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Gdjjr

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I came from a very non-religious upbringing.
I can't say about my initial up bringing, but, I do, vaguely, remember a "tent revival" and my mom telling me a couple different stories about how I (in my baby voice) said some pretty embarrassing things- from age 6 - 12 I attended a Church of Christ every Sunday (twice), every Wednesday night, every night of every revival and every day of Vacation Bible School (because I lived here), because I had an uncle who got tired of going to get me from strangers when my mother and daddy would leave me while on a drinking binge (not complaining, just explaining)- as an adult, beginning at about 30 I attended a Southern Baptist Church- I have some find memories of both churches, but I also have some not so fond.
I only recently (say beginning 15 years ago), really gave "organized religion" much thought. I still don't give it much thought- no more so than political Party apparitions. Both subscribe to a similar dogma. They class people into camps/groups, and I detest that. I especially detest the authoritarian attitudes expressed by the 'special' class at the top.

I would never do college on theology for the same reason I'd never do college on History, or, Law- opinions on some facts are immaterial to the Big Picture effect- I'd argue with the professors incessantly and know I was correct simply because I refuse to argue unless I'm correct, and even then I'm reluctant to argue though I will spend considerable time trying to explain my rationale- - the Big Picture, based on observation, making my conclusions factual, is BOTH religion and politics play/prey on the weak- which segues into; Why do people have to feel they have to belong to something in order to feel good about themselves? Politicians and religion take advantage of that. They both offer the unprovable utopia- happy comes from within, not from outside stimuli-
There was a line in the book I marked (I do that for future readers in nearly every book I read when I see something, a line or a paragraph that catches my fancy)- the line I marked is allegedly from Proverbs; "The simple inherit folly, but the prudent are crowned with knowledge"-

Did you read this thread A new, ethical, church proposal

Just peruse and look at the reactions- amazing! I think it was because I used the word church and offended some sensibilities-

See, there are some things that can't be denied- Truth is constant, knowledge evolves being the most obvious.
If it was true yesterday, it's true today, it will be true tomorrow.
The Truth is; all men are created equal and have certain unalienable rights- there are no caveats. Most everything else, including religion, evolves- in the case of religion it consists of translation over a couple thousand years (at least) - language itself is an evolution, so, the knowledge imparted is as well.

I'm not trying to deny people their right to worship as they see fit- myself I love a sunrise, thunderstorms, the desert, being outside, a cup of coffee, sprint car racing, working on a sprint car, meaningful dialogue (not demagoguery) and I work at being Happy- I don't expect it to come from someone or something. Religion is a "something".
 

hjmick

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I'm reading a book, The Malta Exchange by Steve Berry. Granted, it's fiction with a lot of imagination likely- yet, it looks at the inner workings of the catholic church and reveals the corruption and lies within its own hierarchy -
Is it true? IDK, but, I've not been shown any reason to not believe it.

I've been called anti semite- LOL, as though that hurts me, but, I respond I'm anti religion in general. In fact, I'm anti anything that groups people into lesser thans and lays out rules for the lesser thans to abide by and the rule writers refuse to obey the rules themselves.

Anyway, the story is intriguing and informative and, for me at least, validating my opinion on religion. I mean, come on, religion has too much power over people and the catholic church has been too influential for way too long and corruption abated by lies is inevitable- people are just people regardless of their title (or stature). This particular story corroborates similar stories I've read, (about the church corruption), by different authors, so, there must be some truth to the 'tales' being told since good authors do a lot of preliminary investigation into the subject they write about- good authors do that to add plausibility to their story- if nothing else they are at least entertaining and offer cause to stop and think-

Big Steve Berry, fan, I've read all his books, met him while back, nice guy, great sense of humor. He weaves some history into his fiction, makes for interesting and enjoyable reads...
 

22lcidw

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Yeah, the Catholic Church has way too much power. That's why they have schools, hospitals, homeless shelters, soup kitchens, homes for unwed mothers, substance abuse clinics, daycare centers, and a thousand different varieties of "outreach" to the poor and needy, both here and abroad.
LOL- so, having charitable organizations allows, or encourages?, corruption? Or does it negate the pedophilia? Or does it negate the rule writers not following their own rules? Inquiring minds want to know.
Before our taxes went through the roof, Catholic Schools and Churches were a major part of a good percentage of cities. People gifted a lot of their hard earned money to them and the Church was the center of many and countless neighborhoods. Most of the money stayed in the local diocese and not sent to Rome. the charity did by the Church was enormous and the education it gave people from poorer neighborhoods were enormous also. The pedophile issue is a vile one. The covering up of it is worse. Our nation became slowly more selfish as the years went by after WW 2. The donations though kept piling in until the early 1970's. Vatican 2 became the standard and the changeover of the federal government becoming much more powerful came into focus. The left wing by then was controlled by Progs. The right wing was moving left. Feminism was in vogue and the pill made sex easier and freer. Political correctness and quotas changed the job landscape. Jobs were harder for many white guys out of high school and this during an economic malaise that lasted until Reagan. But when we snipped the last thread to gold in 1971, the fiat presses started churning furiously. The oldest generation back then started to retire and by the 1980's socia security and medicare taxes were massively raise time after time with promised it won't go bankrupt until the mid 2070's. All other social programs were advancing in double digits year after year. With state, local and city governments doing the same. Not much changed but the payout sowed to people are enormous today. And still growing. The Catholic Dioceses were the government before all of this for a lot of people. Maybe not as extravagant if that is what you want to call it. but it existed and helped many.
 

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I'm reading a book, The Malta Exchange by Steve Berry. Granted, it's fiction with a lot of imagination likely- yet, it looks at the inner workings of the catholic church and reveals the corruption and lies within its own hierarchy -
Is it true? IDK, but, I've not been shown any reason to not believe it.

I've been called anti semite- LOL, as though that hurts me, but, I respond I'm anti religion in general. In fact, I'm anti anything that groups people into lesser thans and lays out rules for the lesser thans to abide by and the rule writers refuse to obey the rules themselves.

Anyway, the story is intriguing and informative and, for me at least, validating my opinion on religion. I mean, come on, religion has too much power over people and the catholic church has been too influential for way too long and corruption abated by lies is inevitable- people are just people regardless of their title (or stature). This particular story corroborates similar stories I've read, (about the church corruption), by different authors, so, there must be some truth to the 'tales' being told since good authors do a lot of preliminary investigation into the subject they write about- good authors do that to add plausibility to their story- if nothing else they are at least entertaining and offer cause to stop and think-
No other institution played a greater role in shaping Western Civilization than the HRCC.
 
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Gdjjr

Gdjjr

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I guess no catholics have read the book- I'd sure like to have a dialogue about the history involved.
 

Blackrook

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I was raised by two devout Catholic parents and attended a Catholic boy's high school run by the Servite Order of priests and brothers. I still believe everything they taught me, but I no longer attend Mass on Sunday.
 

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